Theologians to ask Pope to suspend limbo?

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Theologians to ask Pope to suspend limbo?

Postby emad » Wed Nov 30, 2005 1:09 pm

Theologians to ask Pope to suspend limbo?<br>Wed Nov 30, 2005 9:33 AM ET <br> <br> <br>VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - Limbo -- the place where the Catholic Church teaches that babies go if they die before being baptized -- may have its days numbered.<br><br>According to Italian media reports on Tuesday, an international theological commission will advise Pope Benedict to eliminate the teaching about limbo from the Catholic catechism.<br><br>The Catholic Church teaches that babies who die before they can be baptized go to limbo, whose name comes from the Latin for "border" or "edge," because they deserve neither heaven nor hell.<br><br>Last October, seven months before he died, Pope John Paul asked the commission to come up with "a more coherent and enlightened way" of describing the fate of such innocents.<br><br>It was then headed by Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, who was elected Pope in April. It is now headed by his successor at the Vatican's doctrinal department, Archbishop William Levada, an American from San Francisco.<br><br>The commission, which has been meeting behind closed doors, may make its recommendation soon.<br><br>In his Divine Comedy, Dante passes limbo on his way into hell and writes: "Great grief seized on my own heart when this I heard, because some people of much worthiness I knew, who in limbo were suspended."<br><br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=oddlyEnoughNews&storyID=2005-11-30T143158Z_01_DIT052305_RTRUKOC_0_US-POPE-LIMBO.xml">today.reuters.com/news/ne...-LIMBO.xml</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Theologians to ask Pope to suspend limbo?

Postby Rigorous Intuition » Wed Nov 30, 2005 1:28 pm

Reminds me of a scene in Peter Carey's <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>Bliss</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->, but I can't remember if it's in the novel as well as the <!--EZCODE LINK START--><a href="http://imdb.com/title/tt0088821/">film</a><!--EZCODE LINK END-->. Though I do remember it's a very faithful adaptation.<br><br>Recovering from heart surgery, Harry Joy thinks he's died and gone to Hell, because he sees the world that was previously hidden to him. In hospital he receives a pastoral visit from a well-meaning Reverend Des, who says "Do you think God's such a bastard that he'd send people to Hell?" Harry says something like "What about the people in the Middle Ages who didn't know any better? Where did they go?" and adds "Maybe not God; maybe the God behind God...." Des's face blanches, and he stammers, "Well then I can't help you."<br><br>A great book and film.<br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>"If you get up at four in the morning they'll never get you."</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=rigorousintuition>Rigorous Intuition</A> at: 11/30/05 10:29 am<br></i>
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Re: Theologians to ask Pope to suspend limbo?

Postby Pants Elk » Wed Nov 30, 2005 1:37 pm

Does this affect limbo dancing in any way? <p></p><i></i>
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...

Postby Ted the dog » Wed Nov 30, 2005 3:10 pm

"Does this affect limbo dancing in any way? "<br><br><br>watch out...it's the next obscenity on Gonzalez's list. <p></p><i></i>
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and why not get rid of Limbo

Postby mother » Wed Nov 30, 2005 4:19 pm

They are still tidying up loose ends in their Novus Ordo Church. Since they have 2000 years of tradition,etc to fix up for the New World Order, and so little time, ditching Limbo makes sense. Maybe trying to get rid of Limbo has proved more difficult than expected, and that explains why they can't get rid of the pedophile predators ? <p></p><i></i>
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SO this means for the time being, limbo is...

Postby banned » Wed Nov 30, 2005 7:28 pm

in limbo?<br><br><!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :rollin --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/roll.gif ALT=":rollin"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <br><br>When they're not killing people who disagree with them, religious people are downright hilarious. I love how they argue over piddly little doctrinal crap that has no impact whatsoever on anyone's life, and ignore the 'big picture' like people breeding kids they can't feed.<br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: SO this means for the time being, limbo is...

Postby Sepka » Thu Dec 01, 2005 2:29 am

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>they argue over piddly little doctrinal crap that has no impact whatsoever on anyone's life, and ignore the 'big picture' like people breeding kids they can't feed<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>From a religious perspective, though, the "doctrinal crap" determines where a soul will spend eternity - it has more impact on everyone's life than anything else could possibly have. Earthly pain and suffering is almost meaningless in comparison, since it's a temporary condition. What constitutes the "big picture" depends chiefly on where one stands while looking.<br><br>-Sepka the Space Weasel <p></p><i></i>
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Well, from where I stand....

Postby banned » Thu Dec 01, 2005 2:38 am

...it's crap.<br><br>And Jesus didn't run around with a list of 101 things people had to BELIEVE. He went around telling people how they should LIVE.<br><br>He had nothing but contempt for the scribes and Pharisees who were the doctrinal-crap slingers of their times.<br><br>Reread your New Testament.<br><br>Faith without good works is dead. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Well, from where I stand....

Postby Sepka » Thu Dec 01, 2005 8:12 am

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Faith without good works is dead<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>I'm not entirely sure how that applies here. They're speaking of the doctrine of Limbo as it applies to unbaptized infants, who are surely too young to have either professed faith or have done good works.<br><br>-Sepka the Space Weasel <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Well, from where I stand....

Postby AnnaLivia » Thu Dec 01, 2005 1:40 pm

so 'limbo' is in limbo...that's funny, thanks banned.<br><br>the idea that a baby who dies shortly after being born could have something to atone for, and needs to be "saved" by a priest speaking the proper words over it, just is never going to compute in my widdle head. my kids' paternal grandparents are catholic (a think-for-yourself, good kind of catholic), and i well remember asking mom-in-law about this subject when it first arrived on my radar. she tried to explain the thinking, and i tried to comprehend, but by the end of the discussion we both were mostly just laughing over my total wide-eyed incredulity towards the idea.<br><br>i've become resigned to think that religious belief holds a unique power we can't wish away, and we're going to have to harness and re-direct it, instead. Odd that it was "an economist" who convinced me of that. Henry George was his name.<br><br>but that old "american dream" will always be as much about freedom from religion as about freedom of religion, to me. and i still suspect heaven and hell are both here on earth. <p></p><i></i>
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Hope they make it retroactive.

Postby Anonymous » Thu Dec 01, 2005 1:44 pm

Like George Carlin said many years ago, "If they do away with limbo, what happens to the souls that are already there--do they just get cut loose to drift in space"? <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Hope they make it retroactive.

Postby nomo » Thu Dec 01, 2005 1:59 pm

There's going to be a LOT of pissed off babies at the pearly gates. I can just see them kicking the shit out of those cherubs.<br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Maybe they meant Limbaugh?

Postby emad » Thu Dec 01, 2005 3:03 pm

Suspension too good for Rush? <p></p><i></i>
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My point, Sepka, was that Jesus, who...

Postby banned » Fri Dec 02, 2005 1:26 am

...last time I looked is the Big Cheese of Christianity (it being called "CHRISTianity" is what tipped me off), didn't see fit to spend his time on earth spinning a lot of doctrine, including whether his Mom was born free of original sin or where unbaptized babies go when they die.<br><br>He was more interested in telling people how to treat widows and orphans ON EARTH.<br><br>He didn't blather on trying to explain how a single God could be a trinity.<br><br>He didn't tell people they couldn't eat meat on Friday.<br><br>He didn't drone on about transubstantiation versus consubstantiation till everyone was sound asleep on the hillside.<br><br>He didn't tell them if they didn't make their Easter duty they'd go to hell (once there was an Easter of course.)<br><br>Jesus was not concerned with DOCTRINE which is what one BELIEVES. <br><br>He was concerned with GOOD WORKS which is what one DOES.<br><br>You can take all the doctrine, all the 'guardians of the faith', all the church buildings, all the encyclicals and papal bulls (and papal bull****), all the marble altars and silk vestments and gold chalices and church music and statues and PITCH IT ALL IN THE DUMPSTER.<br><br>To be a Christian all you have to do is do what Jesus said: love God, love others, and do unto them as you would have them do unto you.<br><br>That's it.<br><br>And if you do that, Christ is with you and in you and that experience, that ENCOUNTER, not memorizing the contents of the Vatican Library, is the whole point of being a Christian.<br><br>At the end of his life Thomas Aquinas, one of Holy Mother Church's most brilliant theologians, never finished his "Summa Theologica" because he had a mystical experience, the realness and profundity of which caused him to say "All that I have written seems to me like so much straw compared to what I have seen and what has been revealed to me."<br><br>The Angelic Doctor died 3 months and 1 day after his mystical encounter.<br><br>The Church needs to get back to the Imitatio Christi and forget all that straw.<br><br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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