'Gospel of Judas' Surfaces After 1,700 Years

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Re: Easter seasonal agit prop.

Postby Hugh Manatee Wins » Mon Apr 10, 2006 2:44 pm

Frank Zappa once chastened his band as unconducive to his guitar soloing by likening his efforts to "trying to grow a watermelon in Easter hay."<br><br>Trying to bring theological logic to discussion of propaganda is a similarly futile excercise and I'm surprised to see so much of that effort in this thread.<br><br>Rothbardian wrote-<br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>I am definitely a graduate of the Hugh Manatee School of Conspiratorial PTB Media Shenanigans (although I theorize in the opposite direction from Hugh).<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>I'm not sure what you mean by "theorizing in the opposite direction..." Do you suggest the PTB don't control media using psycho-political events and emotional triggers for demographic groups? All evidence suggests otherwise.<br><br>But perhaps I misunderstand you. <br><br>Remember all the Republican strategizing around Terri Schiavo for Easter 2005? "Damn those liberal humanists-killing beautiful young women with their damned activist judges!"<br><br>All about channeling fundamentalist angst into supporting Roberts and Alito on the bench and thus supporting the Reichstag for decades.<br><br>Now this Judas curfuffle as the public turns on the White House.<br><br>Wouldn't be surprised if Easter egg hunts were replaced with citizen traitor hunts led by Bill O'Reilly and David Horowitz. <br><br>Oops, already happening. <br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Gospel of Judas

Postby rothbardian » Mon Apr 10, 2006 3:43 pm

Trachys--<br><br>On the other side of the coin, there is a very readable little book entitled "The Case For Christ" by Lee Strobel. The title sums up what the book is about. <br><br>It's highly readable because it consists fundamentally of a series of interviews with academic scholars who have studied through the nitty-gritty issues, and are 'believers' themselves. The author is a former investigative journalist for the Chicago Tribune who initially set out to 'debunk' all of these things after his wife 'converted'. But, as has happened quite a few times when educated people set out to do such, he came to see that there was substance to the claims of these ancient manuscripts.<br><br>Antiaristo--<br><br>Thanks for the comment. Yes, I been learning some horrific things about that subject over the last couple of years. Here at RI (more recently though) and other sites and books. As I said earlier, there has also been significant infiltration of the PTB into evangelical and fundamentalist religious organizations here in the US. By that I mean, there are people in leadership who are absolute counterfeits and their sole purpose is to be 'Pied Pipers' herding people into the PTB agenda (the Iraq war; going along with massive infringements on civil liberties etc.).<br><br>I'll probably do some postings on some of these individuals later on.<br><br><br>DreamsEnd--<br><br>Back to the Judas thing-- For the record, I totally agree with your passing comment- that whether or not Judas is a forgery or the subject of some long pre-planned PTB prank...that doesn't make a positive case for the accuracy of the Biblical gospels. I agree and recognize that to be a separate issue...but it is one, that if I keep tapping the keyboard here at RI, I'll be getting into, because the Bible's 'inaccuracy' and 'unreliability' seems to be viewed here mostly as a foregone conclusion.<br><br><br>HughManatee--<br><br>I was saying that I agree with your persistent point that a huge percentage of movies, TV programming, pop music, various staged 'events' (on and on) are PTB-orchestrated and have a PTB agenda behind it. You seem to make that interpretation quite a bit more often then some of the other posters here...and I agree with that.<br><br>The difference between you and I (I think) is that you are left-leaning and like to think that huge chunks of mainstream left thinking are very valid and something which should be salvaged.<br><br>I see the entire right/left scenario as a complete PTB contrivance...and that the sum-total thrust of both right and left have been cynically designed by the PTB to consolidate their position and power--<br><br>The right pushes for it's fascist agenda-- summary arrest powers; an industrial strength Patriot Act (the government's right to rifle through our email etc.); the right to torture; war after bloody war for the alleged purpose of peace and security.<br><br>The left has been enticed into this agenda to save the trees, the birds, the flowers. the squirrels, the rabbits, the ozone, the rivers ad nauseam AND a huge, pervasive Orwellian 'nanny state' to allegedly facilitate 'social equity'. That was what butcher Karl Marx claimed his objective was, just before HE proposed a massively overpowered centralized government...and the left (like the right and it's fascism) has apparently learned nothing from the Marxian tragedies.<br><br>A massively overpowered centralized government (powerful militarily and financially) is the HOST...and the PTB is the PARASITE. In order to get rid of a parasite like the PTB which is now SO inextricably interwoven with the 'host'...the host must virtually die.<br><br>The present 'centralized governments' (especially the US) must either be HUGELY reduced or...completely reconstituted, if we are to gain our freedom from the PTB. Unfortunately that doesn't mesh with the current objectives of the right/left who both want massive/centralized/Orwellian/Big Brother/nanny-mommy government. <br><br>This probably deserves a separate thread. Let me get out of the way here, for the discussion to go back to this Gospel of Judas topic, if that is still happening----- <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Templars, Da Vinci, etc.

Postby albion » Mon Apr 10, 2006 4:54 pm

I agree with DE, it's kind of strange that all this stuff is happening just now. Reminds me a bit of some of the weirdness surrounding the <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>War of the Worlds</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> last summer (Tom and Katie and so forth).<br><br>Might as well drop a plug into this thread for Lynn Picknett and Clive Prince's <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>The Sion Revelation: The Truth About the Guardians of Christ's Sacred Bloodline</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->. I'm only about 2/3 of the way through, but basically, they untangle some of the different strands of history and myth that got woven together in <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>The Da Vinci Code</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> -- the origins of Christianity, Rennes-le-Chateau, French royalty and monarchists, modern European occult and esoteric orders, Saint-Yves d'Alveydre, Laurence Gardner & Edward De Vere, and more. Clearly they touch on a lot of contentious issues, and might not be right about everything, but it's a good overview.<br><br>From a parapolitical viewpoint, I thought the most interesting claim was that the Priory of Sion operated in the same sort of murky European nether-world as the P2 lodge, and may have originally been a front for the Gaullist SAC. This quote is a pretty good summary of the book's claims. It's from the last chapter (I skipped ahead):<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>The Priory was originally established in 1956 as a front for groups plotting Charles de Gaulle's return to power, either the network that would later become the notorious Gaulist "praetorian guard," the SAC, or the related Grand O conspiracy led by the arch-plotter Henri Martin. Later, in the 1960's, it was revived with a new purpose, a misinformation exercise aimed to divert other esoteric groups from seeking out certain archives by laying the bewildering false trail of the Merovingian bloodline. After <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> gave its cover story unexpected and unprecedented international publicity - whether it was welcome, unwelcome, or by the 1980's irrelevant, is unclear - it was quietly closed down by reinventing itself with a far less interesting history and purpose.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Why, it's almost enough to make me want to join the Hugh Manatee School. <p></p><i></i>
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Pope's not down with Judas

Postby nomo » Tue Apr 18, 2006 1:03 pm

<!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>(Poor Judas. Can't catch a break.)</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br><br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/pope/story/0,,1754385,00.html">www.guardian.co.uk/pope/s...85,00.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>Pope denounces 'greedy liar' Judas<br><br>John Hooper in Rome<br>Saturday April 15, 2006<br>The Guardian<br><br>Pope Benedict XVI is trying to combat efforts to rehabilitate Christianity's most hated villain after the presentation this month of a newly discovered "gospel according to Judas".<br><br>In his first Easter sermon at St Peter's Basilica, the German pope said the 13th apostle was a greedy liar: "He evaluated Jesus in terms of power and success. For him, only power and success were real. Love didn't count."<br><br>In Washington this month, the National Geographic Society unveiled a leather-bound papyrus written in around AD300 that gives Judas's side of the story behind the most notorious deception in religious history. The 26-page manuscript says Judas was singled out by Christ from the other apostles and entrusted with revealing his whereabouts to the Romans. "You will exceed all of them," the papyrus quotes Jesus as saying. "For you will sacrifice the man that clothes me."<br><br>Theologians had been debating the role of Judas long before the release of extracts from the manuscript. One modern theory is that, like many followers of Christ, Judas expected his master to be an earthly liberator and led the Romans to him - not for the 30 pieces of silver, but to try to force him to use his powers. The Pope's allusions to power and success may have been a nod in that direction. But otherwise his interpretation was strictly orthodox.<br><br>"The money was more important than communion with Jesus, more important than God and his love," he told a congregation in the Basilica of St John Lateran. The pontiff did not make a specific allusion to the papyrus, but his sermon was clearly intended to counter it. The Pope said the renegade apostle's lies had cast him into a hopeless, downward spiral. "He became hardened, incapable of conversion, of the trusting return of the prodigal son, and threw away his ruined life."<br><br>Writing in Corriere della Sera, the journalist Vittorio Messori, who wrote a book with the Pope, said the pontiff's approach was "the strictest interpretation of the mystery of the betrayal". Even his predecessor, John Paul II, had seen some hope for Judas in his book Crossing the Threshold of Hope, published in 1994.<br><br>A gospel written on behalf of history's most reviled traitor is known to have existed because its arguments were condemned by early guardians of Christian orthodoxy. The papyrus revealed this month purports to be a copy into the ancient Coptic language of a Greek version written about 100 years earlier. <p></p><i></i>
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