Ritual Magick -- does it work?

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Ritual Magick -- does it work?

Postby professorpan » Fri Sep 29, 2006 12:45 pm

I posted an excerpt from George Pendle's book, <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>Strange Angel: The Otherwordly Life of Rocket Scientist John Whiteside Parsons,</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> on my blog, with commentary. <br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.charm.net/~profpan/2006/09/strange-angel.html">www.charm.net/~profpan/20...angel.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>But I'll summarize it here. It's a fascinating anecdote.<br><br>Ed Forman was Jack Parson's best friend since childhood. He didn't buy into Parsons' beliefs in ritual magick, but played along and took part in many of the OTO's workings. One night, after participating in a ritual with Parsons, Forman had an experience which made him a believer:<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Parsons was now forgoing his OTO colleagues and enacting rituals with his old friend, Ed Forman. Despite his doubts about the reality of Crowley's magick, Forman was always willing to help out with what he saw as Parsons' hobby . . . "They thought, 'Let's work on the heavier stuff at the end of the magic book without doing any of the simpler stuff," remembers Forman's wife, Jeanne. "They were tinkering with magic spells as they had with their rockets."<br><br>On one such occasion their frivolousness had such a dramatic and unsettling psychological effect on Ed Forman that his family still discusses this story to this day. It seems that Forman was returning to his bedroom late one night following the performance of a ritual, when he felt the whole house shake. At the same time he heard a piercing scream coming from outside his window and looking out of it, he would recall, he saw a number of horrible entities floating outside his window, what he recognized as banshees -- female spirits whose wailing warns of a death in the house. with the sound of their screams filling his ears he rushed downstairs to ask the other members of the house if they, too, could hear it, but nobody could. "Up until then he had not believed in Jack's hobby," remembered Jeanne. "Now he was absolutely terrified." The events of that night would unsettle Forrman for the rest of his life.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Was Forman the victim of an overactive imagination, tweaked into a receptive state by the ritualistic trappings and mumbo-jumbo? Maybe. But however you explain it, in this case, the ritual worked -- it made Forman a believer. It changed his perception and haunted him for the remainder of his life.<br><br>I wonder how many RI posters have similar stories, and what their thoughts are about whether, indeed, this stuff <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>works?</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=professorpan>professorpan</A> at: 9/29/06 11:00 am<br></i>
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Re: Ritual Magick -- does it work?

Postby robertdreed » Fri Sep 29, 2006 12:57 pm

"...he felt the whole house shake. At the same time he heard a piercing scream coming from outside his window and looking out of it, he would recall, he saw a number of horrible entities floating outside his window..."<br><br>Well, if that's what you call <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>working</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->...<br><br>Myself, I wonder exactly how Forman recognized the particular species of spirit as a "banshee"- did he have his binoculars and field guide with him? <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Ritual Magick -- does it work?

Postby Et in Arcadia ego » Fri Sep 29, 2006 1:37 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>I wonder how many RI posters have similar stories, and what their thoughts are about whether, indeed, this stuff works?<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>I have a small handfull of personal stories, one of which was annonymously quoted in one of Jeff's blog posts re: the Necronomicon. Before bantering about the book's authenticity and purpose itself begins, the experience I had was outside the realm of intent on my part while reading it. Matter of fact, I didn't actually engage any of the rituals themselves and had no intention of doing so, but experienced intense negative reinforcements for even reading it until I destroyed the copy. I was in a world of hurt lasting several days, constantly hearing things like scratching/clawing accompanied by footsteps running on my roof/outside my window all night <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>and</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> day)I was advised to burn the book, and whether this was a printer's trick or what, the pages burned white one after another, as if there was never any text printed on the pages at all.<br><br>I should point out I was only mainly reading the book looking for references to Lovecrat's Chtulhu Mythos, as at the time(1985), everyone believed the book was only an..off-hand companion/supplement to Lovecraft's work. When I encountered all the Sumerian/Babylonian ritual, I wasn't sure what to think, and had difficulty maintaining interest, but finished it on principle. Immediately afterwards, the 'hauntings' began, and they weren't nice.<br><br>Running out of your house screaming in broad daylight isn't much fun.<br><br>I flirted with 'Magick' several times in my early years in both sloppy and organized formats in hopes of understanding *, and the above is by no means the worst experience I ever had, but is the only relevant one I'm willing to discuss here in an open forum. I'd like to talk about my *Worst/Scariest Fucking Experience in Life Ever with you guys one day, but it's something I'm still struggling to understand myself more than 20 years later, so I'm still not ready yet.<br><br>That experience, however, was sufficient to directly sustain the xenophobia(I do not limit this to Alien/UFO's, I'm actually not even refering to ET's here) I've displayed on many talks at RI.<br><br>Closest thing I've ever come to understanding it was(with Jeff's feedback, but not conclusion) the possibility I triggered a latent Egregore, but I really have no idea.. <p>____________________<br>Some are born to sweet delight, some are born to endless night.</p><i></i>
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Re: Ritual Magick -- does it work?

Postby postrchild » Fri Sep 29, 2006 1:54 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Closest thing I've ever come to understanding it was(with Jeff's feedback, but not conclusion) the possibility I triggered a latent Egregore, but I really have no idea..<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Ok ET whats an Egregore?<br><br>I am very interested in your stories. I am rarely fooled by any mainstream horror genres, in fact almost to the point of agnosticism...the only thing that keeps me holding on is stories like the ones you have alluded to. I would very much appreciate hearing of it, if only to scare the bejeezus out of me.... Thats some creepy shit with Necronomicon....<br><br>Hey Guys....Its almost Halloween! Time to bring out the ghost stories.... <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Ritual Magick -- does it work?

Postby Et in Arcadia ego » Fri Sep 29, 2006 2:02 pm

<!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egregore">en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egregore</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br><!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>Egregore</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> is a term from Old English which is fading from general use in modern English. Essentially, an egregore is the "spirit of a thing", usually a human group or organization, shared by the members of the group, for whom it provides guidelines concerning principles, beliefs, and goals. Companies, religions, states, and clubs all can be said to have egregores. An example of the presence of an egregore could be when "a project takes on a life of its own."<br><br>This dovetails nicely with what I experienced, btu I'm not going to prostitute one of the most significant experiences of my entire life by congealing it into a Halloween 'ghost story', no offense.. <p>____________________<br>Some are born to sweet delight, some are born to endless night.</p><i></i>
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Re: Ritual Magick -- does it work?

Postby IanEye » Fri Sep 29, 2006 2:02 pm

Since we are on the subject of ritual magick, has anyone heard the following works by John Zorn?<br><br>Magick<br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.tzadik.com/index.php?catalog=8006">www.tzadik.com/index.php?catalog=8006</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>Rituals<br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.tzadik.com/index.php?catalog=8011">www.tzadik.com/index.php?catalog=8011</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>Love, Madness and Mysticism<br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.tzadik.com/index.php?catalog=7065">www.tzadik.com/index.php?catalog=7065</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br><br><br>I like a lot of his stuff but haven’t heard these, but I enjoyed most of<br>IAO<br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.tzadik.com/index.php?catalog=7338">www.tzadik.com/index.php?catalog=7338</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>Again, I don’t think I am taking this thread too off topic because I am pretty sure Mr. Zorn is serious about the musick he makes and the vibe on IAO is pretty heavy, a lot of it reminds me of the group COIL, who also knew a thing or two about spells and Mind Control. I have had very odd “remote viewing” type experiences while laying down and listening to their “Time Machines” album:<br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.brainwashed.com/common/htdocs/discog/eskaton10.html">www.brainwashed.com/commo...ton10.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>“the Past inside the Present….”<br> <p></p><i></i>
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clarifying terms?

Postby Avalon » Fri Sep 29, 2006 2:56 pm

I'd like you to clarify why you are asking about "ritual magick" as opposed to plain vanilla magick, chaos magick, or even fluffy bunny white light magick. <br><br>What do you see as being the difference?<br><br>Do you think that some forms of magick work better than others? <br><br>Or are you intending the term "ritual magick" to cover all forms of magick?<br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: clarifying terms?

Postby professorpan » Fri Sep 29, 2006 3:13 pm

Good question, Avalon.<br><br>I'd like to distinguish ritual magick of the <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>summoning/communication-with-discarnate-entities</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> type from the <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>light-a-red-candle-and-make-her-love-me,</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> style of sympathetic magick.<br><br>I realize it's a huge, convoluted topic.<br><br>The intentional creation of an egregore or servitor, as part of chaos magick, would fit. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: clarifying terms?

Postby chiggerbit » Fri Sep 29, 2006 4:12 pm

Oh, good, this dude was touched on in the Mexico thread. <br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://p216.ezboard.com/frigorousintuitionfrm10.showMessageRange?topicID=6182.topic&start=41&stop=55">p216.ezboard.com/frigorou...41&stop=55</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br> If you don't mind, professor, also ask about Parsons' connection to Wright-Patterson Air Force Base. Has Wright-Patterson ever been known to be involved in this kind of kinky stuff? <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=chiggerbit@rigorousintuition>chiggerbit</A> at: 9/29/06 2:16 pm<br></i>
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Re: clarifying terms?

Postby Attack Ships on Fire » Fri Sep 29, 2006 4:14 pm

I've never took part in any sort of magic. While I believe that there are unusual things happening around us that the mainstream tends to ignore, I believe that they have a rational explanation to them, no matter how strange or frightening they can appear to be.<br><br>If magick exists I believe that it's possible because of the holographic universe theory, or some kind of idea along that notion; somehow the consciousness of the participant influences reality and the magick event happens. There may be metaphysical entities beyond our present senses that can interact with us, and this form of ritualism helps "break down" our view of secualist reality to allow a different perspective to be experienced.<br><br>I am leaning towards the holographic universe principal even though it may not be the entire answer, but I think it's along the right track. I think the HU model goes a long way to explain the bizarreness of quantum mechanics, especially the double slot experiments involving photons and the ability for particles to exchange information instantaneously across distances. If the universe is mallable, then ritual magick may be a crude but working method to change the outcome to a condition more favorable to the practitioner. It would also explain events like stigmata, possession, UFOs and psychic phenomena, and explain the results that serious researchers have found.<br><br>If reality can be skewed that way, then the more one tends to believe in something, the more their reality shapes to that worldview. That means a skeptic would always see more evidence that these things don't exist, and someone practitioning in magick would see things that are not of this world. Unless definitive scientific proof that reality works this way materializes, I can see this debate going on forever.<br><br>Furthermore, if consciousness does somehow shape reality, I think that lends more evidence that the universe was somehow created, shaped, designed, whatever you want to call. 14 billion years ago, and according to science, there shouldn't have been any form of consciousness around when the universe began, yet if the holographic universe theory holds water, now all of a sudden consciousness can change the quantum reality of the universe (such as when an observer attempts to find the speed or location of a particle)? To me that's just stretching disbelief too far; the idea of consciousness arising and being able to shape the universe coming about as complete chance would be virtually impossible...which means that there must have been a conscious force behind or at least involved in some capacity with the creation of the universe at its start.<br><br>I know that I am really proceeding into the shadows here, but I'm merely trying to shine my flashlight down the road ahead of me for clues. The existence of magick, of serendipity, the tangibility of quantum events, these things may suggest an even larger puzzle picture of a universe that may have been designed to be this way. I'm not saying that it proves the existence of God, far from it...but that the special role that consciousness plays had to have been known about, and incorporated into, the ingredients that make the rules for our reality. Science and religion may yet meet at a crossroad, but then another debate about who or what may have been behind the creation of everything will begin.<br><br>Getting back to the original point, I'd like to try some magick to see what I experience. I keep an open mind as to whether it's real or fiction, but my open mind also works far enough ahead that I worry about the possibility that magick is real...and what kind of harm I may bring upon myself or my loved ones by not bothering to read the instruction manual (if there is even one.)<br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: clarifying terms?

Postby professorpan » Fri Sep 29, 2006 5:55 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Oh, good, this dude was touched on in the Mexico thread. <br><br>p216.ezboard.com/frigorou...41&stop=55<br><br>If you don't mind, professor, also ask about Parsons' connection to Wright-Patterson Air Force Base. Has Wright-Patterson ever been known to be involved in this kind of kinky stuff?<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>I've never encountered any evidence that Parsons was descended from an Irish Earl. Parsons is a fairly common name.<br><br>Parsons was one of the founders of the Jet Propulsion Laboratory (JPL) -- maybe that's what you're thinking of? <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Ritual Magick -- does it work?

Postby Enki-][ » Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:26 am

et in Arcadia ego wrote:<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>I wonder how many RI posters have similar stories, and what their thoughts are about whether, indeed, this stuff works?<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>I have a small handfull of personal stories, one of which was annonymously quoted in one of Jeff's blog posts re: the Necronomicon. Before bantering about the book's authenticity and purpose itself begins, the experience I had was outside the realm of intent on my part while reading it. Matter of fact, I didn't actually engage any of the rituals themselves and had no intention of doing so, but experienced intense negative reinforcements for even reading it until I destroyed the copy. I was in a world of hurt lasting several days, constantly hearing things like scratching/clawing accompanied by footsteps running on my roof/outside my window all night <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>and</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> day)I was advised to burn the book, and whether this was a printer's trick or what, the pages burned white one after another, as if there was never any text printed on the pages at all.<br><br>I should point out I was only mainly reading the book looking for references to Lovecrat's Chtulhu Mythos, as at the time(1985), everyone believed the book was only an..off-hand companion/supplement to Lovecraft's work. When I encountered all the Sumerian/Babylonian ritual, I wasn't sure what to think, and had difficulty maintaining interest, but finished it on principle. Immediately afterwards, the 'hauntings' began, and they weren't nice.<br><br>Running out of your house screaming in broad daylight isn't much fun.<br><br>I flirted with 'Magick' several times in my early years in both sloppy and organized formats in hopes of understanding *, and the above is by no means the worst experience I ever had, but is the only relevant one I'm willing to discuss here in an open forum. I'd like to talk about my *Worst/Scariest Fucking Experience in Life Ever with you guys one day, but it's something I'm still struggling to understand myself more than 20 years later, so I'm still not ready yet.<br><br>That experience, however, was sufficient to directly sustain the xenophobia(I do not limit this to Alien/UFO's, I'm actually not even refering to ET's here) I've displayed on many talks at RI.<br><br>Closest thing I've ever come to understanding it was(with Jeff's feedback, but not conclusion) the possibility I triggered a latent Egregore, but I really have no idea.. <p>____________________<br>Some are born to sweet delight, some are born to endless night.</p><i></i>


This is precisely why I generally don't fuck with servitors/godforms. If you're trying to invoke or evoke something with some degree of free will, there's going to be a lot more potential damage (even if it's purely mental) from any flaw in the environment. I think this is probably the canonical reasoning behind all the ritual trappings (the opening/closing of the circle, the banishings before and after, protective seals, &c.) -- if you don't feel totally safe then your dark thoughts may manifest in that altered state.

For what it's worth, some of the stuff from the Simon Necronomicon is actually based on real Sumerian texts, but mostly it appears to be hacked and patched together in a patchwork way so as to relate some arbitrary other material to the Lovecraft mythos obliquely. Assuming that egregores are in fact persistent between people and related by something more specific than the archetypes they echo, it's quite possible that the patchwork nature generated a kind of patchwork egregore that draws power from both the popularity of the Lovecraft mythos and the long history on Sumerian and Babylonian workings that the Simon Necronomicon perverted in its mixture.

As you can probably discern from my nick, though, I am a bit of an intellectual elitist in terms of Sumerian mythology, and so my obvious dislike of the Simon Necronomicon is probably more of a visceral gut reaction due to emotional attachment to the original body of mythology, ^d Enki in particular.
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Postby castanblaidd » Tue Dec 29, 2009 8:41 pm

Ritual magick does indeed work, as it is the focusing of consciousness into creative energy. Most magick is ritualistic in nature, but to a certain extent all things have levels of magick / chi that are able to be summoned, directed and communed with. :)
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Re: Ritual Magick -- does it work?

Postby Lord Balto » Sat Aug 06, 2011 8:55 pm

Enki wrote:
For what it's worth, some of the stuff from the Simon Necronomicon is actually based on real Sumerian texts, but mostly it appears to be hacked and patched together in a patchwork way so as to relate some arbitrary other material to the Lovecraft mythos obliquely. Assuming that egregores are in fact persistent between people and related by something more specific than the archetypes they echo, it's quite possible that the patchwork nature generated a kind of patchwork egregore that draws power from both the popularity of the Lovecraft mythos and the long history on Sumerian and Babylonian workings that the Simon Necronomicon perverted in its mixture.

As you can probably discern from my nick, though, I am a bit of an intellectual elitist in terms of Sumerian mythology, and so my obvious dislike of the Simon Necronomicon is probably more of a visceral gut reaction due to emotional attachment to the original body of mythology, ^d Enki in particular.


My first reaction to the "Simon" book was that it was, indeed, based on common knowledge of the Sumerians and not on any "inside" information.
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Re:

Postby Lord Balto » Sat Aug 06, 2011 9:00 pm

castanblaidd wrote:Ritual magick does indeed work, as it is the focusing of consciousness into creative energy. Most magick is ritualistic in nature, but to a certain extent all things have levels of magick / chi that are able to be summoned, directed and communed with. :)


I have always had much more success just deciding that something was going to happen, based on the knowledge that someone "deserved" what was going to happen to him.

There also seems to be a tendency for "reality" to answer any questions you might have by identifying the source of an event in a way specified by the requestor, such as: the guy who did such and such will show up for work with a red spot on the tip of his nose.
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