911: A 7-MAN JOB

by **NewKid** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 5:46 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>i dont think that people who commit acts like that do it out of any ideology, they, like the money men are purely amoral, there would be special forces guys who have been in it so long that they wouldnt give a fuck who it was, just more dead people, money in the pocket, enjoyment of the job, not everyone has a conscience <hr></blockquote> Yup. <a href="http://globalresearch.ca/audiovideo/Aegis-PSD.wmv" target="top">globalresearch.ca/audiovideo/Aegis-PSD.wmv</a>

by **Qutb** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 8:35 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>But anyone who's seen a Tom Clancy or Robert Ludlum movie, or even watched enough Stargate, Star Trek or Alias, knows that a handful of bad guys can pull off big conspiracies, especially when they've got a high-level military or government person on board.<hr></blockquote> It should be pointed out that the examples cited are all fiction, not reality. Any real-world examples? Furthermore, the claim that 3 persons could have rigged those towers for demolition over the course of a couple of days is absolutely ludicrous. How many people needs to be involved is directly proportional with the complexity of the conspiracy. Enabling a terrorist attack to happen is something I suspect can be accomplished with only relatively few people fully in the know. Still, you need to have the right people in the right places in the relevant bureacratic organizations. If you're going to fake an attack like 9/11, however, using controlled implosions and remote controlled planes, not to mention switching planes with special drones prepared for the event, the number of people who need to be in on that is much bigger. Not only does it require a lot of people actively participating in staging the event, and in planning and preparing it a long time in advance, but also an astounding number of complicits to cover it up and hide the real facts, to frame and perhaps mind-control innocent patsies, create fake evidence of their involvement, get them to confess, even to create a fake terrorist organization to blame it on according to some theories. I'm not saying it's absolutely impossible to do something like that, but I disagree that only a few people need to be in the know and actively complicit. That's magical thinking. I also think the Manhattan project is a very bad analogy. One, it was never meant to remain a secret. It was only kept a secret for the duration of the program. There was no need to create an entirely fictitious cover-story about how the atomic bomb came about, complete with fake evidence, innocent patsy scientists and so on. Does anyone think such a story would have withstood serious historical inquiry? Two, that analogy ignores human psychological factors. The Manhattan project was about making a weapon to use against the enemy in time of war, at a time when there was an actual, real threat against the United States (sure, the Japanese would never have invaded the continental US, but at least it was perceived as a threat at the time and the country was engaged in a total war effort). Conspiring to kill thousands of Americans as a pretext to launch wars of agression overseas is a different matter, and something most Americans with the required special expertise probably would have reservations about. It's not something you can just ask a demolition company to participate in. You need a legion of people, comprising all the needed skills, who either share your views on the necessity of doing this, or who are indifferent to it but don't mind as long as they get paid well enough. And you have to rely on these people not having problems with what they've done after the fact, when they see the result.

by **AlicetheCurious** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 10:40 am

I don't know what's so incredible about the idea that a carefully-designed conspiracy was behind 9/11. Just as an intellectual exercise, imagine it like a well-planned chess game, with a variety of pieces on a board. You'd only need a very small group of individuals who see the whole picture, ie "the Player". The others would be used in limited, compartmentalised roles, like pawns, or knights, etc. The Player would be a group of extremely well-placed, powerful sociopaths, who say, can order special wargames and excercises to sow confusion, and who can stop or delay the military response to the airborne threat. They might include someone who is connected with the company that provides security to the WTC and maybe the airports where the hijacked flights originate. There would definitely have to be someone very high up in the FBI and the CIA as well, to squelch investigations and get rid of evidence that could throw a wrench in the plans. Maybe get rid of an overly conscientious agent who sees him/herself as more than just a small cog, or maybe who's figured out too much. As for the pawns, you'd have the bribable ones. There was a LOT of money made on 9/11, by those who were behind the 'put' options, by those whose financial shenanigans were hidden beneath the rubble of the WTC, by those mysterious individuals who sold the WTC steel quickly and efficiently far below market value to those who sold it for almost twice that much to countries halfway across the world. Not to mention Larry Silverstein's $7 billion insurance settlement. For that kind of money, you can get some people to do something they don't necessarily understand, no questions asked. Later, those who aren't laughing all the way to the bank, are either too compromised, or too afraid to speak up. Then, you have the blackmailable ones. The ones whose sexual ideal is in kindergarten, the ones who have been filmed doing god-know-what to whom. I wouldn't think it's too hard to get them to pretty much anything you want, after letting them know you have the tapes, the pictures, the videos, whatever. Then there are those you've got to get rid of, before they realize what they've been a part of. There were quite a lot of people from the military-industrial complex on those planes, including military contractors developing all sorts of nifty gadgets and devices...poof! What with terrorism, anthrax, small plane crashes, the DC sniper, heart attacks, suicides, hey, it's a dangerous world... There are the military air defence exercises on the day, that created confusion and circumvented the standard operating procedures that normally would have stopped the attacks well before they occurred. Finally, for the actual planting of the explosives, although I'm sure the US has plenty of criminals and sociopaths, it might be hard to recruit a sufficient number of them who are properly qualified and can be guaranteed to keep their mouths shut. I would probably want to import those from abroad. I'd need some trained, disciplined explosives experts, preferably with a military background, who can be shipped in, given an innocuous cover like, say, a moving company (good because you can transport all sorts of stuff in and out of buildings and nobody will find that odd). Unlike Americans, they would have no problem seeing how they are fulfilling their patriotic duty by planting explosives that will kill Americans. <blockquote>Quote:<hr>After the attacks on New York and Washington, the former Israeli Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, was asked what the terrorist strikes would mean for US-Israeli relations. He said: “It’s very good.” Then he corrected himself, adding: “Well, it’s not good, but it will generate immediate sympathy [for Israel from Americans].” <a href="http://www.sundayherald.com/37707">www.sundayherald.com/37707</a> <hr></blockquote> You know what else the Mossad agents would be great for? Handling the Arab patsies: the Mossad has a lot of experience in pretending to be Arab terrorists, and recruiting vulnerable young men in Israeli prisons and detention centers. The agents can easily pass as Arabs, speaking in flawless Arabic and looking "Middle Eastern". Rarely do the Arab patsies guess that their new best friend, flashing wads of cash, taking them out for a good time, or alternatively, exhorting them to a martyr's death, are really Israeli agents. <blockquote>Quote:<hr>In the car was $4700 in cash, a couple of foreign passports and a pair of box cutters – the concealed Stanley Knife-type blades used by the 19 hijackers who’d flown jetliners into the World Trade Centre and Pentagon just hours before. There were also fresh pictures of the men standing with the smouldering wreckage of the Twin Towers in the background. One image showed a hand flicking a lighter in front of the devastated buildings, like a fan at a pop concert. The driver of the van then told the arresting officers: “We are Israeli. We are not your problem. Your problems are our problems. The Palestinians are the problem.”(same source as above)<hr></blockquote> <blockquote>Quote:<hr>Dispatcher: Jersey City police. Caller: Yes, we have a white van, 2 or 3 guys in there, they look like Palestinians and going around a building. Caller: There's a minivan heading toward the Holland tunnel, I see the guy by Newark Airport mixing some junk and he has those sheikh uniform. Dispatcher: He has what? Caller: He's dressed like an Arab. <a href="http://www.wnbc.com/news/1315651/detail.html">www.wnbc.com/news/1315651/detail.html</a> <hr></blockquote> Now why would Israeli Mossad agents be driving around "dressed like Arabs" on September 11, in a van that smelled like explosives to bomb-sniffing dogs? <blockquote>Quote:<hr> The five men, who were in a van stopped on Route 3 in East Rutherford around 4:30 p.m., were being questioned by police but had not been charged with any crime late Tuesday. The Bergen County Police bomb squad X-rayed packagesbut did not find any explosives, authorities said. However, sources close to the investigation said they found other evidence linking the men to the bombing plot. "There are maps of the city in the car with certain places highlighted," the source said. "It looked like they're hooked in with this. It looked like they knew what was going to happen when they were at Liberty State Park." Sources also said that bomb-sniffing dogs reacted as if they had detected explosives, although officers were unable to find anything. <a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20011108025936/http:/www.bergen.com/news/2bombvan200109125.htm">web.archive.org/web/20011...109125.htm</a> <hr></blockquote> We shouldn't confuse the Player with the pieces. I doubt very much that the Israelis were the mastermind of this particular conspiracy. They were very valuable and essential to its success, however. The Israeli elites possibly made a "you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours" deal with their American counterparts. Why not? Especially that this particular operation could be exploited as a Public Relations bonanza for Israeli interests. It's a definite win-win situation for the two parties. And I'll bet that while the US side made sure those hints about the dancing Israelis were allowed to flash into the American public's consciousness, the Israeli side made sure they had some compromising evidence against their American friends. Just in case either one decided to get cute later. I was reading the posts above, and was stimulated into playing this "what if?" game. But the more I think about it, the more it looks like a hypothesis and the less it seems like a game. I guess you'd have to be a true sociopath to appreciate it...

by **darkbeforedawn** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 10:41 am

While qutb is right, the author does site a few popular movies, there are numerous real life examples from the recent past. Go to this site for the live links documenting this info: <a href="http://georgewashington.blogspot.com/2005/12/introduction-to-false-flag-terror.html">georgewashington.blogspot...error.html</a> Wednesday, December 28, 2005 An Introduction to False Flag Terror It has now been persuasively argued -- as shown, for example, in this History Channel video -- that Nazis set fire to their own government building and blamed that fire on others (if you have trouble playing the clip, it is because the website hosting the clip requires you to download the clip before playing it). The fire was the event which justified Hitler's seizure of power and suspension of liberties. And in the early 1950s, agents of an Israeli terrorist cell operating in Egypt planted bombs in several buildings, including U.S. diplomatic facilities, then left behind "evidence" implicating the Arabs as the culprits (one of the bombs detonated prematurely, allowing the Egyptians to identify the bombers). Israel's Defense Minister was brought down by the scandal, along with the entire Israeli government. See also this confirmation. And the Russian KGB apparently conducted a wave of bombings in Russia in order to justify war against Chechnya and put Vladimir Putin into power. This is called "false flag terrorism", where a government attacks its own people then blames others in order to justify its goals But NOT the U.S. It is logical to assume that, even if other countries have carried out false flag operations (especially horrible regimes such as, say, the Nazis), the U.S. has never done so. Well, as shown by this BBC special (which contains interviews with some of the key players), it is probable that America knew of the Japanese plan to attack Pearl Harbor -- down to the exact date of the attack -- and allowed it to happen to justify America's entry into World War II. See also this short essay by a highly-praised historian summarizing some of the key points (the historian, a World War II veteran, actually agreed with this strategy for getting America into the war, and so does not have any axe to grind). The Pearl Harbor conspiracy involved hundreds of military personnel. Moreover, the White House apparently had, a year earlier, launched an 8-point plan to provoke Japan into war against the U.S. (including, for example, an oil embargo). And -- most stunning -- the FDR administration took numerous affirmative steps to ensure that the Japanese attack would be successful. And, as confirmed by a former Italian Prime Minister, an Italian judge, and the former head of Italian counterintelligence, NATO, with the help of U.S. and foreign special forces, carried out terror bombings in Italy and blamed the communists, in order to rally people’s support for their governments in Europe in their fight against communism. As one participant in this formerly-secret program stated: "You had to attack civilians, people, women, children, innocent people, unknown people far removed from any political game. The reason was quite simple. They were supposed to force these people, the Italian public, to turn to the state to ask for greater security." Moreover, recently declassified documents show that in the 1960's, the American Joint Chiefs of Staff signed off on a plan to blow up AMERICAN airplanes (using an elaborate plan involving the switching of airplanes), and also to commit terrorist acts on American soil, and then to blame it on the Cubans in order to justify an invasion of Cuba. If you view no other links in this article, please read the following ABC news report; the official documents; and watch this interview with the former Washington Investigative Producer for ABC's World News Tonight with Peter Jennings (click link entitled "Joint Chiefs Guilty-Northwoods"). Therefore, before you dismiss as a tinfoil hat conspiracy claims about 9/11, please take a look at the historical record. Postscript: the examples discussed above are only a small handful of the many potential examples of false flag operations. Just two more examples: Australia's largest newspaper quoted the well-respected former Indonesian president as saying that the government had a role in the Bali bombings (apparently, Muslim governments play this game as well) And according to the London Times, "The man accused of supplying the dynamite used in the al-Qaeda train bombings in Madrid was in possession of the private telephone number of the head of Spain's Civil Guard bomb squad . . . . The revelation has raised fresh concerns in Madrid about links between those held responsible for the March bombings, which killed 190 people, and Spain’s security services". See also this article showing that two of the bombers appear to be government informants. posted by George Washington at 9:46 AM Wednesday, December 28, 2005 An Introduction to False Flag Terror It has now been persuasively argued -- as shown, for example, in this History Channel video -- that Nazis set fire to their own government building and blamed that fire on others (if you have trouble playing the clip, it is because the website hosting the clip requires you to download the clip before playing it). The fire was the event which justified Hitler's seizure of power and suspension of liberties. And in the early 1950s, agents of an Israeli terrorist cell operating in Egypt planted bombs in several buildings, including U.S. diplomatic facilities, then left behind "evidence" implicating the Arabs as the culprits (one of the bombs detonated prematurely, allowing the Egyptians to identify the bombers). Israel's Defense Minister was brought down by the scandal, along with the entire Israeli government. See also this confirmation. And the Russian KGB apparently conducted a wave of bombings in Russia in order to justify war against Chechnya and put Vladimir Putin into power. This is called "false flag terrorism", where a government attacks its own people then blames others in order to justify its goals But NOT the U.S. It is logical to assume that, even if other countries have carried out false flag operations (especially horrible regimes such as, say, the Nazis), the U.S. has never done so. Well, as shown by this BBC special (which contains interviews with some of the key players), it is probable that America knew of the Japanese plan to attack Pearl Harbor -- down to the exact date of the attack -- and allowed it to happen to justify America's entry into World War II. See also this short essay by a highly-praised historian summarizing some of the key points (the historian, a World War II veteran, actually agreed with this strategy for getting America into the war, and so does not have any axe to grind). The Pearl Harbor conspiracy involved hundreds of military personnel. Moreover, the White House apparently had, a year earlier, launched an 8-point plan to provoke Japan into war against the U.S. (including, for example, an oil embargo). And -- most stunning -- the FDR administration took numerous affirmative steps to ensure that the Japanese attack would be successful. And, as confirmed by a former Italian Prime Minister, an Italian judge, and the former head of Italian counterintelligence, NATO, with the help of U.S. and foreign special forces, carried out terror bombings in Italy and blamed the communists, in order to rally people’s support for their governments in Europe in their fight against communism. As one participant in this formerly-secret program stated: "You had to attack civilians, people, women, children, innocent people, unknown people far removed from any political game. The reason was quite simple. They were supposed to force these people, the Italian public, to turn to the state to ask for greater security." Moreover, recently declassified documents show that in the 1960's, the American Joint Chiefs of Staff signed off on a plan to blow up AMERICAN airplanes (using an elaborate plan involving the switching of airplanes), and also to commit terrorist acts on American soil, and then to blame it on the Cubans in order to justify an invasion of Cuba. If you view no other links in this article, please read the following ABC news report; the official documents; and watch this interview with the former Washington Investigative Producer for ABC's World News Tonight with Peter Jennings (click link entitled "Joint Chiefs Guilty-Northwoods"). Therefore, before you dismiss as a tinfoil hat conspiracy claims about 9/11, please take a look at the historical record. Postscript: the examples discussed above are only a small handful of the many potential examples of false flag operations. Just two more examples: Australia's largest newspaper quoted the well-respected former Indonesian president as saying that the government had a role in the Bali bombings (apparently, Muslim governments play this game as well) And according to the London Times, "The man accused of supplying the dynamite used in the al-Qaeda train bombings in Madrid was in possession of the private telephone number of the head of Spain's Civil Guard bomb squad . . . . The revelation has raised fresh concerns in Madrid about links between those held responsible for the March bombings, which killed 190 people, and Spain’s security services". See also this article showing that two of the bombers appear to be government informants. posted by George Washington at 9:46 AM

by **antiaristo** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 11:13 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>And according to the London Times, "The man accused of supplying the dynamite used in the al-Qaeda train bombings in Madrid was in possession of the private telephone number of the head of Spain's Civil Guard bomb squad . . . . The revelation has raised fresh concerns in Madrid about links between those held responsible for the March bombings, which killed 190 people, and Spain’s security services". See also this article showing that two of the bombers appear to be government informants.<hr></blockquote> There is a lot more than that. Even ETA has realised that. Have you heard about the permanent cease-fire declared by ETA last week? We've been told it was because of "weakness". But they can get hundreds of thousands out on the streets whenever they want. They did it last weekend. The crowds were HUGE. So why the permanent cease-fire? Because they were being USED. And everybody in Spain knows it. The ceasefire was greeted not with surprise, but with relief. It HAD TO come. They were bowing to the inevitable.

by **dbeach** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 11:52 am

"The Player would be a group of extremely well-placed, powerful sociopaths" in other words the 3 branches of govt in Wash DC including about every pol and all their pals.. the homicidal bush family are the TERRISTS

by **NewKid** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 2:33 pm

Staging something like operation of 9-11 wouldn't take very many people. Covering it up would take a few more, but remember most people involved in the coverup will have no idea about the actual operation. Look at how scared everyone is to censure Bush in Congress. Look at how whorish the media is about everything else. Nobody will go near 9-11 in power. I'm surprised we've had as many people come out as have come out. In my view, the whole operation was rather clumsy actually. The only part that really surprises me about it all was how poorly it was executed. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=newkid@rigorousintuition>NewKid</A> at: 4/6/06 12:39 pm

by **NewKid** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 2:43 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Conspiring to kill thousands of Americans as a pretext to launch wars of agression overseas is a different matter, and something most Americans with the required special expertise probably would have reservations about. It's not something you can just ask a demolition company to participate in. <hr></blockquote> Not really. You're not going to use a commercial firm. You're going to use the beltway bandit types or special warfare units. Their mindset is the mindset of those British contractors in that video. They don't give two shits about killing people. They really don't. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=newkid@rigorousintuition>NewKid</A> at: 4/6/06 12:43 pm

by **joyofsox** » Sat Apr 08, 2006 5:24 pm

Here is the quote that someone up thread alluded to: Daniel Ellsberg, "Secrets: A Memoir of Vietnam and the Pentagon Papers": It is a commonplace that "you can't keep secrets in Washington" or "in a democracy," that "no matter how sensitive the secret, you're likely to read it the next day in the New York Times." These truisms are flatly false. They are in fact cover stories, ways of flattering and misleading journalists and their readers, part of the process of keeping secrets well. Of course eventually many secrets do get out that wouldn't in a fully totalitarian society. Bureaucratic rivalries, especially over budget shares, lead to leaks. Moreover, to a certain extent the ability to keep a secret for a given amount of time diminishes with the number of people who know it. As secret keepers like to say, "Three people can keep a secret if two of them are dead." But the fact is that the overwhelming majority of secrets do not leak to the American public. This is true even when the information withheld is well known to an enemy and when it is clearly essential to the functioning of the congressional war power and to any democratic control of foreign policy. The reality unknown to the public and to most members of Congress and the press is that secrets that would be of the greatest import to many of them can be kept from them reliably for decades by the executive branch, even though they are known to thousands of insiders." paperback edition, page 43

911: A 7-MAN JOB

Re: secrets

Re: secrets

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fiction? hardly....

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