In my defense

by **robertdreed** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:14 pm

It strikes me as particularly strange therefore that so many on this board recognise the Methods of the PTB in all of this - namely appealing to the masses with soundbytes, snippets and attention grabbing 10 second infoshots - Whilst at the same time refusing to use such proven methods to recruit. Why is that exactly ? One good practical reason: because if it's phony- like the "substitute for Flight 77" crap- it's destined to backfire. That's presently what's happening at the level of American popular opinion in regard to the Bush administration's advertising hard sell on Iraq. The con-man cleverness had an expiration date. That's what we don't want to happen to honest inquiries into the mysteries of 9-11. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=robertdreed>robertdreed</A> at: 4/13/06 5:25 pm

by **slimmouse** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:18 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>One good practical reason: because if it's phony- like the substitute for Flight 77 crap- it's destined to backfire.<hr></blockquote> Thats a big IF. And ffs meanwhile, how are we expected to catch the average joes attention to the 4th reich which is busily laughing at us all whilst it introduces ID cards, no fly orders to all and sundry, and introduce the Orwellian nightmare at what appears to be an increasingly rapid rate ?

by **robertdreed** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:20 pm

slimmouse, you're still offering objections to a claim, based on an absence of evidence. As a convincing argument goes, that's no bueno. <a href="http://wiki.cotch.net/index.php/Appeal_to_Ignorance">wiki.cotch.net/index.php/..._Ignorance</a> What you're doing differs very little from Donald Rumsfeld's argument that Iraq had WMDs, because no one was able to find them. What you aren't doing is providing a plausible account of what might have happened instead, if it wasn't Flight 77 that hit the Pentagon. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=robertdreed>robertdreed</A> at: 4/13/06 5:22 pm

by **thoughtographer** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:23 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>It seems you find information and debate infuriating, if not intimidating. And yet you insult others instead of owning-up.<hr></blockquote> If that's what you'd like to think, then I won't be able to stop you. I'm not intimidated by your method of debate any more than I'm intimidated by an echo chamber. To me, it seems that you and others find it infuriating that I don't use the same approach that you choose to employ in making an argument. Cutting and pasting redundant "information" comes off as a bully tactic to me, so my instinct is to respond in kind. Sure, it's childish, but I consider it a waste of time to play on your terms. I'm pretty much laughing the entire time I'm posting here. "A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=thoughtographer>thoughtographer</A> at: 4/13/06 5:25 pm

by **slimmouse** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:29 pm

Before this thread is reduced to verbal diahorrhea. Firstly, it is not our job to tell people precisely what happened. It is our job ( hope you dont mind the 'we' in that ) to explain that there is some serious 4th reich shit going down here. It is our job simply to point out that people are being lied to about 19 arabs with boxcutters, which has resulted in a "war without end", restriction of everyones civil liberties, along with social decay caused by "The war on drugs" ( too funny) - The war for drugs more like - The liberation  of depleted uranium coated heroin addicted Arabs and a local community near you, et cetera et cetera et cetera. Again I ask ? Youre problem with that ?

by **slimmouse** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:33 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>I'm pretty much laughing the entire time I'm posting here.<hr></blockquote> Laugh, and the whole world laughs with you. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol"> <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/roll.gif ALT=":rollin">

by **robertdreed** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:35 pm

My problem with that is that you are in fact attempting to "tell people precisely what happened", by appending all sorts of strained claims, some of which push the envelope of the absurd. Like the "substitute UFO for Flight 77 hit the Pentagon" noise, for instance. The entire tack of insisting on an emphasis on showing people pictures and telling them what to think about them, often by bringing up highly dubious and wholly unprovable objections to the pictures, is manipulative. And insisting that it's the only way to get through to the average person in the street is patronizing. It will have nowhere near the positive effect that you think it will. Especially over the long term. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=robertdreed>robertdreed</A> at: 4/13/06 6:10 pm

by **thoughtographer** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:36 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Laugh, and the whole world laughs with you.<hr></blockquote> Take yourself too seriously and stubbornly reject common sense, and the rest of us laugh at you! I'll just assume that all of that empty space was filled with emoticons, which I can't see because I block them. "A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=thoughtographer>thoughtographer</A> at: 4/13/06 5:37 pm

by **slimmouse** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:42 pm

Might I be allowed to pluck a couple of quotes of yours from the last 5 or so posts ? <blockquote>Quote:<hr>What you aren't doing is providing a plausible account of what might have happened instead, if it wasn't Flight 77 that hit the Pentagon. <hr></blockquote> To which I have just replied, <blockquote>Quote:<hr>Firstly, it is not our job to tell people precisely what happened. It is our job ( hope you dont mind the 'we' in that ) to explain that there is some serious 4th reich shit going down here. It is our job simply to point out that people are being lied to about 19 arabs with boxcutters, which has resulted in a "war without end", restriction of everyones civil liberties, along with social decay caused by "The war on drugs" ( too funny) - The war for drugs more like - The liberation of depleted uranium coated heroin addicted Arabs and a local community near you, et cetera et cetera et cetera.<hr></blockquote> To which you now reply with; <blockquote>Quote:<hr>My problem with that is that you are in fact attempting to "tell people precisely what happened", by appending all sorts of strained claims, some of which push the envelope of the absurd.<hr></blockquote> So, what is it youre saying Im attempting to do exactly ?

by **robertdreed** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:52 pm

You're attempting to evade my points. (neutral observers are directed to read the previous record for this debate. You shouldn't have to page back very far to get the idea.) Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=robertdreed>robertdreed</A> at: 4/13/06 6:08 pm

by **thoughtographer** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 8:16 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>The entire tack of insisting on showing people pictures and telling them what to think about them, often by bringing up highly dubious and wholly unprovable objections to the pictures, is manipulative. And insisting that it's the only way to get through to the average person in the street is patronizing.<hr></blockquote> Agreed. The following is off-topic, so please ignore it if you'd like. I don't think it warrants its own thread at the moment. I see a parallel to this in the world of modern spiritism, specifically, the study of <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_voice_phenomenon">Electronic Voice Phenomenon</a> and associated areas like <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareidolia">pareidolia</a> (Jesus on a corn muffin, tortilla, toast, etcetera). These topics are interesting in many, many ways -- but most people are usually too eager to give you their revelation about the voices they hear on a recording before they give you an opportunity to make your own determination. It's like a psychiatrist pulling out a Rorschach inkblot and saying "eagle" or "mommy" or "virgin mary" before the patient has a chance to answer. It's obvious that finding comfort in things like this is one of their more popular functions, as most people truly believe they are communicating directly with discarnate spirits -- often those of deceased relatives. Some people will even allow their fears to manifest in the form of voices they discern as "evil" and, not surprisingly, there are many claims of messages from "Hitler" and other well known and widely feared cultural icons. People see not necessarily what the "want", but a distorted or exaggerated reflection of their current internal condition. All of that said, I think there's definitely something more to phenomena of this type, but that's better left for another time and maybe even another place entirely. "A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=thoughtographer>thoughtographer</A> at: 4/13/06 6:18 pm

by **darkbeforedawn** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 8:17 pm

Lets go back to the beginning--who exactly is absurd?The person saying this: 1. a bunch of 19 year olds with strange suicidal religious beliefs and boxcutters hijack four jets simultaniously and overpower military-trained pilots and co-pilots.Though having very little or no experience flying large aircraft, they perfrom unparalleled feats of aviation while they 2. evade the world's most prepared and trained air defense ever and strike at the heart of its most protected assets, successfully exploding three out of four targets, while moving around completely unconfronted in some cases for over an hour. 3. the master planner, once a known CIA asset, now desperately ill and on dialysis, escapes and hides in caves. The world's most persistent and pervasive military force vows to get him "dead or alive", but can't. Or the person saying this: 1. Powerful forces working behind the scenes in finance and government needed a "new Pearl Harbor" and boldly declared so. They planned for years to bring this event about and diligently included ownership and control of the media in this formula so as to keep the public in the dark. 2. 9-11 was a false flag terror attack designed to legitimize our nakedly aggressive policy to control and and direct resources in the middle east, mainly oil, drugs and arms traffic. 3. The true criminals can be identified by following the flow of money, which Jeff so brilliantly outlined in a recent blog. Which makes sense? All the rest is just the frosting on the cake and timewasting cleanup work which should be left to experts, scientists and police.

by **StarmanSkye** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 8:26 pm

Darkbeforedawn: EXCELLANT distillation and summary of the Most Important Goddamned Thing here. Everything else either adds to this or is an indulgent, energy-distracting circlejerk diversion. Replete with gratuitous 'Oh YEAH?' insults and character-attack one-upsmanshup. Kinda lets folks show their true colors. Starman

by **slimmouse** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 8:30 pm

Jeff, perhaps you can pin the last post by DBD I have yet to read, particularly with regard to 9/11 a more cogent analysis of the whole 9/11 story, but which also contains tangential references to just about everything else that has ever been discussed on this board, in a single post .

by **thoughtographer** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 8:32 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Darkbeforedawn: EXCELLANT distillation and summary of the Most Important Goddamned Thing here. Everything else either adds to this or is an indulgent, energy-distracting circlejerk diversion. Replete with gratuitous 'Oh YEAH?' insults and character-attack one-upsmanshup. Kinda lets folks show their true colors. Starman<hr></blockquote> Dittos! It seems that all the lot of you are interested in most of the time is dividing people up based on their "true colors" by using little lists and multiple-choice quizzes. But seriously, if this is the approach you want to take, then why not just make a poll using one of the many free online polling resources? You can use your buddy's excellant[sic] distillation as a template. "A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=thoughtographer>thoughtographer</A> at: 4/13/06 6:33 pm

In my defense

Re: The point for me is this.

The big IF.

Re: The point for me is this.

...

Let me make it clear.

Thats good !

Re: Let me make it clear.

...

Robert, Robert, Robert.

slimmouse

Re: Another willful, but meaningful digression

house of twisted mirrors

Re: house of twisted mirrors

Can we pin the previous thread ?

Re: house of twisted mirrors

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