Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

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Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

Postby greencrow0 » Tue Apr 18, 2006 12:47 am

<br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1145272627105&call_pageid=968332188492&col=968793972154&t=TS_Home">www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs...&t=TS_Home</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br><!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--><br><br>Apr. 17, 2006. 08:38 PM<br>ASSOCIATED PRESS<br><br>ALEXANDRIA, Va. — A defence psychologist testified Monday that Zacarias Moussaoui is a paranoid schizophrenic with delusions, as his lawyers presented additional evidence the confessed Sept. 11 conspirator believes he will be freed from prison by President George W. Bush. <br><br>Psychologist Xavier Amador testified Moussaoui displays symptoms of the brain disorder, including delusions and disorganized thoughts and speech. <br><br>Moussaoui’s court-appointed lawyers believe he has lied on the witness stand twice about having a role in the country’s worst terrorist attack in order to achieve martyrdom through execution or an enhanced role in history. <br><br>Amador has never examined Moussaoui, who refused to see him. He said his diagnosis is based in part on conclusions of other mental-health professionals and an analysis of Moussaoui’s actions and writings, including numerous rambling and abusive legal motions Moussaoui filed during the 18 months he represented himself. <br><br> ======================<br><br><br>This supports the theory that all the young Arab men like Atta, etc. who were lured into becoming patsies for the cabal who were planning 9/11 were mentally deficients, either mentally ill like Moussaoui or deviants, like Atta.<br><br>Perfect patsie fodder.<br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

Postby thoughtographer » Tue Apr 18, 2006 11:45 am

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>This supports the theory that all the young Arab men like Atta, etc. who were lured into becoming patsies for the cabal who were planning 9/11 were mentally deficients, either mentally ill like Moussaoui or deviants, like Atta.<br><br>Perfect patsie fodder.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br>I hardly have the time to even begin addressing how offensive and ignorant this is, but give me a fucking break. What's next, his sexual proclivities? Surely they can't just directly assault someone's race and nationality in the press...<br><br>Your comprehension of the human mind seems a bit simplistic. <p><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>"A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=thoughtographer>thoughtographer</A> at: 4/18/06 9:51 am<br></i>
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Re: Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

Postby CyberChrist » Tue Apr 18, 2006 12:33 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>This supports the theory that all the young Arab men like Atta, etc. who were lured into becoming patsies for the cabal who were planning 9/11 were mentally deficients, either mentally ill like Moussaoui or deviants, like Atta.<br><br>Perfect patsie fodder.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>And this supports the theory that all American men are dumb racist fucks.<br><br> <p>--<br>CyberChrist<br>http://www.hackerjournal.org<br>My brain is hung like a horse.</p><i></i>
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Re: Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

Postby greencrow0 » Tue Apr 18, 2006 1:36 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>I hardly have the time to even begin addressing <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>how offensive and ignorant</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> this is, but give me a fucking break. What's next, his sexual proclivities? Surely they can't just directly assault someone's race and nationality in the press...<br><br>Your comprehension of the human mind seems a bit simplistic.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--> <br><br>You're funnin me, right thought?<br><br>lol<!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :lol --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <br><br>that's why I gave up a long time ago trying to argue point by point with the righties about 9/11.<br><br>they absolutely hate evidence...even when it's being given by psychiatrists in a 'court of law'.<br><br><br>GC <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

Postby thoughtographer » Tue Apr 18, 2006 1:52 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>they absolutely hate evidence...even when it's being given by psychiatrists in a 'court of law'<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br>The word of a psychiatrist under oath doesn't mean much to me besides "something which helps drive opinion based on stereotypes", and you obviously don't see it that way. <p><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>"A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--></p><i></i>
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Re: Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

Postby FourthBase » Tue Apr 18, 2006 2:05 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>This supports the theory that all the young Arab men like Atta, etc. <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>who were lured into becoming patsies</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> for the cabal who were planning 9/11 were mentally deficients, either mentally ill like Moussaoui or deviants, like Atta.<br><br>Perfect patsie fodder.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Thoughtographer & CyberChrist need to <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>STEP THE FUCK OFF</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END-->.<br>WTF is racist about that?<br>He's not calling all young Arab men mentally deficient.<br>He's saying the ones recruited were.<br><br>My spooky conspiracy professor, William Henry Anderson, has proposed that the terrorists specifically had amygdala damage. So it's not inconceivable. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

Postby 4911 » Tue Apr 18, 2006 2:23 pm

wouldnt it be possible to paint anyone freaked out enough to pull off a terror attack as a delusioinal paranoid schizo? <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

Postby thoughtographer » Tue Apr 18, 2006 2:48 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Thoughtographer & CyberChrist need to STEP THE FUCK OFF.<br>WTF is racist about that?<br>He's not calling all young Arab men mentally deficient.<br>He's saying the ones recruited were.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>You need to straight-up <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>FUCK THE FUCK OFF</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END-->, YOU <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>FUCKING FUCK</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END-->.<br><br>Maybe you can't see how mental illness is used as an all-purpose scapegoat these days, but I can, and the outlook for the future is only worsening because of shit like this.<br><br>[edit: quote for "clarity"] <p><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>"A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=thoughtographer>thoughtographer</A> at: 4/18/06 1:51 pm<br></i>
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Re: Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

Postby nomo » Tue Apr 18, 2006 2:53 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>mental illness is used as an all-purpose scapegoat these days<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Very good point. I propose we lay off the insults and the bold-faced F-words and examine this assertion a bit more. <br><br>Peace. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

Postby Moddey Screbbagh » Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:07 pm

interesting question, 4911.<br><br>there are of course generally accepted "criteria" to make the diagnosis of schizophrenia. typically this is not so hard to do, but there are always going to be questionable cases where so-called experts may disagree.<br><br>the criteria include delusions, hallucinations (often auditory), disorganized speech, disorganized or catatonic behavior, and so-called negative symptoms like flat affect. apparently, in this case there is a family history of schizophrenia which might lend some credence to the diagnosis, but that claim should also be taken with a grain of salt unless the evidence is strong.<br><br>of course, these personality traits might be used to describe many people that visit this site (myself included): delusions: 9/11 was an inside job, disorganized speech and behavior etc, etc. interestingly enough, many of the scenarios, especially affecting patients with the "paranoid" subtype of schizophrenia, involve subjects that are near and dear to jeff and his followers: ufo sightings, being followed by groups like the cia, devil worship and conspiracies...but in general people with schizophrenia are truly psychotic and have lost something called "reality testing." can be hard to pin down, but you know it when you see it. <p></p><i></i>
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If he wasn't schizophrenic before...

Postby Fat Lady Singing » Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:13 pm

It seems to me that many people arrested in connection with terrorism who have been in American custody for long periods of time have become mentally ill, whether or not they were before they were taken.<br><br>Anyone remember Nuradin Abdi, the Somali business owner in Columbus, Ohio who supposedly plotted to blow up a shopping mall? This was in 2004. He was alleged to have colluded with truck driver/self-confessed Al-Qaeda member Iyman Faris, who was also supposedly going to blow up the Brooklyn Bridge.<br><br>Abdi's case is a sad one; last I looked into it, several months after his arrest, a local TV news station said this (sorry, the link's too old to be valid anymore):<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>A man accused of plotting to blow up a shopping mall has been transferred to a federal prison medical center for a court-ordered competency evaluation.<br><br>The U.S. Marshals Service flew Nuradin Abdi and three other prisoners on Thursday from Port Columbus International Airport. Abdi was taken to the Federal Medical Center in Rochester, Minn., one of six medical facilities for males operated by the U.S. Bureau of Prisons.<br><br>A federal magistrate last week ordered a psychological evaluation to determine if Abdi is able to stand trial. Abdi, a 32-year-old Somali refugee, put his face to the glass-covered table, muttered to himself and stared vacantly at relatives during the hearing.<br><br>Authorities accuse Abdi of plotting with admitted al-Qaida member Iyman Faris to blow up an undetermined mall. He was indicted earlier this month on charges including providing material support to al-Qaida, conspiracy and lying to gain political asylum in the United States. If convicted, he could get up to 80 years in prison.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Here's an editorial article about the case, again from 2004:<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0621-01.htm">www.commondreams.org/views04/0621-01.htm</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>Maybe I'll do a little googling in my spare time to see how or if the case has progressed.<br><br>However, knowing Columbus as I do, I can easily see how this poor guy got swept into this stuff. There's a section of town where many Somali immigrants live and work, and at that time, in the heart of this section, there was a decrepit old shopping mall, Northland, which had been abandoned by its tennants.<br><br>There was a lot of talk about what to do with it--should it be bulldozed and made into residential space? Renovated into more retail and office spaces? Etc. I can just imagine some FBI dude thinking he was overhearing something sensational, when Abdi was discussing the neighborhood's problem with someone. What if Abdi said to a friend, "you know, they should just blow up the place"? Officials never revealed which shopping mall was threatened...maybe not because it would scare away consumers but because they knew if they did it would make their case look very flimsy indeed.<br><br>This is, of course, mere conjecture. I have no direct knowledge of anyone involved in the case--just what I've read.<br><br>At any rate, whether or not the guy was a terrorist, he's now nuts, whereas he was not before (or at least he was sane enough to run a business). <p></p><i></i>
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Crazy...Like a Fox

Postby greencrow0 » Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:23 pm

Moussaoui says that Bush will free him and he will leave the country and perhaps write a book.<br><br>Well, why not?<br><br>He was allowed into the US on a special mission...given thousands of dollars [money to burn, hand over fist] to do as he pleased, rubbed shoulders with the shady doers of 'special plans'.<br><br>Then took the fall, and became the storefront SHOWCASE patsie for the mission. Otherwise, they'd not have even one person in prison to point to for this crime.<br><br>Why wouldn't he continue to expect special treatment? He would be crazy NOT to expect that those who had benefited so much from his dedication and loyalty should repay him in kind.<br><br>Now he's playing the lunatic...hoping to avoid the death penalty. Not likely though. He's just one of so many, who know too much.<br><br>GC <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Crazy...Like a Fox

Postby 4911 » Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:29 pm

You know what thoughtographer? I think I like you. Keepin it real. Some people might say that flying into rages detracts from the point they make. I disagree. That was very clearly phrased.<br><br>Yeah, someone was talking about that moussaui walks down the prison hall and exits stage left after the whole show is over. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=4911>4911</A> at: 4/18/06 1:31 pm<br></i>
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Re: If he wasn't schizophrenic before...

Postby Fat Lady Singing » Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:56 pm

Don't know if anyone else is interested in the Abdi case, but after some solid googling I've been unable to discover the current status of his case or his whereabouts. I'd appreciate any information anyone might have come across on it. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Moussaoui schizophrenic, court hears

Postby FourthBase » Tue Apr 18, 2006 4:07 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Maybe you can't see how mental illness is used as an all-purpose scapegoat these days, but I can, and the outlook for the future is only worsening because of shit like this.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>I was talking about the racism accusation, not mental illness.<br><br>And while I understand that the term "mental illness" can be manipulated to persecute all kinds of people, there <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>are</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> genuinely mentally ill people, and it's conceivable that when recruiting hijackers certain mental deficiencies could be among the criteria that plotters use. <p></p><i></i>
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