Was the Titanic Sunk On Purpose?

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Re: RigorousRepublicUnderground

Postby professorpan » Thu May 18, 2006 4:50 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Well, again...like Qutb's post, your post here is spectacularly self-canceling. You're 'whining' about my 'whining'.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>I'm beginning to think you're an AI program trapped in a redundant logic loop. <br><br>This thread is so very, very <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>done.</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br><br>Adios, muchachos. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: RigorousRepublicUnderground

Postby thoughtographer » Thu May 18, 2006 4:52 pm

Maybe I should ruffle someone's feathers, lest I be ignored. It seems to be the way things work around here. <p><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>"A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--></p><i></i>
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assassination disguised as a random shipwreck

Postby john darmy » Thu May 18, 2006 4:53 pm

In his book "The Vatican Assassins," Eric Jon Phelps explains that Astor and the other wealthy opponents of the Federal Reserve Bank were assassinated on the Titanic because they were too prominent to be killed in a more conventional fashion. Their deaths would have created too much suspicion. Since 1,500 innocent people died, people have a hard time believing something of that magnitude could have been deliberate sabotage. Similar to the way modern-day assassinations such as Rep. McDonald on KAL, the CIA agents aboard Lockerbie, JFK Jr. and Sen. Paul Wellstone were disguised as random plane crashes that also killed innocent people in addition to their political targets. People have a hard time believing it, so it's easier to get away with it. The truth is, the Jesuits were kicked out of virtually every country in Europe during the 1800s because of their involvement in political assassinations and other crimes. There have been dozens of well-documented books about this published, and to some extent, "Vatican Assassins" is based on those books. Unfortunately, those books have been suppressed by the Jesuits' modern-day disinformation agents. Just to give you an example, amazon refuses to carry "Vatican Assassins." If it's just junk, as some people claim, I say let it get out there in the open forum of ideas, and it will be discredited. I prefer that to censorship. <p></p><i></i>
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download vatican assassins for free

Postby john darmy » Thu May 18, 2006 5:00 pm

P.S. You can download "Vatican Assassins" for free here:<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.tractsforfree.com/?id=63">www.tractsforfree.com/?id=63</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: download vatican assassins for free

Postby antiaristo » Thu May 18, 2006 5:15 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>I don't run away from your facts, I just have no interest in your views on the Queen.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>You're lying again, pan.<br>Do it once, I let it pass.<br>Do it twice and I call you on it.<br><br>If you had no interest you wouldn't mention it, would you?<br>You certainly wouldn't mention it twice.<br><br>You have a very nasty habit of telling lies, don't you?<br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: download vatican assassins for free

Postby professorpan » Thu May 18, 2006 5:30 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>If you had no interest you wouldn't mention it, would you?<br>You certainly wouldn't mention it twi<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Anti, what part of "I have no interest in your views on the Queen" don't you understand?<br><br>I will no longer use your fixation on the Queen of England as an example. I promise.<br><br>I will, however, continue to use the orgonite alien base zapping as an example of the silliest thing every mentioned on this board (far sillier than Jesuits sinking the Titanic).<br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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assassination disguised as a random shipwreck

Postby rothbardian » Thu May 18, 2006 5:34 pm

John Darmy--<br><br>Very interesting stuff. I hadn't thought of that connection. But you're right-- the indications are that the Lockerbie crash was disguised assassinations. <br><br>Not that I know what exactly happened with the Titanic but...I think people may be setting up artificial obstacles in saying that sinking the Titanic would be an inefficient and inexact method of assassination.<br><br>These guys have no problem taking huge sloppy swipes at things. They tried to kill Reagan. It looks like Bush Sr. tried to knock off Gary Hart's campaign manager (Michael Boren Williams) and missed.<br><br>Again, I don't have specific details on the Titanic but... the PTB certainly made money on both the construction AND destruction of the WTC, for example.<br><br>Pan--<br><br>What is <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>"AI program trapped in a redundant logic loop"? </em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> If by that you mean that I keep repeating same logic, it's because some of you guys keep repeating the same mistakes. At least you credit me with logic (?).<br><br>I don't see what is so automatically invalid about complaints of squelching and abusive behavior. I find it odd that you go to the trouble to object to MY objections...but don't object to Qutb's/Reed's/ thoughtographer's objections.<br><br>If this place is just a wild and crazy free-for-all then why are you objecting to my wild-and-crazy' ranting? Bullys who complain about objections to their bullying? It can make you dizzy.<br><br><br>thoughtographer--<br><br>I didn't notice your post before. I hear what your saying, and obviously we'll all just play it by ear, as we go along here. I just don't understand people who step in, take a 'potshot' and then run for the hills. <br><br>I also don't understand when people prematurely conclude that because a topic is being discussed, those who are broaching these subjects already have formed opinions. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: assassination disguised as a random shipwreck

Postby Sepka » Thu May 18, 2006 5:43 pm

However much malice one attributes to the Jesuits, we're still left with the problem of how the Titanic's collision with the iceberg could possibly have been engineered. Both Boards of Inquiry agreed that had the ship not hit the iceberg at that precise angle, she'd not have sunk. Modern opinion stands firmly behind this idea as well. Had she begun her turn just a few seconds later, she'd have hit bow-on. The bow would have been crushed, and there'd have been deaths and injuries throughout the ship as unbraced passengers and crew were thrown around, much as in the case of the 'Stockholm' some fifty years later, but she'd have remained afloat. Had she turned a bit earlier, she might well have missed the berg altogether. There were literally hundreds of witnesses left alive afterwards to confirm what happened, including IIRC the watch crew who originally spotted the berg. When they sounded the alarm, the helmsman immediately called for full reverse (probably a mistake under the circumstances, but an honest one) and hard left.<br><br>To engineer a hit like that, it would be necessary to know not only the precise (witin feet) absolute position of the iceberg, but also its geometry, including that of the portion that was underwater. <br><br>Let's stipulate for the sake of the argument that that the watch and helm were involved in a conspiracy to sink the ship. Let's stipulate that the Jesuits had scouted out the iceberg in advance, plotted its position as accurately as could be done in 1912, and Titanic had set her course that night to hit it. She'd been on that unchanged heading for several hours before hitting the berg. Even with GPS, setting the helm of a liner to graze the rim of a target a few hundred yards across at a precise angle while still miles away from that target would be precise work. When you're working with a compass, clock and sextant, you can't plot your position to closer than a few hundred yards to begin with.<br><br>It gets worse, though - recall that they swung the wheel hard at the last second. The helm threw the wheel on the watch's sayso - the berg wasn't visible from the bridge at that time. Now we've got a case which is worse than trying to hit an exact spot at an exact angle after sailing four hours in a straight line - we're throwing in a last-second turn, as hard as the ship will go, and reversing the engines as well. All this on a ship that was on her first crossing, one that the crew was still learning how she'd respond to her controls, and what could be expected of her.<br><br>Deliberately sinking the 'Titanic' in that way was pretty much impossible in 1912, and would require GPS and computer control to pull off today. If you want to discuss ocean liners being sunk as the result of a possible conspiracy, the 'Lusitania' is a far more fertile field for speculation.<br><br>-Sepka the Space Weasel <p></p><i></i>
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Re: assassination disguised as a random shipwreck

Postby antiaristo » Thu May 18, 2006 5:55 pm

<br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Anti, what part of "I have no interest in your views on the Queen" don't you understand?<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>pan,<br>In future I will use the word "pan" on this board whenever I am describing weasel words uttered on this forum.<br><br>This in no way reflects on your character, of course.<br><br>What part of this don't you understand, oh superior one?<br><br>(you ARE allowed to lie to the profane, are you not?) <p></p><i></i>
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Re: assassination disguised as a random shipwreck

Postby thoughtographer » Thu May 18, 2006 6:06 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>thoughtographer--<br><br>I didn't notice your post before. I hear what your saying, and obviously we'll all just play it by ear, as we go along here. I just don't understand people who step in, take a 'potshot' and then run for the hills.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br>We're all still here, aren't we? I see what you're saying about people throwing out insults and ducking the actual "discussion" part of the discussion -- but most of the time those things that are perceived as insults keep things moving, regardless. That makes them part of the discussion in my book.<br><br>I think most people confuse hurt feelings with bruised egos, and as far as I'm concerned, egos are for bruising -- especially my own. Anyway -- thank you for paying attention.<br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>In future I will use the word "pan" on this board whenever I am describing weasel words uttered on this forum.<br><hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br>Well, you'll be getting two for the price of one, with Sepka and all. <p><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>"A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--></p><i></i>
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Re: assassination disguised as a random shipwreck

Postby Sepka » Thu May 18, 2006 6:09 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>weasel words<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Let us not use the good name of Weasels in such disparaging fashion...<br><br>Just for the sake of wantonly throwing fuel on the fire here, I'll note that I have a framed picture of the Queen hanging in a place of honour in my living room, and I have in the past (and undoubtedly shall in the future) urged my representatives to introduce a bill calling for the United States to most humbly apologize to Her Majesty for the revolution, acknowledge Her Undoubted Sovereignty, and beg admittance to the Commonwealth. So there.<br><br>(Editted for spelling)<br><br>-Sepka the Space Weasel <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=sepka>Sepka</A> at: 5/18/06 4:10 pm<br></i>
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Re: assassination disguised as a random shipwreck

Postby antiaristo » Thu May 18, 2006 6:26 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>weasel words<br><br> • plural noun statements that are intentionally ambiguous or misleading.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Oxford English Dictionary<br><br>Sepka,<br>I think the meaning is slightly different in English English.<br><br>What you say about Queen Elizabeth is entirely consistent with what you said about de Menezes. Fair enough, it's your opinion, and you are being honest.<br><br> <br> <br> <p></p><i></i>
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R-bardian

Postby robertdreed » Thu May 18, 2006 8:15 pm

<!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>Why are you unable to simply summarize briefly?</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br><br>Because a lot of phony arguments aren't amenable to brief summarization. As a matter of fact, it's often the case that the more absurdly premised and ignorantly posited they are, the longer it takes to unravel the snarls.<br><br>I may be an ex-cabdriver without portfolio or resume, uncredentialed except for a BA and a few library cards.<br><br>But I have been intensively studying parapolitics and the logic and metalogic of conspiracy theory for around 12 years now, and I've learned the importance of triage and winnowing signal from noise. <br><br>If one result of all that effort is that I don't suffer foolish theories and their promulgators lightly, so be it. I don't have the time to grant sober consideration to every flight of fantasy that hurtles down the information highway. <br><br>I can spare a little time for ridicule, though. I need the comic relief, and my targets would find it of considerable educational value if they took it with a sporting attitude. If they had any <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>arete</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->, that is, instead of getting out the crying towel every time one of their shots gets blocked. <br><br>( Murray Rothbard? If he were your professor, he'd probably skin your fatuity alive. Knowing that you'd live. That you'd be better off without it. )<br><br>If you were really interested in pursuing your Titanic conspiracy theory, rothie, you'd be out digging and continuing to persuade people with evidential findings, instead of persisting in attempting to bait the detractors into personal exchanges and howling with umbrage, simply because they've noted how threadbare your case is. <br> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=robertdreed>robertdreed</A> at: 5/18/06 7:46 pm<br></i>
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big words

Postby rothbardian » Thu May 18, 2006 10:41 pm

<br>Good grief, Reed. I'm gonna have to spend fifteen minutes over at dictionary.com translating your post. I'll get back to you. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: big words

Postby robertdreed » Thu May 18, 2006 11:33 pm

If it's any comfort, more than once William F. Buckley has done the same thing to me.<br><br>"I love that cat." Dick Gregory <p></p><i></i>
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