Bob Woodward steps in for the Kill

[chiggerbit]

Michael Ledeen? <p></p><i></i>

[Hugh Manatee Wins]

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>As for Noriega, he was deposed by a US invasion in 1989, although I'm unclear on whether you think that was a bad thing or not.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>I think there were a many hundreds of poor Panamanians killed in that invasion and many of the bodies were burned on the beaches or buried in mass graves on a US military base.<br><br>The documentary called 'The Panama Deception' was horrific to watch.<br><br>And this was to take back the Panama Canal which Carter had arranged to return to the Panamanians, wasn't it?<br><br>Plus continue the eradication of Vietnam Syndrome.<br>Plus blood the commanders of the (soon to be manufactured with the help of ambassador April Glaspie) Gulf War I slaughter.<br><br>Sounds like a bad thing. <p></p><i></i>

[chiggerbit]

Manichur Ghorbanifar? Old ABC (already been chewed) CIA news? <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=chiggerbit@rigorousintuition>chiggerbit</A> at: 10/1/06 11:52 pm<br></i>

[Hugh Manatee Wins]

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Can the techniques of social engineering possibly be any more apparent?<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Looks to me like the Council on Foreign Relations and Pentagon have agreed that the neocons, though suitably driven towards empire, need a few more Democrats in November to temper their recklessness.<br><br>Oh so Hegelian.<br><br>"Fires burning a little too hot. Throw on some Democrats." <p></p><i></i>

[chiggerbit]

Adm. John Poindexter? Oh, no, no, no, he wasn't CIA either. <p></p><i></i>

[chiggerbit]

Elliott Abrams? No, no, no, whatever am I thinking of? He wasn't CIA either. <p></p><i></i>

[chiggerbit]

Richard Secord, Gen. John Singlaub???? Nah, they're mjust old history, right? <p></p><i></i>

[robertdreed]

"no, we won't play dueling human rights abuses."<br><br>That particular match is over. Year in and year out, the Soviet Union kicked the ass of the USA. <br><br>Hell, <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>Ceaucescu's Romania</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> kicked the ass of the USA. <br><br>They even kicked the ass of Pinochet's Chile. And Ceaucescu managed longer. Check the stats if you don't believe me. <br><br>Somehow, I'm thankful for that. That's a World Championship that isn't worth bidding for. I'd rather leave Hitler and Stalin with their jerseys retired, splitting the trophy. <p></p><i></i>

[robertdreed]

chiggerbit, you keep naming historically CIA-associated <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>friends</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> of George Bush, <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>pere et fils</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->. <br><br>That runs directly contrary to DE's thesis that the top level of the CIA is President Bush's <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>enemy</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->, and currently working to depose him. <br><br>( That was the ostensible thread being discussed, before things sort of veered off track. )<br> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=robertdreed>robertdreed</A> at: 10/2/06 12:02 am<br></i>

[chiggerbit]

And MY point is that you don't know who to trust in the CIA. I don't care if it's one in a hundred, you can't know who is who. Yes, I agree, there are probably many very good people there, but who do you trust? These names have a history not only in the old man's presidency, but in Baby B's too. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=chiggerbit@rigorousintuition>chiggerbit</A> at: 10/2/06 12:10 am<br></i>

[Hugh Manatee Wins]

Rather than number of humans abused, I wonder how many governments did the US CIA/CFR/Pentagon knock over compared to the USSR?<br><br>How about the economic hit man casualties of the IMF?<br><br>Which single country has done the most to prevent democracy around the world since WWII?<br><br>And including the Wall Street-Hitler alliance and the way this reinforced totalitarian response by Stalin and China would affect the scoring of the body count, too, wouldn't it? <p></p><i></i>

[chiggerbit]

And I think the association is more than "just friends". I think they're in bed together. <p></p><i></i>

[chiggerbit]

Let's just say, for instance, that I'm right AND DE's right. Then what do you have? <p></p><i></i>

[Dreams End]

<br><br>I will be happy to be proven wrong on my pet thesis. I'm not sure how long it will take. For me to see things differently, it will probably take at least through the 2008 elections. However, there may be things going to happen sooner that will make my perspective more convincing.<br><br>Like if we actually DO have a military coup. <br><br>Or if Dems take over and there actually IS a very significant roll back of anti-Constitutional laws. <br><br>But the Dems I see in my own state and some of the dem leaders...Hillary, kerry...they talk "tougher" on Iraq than Bush does. But THEY can get away with it, because they are DEMS. I actually had people say to me when Kerry was pretending to run for President that Kerry didn't MEAN he wanted to increase troops in Iraq...he just had to say that for political reasons.<br><br>So intentional or not, planned or not, CIA or not...events of the last 6 years, and really of the last 40, have pushed the median further and further to the right. <br><br>When Wesley Clark can be perceived as an anti-war candidate, you know you've entered some very strange waters, indeed.<br><br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>

[Gouda]

Well, we can also look at it in the sense that at tip-top levels of the intelligence community, military-industrial complex and high finance (the <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>very</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> fascist transglobal corporatocracy) are operating in a unaccountable secret netherworld of godgames where petty partisan divides, electoral politics and the bureau-mechanics of covert ops are relevant only to the extent that their ediface and their goals are untouched. Now a rightwing dictator, now a neoliberal from the left - whatever works, or <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>whatever is working</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> (there is a difference) with flexibility required to adjust to the sometimes successful real opposition (resistance from below) which also influences their range of motion. <br><br>And sometimes we just get a stage play for our edification. <br><br>See the example of suprapolitical operatives Henry Kissinger and Bob Woodward, both deep friends and deep enemies (or neither) of the Bush dynasty... <p></p><i></i>