Arrest made in JonBenet Ramsey murder case

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Re: Oprah website omission

Postby Project Willow » Fri Aug 18, 2006 2:39 pm

Chiggerbit, click on the button that says alternately "View my guest map", and "Place your pin", under #4 in that section. A new small window should pop up.<br><br><!--EZCODE LINK START--><a href="http://www.ritualabusetorture.org/index.htm">www.ritualabusetorture.org/index.htm</a><!--EZCODE LINK END--> <p></p><i></i>
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The Carrs

Postby johnny nemo » Fri Aug 18, 2006 4:18 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Also, I still think it's bizarre that his name is, as an earlier poster pointed out, so close to the John Carr involved with the SOS killings as reported by Maury Terry.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Good catch.<br>John "Wheaties" Carr was Sam's son, or The Son Of Sam.<br><br>As you may recall, Berkowitz claimed that his neighbor Sam Carr's dog was sending him messages, as detailed in the note left for the detectives to find.<br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>...I am deeply hurt by your calling me a woman hater. I am not. But I am a monster. I am the 'Son of Sam.'...<br><br>...when father Sam gets drunk he gets mean. He beats his family. Sometimes he ties me up to the back of the house. Other times he locks me in the garage. Sam loves to drink blood. 'Go out and kill,' commands father Sam...</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br><br>Six months after Berkowitz was captured, Sam Carr committed suicide by shooting himself in the head with a rifle.<br>There is some speculation that he was murdered.<br><br>I really think that there was something to the speculations about Berkowitz's and John Carr's possible involvement in the Four Pi Movement, a Satanic cult that was into ritual murder?<br>Jeff covered this some time ago, and the evidence was quite compelling.<br><br>Berkowitz himself wrote that there are "other Sons out there- God Help The World."<br><br><br>EDIT: While thinking about all this, I remembered another Carr, named Lucien Carr, who killed his former scoutleader with a scout knife.<br>Carr was a friend of Kerouac, Burroughs and Ginsburg and the murder, according to Lucien, was self-defense, as his former scoutleader was trying to rape him.<br><br> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=johnnynemo>johnny nemo</A> at: 8/18/06 2:22 pm<br></i>
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Re: Ramsey Case: Emerging Child Sex-Ring Allegations,Politic

Postby chiggerbit » Fri Aug 18, 2006 4:49 pm

Uncle Sam posted this link, which is worth a deeper look. Interesting how often these child sex rings appear to have links to banking. <br><br> <!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.newsmakingnews.com/archive4,24,4,29,00.htm#The%20JonBenet%20Ramsey%20Case:%20Emerging%20Child%20Sex-Ring%20Allegations,%20Political%20Connections%20and%20a%20Suspect">www.newsmakingnews.com/ar...%20Suspect</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>Scroll down to <br><br>The JonBenet Ramsey Case: Emerging Child Sex-Ring Allegations, Political Connections and a Suspect by Alex Constantine © April 2000 CLICK.<br><br><br><br>"....2) Supporting Evidence of Child Sex Ring Involvement <br><br>As Calhoun mentioned, in March of this year, Boulder detectives flew to San Luis Obispo, California, to interview Mary Bienkowski, a licensed family therapist. Bienkowski claimed to have information pertaining to the JonBenét Ramsey murder investigation. The woman said that her mother's godfather is Fleet White, a friend of John Ramsey. The therapist had urged police in Boulder to interview her client: <br><br>Regarding Bienkowski: <br><br>CLIENT GAVE BOULDER POLICE NAMES OF PEOPLE WHO ARE WITNESSES IN JONBENET'S DEATH © 2000 Daily Camera<br><br>A private therapist said Friday she stands behind her client who claims to have crucial information that could help investigators in the death of JonBenét Ramsey. Mary Bienkowski, a licensed marriage, <br><br>family and child counselor, said her client gave Boulder police specific names of individuals who are witnesses in the killing of JonBenét as well as ongoing sexual and physical abuse of other children. <br><br>"If they do their job and investigate what needs to be investigated, the rest of the pieces will fall into place, and nobody is going to like what they find out," she said. "This person wouldn't be coming forward and risking everything if it were not because she wanted the abuse to stop and wanted to protect other children."<br><br>Bienkowski said she has treated her client for the past 10 years for trauma endured as a repeated victim of sexual assault. Because her client had information that a widespread sex ring could have been behind the Dec. 26, 1996, strangulation and beating death of 6-year-old JonBenét, she encouraged the woman to take the information to authorities.<br><br>JonBenét was found in the basement of her family's Boulder home. Her parents, John and Patsy, are the focus of a police investigation, although the couple have denied involvement in their daughter's death. <br><br>After 13 months of investigating the case, a Boulder grand jury disbanded in October without charges being filed. During an interview Friday with the Daily Camera at a downtown San Luis Obispo coffee shop, Bienkowski blasted the Boulder Police Department for not actively investigating the list of people she said her client believes may have knowledge of who killed JonBenét. <br><br>She would not divulge the names of those thought to be involved, saying that information should first be given to law enforcement officials. The Whites have not returned phone calls from the Daily Camera. John Ramsey's attorney has declined to comment on the new information. <br><br><br>Boulder police questioned Bienkowski's client in Colorado for five hours. The FBI interviewed her as well. Detectives also contacted her family and interviewed some of them in California. And then the whole matter was dropped. Bienkowski lost faith in the police and refused to cooperate any further.13<br><br>Who left warnings on her answering machine? The Daily Times-Call in Longmont, Colorado reported in March that a reliable witness "identified the voices as [those] of two women [among others] accused of victimizing the now-37-year-old [informant]. The woman remains in hiding."<br><br>The anonymous callers told Bienkowski:<br><br>1. "Hello Mary. This is a very interested party in regards to [your client's] welfare. [Her] past and her future are of no, of no concern to you. She made an error in judgment when she came to see you and you have caused her nothing but pain and suffering. Her main concern now is her new husband and her family. She has started a life and is going to be moving as far away from you as possible. She belongs with her family and nobody else. She is off limits to you."<br>2. [Caller Two]: "Hello. Leave [your client] alone. We take care of our own. Everything. And nothing is any of your business."<br>3. [Caller Two] "Hello. It's high time that you caught on that [the informant] doesn't have time for your foolishness. Thank you."<br>4. ]Caller Two] "[She] is going on an extended vacation with her family and while there will seek medical care for her problems. [The woman] has forgotten more than you will ever know."<br>5. [Caller Two] "Hello. Sticks and stones may break our bones, but words will never hurt us. So leave [her] alone. It's against the law to disturb the peace. Don't forget it."14 <br><br>The statement of the informant that JonBenet was killed in a sadistic sex game was upheld independently by forensic specialist Dr. Cyril Wecht, who studied the autopsy file and concluded that JonBenet's abuse occurred over a period of time.<br><br>Wecht: "This evidence of abuse, tied literally and figuratively to the cords around her neck and wrist, was enough to draw the conclusion that a sick sex game had gone awry." But the medical evidence "so far suggested that the vaginal penetration had been a carefully controlled, limited situation ‹ not a savage sexual assaults. While the attacker was applying the perverted use of the garrote that pinched the vagus nerve in her neck and eventually shut down her heart and lungs, the young prey had suddenly turned lifeless without explanation, perhaps literally in her abuser's arms. Wasn't it likely that the shocked and panicking molester had shaken JonBenet in a futile attempt to return her to consciousness? A few anxiety-driven shakes and a 'wake up! Wake up!' had failed to restore her to life, but had inflicted the bruises to the temporal lobes of the brain."15....."<br><br><br><br> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=chiggerbit@rigorousintuition>chiggerbit</A> at: 8/18/06 3:09 pm<br></i>
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Re: Ramsey Case: Emerging Child Sex-Ring Allegations,Politic

Postby chiggerbit » Fri Aug 18, 2006 6:54 pm

"...John Karr spoke with JonBenét's grandparents, but her parents refused to speak with him, Wexford Karr said...."<br><br><br>Could possibly explain how Karr had information that was not available to the media. <p></p><i></i>
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America's cute weird dead sweetheart

Postby nomo » Fri Aug 18, 2006 7:05 pm

<!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.salon.com/mwt/2006/08/18/jonbenet_bogus_distraction/">www.salon.com/mwt/2006/08...straction/</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>Wait, was Karl Rove in Boulder this week?<br><br>It's the best explanation for the way an incredible JonBenet Ramsey confession knocked real news off the air.<br><br>By Rebecca Traister<br><br>Aug. 18, 2006 | It has been a decade since the sensational murder of sexed-up 6-year-old JonBenet Ramsey; the case was officially cold. Other news eventually replaced the image of her big-eyed, ringlet-topped face. We had almost forgotten her, and the way she and her parents freaked us out and made us sad and beguiled us with empty-calorie news for the better part of a year. We've had stolen elections and Supreme Court shifts and a terror attack on American soil and wars in the Middle East. Last week we saw an 18-year Senate veteran lose his party's nomination because of his support for a corrupt president and a corrupt war. On Thursday a Detroit federal judge ruled that the Bush administration's warrantless wiretapping program is illegal and unconstitutional. This is heavy stuff.<br><br>So imagine the surprise, amid all this yucky news, to see the heavily rouged face of the tiniest, saddest beauty-pageant murder victim back in the headlines. It was almost enough to make you forget about the war and Middle Eastern politics and illegal eavesdropping, and think just about blond baby beauty queens and the men and women who may or may not have murdered them 10 years ago. Hey, stop this reverie! Don't think that Thursday passed without at least one person widening her eyes to the dawning realization that this John Mark Karr person seems about as likely to have murdered JonBenet Ramsey as he is to have abducted Chandra Levy or helped the Iranians with their nuclear program.<br><br>But was I the only person in America asking her colleagues, "Does anyone know if Karl Rove has any ties to Boulder?"<br><br>OK, so maybe I was. But I have a point. It's perfect, really. It's August. None of us want to wrap our heads around "complicated" news. We're mushy and suggestible. And we all know that that's just the way our president and his buddies like us. Trouble is, that damn real news keeps rearing its head. Wiretapping, Lebanon, something funky at the FDA, an insurgency in Iraq that just keeps expanding, no matter how forcefully they try to stuff it in the suitcase and sit on it till it closes. The busted London terror plot seemed promising for the administration, until the story line got complicated, and travelers got confused about how serious it was, started simply chucking the KY in their checked luggage and moved on.<br><br>If that didn't work, what could distract us? How about JonBenet Ramsey? She's cute, she's weird, she's dead! She's America's cute weird dead sweetheart! Her mother just died in June, we're coming up on the 10th anniversary of her slaying, and -- bonus! -- this month would have marked her Sweet 16 birthday. Seriously, what else could explain police work this shoddy? So shoddy that it takes the media approximately four hours to poke holes -- for instance, that the accused was probably in a different state at the time of the victim's demise -- in the case against Karr? (Not that this fact stopped CNN from blathering on about it most of Thursday night.) Did investigators bother to ask anyone about the facts before they held a press conference? It's as if they printed that Jennifer Aniston and Vince Vaughan got engaged on the cover of Us Weekly without checking with their publicists first.<br><br>Wait a minute! That happened this week too! How odd. It's true that the celebrity weekly sales are finally leveling off now that the soap operas taking place inside Katie Holmes' or Angelina Jolie's womb have reached their inevitable end. And the Bushies are no fools. They know what people want to read: They want their Jen happy and over Brad! Of course I'm not suggesting that Karl Rove would spread that kind of filth himself. We all know he's no leaker. But what exactly is Us editor Janice Min's relationship with Scooter Libby? And hey, who better than a high-up administration official to tip off Black Crowes frontman Chris Robinson that his wife, Kate Hudson, was diddling her "You, Me, and Dupree" star, Owen Wilson? OK, so that story didn't make the Times. But the Chicago Tribune, the Guardian, CNN, ABC ... good work, guys!<br><br>As long as we're at it, we also should consider the possibility that Secret Service agents are concealing Suri Cruise in a secure location, timing her big debut to coincide with the U.N. General Assembly meetings in September. Or maybe a big move against Iran? And I don't want to be some kind of crazy wacko tinfoil-hat person, but come on, can't you see Condi partying a little with Mel? You know, handing him a bottle of tequila and forcing him to watch "Bananas" 12 times in a row before sending him spinning down the Pacific Coast Highway?<br><br>But really, the celebrity stuff is small potatoes. What with increasingly shorter attention spans and all that, those headlines are good for maybe a week of distraction, 10 days if they involve Lindsay Lohan and her freckled nether regions. That's what made this JonBenet move so inspired, even if the execution was ham-handed. We need more of the true-crime stuff. More Nancy Grace, big cable news kinds of stories. More Amber Frey. More rosy-cheeked missing persons.<br><br>In fact, if he's smart, at this very moment, Rove should be standing outside Scott Peterson's jail cell, turning the key and yelling, "What are you waiting for? Run! Run, you idiot! Run like the wind! You have 24 hours before we call Greta Van Susteren!"<br><br>And should the pesky news cycle fail to shift away from our dire reality before the midterm elections, there's always the last resort, the big gun to pull, the one man to call: Anyone spoken to O.J. recently?<br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: America's cute weird dead sweetheart

Postby Et in Arcadia ego » Fri Aug 18, 2006 7:11 pm

I particularly enjoy how some assholes trivialize and scorn this poor child's viscious murder..<br><br> <p>____________________<br>Some are born to sweet delight, some are born to endless night.</p><i></i>
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Et in Arcadia

Postby Asta » Fri Aug 18, 2006 7:38 pm

"I particularly enjoy how some assholes trivialize and scorn this poor child's viscious murder..."<br><br>I understand how you feel. I saw the autopsy photos yesterday for the first time and realized how brutal and sadistic this murder was.<br><br>When I saw how tiny her little hands were, well, I just felt really sickened. It was overwhelming.<br><br>She was, after all, just a baby. The world she lived in never let her have a normal childhood. As an earlier poster said, her parents do share in the guilt. This child's life was sexed-up and I have to wonder if she ever had one moment of childhood innocence. Somehow, it doesn't seem possible. <br><br>Child beauty pagents should be outlawed. It's a meat market, it's wrong, it's sick, and I see not one good reason to let this crap continue. <p></p><i></i>
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Reality

Postby El Tedo » Fri Aug 18, 2006 8:14 pm

"I particularly enjoy how some assholes trivialize and scorn this poor child's viscious murder.."<br><br><br>It's unfortunate, but if you set your emotions aside for a moment, you'll realize that her tragic death is not even close to important news. Thousands of kids have been brutally murdered since 1997. Sometimes a murder is just a murder, but its strange how many perverts just love this story. Its just a distraction.<br><br>That Salon article had the right idea. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Et in Arcadia

Postby Et in Arcadia ego » Fri Aug 18, 2006 9:36 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>I understand how you feel. I saw the autopsy photos yesterday for the first time and realized how brutal and sadistic this murder was.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>I mean, seriously..I see people bitching about this being in the news, not just here, but all over, as if they don't have room in their own brains for more than one type of news. It's not like the news isn't out there; if you want to know it, you'll find it. Griping about this being in the headlines instead of a disaster of more suited to their own tastes makes me fucking sick..<br><br>One person on DU even called it a 'stupid, old case'..<br><br>What a fucking asshole. You wanna know why people get away with this kind of shit? <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>THAT'S</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> why..<br><br>I don't know what role, if any, this person has in her murder, but I'm <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>ALL ABOUT</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> her killer(s) being brought to justice, so this can be spammed on the news all they want. <p>____________________<br>Some are born to sweet delight, some are born to endless night.</p><i></i>
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To Arcadia

Postby Asta » Fri Aug 18, 2006 10:46 pm

If "we" (society) had been vigilent and never let the assholes get away with the crimes in our hometowns, had protected our children, stayed in touch, not been distracted by the bullshit, I believe we wouldn't be facing this social crisis that is coming at us at hell speed right now. Things are corrupt from the bottom up and inside out.<br><br>We as a human, moral species are in trouble. I'm not trying to be a scare-monger, but I am deeply troubled by the things I have been learning here on this forum, (MK, RA) I have been trying to find the courage to tackle the information and find a way to face it without burying my head in the sand. It is bad news for our children, our grandchildren and .... you do see what I mean, I am sure. It's frightening, and I feel much dispair for our future generations. <br><br>Sorry, I'm rambling, I think it's because I am finally waking up. And it's painful. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: To Arcadia

Postby sunny » Fri Aug 18, 2006 11:08 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>When I saw how tiny her little hands were, well, I just felt really sickened. It was overwhelming.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Exactly what I thought. At it's core, this is about the murder of a baby girl who never hurt a soul in her life. Not matter her mother put her in those atrocious pagaents, you just know she loved her little friends, her pets, her dolls, <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>and</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> her mommy. She did not deserve what happened to her. The person who did this was a beast, and catching that beast would be an important victory for justice. <p></p><i></i>
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Murder not suicide

Postby The Omega Man » Fri Aug 18, 2006 11:57 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Six months after Berkowitz was captured, Sam Carr committed suicide by shooting himself in the head with a rifle.<br>There is some speculation that he was murdered.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>No speculation, the shot was directly into the back of Carr's head and how does one inscribe the numbers '666' onto ones own hand in ones own blood post mortem? There's a picture of Carr in the crime scene in Terry's book. It was a hit by a clean up team whacking out members before the detectives could talk to them. Please read Maury Terry's book "The Ultimate Evil" and take a good look behind the curtain. The Manson murders, the Zodiac Killings, and the Son(s) of Sam terror spree are all connected.<br><br>Apologies to all for the temporary digression from topic. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: To Arcadia

Postby Rigorous Intuition » Fri Aug 18, 2006 11:58 pm

I think of the James Gaines quote prefacing the <!--EZCODE LINK START--><a href="http://www.konformist.com/jonbenet.htm">Konformist</a><!--EZCODE LINK END--> article: "To know who murdered JonBenét Ramsey is to know what world we live in."<br><br>If this were an isolated case it would be both a tragedy and a distraction. Because it's not, I think we'd better pay it some attention. <p></p><i></i>
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In retrospect

Postby greencrow0 » Sat Aug 19, 2006 1:10 am

I posted here but it was deleted and I was asked to give my password again...<br><br>anyway<br><br>...what I said was that I am also looking at this murder with new eyes and with the hindsight of 9/11, I suspect the murderer must have had a lot of power with the government and institutions.<br><br>gc <p></p><i></i>
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Pure speculation

Postby professorpan » Sat Aug 19, 2006 1:53 am

Karr has always liked the little girls. He knows he is sick, yet he can't deny his attractions. He's tormented by his illness.<br><br>JonBenet is murdered in Colorado.<br><br>He is mesmerized by her beauty. He empathizes with her victimization. Like a high percentage of the citizens of the United States, he watches the parade of JonBenet images on TV, and is caught up in the Ramsey mystery.<br><br>He is obsessed. He's also fascinated at how love turns into murder. He becomes aware that his own desires, no matter how pure, could lead to violence. And since he's always been a good guy -- an upstanding, religious, friendly fellow, with righteous intentions -- he decides to take action.<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.drudgereport.com/flash5.htm">www.drudgereport.com/flash5.htm</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>Nate Karr, John's brother, in an interview with Greta Van Susteren:</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>VAN SUSTEREN: Did he ever mention to you the death of JonBenet?<br><br>KARR: Yes, he did, actually. That maybe we could get into more in depth. He was in the process several years ago, you know, maybe five, six years ago, long after the JonBenet murder, about researching a book he was going to try to write about men who create -- commit these horrible crimes against children. And I think he had even, at one point, been in contact with several, you know, convicted people. Like, I think that he actually had correspondence with the gentleman that was involved in the Polly Klaas case, and things of that nature. He was on the Internet, you know, doing research for his book.<br><br>And that's why I say, you know, it's very possible that through his investigations for the book he was trying to write, you know, he was contacting people. He was trying to get the real feeling of why these people did this, what they were doing, how they would possibly go about doing this. And maybe, you know, the FBI or whatever saw this -- you know, his going to contact these people or him researching the Ramsey case so thoroughly and having such interest in it, maybe -- that is the only possible way that we think that he could have been brought into this because, of course, there's going to be no physical evidence. If they do, in fact, have DNA at the scene, please test him immediately so he can be vindicated.<br><hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Karr goes <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>deep</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> undercover. He has nothing to lose. He infiltrates the depths of the RA underground, working his way around the globe, from Europe to Central America to Thailand. He sees the stuff of nightmares. And as he learns, he remembers, and compiles lists of names, and places, and details.<br><br>Not to say he doesn't enjoy much of what he sees. He slakes his own thirst, of course, much like a crooked DEA agent helps himself to a bit of the contraband after a raid.<br><br>He knows that he's a dead man if he tries to expose the things he has learned. He's already wanted for possession of child pornography in California, after all -- he's an international criminal on the run. He has been feeding details to Michael Tracey via email, but it's not doing much good.<br><br>He has secrets. Lots of secrets. Names, from Petaluma to Boulder to Paris, the Netherlands, Costa Rica, and -- of course -- Thailand. Civil servants, government, industry. An international brotherhood, of sorts.<br><br>There's one way to go public, and to be assured of a global soapbox. One way to be on every newspaper and website, front page, above the fold.<br><br>Read his comments with that theory in mind.<br><br><br><br> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=professorpan>professorpan</A> at: 8/19/06 12:02 am<br></i>
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