Israel shelling Lebanon

by **Gouda** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 9:13 am

No. I would set him up in Beruit or Gaza, get him a nice place, something modest, close to a market. Running water. A fridge. A reading lamp or two. Following his logic, there he'd be fair prey to the whims of self-defense and those who have the power to define its terms. One hot evening, he may find himself the victim of a moral self-defense bomb undeliberately nontargeting his guilty noncivilian ass, which if it did not miserably cut him off from life on the wrong side, it would be a slightly lesser death than a death on the right side. I imagine if given the choice he would rather take it direct by firing squad rather than suffer the indignity of anonymous, arbitrary inequivalency.

by **sunny** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 9:46 am

In case this hasn't been posted- <a href="http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article14000.htm" target="top">Robert Fisk</a> (sorry if it has) Also, from <a href="http://atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/HG18Ak02.html" target="top">Asia Times</a>- Israel's path to total war By Kaveh L Afrasiabi One of the most malignant aspects of the new chapter in the Arab-Israeli conflict is the myth of Israel as the assaulted party, lavishly propagated by the White House and the infinite pro-Israel pundits in the US media, including the editors of the New York Times, who have labeled Israel's blatant aggression against the nation of Lebanon as "legally and morally justified". Never mind that the rest of the world, including the European Union, does not share this perception of who is mainly at fault for the deadly cycle of violence that has gripped the Middle East again. The irony is that one can detect greater voices of dissent and opposition to Israel's massive, disproportionate response to the token kidnapping of a few of its soldiers than is the case in the "pluralistic" US media, nowadays sheepishly toeing the official line. This line was expressed by President George W Bush in his press conference alongside President Vladimir Putin on Sunday when he stated firmly, "In my judgment, the best way to stop the violence is to understand why the violence occurred in the first place. And that's because Hezbollah has been launching rocket attacks out of Lebanon into Israel." Sure, Hezbollah conducted a raid across the border and kidnapped {I continue to resent this characterization-soldiers are CAPTURED in a war zone-sunny} two Israeli soldiers, and that as a show of solidarity with the much-repressed Palestinians, but the rocket attacks on Israel were in response to Israel's massive bombardment clearly pre-planned to attain the dual objective of defanging Hezbollah and creating a regime change in Lebanon, perhaps as a prelude to a wider war on Syria and Iran. Gideon Levy in the liberal Israeli paper Haaretz has put it cogently: "In Gaza, a soldier is abducted from the army of a state that frequently abducts civilians from their homes and locks them up for years with or without a trial - but only we're allowed to do that. And only we're allowed to bomb civilian population centers." The White House-led masterly mischaracterization of the chronology of events culminating in the widening war show how nicely adapted are the standards of public relations that serve the Israeli war machine, currently pressing hard to pave the road for a future attack on Iran, by either the US or Israel itself, without the fear of any retaliation through Lebanon, thus depriving Iran of one of its multiple lines of defense. Little wonder, then, that the pro-Israeli pundits in Washington are wasting no time in pushing for an attack on Iran. "Why wait?" asks William Kristol of the Standard Weekly, rationalizing his warmongering bid in the form of "It is our war, too." But of course, assuming that the script for war on Iran began with the one-ton bombs on Gaza residential neighborhoods a few weeks ago, propelling Hezbollah inevitably into action, and the specter of wider war getting more and more imminent as we witness the ever-expanding list of "targets" by Israel, now including government buildings in both Gaza and Lebanon. Ze'ev Schiff, considered a top Israeli military analysts, penned an article titled "Invitation for escalation: Take note of what hasn't been hit" arguing that the Israeli air raids were deliberately selective, sparing the Lebanese government and army and focusing on Hezbollah strongholds. But wire reports of "colossal damage" to Beirut in retaliation for the Hezbollah rocket attacks on Haifa tell a distinctly different story, that is, a spiraling conflict that is fast turning the capital city of a sovereign nation to rubble. Not to be outdone by the Israeli apologists, New York Times columnist David Brooks disingenuously penned an opinion article in the Sunday paper titled "As Israel withdraws, its enemies go berserk". Putting the discourse of Israel as the aggrieved party to full throttle, Brooks and other like-minded pundits are busy cultivating an ill-informed American public, as there is no serious attempt by the US media to bring home the Palestinians' sufferings to Americans. There are not even half-decent reports on their plight after the recent barrage of lethal Israel attacks throwing Gaza into "semi-feudalism", other than a passing reference in the New York Times that there is no electricity or adequate running water, causing the beginning of a massive health epidemic. As Arnold Toynbee once wrote in A Study of History, "The absent are always in the wrong." A war to create Pax Israelica? A disconcerting truth, revealed recently by two prominent Jewish American political scientists, about the extraordinary control of United States' foreign policy by the pro-Israel forces, has now been fully confirmed by the empirical realities of this brutal war. Despite dire warnings by certain US politicians, such as Senator John Warner, the Bush administration has failed to call on Israel to halt its offensive, opting instead to focus on Syria and Iran - reminding one of the Vietnam War when Moscow or Peking (Beijing) were often blamed for the efforts of the North Vietnamese. History unfortunately repeats itself more often on the tragic side, for otherwise we would not be witnessing such concerted scapegoating of Syria and Iran for the two-pronged warfare Israel has deliberately ignited. On the one hand, this is to dismantle the Palestinian Authority and return the Palestinians to the status quo ante, somewhat similar to the millet system in the old Ottoman Empire (in the best-case scenario). And on the other hand, seeking the "implementation of the UN resolution" calling for the disarming of Lebanese militias. Of course, from an observer's point of view, it is ironic that Israel has no qualms about disregarding other relevant United Nations resolutions, above all 242 and 338, which call for the restoration of rights of Palestinians, focusing selectively on a resolution pertaining to a sovereign nation. As the tide of war intensifies, it is increasingly obvious that Israel's hidden objective is to inflict such mortal wounds on the weak nation of Lebanon as to bring it to its knees and thus take a giant step toward its grandiose objective of a Pax Israelica. A big regional superpower, bounded in a small physical space and bloody, ill-defined borders, Israel's warmongering is not a result of its absence of policy, as claimed by The Nation's recent editorial. Rather, it is the result of a sedimented power dynamism better understood from the prism of the (Michel) Foucaultian theoretical framework, which shows how the operation of (sacred) knowledge/power of Zionist ideology has now manifested itself in the deadly form of military regression that Israel has opted for in Lebanon and the occupied territories. Indeed, Gideon Levy and other Israeli liberals currently bemoaning Israel's "war of choice" miss this crucial point that long ago was articulated by the likes of Maxime Rodinson in his writings on Israel as a post-colonialist, expansionist state, for the very motif of this state militates against anything short of a "Greater Israel". The key question is, of course, if the present architects of this state will ever settle for the less-than-grandiose notion of a tiny Jewish state in a sea of Arabs. Looking back, at Israel's masterly use of preemptive warfare, most vividly demonstrated in the course of the 1967 war, and its clever maneuvers of taking half-steps toward the fulfillment of a "two-state" solution, such as the Oslo Agreements, only somehow to nullify those measures under one excuse or another, then their breach of peace with Lebanon and the Palestinian people is anything but surprising. Rather, Israel's actions today fully conform with its prior history, and its cyclical pattern of warfare with its Arab subjects and neighbors. Israel's strategy of provoking the "hostile other", eg, by assassination of a Hamas chief on June 8 and its "mistaken" shelling of Gaza, killing scores of civilians, without venturing a word of apology to the innocent victims, is indeed quite familiar in the annals of Arab-Israeli conflict, as is its strategy of massive, overwhelming response to a token breach from Lebanon. A more penetrating vision may, no doubt, discern some underlying, disconcerting realities, about the nature of world politics, role of power and the premature post-Cold War predictions of the world's passage beyond the old paradigm known as "realism". The military logic of action by Israel, discarding all peaceful options with the Palestinian people, is indicative of a Leviathan running rampant, in a world supposedly led by the US "unipolar moment". Yet that moment is increasingly turning a different color, that is, as the appendage of a much smaller state, whose supporters "wield political power disproportionate to their number", to paraphrase Toynbee. To add to Toynbee's insight, as the biased interpretations of the present conflict cited above clearly show, wielding media power is a key as to how this political power has come to such heights that bedevil and mesmerizes those who study it today. Kaveh L Afrasiabi, PhD, is the author of After Khomeini: New Directions in Iran's Foreign Policy (Westview Press) and co-author of "Negotiating Iran's Nuclear Populism", Brown Journal of World Affairs, Volume XII, Issue 2, Summer 2005, with Mustafa Kibaroglu. He also wrote "Keeping Iran's nuclear potential latent", Harvard International Review. He is author of Iran's Nuclear Program: Debating Facts Versus Fiction. (Copyright 2006 Asia Times Online Ltd. All rights reserved.

by **AlicetheCurious** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 9:53 am

This is a debate?! Thanks for nothing, Canada: <a href="http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20060718.MIDEASTHARPER18/TPStory/">THE MIDEAST CONFLICT: THE CANADIAN DEBATE</a> Harper refuses to budge PM unwavering in support for Israel despite appeals to moderate stand JANE TABER SENIOR POLITICAL WRITER; With a report from Canadian Press ST. PETERSBURG -- Prime Minister Stephen Harper refused yesterday to budge in his support for Israel and its response to the deepening crisis in the Middle East, despite criticism from opposition MPs and Lebanese Canadians that he should have appealed for restraint and moved faster to evacuate Canadians from Lebanon. Mr. Harper said the conflict is the result of the fact that there is no Middle East peace process because "the current Palestinian government is not committed to a peace process. "Secondly, there is an immediate crisis because of the actions of Hamas and the actions of Hezbollah," he said, referring to the radical Islamic movement that controls the Palestinian Authority and the Shia Muslim group that controls much of southern Lebanon. He said the key to ending the crisis is not an immediate ceasefire, as has been advocated by some members of the Group of Eight industrialized countries at their annual summit here, but rather the safe return of three kidnapped Israeli soldiers and the end of "Hezbollah attacks on Israel." These were Mr. Harper's first comments on the violence in the Middle East since eight Canadians, seven from a Montreal family, were killed Sunday in an Israeli air raid on Lebanon. Relatives of the Al-Akhrass family appealed to the government to act swiftly to evacuate other Canadians. ... "We are not going into the temptation of some to single out Israel, which was the victim of the initial attack," he said. Mr. Harper said neither he nor his officials have contacted Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert for an explanation of the air strike on Sunday that killed a Montreal pharmacist, his wife, their four young children and others. He offered his condolences to the victims' families at the start of his news conference. "The onus remains on the parties that caused the conflict to take steps to end the conflict," he said. "But obviously we urge Israel and others to minimize civilian damage. It is difficult, though, we recognize it is difficult when you're fighting a non-governmental organization that's embedded in a civilian population." Former Liberal foreign minister Lloyd Axworthy said Mr. Harper was abandoning Canada's traditional role of honest broker in the Middle East. "He's almost at the forefront of a very small group of nations who say whatever Israel does is right. . . . We're becoming part of the problem, not part of the solution," Mr. Axworthy said. Mr. Harper said a statement issued by the G8 leaders accurately reflects his government's position. He said the G8 "sent a firm message that the extremists who committed cross-border murder and kidnapped Israeli soldiers bear the responsibility for instigating the crises in Lebanon and Gaza. ...[/quote]

by **OnoI812** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 11:07 am

I don't have the patience to read through the whole thread. so excuse me if this has already been covered. Hopefully there is someone that can translate German better than Google. This Junge Welt article from the 14th seems to suggest that Lebanon was complaining to the UN about Israeli incursions and false flag prior to the kidnappings(which quite possibly, as Al Manar reported, happened on the Lebanese side of the border) this month. It also says that the Mossad is behind a whole rash of Carbombings and assassinations within Lebanon, some with the help of laser guidance from Israeli aircraft. The USA and France protect Mossad Lebanon is to be held to bring up for discussion attempted assassinations of the Israeli secret service before the UN Jürgen Cain Külbel Does the continuous Lebanon campaign actually revolve only around” retaliation “for the capture of two Israeli soldiers? Briefly before the israli army marched into the neighboring country and began with the bombardment of several targets, the government in Beirut at the UN security council in New York had a resolution or at least a statement requires, which condemns the recent activities of terror of the State of Israel on Lebanese territory according to international law. ” This affair brought the United States and France in embarrassment, announced “the Lebanese news station, al Manar. From diplomatic circles in Lebanon it was to be experienced on Tuesday that western countries Beirut forced at present, which UN security council a Meeting concerning the networks of the Israeli foreign secret service Mossad do not abzuverlangen, which had dug the Lebanese security authorities in June. The boss of the Mossad, Meir Dagan, had maximumpersonally recruited the prominent heads of the gangs (Lebonese Maronites, and Phalange) and particularly from Israel for carbomb attacks and crime member of its secret service into Lebanon fly to let, those there in concentrated action to May 26, 2006 the Dschihad leader Mahmoud Majzoub exekutierten. The attempted assassinations have continuity: To May 20, 2002 had been murdered Jihad Ahmad Jibril, son by Ahmad Jibril, boss of the people front for the release of Palestine (PFLP), the Hisbollah politician Ali Saleh on 2 August 2003. Also for liquidating Ali Hassan of thief on August 16,1999 is responsible the secret service troop. ” We regard as an act of the aggression “, avowed Prime Minister Fouad Siniora briefly after search success and announced: ” We work on a summary, and if everything is complete, we will submit a complaint at the UN security council “. The Lebanese State Department confirmed on Tuesday that under those, which spoke with Lebanese official ones, in order to induce the political guidance in Beirut to the break of desiring also US Ambassador Jeffrey Feltman was. Feltman had already intervened, the affair could impair the American-Lebanese relations and the military aid for Lebanon. In the State Department” one regrets this policy of the double moral “operated by western powers. In particular the USA and France urge well-known-measured on brisk conversion of the UN-resolution 1559, which demands a complete disarmament of the Shiite Hisbollah. The State Department stressed, to” Beirut in a meeting of the security council will persist “. Of Lebanon minister of foreign affairs Fawzi Salloukh it hopes besides that the security council will direct its attention also toward” the repeated Non stop injuries of the Lebanese air space by Israeli military aircraft and combat hunters(commandos), which were used when planning of the activities of terror against Lebanon. It referred to Secretary of Defense Elias Murr, which regards it after the conditions of the determinations as” very probably “that Israeli military aircraft were involved by laser ignition in the release by autobombs(carbombs). President Émile Lahoud wants to hand the determination results of the Lebanese authorities to the UN-investigator over, Serge Brammertz, whose commission of inquiry wants to clear the murder up at the former Lebanese Prime Minister Hariri on 14 February 2005. <a href="http://tinyurl.com/z9zox">tinyurl.com/z9zox</a> a better translation would be appreciated on edit, more about Meir Dagan: On November 26, 2001 Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon appointed a military hawk, reserve IDF Major-General Meir Dagan to head the Israeli team that will work with US envoys Anthony Zinni and William Burns. Sharon's diplomatic adviser, Danny Ayalon, former Israeli Ambassador to the US Dore Gold, and Foreign and Defense Ministry representatives are also included in the Israeli negotiating team. Meir Dagan has been a close confidante of Ariel Sharon for three decades and was active in Sharon's election campaign last February. The two men share not only a long military career together, but also hard-line views regarding Israel's relations with its neighbors. Military career 1970s: Under Sharon's command as chief of the Israeli army's southern command, Dagan led a special anti-terrorist unit in the Gaza Strip. He headed the Rimon undercover unit, which killed Palestinian militants wanted by Israel in Gaza. 1982: As a commander in southern Lebanon during the Israeli invasion and ensuing war, he helped establish the pro-Israel South Lebanese Army. He is said to have been the first Israeli to enter Beirut in a tank. According to foreign reports, in the 1980s Dagan was involved in similar activities in Lebanon a he was in the Gaza Strip. 1987-1993: As special assistant to the army's chief of staff during the first Palestinian Intifada, he was involved in the establishment of undercover units operating in the West Bank and Gaza Strip. Political career 1995: After retiring from the army, Dagan joined Israel's secret service as deputy director. 1997: Then Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu appointed Dagan as his counter-terrorism advisor. Dagan was probably behind the failed assassination attempt against Hamas leader, Khaled Mish'al in 1997. When Dagan took up that post, reports said he wanted to expand his mandate and initiate more "offensive" and "aggressive" measures. Thus, an attempt on a Hamas leader's life would fit into Dagan's frame of reference. Dagan remained in that position under former Prime Minister Ehud Barak. A long time opponent of the Oslo peace accords, Dagan finally resigned after Barak appointed a more moderate retired major general to run his new security-diplomatic team. Dagan's Positions on Jerusalem, January 2000 Camp David talks and the current Intifada: On August 30, 2000, Dagan told CSNews.com that if Arafat is given control of parts of Jerusalem, while keeping it as an open city, "Israel would no longer have the ability to control its border and terrorist organizations such as Hamas and Islamic Jihad would have free access - not only to Jerusalem but to the rest of Israel." Regarding proposals to give Arafat control over the Temple Mount, known as the Haram As-Sharif to Palestinians, Major-General Dagan said: "I don't see any logic in giving the Temple Mount (to Arafat) and cutting a border on the most delicate point, when Israel is able to provide freedom of worship to anyone and maintain overall security responsibility all over Jerusalem." On Israel's assassination policy that has claimed the lives of 77 Palestinians so far, 20 of whom were bystanders, Dagan said that from Israel's standpoint the aim is to thwart attacks on its citizens any way it can. While executing terrorist ringleaders is not a policy, "it is one of the tools a state takes to prevent attacks and to boost deterrence," Dagan said. Source: Jerusalem Post, December 15, 2000. Reactions to Dagan's November 2001 appointment (to filled in as more comes) Israeli opposition leader Yossi Sarid accused Sharon on Monday, Nov. 23, 2001 of appointing a team of extremists to the talks, to ensure their failure. Palestinian legislator Hanan Ashrawi said: "Sharon is not interested in a political solution to the problem and the appointment of Dagan reflects his intentions." Foreign Minister Shimon Peres has come under criticism from his own party for approving Dagan's appointment. Party member Haim Ramon said: "On the day you agreed to Dagan's appointment, the slightest chance of bringing about a ceasefire was buried." Peres's top aide, the director-general of the foreign ministry Avi Gil, said he would not take a position in the team, in protest of Dagan's appointment. Only, Moshe Arens, a parliamentary deputy for Sharon's Likud party and a former defence minister who had worked Dagan, defended the appointment. "These aren't negotiations that go beyond the ceasefire, and that's why he's the right man for the job," Arens said. According The Guardian: "The appointment of a fellow hawk with a bloody military record as lead negotiator is seen as a clear message to Washington, the Palestinians - who have cruel memories of Gen. Dagan - and to Mr. Peres and other Labor members of Mr. Sharon's government, that the Israeli leader has no intention of abandoning his hardline policies. Mr. Peres had wanted to head the negotiating team, and Palestinian officials were dismayed at Gen. Dagan's appointment. Mr. Sharon amplified his position with a further rebuff to the US team by repeating his insistence on seven days of absolute quiet before implementing a ceasefire that would require Israel to lift its siege of Palestinian cities, and freeze settlement in the West Bank and Gaza. Sources: BBC News Website November 2001; Ha'aretz, "Who decided, who approved and why", October 7, 1997, The Guardian, "Hardline general who led death squad is Israel's peace negotiator", November 27, 2001. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=onoi812>OnoI812</A> at: 7/18/06 9:26 am

by **Gouda** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 12:26 pm

A good companion piece to the Junge Welt article: <a href="http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/D259C343-ED88-4C43-B839-BCEFBED61924.htm">english.aljazeera.net/NR/...D61924.htm</a> <blockquote>Quote:<hr>'Lebanon crisis an international conspiracy' By Firas Al-Atraqchi As'ad AbuKhalil, author of Bin Laden, Islam, and America's New 'War on Terrorism' as well as The Battle for Saudi Arabia: Royalty, Fundamentalism, and Global Power, believes the recent violence is a symptom of an international conspiracy under way to enforce UN resolution 1559, which calls for the disarmament of militia groups in Lebanon - a reference to Hezbollah. A professor of political science at California State University, Stanislaus, and visiting professor at the University of California at Berkeley, AbuKhalil just returned from Lebanon. ... Hezbollah did not surprise Israel with the capture of the two Israeli occupation soldiers. Hezbollah leader Hasan Nasrallah has repeatedly warned that if Israel does not release its Lebanese prisoners, he will be compelled to take Israeli soldiers as bargaining chips. And Israel has not been sitting idly by since its partial withdrawal from South Lebanon in 2000. It has not only continued to occupy parts of South Lebanon, but also has been violating Lebanese sovereignty, by air, sea, and land. Israel has also been kidnapping innocent Lebanese citizens: fishermen and shepherds. And one fisherman from Tyre - my hometown - is still missing, and at least one shepherd was killed last year. Furthermore, Israel has adamantly refused to give to Lebanon a map of the more than 400,000 land mines that it left behind in South Lebanon, and which continue to kill Lebanese children in the region. The recent crisis, as the article in the Washington Post by Robin Wright pointed out yesterday, is an international/regional conspiracy to implement United Nations Security Council resolution 1559. The groundwork for this aggression began with the work of Rafiq al-Hariri [the slain former Lebanese prime minister] in 2004, when he worked with the US and France to pass that resolution in the Security Council.<hr></blockquote> This would partially confirm that: <blockquote>Quote:<hr>Annan calls for beefed-up U.N. force in Lebanon EU says it's ready to help BRUSSELS, Belgium (AP) -- U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan called on Tuesday for establishing a strong international force in Lebanon -- adopting one of the key emerging ideas on how to end what he termed "the fighting and the killing" in the Middle East...<hr></blockquote> <a href="http://edition.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/07/18/mideast.annan.ap/index.html">edition.cnn.com/2006/WORL...index.html</a>

by **Gouda** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 12:32 pm

Reminder...Gaza. Anyone heard anything?

by **trachys** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 12:51 pm

SIR The IDF does NOT need you to justify its acts of aggression. I'm horrified that you represent my country on "the international stage." You sick fuck. Satan is preparing an exquisite chamber of delights, to entertain you throughout eternity. Meh, who am I kidding, a psychopath gives no thought to an afterlife. So it is that I solemnly curse you, and those who work for you, with a slow, and by slow I mean by fractions incrementally but inevitably approaching a suffocation of horror-inducing intensity, painful death. *** a former CIA analyst analyses "Atrocities in the Promised Land" at counterpunch.org: <a href="http://www.counterpunch.org/christison07172006.html">www.counterpunch.org/chri...72006.html</a>

by **AlicetheCurious** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 6:34 pm

Gouda, check out the Electronic Intifada, a good source of information on Palestinian issues: <a href="http://electronicintifada.net/new.shtml">electronicintifada.net/new.shtml</a> <blockquote>Quote:<hr>Israeli Occupation Forces (IOF) continued the aggression on the Gaza Strip for the 4th consecutive week, inflicting additional casualties among Palestinian civilians and destruction of civilian property. IOF continue to systematically target infrastructure and governmental institutions, to undermine the Palestinian political system. Further, IOF continue to hold nearly 1.5 million Palestinians in the Gaza Strip hostages after closing all its borders, and prevent food and supplies from entering the Strip freely. The situation is the worst in years, and could escalate into a humanitarian and environmental catastrophe. As this press release is published, IOF continue to advance into the town of Beit Hanoun, and to isolate it from its surroundings. Most of the town is under direct IOF occupation. Many families were forced to flee their houses due to indiscriminate IOF shelling. IOF troops have taken over residential structures and converted them into military outposts, while detaining hundreds of civilians, including journalists, inside. IOF use these detained civilians as human shields during bulldozing and detention operations. IOF have prevented the Red Cross and some relief organizations from accessing the area. ... ...the 30,000 residents of Beit Hanoun are under direct IOF occupation. IOF continue to bulldoze houses, and residents are forcibly fleeing their houses due to indiscriminate shelling. It is noted that all border areas in the Gaza Strip are under unprecedented, indiscriminate shelling. Families from El-Shoka community, east of Rafah, are forcibly fleeing their houses, and seeking refuge in temporary shelters provided by UNRWA. PCHR reiterates its condemnation of IOF willful killing of Palestinian civilians. The Centre considers these crimes as a form of reprisal and collective punishment against Palestinians, which is a violation of article 33 of the Fourth Geneva Convention. ... In the Center’s view, the complacency of the international community and the High Contracting Parties of the 4th Geneva Convention and their failure to take effective steps to stop Israeli war crimes has been a supporting and encouraging element for Israel to continue perpetrating additional war crimes against Palestinian civilians. The legal cover provided to Israel by the US, which purposely hinders International Humanitarian Law, and the conspiracy of silence by Europe encourage Israeli to continue to perpetrate war crimes unchecked, placing it above international law. <a href="http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article5048.shtml">electronicintifada.net/v2...5048.shtml</a> <hr></blockquote>

by **Joe Hillshoist** » Tue Jul 18, 2006 11:35 pm

This is some of Tony Jones' interview with Ehud Barak, last night on <a href="http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2006/s1690079.htm" target="top">lateline.</a> <blockquote>Quote:<hr>TONY JONES: But I'm just wondering, are the people of Israel hearing about what is happening in Lebanon: that thousands of foreigners are trapped there; that warships are being sent there to evacuate them; that Australian and Canadians and other citizens are caught in areas that are being bombed by Israel planes? Do Israelis realise this is happening? EHUD BARAK: Um, I don't think that we are aware of it to the extent that you have described, but we will become aware of it. Basically, I think what the international community could easily do is trying to put pressure on the Lebanese Government, the Syrians in a way, to put an end to it. If the Lebanese Government will order its armed forces to move to the south, backed by the international will, I think that it will dramatically reduce the level of violence and probably stop it. <hr></blockquote> Um I don't think we are aware of it at all. Hmmm. <blockquote>Quote:<hr> TONY JONES: But only overnight 12 Lebanese soldiers were killed by an Israel air strike. I mean, I would imagine they would be afraid to send armed troops to the south for fear that they too would be caught up in the fighting. EHUD BARAK: Oh, no. No reason for them to avoid it. We will not hit them. The only place we hit is sea borne RADAR systems which cooperated with the Hezbollah in arranging shooting missiles towards our missile boat. So I don't think that it's a place where they were involved with the Hezbollah directly. I am aware of the fact that when you fight on those kind of large-scale intensive fighting, there's no way to be fully in full control of every individual of an aircraft or every single piece of munition. But basically I don't see any reason why the Lebanese Government cannot order its armed forces to move in a coordinated way to the south to take over the border to push the Hezbollah out and I believe it could lead very easily to the end of these fire exchanges.<hr></blockquote> I am laughing at Baraks bullshit at the mo. But its only to stop screaming. <blockquote>Quote:<hr> EHUD BARAK: Yeah. Until two years ago, the Government was a puppet government of the Syrians and they did not want to do that. But now there is a weak government, but a democratic one, that wants to see the Hezbollah dismantled and it's up to the world to back them in a convincing way and tell them, "We are behind you. Don't be frightened. We will come to your help if necessary to help you exercise your sovereignty over the whole sovereignty of Lebanon." I believe that if they will feel the support of the world leadership in their backs, they are capable of doing it. They are clearly willing to do it. TONY JONES: But, Ehud Barak, how could they do that when Israel has effectively declared war on them, has bombed its civilian infrastructure, its international airport in Beirut has been bombed, sea ports, bridges, communication infrastructure, electrical plants, houses, vehicles on the roads, have been bombed by the Israelis. It's hard to see that the Lebanese Government would be able to do anything at all at the present moment. You've declared war on them. EHUD BARAK: We did not - I repeat - we did not declare war on the Lebanese Government. We declared war on Hezbollah. I believe that no government on earth would accept the situation that someone tries to - Hezbollah tries to dictate to us, as well as the Hamas from the other side of the Gaza Strip. Namely, the first attribute of any legitimate sovereign is the monopoly on the use of weapons. No one would accept or enable where a political party, which has its Members in the Parliament, even the Government, has its own militia with weapons and they shoot rockets at will of the militia, not of the Government, into a neighbouring sovereign. That's no way to accept it. The primal contract of our Government with our nation, as well as your Government with your public, is to protect them. If this would have happened in Sydney or Melbourne, I have no doubt what Prime Minister Howard or his predecessors would have done. I'm talking from experience. I know him very well. TONY JONES: Well, let me just put this to you. This is what Lebanon's Prime Minister has said tonight. He said Israel - and this is the man you want to help you - he said Israel is now a terrorist country that's committing every day terrorist acts. He's talking about the bombing campaign that's hitting Lebanese targets, that has killed now a very large number of Lebanese civilians. Where can this go now? EHUD BARAK: You know, it is up to him. If the Lebanese Government would start to govern, namely to exercise this monopoly on the other weapons,<hr></blockquote> You should have seen the look on his face at this point.<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol"> There is so much in this. 1 Monopoly on weapons remember that people the state wants to exercise a monopoly on weapons 2 Does he really want the rest of the world to stand up and help the Lebanese exercise their solidarity. 3 Tony Jones says last night you killed 12 Leb soldiers, why would they go anywhere near you. Barak says, oh no if we go they won't be at risk. No really, cross my heart. 4 Notice his reluctance to confirm the Israeli people actually knew what was happening in Lebanon. No wonder the whole place is in such a mess. I suppose this state of affairs suits the IDF and its real backers. That way the Israeli people will be more likely to go "WHy us what have we done they are attacking us and we must fight back." I was actually surprised to see Jones giving him even this much hassle. Usually he is embarassingly pro Israel. But he(Well lateline) still gets Robert fiske on every week or so, and when Fiske accuses him of being pro israel, he shuts up about it and lets Fiske say his piece. Barak was struggling for the whole interview tho. He knew his position was indefensible from an international POV, and he tried to sound all "we are just defending our people" and reasonable, but just getting to annoyed. It was like he was unable to comprehend the world outside the terms Israel = Good Anti Israel = Bad. Fair enough for someone in charge of protecting their nations interests (he was a former PM), but not in this context. In fact it seems as if he didn't want to believe that his nation was actually doing the damage it was to PEOPLE. Read that any way you like. Some will say typical attitude of the Jews to the Goy. I prefer to think of it as a symptom of the sociopathic tendencies of all national leaders, and power brokers. Its not unique to jewish people. Thats what I am talking about when I say Israel is batshit psycho Alice. Not as some way of getting all touchy feely with them. But because if you don't understand people's bahavior you will not be effective in dealing with it. Read Jeffs latest blog and think about Israel in terms of lack of empathy, and the same old boring shit repeating itself (ie banal evil). then see if the same thing could apply to yourself. Persdonally thats always the first step for me. AS bad as the agenda of Israel and their brutal actions are, who do they really serve? I'll tell you who, the reemerging Nazi mentality. Maybe they were right about some Jewish bankers being essentially evil. What are they the only bankers like that? Get real. but that served the Nazis very well in their attempts to feed the gods of war. Over 50 million dead in violence. Not including the shit Stalin got up to at the same time. And they are coming back. All the old ww2 vets are going now. People who were born during the war are reaching retirement age, and being medicated and shut away where no one listens to them. The one true aeons old enemy of human freedom is coming back in the guise it wore most effectively, black leather and jackboots. And all this bullshit about Israel being the new Nazis is just that - bullshit. they are wanna bes. All heil the new right.

by **Et in Arcadia ego** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 12:02 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan called on Tuesday for establishing a strong international force in Lebanon <hr></blockquote> Good old Hegelian dialectics at work there.. ____________________ Oderint, dum metuant

by **Sweejak** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 12:13 am

United States to Israel: you have one more week to blast Hizbullah Bush 'gave green light' for limited attack, say Israeli and UK sources The US is giving Israel a window of a week to inflict maximum damage on Hizbullah before weighing in behind international calls for a ceasefire in Lebanon, according to British, European and Israeli sources. <a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1823817,00.html">www.guardian.co.uk/israel...17,00.html</a> <blockquote>Quote:<hr> The Bush administration, backed by Britain, has blocked efforts for an immediate halt to the fighting initiated at the UN security council, the G8 summit in St Petersburg and the European foreign ministers' meeting in Brussels. "It's clear the Americans have given the Israelis the green light. They [the Israeli attacks] will be allowed to go on longer, perhaps for another week," a senior European official said yesterday. Diplomatic sources said there was a clear time limit, partly dictated by fears that a prolonged conflict could spin out of control. US strategy in allowing Israel this freedom for a limited period has several objectives, one of which is delivering a slap to Iran and Syria, who Washington claims are directing Hizbullah and Hamas militants from behind the scenes. George Bush last night said that he suspected Syria was trying to reassert its influence in Lebanon. Speaking in Washington, he said: "It's in our interest for Syria to stay out of Lebanon and for this government in Lebanon to succeed and survive. The root cause of the problem is Hizbullah and that problem needs to be addressed." Tony Blair yesterday swung behind the US position that Israel need not end the bombing until Hizbullah hands over captured prisoners and ends its rocket attacks. During a Commons statement, he resisted backbench demands that he call for a ceasefire. Echoing the US position, he told MPs: "Of course we all want violence to stop and stop immediately, but we recognise the only realistic way to achieve such a ceasefire is to address the underlying reasons why this violence has broken out." He also indicated it might take many months to agree the terms of a UN stabilisation force on the Lebanese border. After Mr Blair spoke, British officials privately acknowledged the US had given Israel a green light to continue bombing Lebanon until it believes Hizbullah's infrastructure has been destroyed. Washington's hands-off approach was underlined yesterday when it was confirmed that Condoleezza Rice, the US secretary of state, is delaying a visit to the region until she has met a special UN team. She is expected in the region on Friday, according to Dan Gillerman, Israel's ambassador to the UN. The US is publicly denying any role in setting a timeframe for Israeli strikes. When asked whether the US was holding back diplomatically, Tony Snow, the White House's press spokesman, said yesterday: "No, no; the insinuation there is that there is active military planning, collaboration or collusion, between the United States and Israel - and there isn't ... the US has been in the lead of the diplomatic efforts, issuing repeated calls for restrain,t but at the same time putting together an international consensus. You've got to remember who was responsible for this: Hizbullah ... It would be misleading to say the United States hasn't been engaged. We've been deeply engaged." Steven Cook, a specialist in US-Middle East policy at the Washington-based Council on Foreign Relations, said: "It's abundantly clear [that US policy is] to give the Israelis the opportunity to strike a blow at Hizbullah ... "They have global reach, and prior to 9/11 they killed more Americans than any other group. But the Israelis are overplaying their hand." Israel is already laying the ground for negotiations. "We are beginning a diplomatic process alongside the military operation that will continue," said Tzipi Livni, Israel's foreign minister, yesterday. "The diplomatic process is not meant to shorten the window of time of the army's operation, but rather is meant to be an extension of it and to prevent a need for future military operations," she added. Moshe Kaplinsky, Israel's deputy army chief, said the offensive could end within a few weeks, adding that Israel needed time to complete "clear goals". Israeli officials said fighting could begin to wind down after the weekend, if Hizbullah stops firing rockets. A peace formula is also beginning to emerge: it includes an understanding on a future prisoner exchange, a deployment of the Lebanese army up to the Israeli border, a Hizbullah pullback, and the beefing up of an international monitoring force. For the first time, Ms Livni suggested Israel might accept such a force on a temporary basis. There were signs of differences of emphasis between the Foreign Office and Downing Street over the conflict. Kim Howells, a Foreign Office minister, explicitly called for the US to rein in Israel. "I very much hope the Americans will be putting pressure on the Israelis to stop as quickly as possible." he told the BBC. "We understand the pressure the Israeli government is under, but we call on them to look very carefully at the pressure ordinary people are under in southern Lebanon and other parts of Lebanon too ... We want to stop this as quickly as possible". Israeli airstrikes killed 31 yesterday, including a family of nine in Aitaroun. More than 230 civilians in Lebanon have been killed in the past week. An Israeli man was killed by a Hizbullah rocket in Nahariya in northern Israel, bringing the total of Israeli civilian deaths to 13. The army said 50 missiles were fired yesterday at northern Israel, injuring at least 14 people.<hr></blockquote>

by **Sweejak** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 12:17 am

Gaza <blockquote>Quote:<hr>Gaza is out of news. The Strip could be relocated to Mars - there no reports from there, just brief reports of Jews bombing away the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and another small power plant. Israel allows no reporters inside. Our friend Silvia Cattori tried to get in, could not make it, but managed to record the following interview with a Palestinian located in the North of Gaza: Silvia Cattori: What is the mental state of the population after weeks of bombings and deprivations? A: We have suffered. We are in a dramatic situation. The Israeli army has entered up to Saladine Street; the military has cut Gaza in two: it is like it was before. They have installed a base. There are a dozen tanks with bulldozers. They are in the process of razing land, greenhouses; they are destroying all that remains of life. For two weeks, the F-16s and the drones bomb and destroy our homes. There are hundreds of dead and badly wounded. S.C.: Is it blind bombing of everything as opposed to bombing that is targeting "terrorists"? A: The day before yesterday, for example, the Israelis attacked a house, assassinating an entire family, under the pretext that it sheltered Mohamed Daif, the head of those firing the Qassam rockets. However, it wasn't true. Unfortunately, an entire family, a father, a mother, five daughters and two sons lost their lives. S.C.: Having cut Gaza in two, are the soldiers threatening the population from this position? A: Yes, their tanks, posted in the centre of the Gaza Strip, between Del Balla and Kahn Younes, are currently firing rockets - just like in the north of Gaza. S.C.: Are the tanks moving? A: No, the Israeli soldiers are chicken; they are afraid of being attacked by the resistance. S.C.: Do the members of the Hamas Government still show themselves on the street? A: We are seeing no one. They are all on the list of the next assassinations. They only come out when they have a rendez-vous, but it is always done with great secrecy. S.C.: During the two weeks of the bombings that have left you without water, without electricity, without food, have you been afraid for your family? A: The first attack by the Israeli planes at Betlaya was near my house. It was there that there were a large number of wounded and killed. The children were in a panic. Fearing that Israel would attack our neighbourhood, we left our house to move away from the zone. Now, we have returned home. S.C.: How do people put up with living in such a horrible situation? Do they want you to free the captured soldier as quickly as possible to end Israel's pretext to continue the collective punishment? A: The majority of the Palestinians support the position of the resistance, the position that the soldier won't be released until Israel releases 1000 of the weakest prisoners they hold, women and children. Prisoners that are living - contrary to the Israeli propaganda film shown recently on television in the west that we have heard about - under inhuman conditions. This film didn't talk about the torture of the prisoners, didn't show prisoners being held like beasts in tents, plagued by insects and disease, didn't say that most of the prisoners can only see their families once every six months. [1] S.C.: Has the accord signed between Fatah and Hamas two weeks ago taken affect? A: They were speaking of an entente. But on the ground, it is the contrary. The Fatah militia continues their assassinations, so the Palestinians continue to be threatened by two enemies: that is, by Israel and by those Palestinians who are collaborating with the occupier in order to destablize Hamas. The Israeli attacks actually prevented a civil war between Palestinians. At this moment, each Palestinian, no matter what party, feels above all like a target of Israeli shooting. S.C.: Can even the father of a family like you, who has nothing to do with the resistance, be hit by what they call a targeted assassination? A: You must know that our crime is being Palestinian, to belong to Palestine. If I find myself by chance in the same taxi as someone that an Israeli plane wants to assassinate, I can be killed. S.C.: For that you will have to face more and more aggression? The Israeli army has announced that Operation Summer Rain will last as long as necessary. A: You know that Israel is government by lunatics at this moment. They are narrow-minded politicians. They have unleashed war in Gaza, and, as of two days, they have declared war on Lebanon. Maybe that will give us a bit of a break because the pressure is only longer only concentrated on us. S.C.: One thing that is worrisome in any situation of war is the trauma undergone by the children. Are they still normal after all they have had to endure? A: The other day I wanted to take my kids to the sea. My three-year-old daughter started to cry. She said, "No, Daddy, I never want to go to the beach again." I asked her why. "I don't want to die." I said, "OK, if you don't want to die, I'll go with your brothers and sisters." "You neither. No one should go to the beach," she cried. You can see how a three-year-old child reacts after seeing on television the family massacred on the beach. If I talk about the beach, she cries. S.C.: Were the victims these last months people like you, people who are not armed, who have no protection, and who do not harm anyone? A: Almost all of the victims are civilians. However, the Israeli army justifies the bombings of families who are eating or sleeping saying that there are fighters among them. There are members of the resistance, but they aren't among these victims. Everyone in Palestine, with the exception of the collaborators, is a resistor in spirit. S.C.: With such a catastrophic situation, one that is ongoing, in what kind of mental state are you? A: We continue to live in spite of the unlivable situation Israel imposes upon us. We are accustomed to living this life that isn't a life. There is no food, there is only brackish water, there is no electricity. This is our life. But it is better than living a life were we crush ourselves. SC.: How will you be able to rebuild yet again the entire infrastructure that the Israel bombing is destroying? Do you think they can be put back in action quickly? A: The Israelis will never leave standing anything we build. Each time that we repair the transformer in the north or the south of Gaza, they bomb it again. We have yet to hear any protests from the Arab or European states. Some states have condemned the Israeli operations, but their condemnations are too weak. It isn't enough to make Israel back off. From the moment that Europe cut off our aid, it meant they have been collaborating with Israel in its collective punishment, to starve us and to make us suffer more. S.C.: Do you have the impression that the journalists who obtained permission to enter Gaza have been correctly informing the world on the suffering you are undergoing? A: It is always the same thing, whether they come or not. I would have been very happy it if had been you who had gotten permission to come, because I am certain you would have reported with honesty. We follow the news. It is always a superficial and Israeli version of things that is shown. The suffering of the people, our pain, all those at CNN, Fox News, the BBS, have no idea what it is. They lie in our faces. We watch their lies live. S.C.: Don't you think that those journalists that ignore your reality and repeat the same things are led into error by the Palestinian chauffeurs and guides accompanying and supervising them and informing them in a biased way? A: All they have to do is what you do, go out into the street and get people to talk. It's not by them all staying in the same five star hotels in Gaza that they will be able to find the truth. S.C.: They don't go out into the streets? A: Even when they go, they conform to the information given by Israeli press officers or the supervision of their agencies. At the end of the day, they say what their Jerusalem or other office tells them to say and don't say what they have been told not to say. You're a journalist; you should know how it works. S.C.: I wasn't able to enter Gaza this time and can't report on what is happening to you. It makes me all the more sad because I have remained very attached to the place and I knew so many Palestinians who were suffering and two members of the ISM as well as the London journalist James Miller - who wanted to report about your suffering and the assassination of children - who were killed in 2003 by the Israeli army. A: They won't let you in because you are too honest. Israel well knows that you do not look at our reality in the same way as the journalists who generally come here. If you were seeing everything through the eyes of Israeli propaganda, you could have entered Gaza.... S.C. I was interrogated by the Israel secret service Sabak on my arrival at Ben Gurion airport. Won't I put any Palestinian I meet into danger if these services, which have their spies on every Palestinian street, are watching me now? A: You can't put anyone in danger. Every Palestinian is in danger. At any moment, the drone that is flying overhead can strike me. Don't let yourself be intimidated. Do you know why they intimidated you when you arrived and why they follow you? Because those people are afraid of you? S.C.: Afraid of me? Are you joking? A: All of these soldiers and spies that make up the most formidable army in the world, in spite of their power, are afraid of anyone who uses his words...to speak the truth. They are afraid of those who speak the truth. They are weak people. We can win this fight even though our means are nothing compared to theirs, because we have the will and the courage that they don't have. S.C.: What I have seen since I started traveling through the West Bank is without a doubt less atrocious than what is happening in Gaza, but, believe me, it is already too much to support. I cried when I saw a group of people being held like animals in an enclosed space at the checkpoint in Bethlehem. I cried when I arrived in Naplouse and I saw the crowd of silent people who were waiting for the soldiers to condescend to let them leave. You Palestinians seem so strong in the face of all of these humiliations they impose. Do you cry sometimes? A: Of course I cry. I often cry now when I see all of these families who have been assassinated. A quarter of the victims are children. S.C.: Does your wife cry, too? A: Yes, often. Everywhere around, here in Gaza, or over there in the West Bank, are people struck by misfortune that breaks your heart. We are one people and we are suffering together. We are one unique body. [1] It may be the film recently shown by the television network Arte. P.S.: This interview was conducted via internet and telephone. Translated by Signs of the Times <hr></blockquote>

by **greencrow0** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 12:21 am

Don't Blame Canada! We're just as much a victim of selective vote fraud as the US. We have a minority government (Harper) who is ruling as if he has a majority...which he likely will have thanks to mexican style vote fraud in the next 'election'. 3/4 of Canadians DID NOT vote for Harper. 1/4 voted for NDP and 1/2 voted Liberal...Harper split the vote and came up the middle....with a little help from his friends...my own personal opinion here. He is a wierd hybrid of a Canadian crossed with a neoCon crossed with a fundamentalist. Harper is unelectable [except by Diebold]. GC

by **havanagilla** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 1:34 am

Well, the Israeli government is now doing what Bush did in Katrina. They are taking advantage of the war to stop social assistance and other services for "useless eaters". while workers are exempts from attending work for as long as the war is on, recepients of disability payments and social assistance are REQUIRED to attend their agencies even in danger zones, or else - no money coming. All monthly payments have been "delayed" (rather in the past, they would usually advance payments in such cases to help people cope with the emergency). While the big business already squeezed the government to pay them "for the loss of business" during the war, the poor are being culled. -- Is the shelling in both Israel and Lebanon, the work of the same real estate/contracting corps which rebuild New Orleans? GC, if you continue bitchin how Harper stole the elections, you will wind up with "we were only complying with orders" thing. Welcome to reality.

by **chiggerbit** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 10:30 am

Does anyone else find it odd that Olmert(?) and Bush haven't even had one single phone call with each other since this started? There's a feeling of exaggerated posturing about that fact, as if they had already discussed a plan at the last visit, and now want to appear as if there was no coordination, so they don't talk directly with each other. "What conspiracy? We haven't even talked to each other."

Israel shelling Lebanon

Re: Bolton, BBC on the same page

war, war, war

Re: the banality of evil; Oh! Canada!

Re: Junge Welt

Re: Junge Welt

Re: Junge Welt

my email to PM Stephen Harper re comments made in London

Re: Gaza

Re: Gaza

Re: Gaza

One week

Gaza/Mars

Canada: Thanks for Nothing

Re: Canada: Thanks for Nothing

Re: Canada: Thanks for Nothing

Who is online