Sinister Forces

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Sinister Forces

Postby terryintacoma » Sat Sep 23, 2006 7:09 am

Hi There, <br><br>I'm new here and to be honest, I've never joined in on a chat room or internet discussion board before.<br><br>I discovered your blog while searching for reviews and reactions to the series of books written by Peter Levenda. Sinister Forces.<br>The 3rd book came out, I read it and would be interested in hearing, at least, Jeff's take on the finished work. <br><br>Reading over some of your more recent articles and postings here, you folks seem to be an interesting bunch. I look forward to meeting you all...especially the poet who goes by the name anonymous.<br><br>Here goes nothin' ... post #1 Terry<br><br>ps Am I suppose to read the very very very long postings as well? <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=terryintacoma>terryintacoma</A> at: 9/23/06 5:39 am<br></i>
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Re: Sinister Forces

Postby Rigorous Intuition » Sat Sep 23, 2006 8:31 am

Hey terryintacoma, glad you joined.<br><br>Afraid I don't have time to respond in depth right now, but I think vol. 3 is by far the most successful. (I'd like to see all three collected in one volume, somewhat abridged. I think it may make a greater impact that way, and reach more readers.) <br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em><br>ps "Am I suppose to read the very very very long postings as well?"</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br><br>Only if you want to! <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Sinister Forces

Postby IanEye » Sat Sep 23, 2006 10:56 am

Hi Terry,<br>I have read all three of the "Sinister Forces" Trilogy. They cover a lot of ground. I like the way he approaches what I call the "Rosemary's Baby Nexus" of weirdness in America.<br><br>Cielo Drive on the West Coast - The Dakota on the East Coast<br><br>Reagan on The West Coast - Lennon on the East Coast<br><br>The way Levenda can zero in on the sordid factual details of Earth based power struggles and then zoom out to a kind of Cosmic Conspiracy level of intrigue. Like the other day I was thinking about how:<br><br>John Cassavetes stars in "Rosemary's Baby", in the film his character lives in the Dakota. The site of Lennon's death in the "real world", meanwhile Cassevetes also co-stars in "The Killers", the last movie Reagan plays a role in [and as a villian, no less]. Just an odd jumble of facts, until you start reading Levenda, and then maybe it is all somehow related. Perhaps Reagan survived the same "forces" that Lennon perished from. Why? Perhaps Nancy was simply a better witch than Yoko was. Don't even get me started on how Mia Farrow leaves Reagan chum Sinatra during the Rosemary period to go hang out with the Beatles only to resurface at the Dakota later on with Woody [Jimmy Bond] Allen....<br><br>What old decadent Mansions did Manson play in? We know from Maury Terry's "The Ultimate Evil" that the Carr's played in the ruins of the old Rothschild-Warburg Estate. Maybe the Proccess runs a Time Share resort chain.<br><br><br>So, welcome Terry!<br>i like it here because people are at least willing to consider whether it is worth it to keep digging, stay positive, and knock on the ever growing pile of coffins. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=ianeye@rigorousintuition>IanEye</A> at: 9/23/06 9:11 am<br></i>
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Re: Sinister Forces

Postby OnoI812 » Sat Sep 23, 2006 11:37 am

<!--EZCODE IMAGE START--><img src="http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m306/coolviper12/DSCF0002-1.jpg" style="border:0;"/><!--EZCODE IMAGE END--><br><br><br>LOL-<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>in "The Killers", the last movie Reagan plays a role in [and as a villian, no less]. Just an odd jumble of facts, until you start reading Levenda, and then maybe it is all somehow related.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br><br>Yes - St. Ronny has been known to appear in front of many a strange marquee... <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Sinister Forces

Postby terryintacoma » Sun Sep 24, 2006 8:35 am

Post #2<br><br>Thanks for responding RI. I look forward to your insight on Levenda's work. <br><br>Hey there IanEye. Did you read "Unholy Alliance" as well? I really like the way this guy writes. <br><br>Ono/812 Nice photo.<br>Think I'll make a print of that. lol<br><br>Anyway, I grew up during the same period of time as Peter.<br>He might be a few years older. idk I did the "hippie-chick" thing in the early 70's in Kent, Ohio. The human growth potential movement was in full swing there. Lotsa drugs, sex and rock and roll, and looking back now, could have been some sinister forces at work...indeed. >.><br><br>I was advised early on to stay away from witchcraft and noting the behavior of the resident warlocks in our particular commune, I heeded the advice willingly.<br><br>Anyway, to make a long story longer...<br><br>Actually, I'm getting sleepy, but I would like to discuss, someday, at length the LSD experience...I'll tell you mine if you tell me yours. <br><br>And coming back to Peter's books, there is so much to talk about there. <br><br>You know once upon a time I wanted to be a rosecrusian, or mason or something otherworldly. Waited for the "white-brotherhood" to contact me from some other dimension to tell me I had passed a great milestone in my development (without even trying, heh). <br>I so wanted to be a part of Eslan and hang out with the "enlightened hippies". I thought Disney was good.<br>I could even enjoy music.<br><br>I've been duped.<br><br>Courage people<br><br>Your Pal, Terry<br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br> <br><br><br><br> <br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Sinister Forces

Postby Et in Arcadia ego » Sun Sep 24, 2006 8:48 am

hmm.. <p>____________________<br>Some are born to sweet delight, some are born to endless night.</p><i></i>
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Re: Sinister Forces

Postby medicis » Sun Sep 24, 2006 9:42 am

just a comment to terryintacoma. You said:<br><br>Anyway, I grew up during the same period of time as Peter.<br>He might be a few years older. idk I did the "hippie-chick" thing in the early 70's in Kent, Ohio. The human growth potential movement was in full swing there. Lotsa drugs, sex and rock and roll, and looking back now, could have been some sinister forces at work...indeed. >.><br><br>-------<br>I did the Kent thing too. Started in 68 and did my M.A. work in philosophy there in 75. Nice to know there are other survivors. Still have family there and visit Kent a couple of times each year. Still like to have a few at Ray's.<br><br>And everytime I road in one of KSU's 'Blue' Busses, I would start humming the Doors........ It helped to be stoned. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Sinister Forces

Postby IanEye » Sun Sep 24, 2006 11:15 am

Hi Terry,<br>I have not read "Unholy Alliance" yet, although I probably will at some point. Right now I am looking forward to reading a book I have on order called "Loveless" which concerns an album of the same name by the group My Bloody Valentine.<br><br>In terms of talking about LSD use on a blog, I feel comfortable stating that I was able to quit while I was a Head [but not a DeadHead - wink wink nudge nudge]. It is funny, my use of the drug spanned the first Bush Administration, 88-92. It seems like it was really being pushed hard then, probably nothing more sinister there than "20 years ago today" Corporate Nostalgia bullshit [cd reissues of Beatles, Stones, The Doors movie etc]. My typical modus operandi was to score some tabs from my "Touch of Grey" era DeadHead friends in the dorms and then scurry back to my leafy hometown and retrace the mossy paths of my youth in the forests of Western Mass, then melt home and listen to Duke Ellington records [ wah-wah guitars are cool, but nothing beats the muted trumpet animal noises of "Cat" Anderson].<br><br>It was a strange time, the four years of Poppy nestled between 8 years of Reagan and eight years of Clinton. The advent of CD technology caused the Record Industry to reach into their Archives and reissue a lot of great music that had been out of print for years [yes, I realize the CDs don't sound as good as Vinyl]. I considered my WalkMan as a Time Machine. A soul could read Gravity's Rainbow and listen to the '73 era KrautRock of the novel's publishing date, or the previously mentioned BigBand era Jazz of the novel's setting.<br><br>The other thing I remember about the Poppy Era was Joe Camel's visage was everywhere. Joe's sly, knowing genitalia face peered from the back of every issue of Playboy magazine in those years. issues that usually featured a nubile airbrushed female halfway out of a uniform [always a uniform in that era, usually military].<br><br>So, what Gentle Reader, does any of this have to do with Sinister Forces? Well, it was in this time period that i heard a crazy rant in a dorm room about Bob Crane. Two popular books going around the dorms were RAW's "Cosmic Trigger" and Terry's "Ultimate Evil". The cross-continental trail of blood detailed in Terry's book was the springboard for a Mind Bending "Krayzee Rich" rant.<br><br>Krayzee Rich was truly odd. He would cradle a classical guitar between his legs like a tiny cello and tap out [ala Yngwie Malmsteen/Stanley Jordan] an odd time signatured Frippian riff that would stay in your head for hours. He grew up on the West coast and had only recently been exiled at UMass/Amherst. He had a treasure trove of trivia inside that head of his. [That rerun of Batman on the teevee, the one with Mr. Oceanbring? Why, that's Jay Sea-bring! A Manson victim!! Why does "Murder, She Wrote" starring Angela Lansbury, filmed at Carmel-By-The-Sea, CA take place in Maine, an East Coast state? it was a deal worked out by Barbara Bush and Nancy Reagan to bounce the vibrations of the two coasts off each other so the Americans would think of East as West and vice-versa. By the way did you know that Dee Dee Lansbury carried a note from her mom that .....rant rant rant .... and who is the Mayor of Carmel right now anyway...rant rant rant....Scorpio is really Zodiac.....rant rant rant....]<br><br>In the midst of an intense Process filled rant about the sub cellar of American decadence, Krazee Rich's eye seized upon a clipping my friend Wally had taped to his bunk bed post. The clipping was of a hippy looking dude seized by Secret Service agents after he had disrupted a speech given by former President Reagan at some corporate event somewhere. You could see a dazed Ron at a podium in the background. Rich, staring at the clipping said, "you know, as long as Bob Crane was alive, Ronald Reagan could never get his Party's nomination for President. And since Mr. Crane knew Bing Crosby, it was no accident that Bob had access to the latest in videotape technology." and then right back to the rant about how odd a place Yonkers, NY is, going back to Colonial times.<br><br>Such a non-sequitur was common place in a Krayzee Rich rant, but that one has always stayed with me. As the years go by, more and more details snap into place. At the time I had no doubt seen Bing Crosby Productions mentioned in the credits of "Hogan's Heroes", but i didn't know then about how Bing acquired rights to the use of Nazi tape based technology, Rich obviously did. I also didn't know at the time that Mr. Crane had issues with video taping and sex, or that previous to "Hogan", Crane had stumped for several right wing Republicans, including Reagan. I keep waiting for the passing of Time to connect more dots for me, maybe some RI readers or fans of "Sinister Forces" can connect a few more.<br><br>If you have seen the footage of the '76 Republican Convention, the frenzy of delegates chanting Reagan's name, you really have to wonder why he had to wait until '80 to get the Official nod. Was Bob in a darkened motel room somewhere, watching the convention on a flickering screen, reaching into his own archive for a half forgotten reel? Krayzee Rich, where are you now?!?<br><br>Thanks for reading!<br><br>IanEye<br><br>PS: Terry, here is a cool link I found on this RI Board<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.cafes.net/ditch/Elsewhere.htm">www.cafes.net/ditch/Elsewhere.htm</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>enjoy!! <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Sinister Forces

Postby terryintacoma » Sun Sep 24, 2006 6:26 pm

Whoa!<br><br>Got me a live one.<br><br>Will write back later. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Sinister Forces

Postby terryintacoma » Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:45 am

Cool Medicis. Don't remember Ray's, but they did let me into Orville's Tavern. Jerry's Diner still there? <br><br>I noticed there is "live-chat" on this website. It would be fun to use it and talk about Kent and other topics of interest.<br><br>Writing something every now and again, and casting your words out into the ocean of the internet and seeing what comes back is an artform that alot of you have down really well. I've yet to find it fullfilling or anxiety free. Live chat sounds like fun tho. You guys ever use it?<br><br>Anyway, the reason I brought up the LSD is because it was used in mind control experimentation, many of our "gurus" back then turned out to be on the CIA's payroll and Mr. Levenda in his book brings up the sordid past of a certain doctor who experimented using LSD on the patients in his mental institution in for the Czech government and now instructs people in "Holotropic" transpersonal (is it?) psychology. In fact his institute will be having a workshop (Dr. Stan Grof) right here in Tacoma next month. <br><br>This concerns me. <br><br>I had some pretty good trips before unknowingly being fed a 4-way hit of windowpane acid at a party in Laguna Beach one night (age 17). I ended up in jail. Busted on a 4-way hit of acid. <br><br>From my own personal experience with LSD, I would never in my wildest dreams ever consider giving acid to an alcoholic or to someone who is depressed or to a child or to whoever else they had locked up in their mental institution. <br><br>The last time David Icke was in Seattle I went to see him speak. He ended his lecture talking about how "GREAT" his then recent psychedelic experience in Brazil had been. Guided by a shaman and the whole thing. idk It disappointed me, but he got another book out of it.<br><br>Anyway, it seems that the psychedelic experiance is making it's way back via the "new-age" movement (mind-control movement). Kinda wonder if that's what brought down the hippies.<br><br>Don't worry conspiracy theory geeks, there is medication available for our condition. What does have the researchers concerned though is that our particular mental disorder is catchy. <br><br>And who the heck is Krayzee Rich?<br><br><br>Peace All, Terry ^^<br><br><br><br><br> <br><br><br><br><br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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which gurus were plants?

Postby nashvillebrook » Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:11 pm

i'd love to hear more about your feeling that all psychedelics are all bad. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: which gurus were plants?

Postby terryintacoma » Tue Sep 26, 2006 7:01 am

Sorry, I didn't see where I said all psychedelics were all bad.<br><br>(sigh) I thought you were going to say that you would love for me to tell you my acid trip.<br><br>Oh well. Here we go, back to the top of the list. ^^<br><br>Wheeeeee!!!<br><br><br><br>As much as I do enjoy conspiracy theories, it does get kinda dark in here people. You're all so bright, well-spoken...<br>I only wish our world wasn't so screwed up so as to see what kind of enlightening adventures you'd be taking us on today.<br><br><br>Keep the faith.<br><br>Terry <p></p><i></i>
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Postby Username » Sat Nov 01, 2008 5:48 am

~
Funny, when I first came here 2+ years ago, I thought it would be a great place to explore and learn more about paranormal experience, conspiracy theories and other occult subjects that are off limits with most anyone else you meet.

I won't say i've been totally disappointed, maybe somewhat disappointed though, because much of what does get talked about at this forum is just as HMW says it is, alot of W.O.O.

A couple of recent posts by timetunneler brought this point home to me.

Here, on Obama

which led to:

Here, about the georgia gorilla, where he gives an extensive timeline between events and bigfoot sightings.

timetunneler wrote: Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 6:53 am Post subject: Re: FBI: "spore on the grassy knoll"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dumbing down America for the Rich... one spook infested Hoax at a time:

"Funding for scientific investigation of the paranormal has come almost entirely from wealthy individuals. Virtually no large philanthropic organizations or government bureaucracies have provided substantial, long-term support for the research. The only exceptions are the intelligence agencies—the only section of government formally allowed to use deception. Why does the money come from these sources?"

http://www.tricksterbook.com/Intro.htm


In light of all the shenanigans surrounding the paranormal, because undoubtedly the government is up to their eyeballs in passing out the disinformation and debunking all at the same time, I'd like to try to make a case for a truthseeker in the midst of all the BS.

My theory is, we are more than they allow us to know, and most, if not all of the paths, to learn who we truely are, have been sabotaged.

That's all I'm going to say about this for now, because I spent alot of time writing out the story of the acid trip from 37 years ago, and I'm running out of steam. This story has to do with some of the experiences Beth Goobie talks about, it's why i read people like Levenda and it's why I copy books in the book forum about "the great psychological crime."


terryintacoma = Username (in case you didn't know.)


terryintacoma wrote:From my own personal experience with LSD, I would never in my wildest dreams ever consider giving acid to an alcoholic or to someone who is depressed or to a child or to whoever else they had locked up in their mental institution.


And I still wouldn't, and think anyone who advocates the use of these drugs to people they don't even know as a solution to their problems or a pathway to enlightenment is a scoundrel and a liar and a self-serving so and so. You rarely read detailed encounters of their trips, because they can only speak in cryptic sentences, as if they know something you don't.

terryintacoma wrote:The last time David Icke was in Seattle I went to see him speak. He ended his lecture talking about how "GREAT" his then recent psychedelic experience in Brazil had been. Guided by a shaman and the whole thing. idk It disappointed me, but he got another book out of it.


and I'll betcha five dollars that David can hook you up with a spirit tour guide who will gladly sell you the same shamanic experience, so you could be as wise as David wishes he was.

Anyway, it seems that the psychedelic experiance is making it's way back via the "new-age" movement (mind-control movement). Kinda wonder if that's what brought down the hippies.

Don't worry conspiracy theory geeks, there is medication available for our condition. What does have the researchers concerned though is that our particular mental disorder is catchy.


I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I did not mean to insult any of you with that remark. I have always worn my conspiracy theorist label proudly, and didn't realize you all were so sensitive about it.

terryintacoma wrote:I had some pretty good trips before unknowingly being fed a 4-way hit of windowpane acid at a party in Laguna Beach one night (age 17). I ended up in jail. Busted on a 4-way hit of acid.


Where to begin...


...it was back in 1971, I was 17 and drugs were easy to be had in the Cleveland suburb where I grew up. I mostly enjoyed smoking pot, but would occasionally get a hit of acid and take walks through the valley. It was pleasant. The tall trees would gently wave to me and invite me to rest near them, and although I appreciated the offer, and maybe smiled back, I would keep walking.

Oh, and there were a lot of trails too, when you were peaking. Trails like when a car drives by it becomes a long trail of cars. The material world became very fluid. Everything moved. Nothing was solid. Really did bring home the message of how drastically our perception of the world can change; a simple flip of the switch.

The worst part of acid was coming down. The material world seemed dirty, dense and disgusting, it was hard not to notice the change and it wasn't at all pleasent to be back, especially for the first hour or two.

The mescaline we had, could have just as easily been rat poison. You never really knew what you were ingesting, but it was odd because it put a design, a pattern over everything in lime green and pink. Not a paisley pattern, but it was ornate and consistant in color and style.

We're going to fast forward to the good part...ran away from home, hitchhiked to Calif, ended up in Laguna Beach, picked up by a wealthy family that lived on the hill. There was a mom, dad, two young children (ages 4 and 5) and two house guests living there. The dad was the one who found me sitting on the steps of a head shop with backpack, guitar, dog, etc, writing a letter home, and invited me to stay with them. He gave me to his male houseguest (don't ask) and i did stay with them for maybe a week before i could manage to get myself the heck out of that situation by finding a job as a live-in housekeeper/babysitter with this hispanic woman, who left me with her two young children (ages 3 & 5), only a day or two after i took the job. She said she would be gone for a week, vacationing with her boyfriend. Returned two weeks later.

Anyway, I and my girlfriend were invited to a party at the house of those wealthy people on the hill. (She was their babysitter which is how I came to meet her, and she was also the person who helped me to find a job.) The first thing that happens when we walk through the door, one of them slips a tiny something into our mouths and laughs, and tells us that it was a 4-way hit of windowpane acid.

I wasn't overly concerned about this and settled in for what i thought would be an interesting/fun trip. Sitting on the floor as the drug started to take effect, Kathy E. (the mother) was chatting to me as her two children played near us. She said about her children, "They could be such monsters." and as soon as she said that, both of her kids turned into robot-like automatons and stared at me with expressionless faces, while marching into me, over me, and I'll tell you right now, it wasn't the acid at that point. I told her to call her kids off, and she did so. The kids ran off and i didn't see them the rest of the night.

Looking back on it now, many years later, i have come to realize they were trying to freak us out on purpose. You see, i had no idea people would actually do something like that, then.

Anyway, I started coming on to the acid pretty strong, panicking, and for some reason searching for the other house guest, who was this absolutely gorgeous blond with the mind of a child. (She must have been what remained of a previous visitor to this house.) I'm going down a hallway which is way long and distorted, trying to make it to the door at the end where I thought she would be, but whenever I would go near the door, it felt like I was about to burst into flames. Then I thought the house was about to burst into flames, and told them I had to get out of there. My girlfriend was sitting on the couch crying, they surrounded her and acted as if they were only trying to help her as they phoned every boyfriend she had ever broken up with. Maybe they were too busy to deal with me, so the other house guest puts me in his car and starts to drive me around.

Can't see much of anything I was tripping so hard, but I could see him driving the car, and out of the corner of my eye he would transform into a hideous demonic being, and he would put his left hand down beside him out of sight and I would feel it coming up under me and I'd freak out, look at him straight on and he would change back into the lowlife human he was, and look so worried and oh so concerned. I would look forward again and the same scene would happen out the corner of my eye. After that kept happening, 3 or 4 times, I insisted to be let out of the car. He stops the car, I and my dog Oscar get out of the car, and I can't see anything except for my dog's back-end. I figured I'd follow my dog's butt home, and I was doing pretty good until this police car pulled up beside me and I laughed at them.

They throw me into the back of the police car and take me to the County Jail. They were having their fun with me too, instead of taking me inside they're walking a little ahead of me coaxing me to "come on" motioning with their hands, being weirdos and up the stairs near the door I said "fuck this" and grabbed onto this pole and started yelling for help. They tugged at me, yanked me off the pole, tossed me through the door, and this other cop behind a window screen says, "What's going on here?" and I said "They're trying to kill me."

Well, after throwing up and pissing myself, they put me into a cell, and I remember seeing my dog was on the other side of the bars growling at the people in the doorway who were trying to calm Oscar and coax him out of there. I was sitting on the floor petting him through the bars, but realized the futility of our situation and asked Oscar to go with them. So he did.

I hung onto the bars there tripping my ass off. Whenever I would close my eyes I'd start racing through space and these voices are ahead of me encouraging me to follow them and we'd be zooming faster and faster and faster and I would have to open my eyes to stop. and they would say "awwww, come on, let's go, follow us" and when I would close my eyes we'd take off again and this would make them happy. But, while I was ripping through space at the speed of acid, I looked back at my body and it was dead and it was laying on the tiled floor of a gas station washroom, badly beaten, and the voices would assure me that this was ok.. I said "this ain't right, why do you have to leave me like that? What would my mother say when she reads that in the paper?" They insisted it wasn't important, "don't worry about it," “follow us.” and I said "No, I'm going back" which made them irritated with me.

I returned to my dead/dying body and started to re-enter at the base of the skull. I could feel the smashed jaw, taste the blood and worked to put my jaw back into place, and my lifeless limbs back into socket. It took a long time to pull my broken self back together.

I started to come down from the acid, found myself in that jail cell and said "shit, this is the afterlife?" (they never mentioned this in catechism class.) I took off my patched blue jeans, fringed leather jacket and the rest of my clothes, wrapped a blanket around me and sat up on the top bunk looking down at the pile of soiled clothes.

That was me.

In the meantime, the cops brought someone in and locked them in a cell down the way. I couldn't see the them or her, but after the cops went back out, lol, she started ohming.

Ooohmmmmmmmm...

I said "Hey. Hey, where are we?"

She stops ohming and says, "You don't know where you are?"

"No, tell me. Where are we?"

"Girl, you in jail."

And I said, "Oh, THANK GOD!"

Here's another weird part to this story. For at least a month or two after this event, no one would have ever been able to convince me that I didn't hold the choice of the outcome in my hands. I knew that I had chosen between two moments in time, like time stood still.

After that episode I couldn't take psychedelics without having the voices, now menacing, return. I tried a couple of times, then said, no more.

the end
~
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Postby zhivkov » Sat Nov 01, 2008 11:35 pm

terry-what a fascinating and eerie experience. thanks for sharing this and your many other contributions to the forum! I am glad other people come to this part too!
"you gave me in secret one thing to perceive, the tall blue starry strangeness of being here at all"-Franz Wright
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Postby annie aronburg » Sun Nov 02, 2008 2:13 pm

Thanks, Terry.
"O Oysters," said the Carpenter,
"You've had a pleasant run!
Shall we be trotting home again?'
But answer came there none--
And this was scarcely odd, because
They'd eaten every one.
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