A mystical experience thru sex....interesting account

by **yesferatu** » Fri Jul 21, 2006 1:26 am

<a href="http://geocities.com/maya-gaia/mysticalexp.html#footnotes">link</a> He has been pondering this for 36 years, the experience took place in 1970. And here is his "compendium of resources including books, articles, papers and speculation on consciousness with many featuring its relationship to electromagnetism ... with descriptive excerpts" updated 7/1/06: <a href="http://geocities.com/maya-gaia/emcu_appendix.html">geocities.com/maya-gaia/emcu_appendix.html</a>

by **bvonahsen** » Fri Jul 21, 2006 2:24 am

Isn't that what Sufism is about? At least partly? Mystical enlightment through sexual ecstasy. There are worse ways to go about that.

by **Seamus OBlimey** » Fri Jul 21, 2006 10:05 am

Interesting yes, but also looks heavy reading, later maybe. Today I'm taking my enlightenment lite.. Sex and drugs and rock and roll Is all my brain and body need Sex and drugs and rock and roll Are very good indeed Keep your silly ways or throw them out the window The wisdom of your ways, I've been there and I know Lots of other ways, what a jolly bad show If all you ever do is business you don't like Sex and drugs and rock and roll Sex and drugs and rock and roll Sex and drugs and rock and roll Is very good indeed Every bit of clothing ought to make you pretty You can cut the clothing, grey is such a pity I should wear the clothing of Mr. Walter Mitty See my tailor, he's called Simon, I know it's going to fit Here's a little piece of advice You're quite welcome it is free Don't do nothing that is cut price You know what that'll make you be They will try their tricky device Trap you with the ordinary Get your teeth into a small slice The cake of liberty Sex and drugs and rock and roll Sex and drugs and rock and roll Sex and drugs and rock and roll Sex and drugs and rock and roll Sex and drugs and rock and roll Sex and drugs and rock and roll Sex and drugs and rock and roll Sex and drugs and rock and roll Sex, drugs, rock, roll Sex, drugs, rock, roll Sex And Drugs And Rock 'N' Roll by Ian Dury & The Blockheads There's always more than one way <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek">

by **professorpan** » Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:48 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Isn't that what Sufism is about? At least partly? Mystical enlightment through sexual ecstasy.<hr></blockquote> I think you mean Tantrism. Not all Tantra is sex-based, just certain strands.

by **johnny nemo** » Fri Jul 21, 2006 2:58 pm

I think the whole "attaining enlightenment from sex" crap is a huge spiritual red herring. If it were true, wouldn't many porn stars be "enlightened masters"? Most Eastern mystic traditions involve some sort of carnal restraint, generally involving absolute celibacy. Sex involves desire and passion, both of which are big no-nos on the path to enlightenemnt. Whether it's Lao Tzu's concept of the "Uncarved Block", which is explained as "freedom from desire" or the Buddha saying that "the best of virtues is passionlessness", you just can't "hump your way to Heaven".

by **Jezebelladonna** » Sat Jul 22, 2006 12:10 am

On Peak experiences: For a few months recently, I was neck-deep in Abraham Maslow and discovered a few things about him that we didn't learn in college. We learned about Maslow's self-actualized individuals, but we also learn that they are few and far between. In reality, Maslow found he was studying a superior kind of person, manifesting psychological health and spiritual maturity, and found that these self-actualized people were similar in their personalities and way of viewing themselves and the world. Although Maslow famously thought that self-actualization occurred only rarely, Maslow found that people who have had what he called “peak experiences” shared with the self-actualizers all of the same characteristics and then some. For Maslow, peak experiences provided a path to self-discovery and eventually to transcendence, the highest aim for humans (as opposed to self-actualization... he modified his Hierarchy of Needs, but you don't find it so revised in intro psych textbooks). Maslow seemed to almost impermissibly blur the line between psych and spirituality, which opened the door to Transpersonal Psychology (mentioned in Yesferatu's link above), which was ALSO founded by Maslow (who founded Humanistic Psychology) to explore peak experiences and other ultimate states of being (look it up on their website at 'about us"). TP never became a true division in the APA (unlike the Humanistic Psych- Division 32) but is a viable and active field, albeit a mushier, touchier-feelier, psycho-spiritual field, within Humanistic Psych. So even though Maslow became a kind of proselytizer for the true reality revealed by peak experiences, he was, up to a point anyway, taken seriously by the APA (he was president of the APA in 1968, just as he began to get all eastern philosophical and mystical) and not only sired Humanistic Psych but also Transpersonal Psych and its progeny. Maslow generalized the characteristics of people who experience peak experiences ("Being-cognition") and the type of knowledge peak experiences can offer ("Being-knowledge"). Maslow used the term “peak-experiences” to refer to: “…the parental experience, the mystic, or oceanic, or nature experience, the aesthetic perception, the creative moment, the therapeutic or intellectual insight, the orgasmic experience, certain forms of athletic fulfillment… moments of highest happiness and fulfillment…”. Maslow believed that peak experiences are transformative in the moment, and also have residual transformative consequences. Peak experiences can be so profound they can actually remove symptoms of neurosis in an individual. Aside from the use of psychotropic drugs, Maslow found that the two statistically easiest ways of achieving peak experiences is through music and through sex. Maslow clarified that, by music, he means the great classics (as opposed to John Cage) in addition to drumming and dancing (or, as Maslow terms it, “the rhythmic experience”) as statistically “good paths” to the cognition of being that results from peak experiences. Peak experiences provided humans with a glimpse behind the veil of ultimate mysteries involving the very nature of reality. Quote: Perhaps we can see mystical or peak-fusion not only as communion with that which is most worthy of love, but also as fusion with that which is, because he belongs there, being truly part of what is, and being, so to speak, a member of the family…. And although the universe cannot be said to love the human being, it can be said at least to accept him in a nonhostile way, to permit him to endure, and to grow and, occasionally, to permit him great joy. (Maslow, 1971, p. 323) Endquote. And then he died. But wow! he was on a roll. Sources and more details on request. I researched the crap outta this.

by **Homeless Halo** » Sat Jul 22, 2006 12:52 am

yep. You'd be suprised (or maybe not) as to how many psychologists are unaware of Maslow's "mystic" tendencies, which are generally avoided subjects by those few that did learn about them (that is, by those people who read outside their textbooks). Neither sufism nor tantra are even primarily sex-based. Also: in regards to sex, of course "humping" to heaven is a bit of a misnomer. No one believes that, and only sleazy "faker" new agers will even claim that. However, the neuronal similarities between peak sexual experience and religious transcendence are well known and established, with a number of modern researchers even maintaining that "religion" as a whole amounts to little more than a collection of spangles attached to sexual pleasure (like romantic "love").

by **Jezebelladonna** » Sat Jul 22, 2006 1:23 am

yesssssss...In his book Religion, Values, and Peak Experiences Maslow explored (among other things) the contributions of peak experiences to religious revelations and illuminations, and concluded that since peak experiences were essentially the same, it is likely that religions, at their essence, are the same. ooooh, I wished he had lived a few years longer... (His last book, The Farther Reaches of Human Nature, was published posthumously and is pregnant with ideas on personal evolution, brimming with optimistic enthusiasm.) Does you (anyone?) know anybody else that followed down the path of research Maslow was carving out? His contemporaries were Suttich and Grof, but I haven't had the opportunity to read their works.

by **jingofever** » Sat Jul 22, 2006 1:31 am

Jezebelladonna (and Homeless Halo), you might like "Zen and the Brain" by James Austin. I've started reading it; he mentions Maslow a fair amount. From the Amazon.com description: <blockquote>Quote:<hr>The book uses Zen Buddhism as the opening wedge for an extraordinarily wide-ranging exploration of consciousness. In order to understand the brain mechanisms that produce Zen states, one needs some understanding of the anatomy, physiology, and chemistry of the brain. Austin, a neuroscientist and Zen practitioner, interweaves his teachings of the brain with his teachings/personal narrative of Zen. The science, which contains the latest relevant developments in brain research, is both inclusive and rigorous; the Zen sections are clear and evocative. Along the way, Austin covers such topics as similar states in other disciplines and religions, sleep and dreams, mental illness, consciousness-altering drugs, and the social consequences of advanced stages of enlightenment.<hr></blockquote> Austin released a new book this year, "Zen-Brain Reflections". The Amazon.com description: <blockquote>Quote:<hr>Zen-Brain Reflections takes up where the earlier book left off. It addresses such questions as: how do placebos and acupuncture change the brain? Can neuroimaging studies localize the sites where our notions of self arise? How can the latest brain imaging methods monitor meditators more effectively? How do long years of meditative training plus brief enlightened states produce pivotal transformations in the physiology of the brain? In many chapters testable hypotheses suggest ways to correlate normal brain functions and meditative training with the phenomena of extraordinary states of consciousness. After briefly introducing the topic of Zen and describing recent research into meditation, Austin reviews the latest studies on the amygdala, frontotemporal interactions, and paralimbic extensions of the limbic system. He then explores different states of consciousness, both the early superficial absorptions and the later, major "peak experiences." This discussion begins with the states called kensho and satori and includes a fresh analysis of their several different expressions of "oneness." He points beyond the still more advanced states toward that rare ongoing stage of enlightenment that is manifest as "sage wisdom." Finally, with reference to a delayed "moonlight" phase of kensho, Austin envisions novel links between migraines and metaphors, moonlight and mysticism. The Zen perspective on the self and consciousness is an ancient one. Readers will discover how relevant Zen is to the neurosciences, and how each field can illuminate the other.<hr></blockquote> Zen and the Brain: <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0262511096/sr=1-1/qid=1153542341/ref=pd_bbs_1/102-0650637-8341728?ie=UTF8&s=books">www.amazon.com/gp/product...F8&s=books</a> Zen-Brain Reflections: <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0262012235/ref=pd_bxgy_text_b/102-0650637-8341728?ie=UTF8">www.amazon.com/gp/product...28?ie=UTF8</a>

by **Homeless Halo** » Sat Jul 22, 2006 1:38 am

Yep. Own it. It was one of the things rocking about when I read this thread. Along with "Rational Mysticism" and "Why God Won't Go Away", both of which are (fairly) well known modern attempts at these questions (both of which, I think, also reference the book you mention).

by **Jezebelladonna** » Sat Jul 22, 2006 1:53 am

Excellent. Thank you, jingofever.

by **Hugh Manatee Wins** » Sat Jul 22, 2006 3:53 am

Here is a culture war propaganda criticism followed by a sex brain science article. They are related. 1) Remember the trailer scene for 'When Harry Met Sally'? She convinces him that women can fake orgasms by doing so loudly in a restaurant? That one scene has been inflated into an entire movie starring Parker Posy as a women unable to have an orgasm with her school teacher husband but might with local macho mogul Danny Devito. Heather Graham turns her on to 'do it yourself' technology. Prurient enough for ya? <a href="http://imdb.com/title/tt0422861/">imdb.com/title/tt0422861/</a> And the punchline is the title- 'The Oh in Ohio.' <img src="http://ia.imdb.com/media/imdb/01/I/36/61/20/10f.jpg" style="border:0;"/> I think the real punchline is not just keyword hijacking but conceptual hijacking of "faked results in Ohio," as in the stolen election of 2004. And the discrediting of women is a constant in pop culture to protect the male warrior class from their influence. 2) Back to sex brain science- http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,589-1662280,00.html<blockquote>Quote:<hr>June 20, 2005 Women fall into 'trance' during orgasm From Mark Henderson, Science Correspondent in Copehagen The first brain scans of men and women having sex and reaching orgasm have revealed striking differences in the way each experiences sexual pleasure. While male brains focus heavily on the physical stimulation involved in sexual contact, this is just one part of a much more complex picture for women, scientists in the Netherlands have found. The key to female arousal seems rather to be deep relaxation and a lack of anxiety, with direct sensory input from the genitals playing a less critical role. The scans show that during sexual activity, the parts of the female brain responsible for processing fear, anxiety and emotion start to relax and reduce in activity. This reaches a peak at orgasm, when the female brain’s emotion centres are effectively closed down to produce an almost trance-like state. The male brain was harder to study during orgasm, because of its shorter duration in men, but the scans nonetheless revealed important differences. Emotion centres were deactivated, though apparently less intensely than in women, and men also appear to concentrate more on the sensations transmitted from the genitals to the brain. This suggests that for men, the physical aspects of sex play a much more significant part in arousal than they do for women, for whom ambience, mood and relaxation are at least as important. "Men find it more important to be stimulated on the penis than women find it to be stimulated on the clitoris," Gert Holstege of the University of Groningen told the European Society of Human Reproduction and Embryology conference in Copenhagen today. "We know from these images that each sex experiences stimulation differently." The experiments also revealed a rather surprising effect: both men and women found it easier to have an orgasm when they kept their socks on. Draughts in the scanning room left couples complaining of "literally cold feet", and providing a pair of socks allowed 80 per cent rather than 50 per cent to reach a climax while their brains were scanned. The scans also show that while women may be able to fool their partners with a fake orgasm, the difference is obvious in the brain. Parts of the brain that handle conscious movement light up during fake orgasms but not during real ones, while emotion centres close down during the real thing but never when a woman is pretending. In the study, a team at the University of Groningen led by Gert Holstege scanned the brains of 13 women and 11 men using a technique called positron emission tomography (PET), while they manually stimulated to orgasm by their partners. All were heterosexual and right-handed, the latter to ensure that all their brains could be easily compared. The subjects’ heads were restrained in the PET scanner during the procedure, as it only works if the body area being scanned remains still. The dimensions of the scanner and the need for stillness also explain why the researchers were unable to study intercourse itself. In both sexes, activity in the amygdala, which processes fear and anxiety, was reduced during stimulation. Women, but not men, showed lower activity in the hippocampus, important for memory, as well. In men, greater activity was seen in the insula, which deals with emotion, and particularly in the secondary somatosensory cortex, which rates the significance of physical sensations. This suggests that the sensory input coming from the genitals is being judged highly important and pleasurable by the brain. Women, however, show very little increased brain activity, and only in the primary somatosensory cortex - which registers purely that a sensation in the genitals is there."In women the primary feeling is there, but not the marker that this is seen as a big deal," Dr Holstege said."For males, touch itself is all-important. For females, it is not so important." As orgasm lasts much longer in women than in men, it is easier to study using PET - male ejaculation is over so quickly it is hard to get a reliable reading. The scans showed that in the female orgasm, activity is reduced across all the brain regions - conscious and subconscious - that handle emotion, including the amygdale, medial prefrontal cortex and orbitofrontal cortex.  "What this means is that deactivation, letting go of all fear and anxiety, might be the most important thing, even necessary, to have an orgasm," Dr Holstege said.<hr></blockquote> Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=hughmanateewins>Hugh Manatee Wins</A> at: 7/22/06 2:06 am

by **professorpan** » Sun Jul 23, 2006 1:30 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>I think the real punchline is not just keyword hijacking but conceptual hijacking of "faked results in Ohio," as in the stolen election of 2004. And the discrediting of women is a constant in pop culture to protect the male warrior class from their influence.<hr></blockquote> I'm surprised you missed the obvious keyword hijacking, Hugh. The tagline -- The Oh in Ohio -- is clearly a ploy to misdirect attention from the murder of four students at Kent State in 1970 (immortalized in the Crosby, Still, Nash and Young song "Ohio"). Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=professorpan>professorpan</A> at: 7/22/06 11:34 pm

by **Hugh Manatee Wins** » Sun Jul 23, 2006 2:22 pm

By the gods, Prof, (hitting my forehead with my palm) you are absolutely right! Prof Pan, I'm sure you thought you were being sarcastic since you have been poo-pooing the idea of linguistic hijacking as deliberate steering away from government dirty laundry and not just clever marketing. But...you are absolutely right. Did you realize that CSNY are about to do a reunion tour and were just in the studio doing a new record? Very political themes too. Very anti-war and anti-Bush.  Here's an article attempting to focus on Stills solo tour and divisions, not a united CSNY. But the dangerous truths are still in there. <a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12597825/from/RSS/">www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12597825/from/RSS/</a> <blockquote>Quote:<hr>Stills to tour solo briefly before CSNY reunion May 4, 2006 CLEVELAND - As Crosby, Stills, Nash & Young plan for their first tour in four years, Stephen Stills is slotting in a quick solo trek this month to promote his 2005 album, "Man Alive!" .... As for the CSNY Freedom of Speech trek, which kicks off July 6 near Philadelphia, Stills said the outfit was hoping to hit the road a few years ago but Neil Young's 2003 "Greendale" album kept the foursome from touring at that time. .... There was also talk of a new CSNY project but as Stills revealed, "Neil turns around and gets hopping mad and says, 'You have to come up and play with me when you get back from vacation' ... And by the time I got back from 10 days in Mexico, he had not only written enough for a new album, he had recorded a new album ('Living With War'). God bless him. I've read the lyrics and he's right on the money." Stills has a politically charged song of his own that he may put out to coincide with the Freedom of Speech tour. "It's called 'Cry Traitor,' which I may just let the Internet take because it fits with the theme of the tour," Stills said. "'So you wanna cry traitor every time we disagree.' That's what they tend to do."<hr></blockquote> Imagine the emotional triggers this will set off in the baby boomer demographic which remembers the Vietnam War. And most social engineering and propaganda since the 1960s has been preventing that level of visible resistance from breaking out again. In the target audience of youth who didn't experience the public outrage over the Vietnam War, their endorphins will instead be triggered by a images of a pretty woman having sex, not a stolen election during Vietnam II or the iconic photos of murdered college students at Kent State, Ohio or of a Vietnamese girl named Kim Phuc running naked crying with her clothes burned off by American napalm. <img src="http://www.english.uiuc.edu/maps/vietnam/vietphotos/24.jpg.jpg" style="border:0;"/> <img src="http://www.english.uiuc.edu/maps/vietnam/vietphotos/25.jpg" style="border:0;"/> That is the goal of image-mongering: to induce in the brain pleasure chemicals or stress chemicals to produce state-sanctioned behavior. Hostile images are replaced with happy ones and alternative narratives to Orwellify negative experiences into positive ones. Just as in finding the CIA cut-out Johnson Group's involvement in hijacking the name Project Paperclip , I appreciate your assistance in showing how pop culture generates the images and vocabulary which power wants in our heads.

by **orz** » Sun Jul 23, 2006 8:57 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Prof Pan, I'm sure you thought you were being sarcastic<hr></blockquote> <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol"> Nice one. <blockquote>Quote:<hr>Sudden surprises, by the way - and this thought may be in itself a sudden surprise to you - are a sort of antidote to the paranoid... or, to be accurate about it, to live in such a way as to encounter sudden surprises quite often or even now and then as an indication that you are not paranoid, because to the paranoid, nothing is a surprise; everything happens exactly as he expected, and sometimes even more so. It all fits into his system. For us though, there can be no system; maybe all systems - that is, any theoretical, verbal, symbolic, semantic, etc., forumulation that attempts to act as an all-encompassing, all-explaning hypohesis of the what the universe is about - are manifestations of paranoia.<hr></blockquote> - Philip K Dick

A mystical experience thru sex....interesting account

A mystical experience thru sex....interesting account

Re: A mystical experience thru sex....interesting account

Re: A mystical experience thru sex....interesting account

Re: A mystical experience thru sex....interesting account

Re: A mystical experience thru sex....interesting account

Re: A mystical experience thru sex....interesting account

re: maslow

Re: re: maslow

Re: re: re: re: re: re: Maslow

zen and brain.

Re: zen and brain.

Re:Orgasm and the amygdala, differences for male and female

Re: Re:Orgasm and the amygdala, differences for male and fem

Re: Prof Pan cites CSNY song 'Ohio' about Kent State.

Re: Prof Pan cites CSNY song 'Ohio' about Kent State.

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