Quantum Physics in Action

by **blanc** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 3:29 am

Bambabecky, what you say about people who have not experienced abuse being unable to believe it is part of the issue. Another part, very important, is the mental process of assimilation of new info. The debunkers know how to dress up the misinfo as something we are familiar with. New learning is always painful, this goes for verb tables in a small way and for bad news about the world in a big way. I've been re-reading the Belgium testimony in order to try to figure out what can be said, and I have noticed that the horror literally blocks my mind. I can't cope with extracting the key info in one pass, tho it aint rocket science. The inside of my mind seems to freeze up. I keep missing bits because I want to get it over with. Had I never met with irrefutable proof that this vileness is possible, I'd also be ready to switch channels. The misinfo merchants have several practices:- bad things happen but not here, where you are bad things happen to only a few stupid people who take risks women who get into trouble aren't like you, children who get hurt aren't like yours bad things didn't happen, psychiatrists/social workers led vulnerable people into fantasising the police made a cock-up, nothing bad happened, they fell for a line by an unstable woman looking for thrills police investigated appropriately, no evidence was found a couple of bad things happened because there was a psychopath in the vicinity, but we got him, its all ok now psychopath's are loners from the wrong part of town, who had a lousy childhood. you couldn't mistake them for someone doing a regular job so-called victims are realy suffering from a mental condition we just found out about that makes them say things happened which didn't people who smear politicians ( judges/industry chiefs)with this stuff have an ulterior motive its a good job you have a free press to keep you well informed so you don't get duped by all these crazy fantasists. you're better off not dwelling on the black side of life, anyone can get in a traffic accident, but that doesnt stop you getting in a car. traffic accidents are commoner than violent crimes by sadistic psychopaths, we just did the statistics, violent crimes are down, you're safer than you've ever been, chill out

by **bamabecky** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 9:22 am

One thing my friend taught me after I expressed my not understanding why the authorities didn't do something about all of this is: That these people who are involved have infiltrated the courts and the police. At the time, I thought to myself this must be way more wide-spread than I ever imagined. I even heard from a completely different source that a building in the town where I was living at the time, had been observed many times at midnight with rich looking cars arriving with people wearing black robes. Now many years later, I recognize the cover-up network to be a combination of the Freemasons, the Jesuits, the Knights of Malta, the mob (who did I leave out?); in other words the secret socities. These are the people that can approach a judge or someone in authority and make it all "go away" and make the victim look completely foolish. The average man on the street is clueless and very gullible to all of it. So as I see it, you are fighting much much more than sheer ignorance of ordinary people. Does that make sense? Bama Be the Media! Write a personal essay to your friends and family, telling them what's going on and tell them how and where to find more info.

by **blanc** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 9:57 am

absolutely. but information, is the key to keeping the mass of the people passive in the face of extreme horror.

by **LilyPatToo** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 1:42 pm

Another busy day, but I'll pop in and try to answer more of Attack Ships on Fire's questions as I find a few minutes here and there: <blockquote>Quote:<hr>Are you open to other possibilities for the trauma you experienced, or do you definitely feel that it's as a result of MC slavery? <hr></blockquote> Definitely. In fact, I yearn for another explanation. What I've found is that the other explanations I've come up with (alien abduction, for one) only explain some of the bizarre things in my life. Every one other than mind control leaves many other experiences unexplained. So far, MC is the only explanation I've found that explains ALL of the traumatic things and personal mysteries in my life. But it's horrific to me. I would *love* to wake up some morning with another answer that can also explain everything without being so evil. Another thought on your question about why survivors of MC are still breathing and walking around: Most of us who are alive, aware and talking have neatly discredited ourselves in some major way. So when we speak out, we're actually contributing to the all-important "snicker factor" for our Controllers, albeit unwillingly. We've been deliberately force-fed absurd-sounding false screen memories that, when we earnestly report them, serve to bring down ridicule upon our heads. Look at Kathleen Sullivan (and me and many, many others) whose memories include alien abduction. A very few of us are trying to make people understand that we were conned and to correct what we first reported, but the damage is done, as far as 99% of the population is concerned--we're lunatics and/or delusional. So we can talk and explain about what we NOW understand happened and no one believes us. In fact, we're SO easy to dismiss that we feed the snicker factor every time we open our mouths. To the Controllers, we're definitely earning our keep as disinformationists, even if we're now telling absolute truth. Makes me NUTS. <blockquote>Quote:<hr>How much of your recollections do you think are coming in memories you feel that you can fully accept as being real? <hr></blockquote> The first thing I did when I began to remember was to get back in touch with people that I knew at the time that the events took place. Without telling them how I recalled it, I asked them how they remembered the incidents. And my memories agreed with theirs almost 100%. In many cases they'd not been present, but I'd come to them frantic and upset immediately afterward and since the events I was reporting were so unusual, they tended to recall what I'd said quite vividly. Though I can't do that for every incident, the fact that I did recall the details of so many other incidents that could be corroborated very clearly tells me that my long-term memory for this sort of thing is apparently very accurate. So it's likely that the ones with no witnesses that I was far too terrified to tell anyone about are also being remembered correctly. But then there are Lily's memories--she's my apparent Beta sex slave alter who emerged into co-consciousness with me after my mother's death. For years, I'd had vivid, undream-like dreams that seemed to be from someone else's perspective (ie. it wasn't ME in the dream) of sexual assignations with some national and international level politicians. Just like Sue Ford ("Brice Taylor"), Cathy O'Brien and many other MC survivors. I don't know what to make of Lily's memories at all. She believes that they happened--both the ones in the "Lily dreams" and also others. But she's 14 years old and a True Believer if ever I've met one--what male power figures tell her, she believes implicitly. So they could be false screen memories deliberately implanted by a programmer--they certainly would serve to discredit me if I made them public, wouldn't they?! LilyPat

by **havanagilla** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 5:54 pm

LilP, basically I agree, but I wish to add something (which we actually mentioned earlier) and that's the failure of certain groups on other grounds. If I take my case as a typical situation, when my awareness started, i actually acted very reasonably, I didn't think I was abducted, i understood the goal of the exploitation in one major case, and I went and spilled the beans to someone who should have been more courageous. He was one of the (then) leaders of the Left, civil rights blah blah people and was actually holding a fairly significant position (Head of Legislative Committee of the israeli parliament, well, not an executive position and THAT kind of power, but a dignified position with some power). The man heard the gist of it, beleived me immediately and you know what he said "you'd better shut up totally or you'll find yourself 6 ft under in Holon cemetary"...Similar, but less dramatic *and more supportive, message I received from the head of the legal of dept of the largest women's org in Israel (an org with political power), she said "shut the fuck up" but also offered me an umbrella, job and networking etc. -- Another was a pretty famous MK, on the feminist front of affairs, who said she cannot deal with this case, because its too big. Etc. (there were some more). I didn't say MC, I just stated the facts which included sex relations with a person in a position that should disqualify him and all his decisions, and even though made me look bad (i didn't say he hypnotized me, cause nobody would believe that), I went ahead and said it, and there was enough proof that he did (he was a lecher). - So, sometimes the PTB's don't have to ruin your reputation at all, or even smack you, they can just trust the general corruption and fear. Another failure we discussed was the "left", these people are dumb. And so even if you hand them their best bet to make some real noise and challenge the gov, they tend to either not believe or be afraid, OR...as is more usual the case I think, they are busy hearing themselves preach slogans of abstract meaning, that they don't want to dirty their hands in real life, and so you actually get them to do the smearing job, for the PTB, for free. No need to implant abduction memories. For instance in my case again, the person from MY group who burried it, is a "civil rights lawyer/macher" (whealer and dealer), since she was more concerned with competition, power struggles and her ego, she saw my situation as an opportunity to get rid of a competitor (she saw it that way, I was not in that direction anyway, I was dealing with my inner dark demons most of the time) and fortify her position within the little NGO. I believe someone was also sending her some misinfo, but surely if people are not already inclined to hear trash on collegues, in the first place, it would not be so EASY for the PTB's to create those blasts within NGOs. (divisions, blow up orgs, etc.). It takes some pretty ugly character to accept easily some smearing without confronting YOUR OWN colleague, out of about a dozen of such lawyers in the entire state of sirael. (we were about a dozen civil rights lawyer all in all, I think now there are less). She was from my hometown, she was in my elder sister's class, they were like "rivals" on the basis of "who is the queen of the class" at around 16 years old, a good background for such intrigue to materialize. i think she NOW knows what happened, in that case, to me, and who incited her not to even hear me out, but even now, she is not going to sort it out. Ego comes first, much before "the cause" or any struggles against the gov. Her first loyalty would be the old grudge to my (now dead) sister, from 10th grade. This is the type of person, and she is not the only one of that sort, in this small club of "activists". -- So add this to the usual discreditation. -- I have so far avoided statements like alien abductions, i also have no psychiatric record (except what I think ahppened when I was 17, namely a heavy drugging by a psych clinic, which my mother confirms but for some magical reason HAS NO RECORD). Other than that, i had some minor psych stuff, not more than the usual yupie. cannot be brought against me. But since I was disoriented and confused for the last 2 years here, I am always careful lest someone send the troops with the white coats, its never hard to do if someone really wants to. But officially, except poverty (a big discrediting factor in Israel, btw, and I think in the USA too...), my testimony, if I ever do that, cannot be automatically dismissed as "nut case", plus there's so much validation for some of those affairs... that's why, the other mechanism, (much less in the USA btw, your justice system, and i've seen it, is MUCH more reliable, or actually unreliable to PTB scams), is CORRUPTION. Works fine in Israel.

by **LilyPatToo** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 11:51 pm

havanagilla, that recent confusion you mention--is there any possibility that you might be being targetted with electronic "non-lethal" weapons? They are said to cause mental confusion, along with a lot of other symptoms. Author Alex Constantine has written about them, having been targetted himself due to his books. He has several articles online, too--Google him if you are interested. And if the US has them, then it's pretty safe to assume that Israel does too.... Attack Ships on Fire, you asked one BIG question that I've struggled to answer in less than a book-length manuscript and failed, so far: <blockquote>Quote:<hr> How much have you been able to confirm as having happened (i.e., have you been able to identify your handlers, where they live, locations where you've been, etc.)? <hr></blockquote> It’s a good question that, unfortunately, would take a tremendous amount of time to answer fully, since I’ve managed to verify that a number of incidents happened that are very suggestive of mind control and that are difficult to explain in any other way that makes sense. I've posted here about a couple of them --like the memory of watching as I was sold by one very wealthy businessman to another back in the mid-1970’s. So is the moment in the summer of 2004 when an old man walked up to me on Grand Ave. and spoke 4 familiar-sounding words into my ear and I lost some time. The next thing I recall was standing 10 feet or so from where he’d accosted me, backed up against a building, absolutely terrified, while he stood grinning at me. Then there was the CIA mercenary guy who practically took over my life around 1979-80ish. And the Dutch friend who was arrested by a bunch of government agents as we stepped off the plane at Schipol Airport in 1982 (for Mafia crimes). Or the mysterious Dutchman who took me to stand in front of the Bilderberg Hotel in 1983 and grilled me on the subject of the Bilderbergers, of whom at that time I had no conscious knowledge at all. He then went away, apparently satisfied, and none of the friends who'd introduced us would talk about him. Are you getting the picture? My life is full of incidents like those. Either I was in some kind of program or I had very bad, very interesting karma, because no one else I’ve ever known has had a life like mine. When you ask me for locations of incidents, I have so many that I hardly know where to begin....I’ve been to most of the countries in Europe (and to Israel), some of them multiple times, and to a lot of places inside the US, too. Lots of missing time and strange incidents. I’ve put together a lot of evidence that’s suggestive of a number of handlers over my lifetime, including a current one. And of occasional Mafia enforcer-types working with them. None of it is proof, but it’s extremely suggestive of their being real handlers. The current one, who I call Handler Guy, even works at at local lab that handles top secret govt. weapons contracts and that has been named by MC researchers as an MC center funded by money siphoned off of the Star Wars program, which has been a source of covert MC funding in the past. And when I met him, he had a very unstable DID woman living with him, who I now realize sounds just like a MC victim with decaying programming. I could give you chapter and verse for all of this, but, at the end, would you be any more convinced? I've already lost track of which thread(s) Ive posted about my odd experiences here on this board, but they're floating around somewhere. The thing about this kind of a life is that the Controllers are scrupulously careful to leave victims with little or no verifiable/will-stand-up-in-court evidence. All we're left with is a bewildering mess of a life that sounds (even to us) like a bad film script. I'll gladly try though, if we can narrow down the questions a bit. When you ask them, it helps me to clarify and organize the huge amount of personal information I've amassed into something approaching a time-line--something I've become aware that I need, with this amount of information stretching over half a century. LilyPat

by **havanagilla** » Tue Jul 11, 2006 1:48 am

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- <blockquote>Quote:<hr>havanagilla, that recent confusion you mention--is there any possibility that you might be being targetted with electronic "non-lethal" weapons? They are said to cause mental confusion, along with a lot of other symptoms<hr></blockquote> Maybe that too, but mostly i was just shattered from the trauma in canada, the forced return, the threats and stalking I endured here upon return, it would disorient anyone, without being bombarded with some electromagnetic weapons. The situation in canada was a make or break one, and i ended on the wrong side of the fork.

by **LilyPatToo** » Wed Jul 12, 2006 4:41 pm

Threats and stalking do have that effect, not least because they are generally disbelieved by people who have never experienced them, which adds invalidation to the stress that the harassment has already caused. Whenever I meet another MC survivor, I try to remember to ask them if any of their harassment was witnessed by others. The second time I was subjected to very overt street theater on a local freeway ("freeway theater"?!), I had an actual witness who also reacted to the sight, for the first time. But once the perpetrators exited the freeway and he saw that I was OK, he waved, tooted his horn and exited himself and I lost the one witness I've ever had, which still depresses me every time I think of it. Like now. I've even fantasized about placing an ad in the newspaper personals column or on Craig's List, but I never do it, since the chances of this one man ever seeing it are close to nil and I know that. But at least his responses proved that it wasn't my imagination, and for that, I'll always be grateful. Then there's the problem of program-loyal alters taking over for the split second needed to get me away from the scene or to destroy evidence--that's happened a couple of times and it makes me nuts, too. Once, early on in my discovery that MC was operating in my life, I posted online about a dream I had from the POV of my alter Lily. I didn't mention the name of the politician and I scrupulously avoided even hinting at the particular perversion that he liked, but the next AM I received my first piece of porn email spam...and it featured that precise perversion. I began hyperventilating and felt such vulnerability and panic that I reflexively hit the "Delete" key, thereby depriving myself of actual evidence, albeit circumstantial, that my handler was indeed monitoring my posts. Was that stupidity allied with panic? Or was it a program-loyal alter? Not long after that, I posted about the CIA "minder" I had for a number of years (not even by name) and my house was entered and my computer turned on and MC files left open on the desktop. When I kept on posting, my house was entered a second time, the same thing was done with the computer and a little fairy statuette was left beneath the desk, stomped-upon and smashed. And my alter Lily suddenly vanished, after 9 months of daily co-presence, so I must have been accessed, too. Events like that make us sound paranoid and delusional, but they happen all the time to MC survivors. And we ARE paranoid, most of us for very good reason, so that critics who buy into the snicker factor find it pitifully easy to dismiss us and our stories. The kinder ones tend to simply say there isn't enough hard evidence and move on to other subjects. LilyPat

by **havanagilla** » Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:34 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Events like that make us sound paranoid and delusional, but they happen all the time to MC survivors. And we ARE paranoid, most of us for very good reason, so that critics who buy into the snicker factor find it pitifully easy to dismiss us and our stories. The kinder ones tend to simply say there isn't enough hard evidence and move on to other subjects. LilyPat<hr></blockquote> Lily, i have had some similar experiences, and yes, the destruction of evidence ...familiar and painful memories...(the famous delete, amongst them, and there was one case when I was led to bring my one cassette of GOOD recording of an OFFICIAL threatning me with murder if I discover what happened to me...- to a person they sent...it was awful). Anyway, as for those events and others, again, don't know about the US as much as I know about israel. Here, i found out quite late in my life, that there are ample witnesses, and in fact a large segment of society here KNOWS even the context - maybe they don't know the term MC etc., but they know it in simpler words, as in "this gal is an official dupe and this is decided from high and we should/want to cooperate". It is more an issue of corruption than invisibility. At least in my country. I was amazed recently to find out how many people know these things happen and justify it, and cooperate HAPPILY, either in hope to get perks or just from obedience and trusting "the system". Example. When in Canada, before I was shipped, I was speaking to some local israelis in very general terms about my situation, one guy (a local "dude" who is running the small israeli radio in TO) told me the position of the group - Well, I would gladly have killed you personally, if your existence is not helpful for Israel's PR here, but since there are little kids involved (me, as a mother), I say we can show mercy, but not too much, namely, if it is "necessary", then this too will not be a hurdle.". Now, don't think for one moment that he thought I was an enemy, or something, he knew roughtly my tragedy (he called it "oh, so you were used an "escort" ? something like that, giggling), namely, that I was picked as a victim. But in their normal values, this is a must, and tough luck. More so, I should gracefully commit a suicide or something to clear my annoying presence and spare "the people" the need to resolve the issue. Same response even more chilling, in the USA (berkeley in fact) from a well to do hi tech guy, one of those "born again" jews namely, suddenly became zionist/religious, he said, while playing a mellow tune on his Stenway (100k) piano - "oh so you got screwed up, ah, that doesn't mean anything". Namely, some people get screwed up, so what. Israel is still a "holy place" or something for "the select". He had no problem doing that, and not even pretending to sympathize with a gross violation of justice, human rights, and even simple mercy for a woman who was just sacrificed brutaly. That should tell you, that probably in more cases than you'd like to think, people KNOW something, get the gist, and concur, and even collaborate for something or for free. People are not very nice, ehem... Hope this is not very depressing news about the world, but again, perhaps the situation is entirely different in the USA. I tend to think itis, because in sirael people are used to treading on bodies...its a war zone for very long.

by **LilyPatToo** » Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:25 pm

It IS different here in some minor ways, but not over-all. I totally agree that in Israel there is a MUCH higher tolerance for causing people misery--I saw that first-hand when I was there. The idea of fairness is either different or absent, I kept finding out when I interacted with one of the Israelis who was running the Neanderthal digs that we worked on. She was the kind of Sabra who hates blue-eyed blondes on sight and singled me out for incredibly overt tormenting/bullying. The only people who objected to her tactics were other US or UK people--the Israelis on the dig all just shrugged and told me to get used to it. They basically said, she's in charge and I'm not about to piss her off by sticking up for you. End of story. And as for the callousness of people dismissing sexual exploitation with a snicker--that's happened to me, too. Sometimes it's boorishness and sometimes it's something more, but it always hurts. On the board where I was posting when I found out about MC, one woman even went so far as to say that I was obviously just trying to avoid responsibility for making bad choices in men...! Keep in mind that she knew about all of my MC history to that date, in far greater detail than I've gone into here, too. She shrugged off my being sold and prostituted, my discovery of who my handler was, the stalking and the harassment--all of it. Then, a little later, she mentioned on another thread about all of her "dreams" of being raped as a little girl by a prominent US politician/pedophile who's been named by at least 3 or 4 MC survivors, and it suddenly struck me that she was a survivor, too--just one still deep in denial and lashing out at anyone who made her uncomfortable by jeopardizing that denial. And another person, a guy, also showed up at that board and became the bane of all the posters there who had found solid evidence in their pasts of MC program involvement. His tactic was to lead any evidence or fact-based discussion off into "woo-woo land" fast. We never figured out whether he was a professional disinformationist, a survivor with a program-loyal alter that was acting out or a lone loon looking for an audience. When you're dealing with a subject as incendiary as MC and its survivors are as deeply damaged as most are, you have a prescription for chaos. LilyPat

by **Attack Ships on Fire** » Wed Jul 12, 2006 9:25 pm

Thanks LilyPatToo for continuing to take time out and answer my questions. I don't have any more right now that I think would help illuminate the subject for me any further. I think you've already given me enough to dwell on. One thing I would like to suggest is to find someone you can trust and get them involved with documenting your experiences and being prepared for any future incidents that may happen. Make sure that it's someone of your choice, not someone that approaches you. I would be cautious of syncronicity based on the strange events you've described. Anyway, it's just a thought. Do whatever makes you the most comfortable because it is your life. Again, thank you for thinking about and replying to my questions and keep your chin up.

by **LilyPatToo** » Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:18 pm

Thank you, Attack Ships on Fire, for being the most courteous skeptic I've encountered since I've been posting about this stuff. You're living proof that it's possible to reserve judgement without ridiculing the survivor--and I was beginning to wonder about that, having run into a lot of people online who were either dismissive or quite defensive. Your questions helped me to organize my thoughts about some of my history, so I hope I encounter more people who know how to phrase questions in such a way that they evoke new ways of looking at complex information. I do have several (off-line) friends now who are aware of past events and who believe me--that was something I despaired of ever having during most of the last 2 years, so it has made me feel more secure. One of them is especially interested in the unusual structure of my mind and she's become my "spare/back-up harddrive". I have extreme memory problems around this stuff and sometimes the only way I have subsequent access to memories is if I've told her about them immediately after they've happened. Otherwise, they vanish from my mind within days. Since they occur most often around anything to do with the man I believe to be my handler, they tend to make me think I'm correct about him. My chin's not just up, it's out--as in oppositional<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/wink.gif ALT=";)"> And that's the only way to approach this kind of interference. At other boards where MC is discussed, there are huge numbers of whiners that have shown me how futile (not to mention *annoying*) that response is<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/eyes.gif ALT=":rolleyes"> LilyPat

by **rothbardian** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 4:10 am

Havanagilla, LilyPatToo and some of you other 'walking wounded'--- I don't want to interrupt your conversations, other than to say this is a spectacular thread and yet more proof that, despite a few hardcore naysayers and obstructors hanging around RI, this is the most important discussion board in the world, hands down. As far as I am concerned, the couple or three of you here who are dissecting your horrific experiences and trying to provide understanding and insight...are courageous and heroic. Real life heroes. You (we?) may yet shed enough light on all these things, to force the bad guys back under the rocks from whence they came. Thanks much for your efforts, but more importantly...stay safe. Chin up and out!

by **4911** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 8:50 pm

I heard the idea that people have been responsible for their experiences is central to most major religions. This is OLDER than the idea of any NWO. It points to something more than a major marketing tool/devide and conquer/enforce not caring, you intelligent eggheads. Way pre-1800s. Fuck the NEW AGE bullshit. That is OLD AGE school of thought. Anyways, this thread was about quantum physics, not RA. Either way, people who play the weak ass anti-semite card right off the bat are fucking losers wearing those things horses wear to keep em looking straight ahead. This board is about OPENNESS and TRUTH, supposedly. Check your shit before you play that card, whatever youve been through...it will only weaken your position if you play it wrong. You chose your parents. but you dont remember why. That has its reasons. The kid chose napalm to feel what its like to suffer. How dare you minimalize the human experience. how DARE you exclude the SOUL and attribute that to a projected IDEAL of ANTI-SEMITISM.. There IS death, and it is as fleeting as life. Ive talked to people whove been dead. Flatline. This is about consciousness, not about whether a vehicle ( b o d y) is in life or death. Either way, this thread has been quite important to me. Alot of healthy things came out of it so far, for all the activity it seems to have sparked. (at least in my mind and life.) I got my ex to accept the idea of therapy through what I learned here. Thank you DE, even if you think Im full of shit. Thank you Blanc. Thank you LillyPat. Life & Being... so strange. Also, thanks Joe Hillhoist in friggn australia of all places. May you all synchronicitize. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=4911>4911</A> at: 7/19/06 8:32 pm

by **Dreams End** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 9:50 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>I got my ex to accept the idea of therapy through what I learned here. <hr></blockquote> I'm extremely happy to hear it. It's a marathon...not a sprint, so it's a long road ahead.... But that's a great first step.

Quantum Physics in Action

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That's a good list Blanc

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Chin up and out!

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