Why are 'they' scaring us away from the news?

by **FourthBase** » Wed May 10, 2006 11:26 pm

It's not been a debate on the merit of the ideas. It's been you sucking your own dick. All your conjecture is "fact". All our conjecture is "flimsy". Fuck off. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=fourthbase>FourthBase</A> at: 5/10/06 9:29 pm

by **wordspeak** » Wed May 10, 2006 11:40 pm

"The motion picture is one of the most powerful propaganda weapons at the disposal of the United States. It can serve many diversified functions." So back to common sense here- obviously, there is a unified elite that has control over the media and uses it for propaganda purposes. If you had power wouldn't you? They're not just out to make money; they're waging a war of ideas, information, propaganda. "They" are the string-pullers of this system; looking at a Bildeberg roster is a good place to start to see who "they" are. Professor Pan, you are an extremely naive individual, assuming you are not being disengenuous in this discussion. The Coup cover is a non-sensical example for the overarching topic of the control and influence by a unified ultra-elite. First of all, The Coup is an anti-government group, and the image of the towers falling was in public consciousness prior to 9/11. So there are any number of explanations, which have been stated here, for the album cover. But more importantly- do we not agree that it's in the interests of leaders of this Empire to influence opinion and exert psychological control, to inject "memes" into society? Do you not believe people are thinking on that level? You don't recognize the existence of an overclass that is about alot more than making money? What do you think that psychological operations are? What do you think 9/11 was? Why- or how?- has the mass media covered up the evidence of a 9/11 conspiracy in such a uniform manner, just as it did the JFK assassination and countless high level conspiracies, from assassinations to CIA drug dealing? Because it's deeply infiltrated. Because the military-intelligence establishment of the world's wealthiest and most powerful country recognizes that CONTROLLING THE MEDIA is the most important tool of controlling the people. duh. In the media, and for the most part, there are lines that you can't cross, or you get fired. Do I have to say what these lines are? Heads of various newspapers and other media companies meet, and the agenda of people who have an interest above that of pure profit- an interest of control and the greater advancement of the socio-economic system- are met. There exist foundations, such as the Rockefeller and Ford Foundations, which represent the interests of the ruling ultra-elite, and they fund and control the institutions of this system. If this were not the case, across-the-board cover-ups of assassinations and other covert operations would not be able to be executed. Remember the Jekyll Island meetings that started the Federal Reserve? Throughout the past century political and economic power was consolidated in the hands of very few, in a system of "monopoly capitalism." Better than competing, elites have realized, is consolidating interests for greater gains on behalf of advancing the neo-liberal agenda. The Central Intelligence Agency was created. The CIA does a lot of the dirty work. The intelligence network and the foundations influence films, television and books, in order to, in a sophisticated manner, benefit the system to which they are beholden. No, intelligence agents don't control every news anchor and every script line, and they don't have to. But they cover up important stories; they don't allow "memes" that carry a strong social class analysis; they propagandize daily for the specific geo-strategic ambitions of the world's only Empire. Of course they do. They'd be foolish not to. If too much truth came out about fascism, about child labor, political corruption, government drug dealing, the violent attacks on progressive democratic social movements, people would be outraged, and the entire system would be at risk. The most powerful entities realized long ago that they have to consolidate their interests, and also that they have to infiltrate and control the opposition. A lot of the media that appears to be "anti-government" is actually limited hangout or stealth "bad memes," with occassional exception. And in this era of rising awareness of government conspiracies and the existence of an essentially unified elite, disinformation that there is *not* significant unification of ultra-elites is rampant. A couple people on this board seem to be both buying and selling it. I say people who want to proceed with having more advanced discussions should proceed.

by **Dreams End** » Thu May 11, 2006 12:14 am

I thought that was a great summary, wordspeak. Except you forgot to call Pan a scumbag. So your post wasn't as eloquent as fourthbase, but you'll learn. Meanwhile...what are some good resources to put some meat on the skeleton you've laid out? It's time for the left to take analysis of ultra-elites back from the far right "Illuminatists" and to show that there's a way to track what these guys are up to, at least to a significant extent. Personally, if I wanted to live by my own words, I'd stop reading here and start reading Foreign Affairs, Wall Street Journal and related. It's actually pretty amazing how much is actually spelled out. Check the post above from Newkid linking to documents where they just say, "Hey, let's use the movies for propaganda." Read that document. They lay it all out...and that's before there even WAS a CIA (it was OSS still). Note the casual reference to "blacklisting", also. Chilling in its succinctness. It's not about some magical formula that if kids watch a movie they become slaves. It's about controlling mental space, limiting the worldview and the accepted limits of debate. Add in MKUltra and various CIA run cults and you get into some scary stuff, but much of it doesn't even require this sort of thing. But we need to start being specific. I agree 100% with Wordspeak...but there's no evidence offered there. Who has built this case already to some degree? Who is putting together analysis of the elites that goes beyond a secret 13 family cabal that controls everything down to your garage door opener? Unless we can compete with these theories, with more substantial theories, the extreme right will own this. It will always be Larouche exposing (and embellishing) SRA and eugenics schemes. THAT is why all this is so frustrating for me. Not that I reject the idea of elite schemes, but that the simplistic, cartoon-like characterization of these schemes is not only self-discrediting, but actually, in some weird paradox, feeds the very fascist beast it claims to want to tame.

by **thoughtographer** » Thu May 11, 2006 12:21 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>A lot of the media that appears to be "anti-government" is actually limited hangout or stealth "bad memes," with occassional exception. And in this era of rising awareness of government conspiracies and the existence of an essentially unified elite, disinformation that there is *not* significant unification of ultra-elites is rampant. A couple people on this board seem to be both buying and selling it. I say people who want to proceed with having more advanced discussions should proceed.<hr></blockquote> Hahaha! Do "advanced discussions" only consist of topics stemming from your chosen presuppositions? Nobody is stopping your from polishing your ivory tower; so either keep talking and debate the opposing viewpoints, or shut the fuck up. It's rhetoric like yours that turns people off to the extremely important topics often discussed around here, and I'll be damned if I'm going to be one more author of your collective cartoon. If oversimplification is what it takes for you, fine -- just don't expect everyone else to accept the same evidence that won you over and imply that they're just too naive or stupid when it doesn't happen. Of course the well is being poisoned by greedy, manipulative people with money and power. Of course they take care of their own. Of course they benefit from ignorance and stupidity -- these things are given by human nature, of which we're all on intimate terms. The fact remains that some of those greedy bastards don't play the game, because it would mean less for them. Do you think every smarmy, fatcat Hollywood producer wants The Con to get a piece of their action? Fuck no. Assholes like that wouldn't even pay their taxes (and don't) if they can figure out a way around it. "A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."

by **NavnDansk** » Thu May 11, 2006 1:31 am

<a href="http://www.eoneill.com">www.eoneill.com</a> ====Contour In Time=== Prior The Door and the Mirror: The Iceman Cometh   Next In other plays, on the other side of the door in the mind, O’Neill explored such lost men, men for the most part without women. In the cycle, the ability and the need to dream were the consequences of man’s having in him a touch of the poet. As he wrote, however, O’Neill came to see the need to dream as a universal one, shared by all men, a human drive, possibly man’s most basic urge. Any dream sustains, whether it gives hope or hopeless hope or acts like hope, a “dope-dream.” The dream alone gives life. Nina Leeds called life “a long drawn out lie with a sniffling sigh at the end,” (40) and the pun has relevance to the lie of the pipe dreams to which the derelicts in Harry Hope’s saloon cling. O’Neill wrote the first draft of The Iceman Cometh between June 8 and November 26, 1939. In this year, the world fell apart as Poland was invaded and Britain and France declared war on Germany. Throughout the end of the Depression, O’Neill had worked on the cycle, finishing drafts of And Give Me Death, The Greed of the Meek and More Stately Mansions. Work on The Calms of Capricorn had begun, but the world crisis made it mpossible for him to continue his account of the decline and fall of the United States. In the midst of Armageddon, one does not bother to prophesy. O’Neill’s reaction to war was predictable. At Tao House, he retreated further into himself than he had ever gone before, as if the only understanding that could come in a world gone mad was the understanding of one’s self. The following year he wrote Hughie and the scenarios and some draft versions of its companion works in the cycle of one-act plays called By Way of Obit. In 1941, he wrote his last completed work, A Moon for the Misbegotten. Although he picked at the cycle, making revisions on A Touch of the Poet as late as 1942, the work was at a stalemate. Whatever truths it contained for O’Neill had finally to be explored in another past, his own, and in another way than he had in the cycle. The last four plays form a network of introspection whose effect is perhaps best expressed in O ’Neill’s words about The Iceman Cometh contained in a letter to Lawrence Langner dated August 11, 1940: <blockquote>Quote:<hr>. . . there are moments in it that suddenly strip the secret soul of a man stark naked, not in cruelty or moral superiority, but with an understanding compassion which sees him as a victim of the ironies of life and of himself. Those moments are for me the depth of tragedy, with nothing more that can possibly be said.<hr></blockquote> Compassion produced by a full understanding of man’s circumstances and man’s essential nature, a compassion which beggars analysis, is O’Neill’s final achievement in theatre. The action of each of the four last plays rests in a tale to be told, a tale that is essentially a confession made in hope of absolution. Although the confessional tale is often plotless, often nothing more than a dream, it is a way of reaching out in the dark, of finding pity long denied to old sorrow.<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/indifferent.gif ALT=":|"> == Perhaps the nearest theatrical analogue to The Iceman Cometh is Dylan Thomas’s Under Milkwood. Both are “plays for voices,” and the voices are those of the dead, reiterating their stories endlessly in an eternity of silence. Under the circumstances of the play the period slang takes on the special qualities of lyric speech. * The movement is musical; the repetition of what is said, often almost without significant development, must be followed as if it were music, as patterned abstraction, implemented through contrapuntal repetitions. It is a kind of “sound effect,” but here blended so completely with the action that it becomes the action. There are not many moments in theatre comparable to the canonical weaving of the narratives of betrayal, Hickey’s and Parritt’s, toward the end of the play. Hickey’s long monologue is interspersed by short echoing comments from Parritt telling Larry Slade of his own act of betrayal. Parritt and Hickey do not, really, listen to the words that are said. That is to say they do not understand one another and from that understanding receive direction. Rather, they move toward the same end without conscious inter-awareness, impelled by purely verbal concatenations, each developing the theme of betrayal as a sound in the air. The Iceman Cometh does not need music, yet it should be heard as music is heard with an understanding that it progresses in patterns of sound, as much as in patterns of narrative action... == Hickey’s remedy for the ills of the world, as that world is represented by the types in Harry Hope’s back room, is equally cold, equally predicated on a belief that human life is an illusion. As Lazarus exhorts, so Hickey, by means of a series of long, brutal individual encounters in the rooms above the bar, forces the dreamers to give over their ultimate link with life, the sustaining pipe-dream of their worth as human beings. Their dreams hold at least an illusion of life’s essence: movement in purposive action. Action, to be sure, will never be taken, but the dreams reveal a basic human truth: to foster life, man must preserve a minimal dream of movement. Hickey, whose promised peace is predicated on showing the dreamers that they will never take action and that their dream of doing so is a lie, brings the peace of death. Like much psychiatric theory, Hickey’s Godless theology seeks “adjustment” to a meaningless reality, claiming that he who faces his life will find it. Yet if there is no life to be found, Hickey—not unlike Lazarus—becomes Death’s priest... <blockquote>Quote:<hr>The world which the dreamers inhabit has the fragile ecology of a tide pool. O’Neill calls the saloon “The Bottom of the Sea Rathskeller,” and the imagery of drifting tidal life is pervasive.<hr></blockquote> * It is a world that barely holds to the fringes of consciousness, moving hesitantly between sleeping and waking, fusing the two conditions into a continuous trance-like existence. The light that filters through the dirty windows from the street is pale and insufficient to separate day from night. Time is meaningless. Voices are nearly unheard in the comatose silence. Existence at Harry Hope’s is reduced to its lowest denominator, a hibernation of animals huddled together in dread of waking.<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/tired.gif ALT="|I"> * Interestingly, no one of the cast of characters has any connection with the sea, as if O’Neill were deliberately denying the source of his earlier poetic dreams. ** Larry has stood in loco parentis to Parritt. Whether or not he is actually Parritt’s father is deliberately left ambiguous. Slade denies it when Parritt suggests that he is, but with such vehemence as to raise the possibility. *** O’Neill to Dudley Nichols, December 16, 1942. He had worked on the outline and scenario over the year prior to the bombing of Pearl Harbor. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=navndansk>NavnDansk</A> at: 5/11/06 1:24 am

by **NavnDansk** » Thu May 11, 2006 2:06 am

Stop picking on people, Professor Pan and Thoughtographer, you all just might be Theodore Hickey <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> As Jesus said: <blockquote>Quote:<hr>"Take care of the log in your own eye before you presume to take the mote out of your brother's eye."<hr></blockquote> Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=navndansk>NavnDansk</A> at: 5/11/06 12:46 am

by **NavnDansk** » Thu May 11, 2006 2:23 am

Non-judgmental atmosphere. The most common illustration is script writing. A scene development is needed, so for a half hour or so NO CRITICISM IS ALLOWED and everyone primes the pump of creative ideas by either speaking any ideas they want to get the flow of creative ideas going -- or they write ideas on an index card, without any criticism again, like priming a pump to get rid of the gunk and so that the clear water can flow and throw the cards in the middle of the table. The ideas are read one by one, AND ONLY IN THIS SECOND STAGE IS CRITICISM ALLOWED and for further sessions inspiration, hopefully, no one uses vitrolic language to reject one of the ideas but just states why the idea doesn't seem a likely solution and it is discarded right away OR set aside for further examination from different angles. Some variation of this is necessary in any creative work either with a group or by oneself and self-criticism which is often the voice of a parent or an authority figure from the past can block you off from the creative ideas that are everyone's birthright and need to solve any problem. I know everyone is very upset by the really scary things going on but in blocking the flow of ideas and hurting people's feeling so you can feel stronger and more powerful in this very disempowering world situation is not moral or right and is distressing to many observing it. Everyone, please try to treat other people with respect. Any kind of creative thinking makes people vulnerable and jumping on people for expressing something that moved them is counterproductive on ALL levels. Thank you. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=navndansk>NavnDansk</A> at: 5/11/06 1:44 am

by **thoughtographer** » Thu May 11, 2006 2:29 am

Are you through? "A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."

by **NavnDansk** » Thu May 11, 2006 2:30 am

nt. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=navndansk>NavnDansk</A> at: 5/12/06 6:24 am

by **thoughtographer** » Thu May 11, 2006 2:31 am

The only "pump" you're "priming" is your own. "A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."

by **NavnDansk** » Thu May 11, 2006 2:32 am

cup of tea. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=navndansk>NavnDansk</A> at: 5/12/06 6:25 am

by **NavnDansk** » Thu May 11, 2006 2:33 am

You can share creative ideas and sometimes reaches a synergy with others but I am a painter and mainly work alone. Better creative control. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/indifferent.gif ALT=":|"> Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=navndansk>NavnDansk</A> at: 5/12/06 6:25 am

by **thoughtographer** » Thu May 11, 2006 2:38 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>You can share creative ideas and sometimes reaches a synergy with others but I am a painter and mainly work alone. Better creative control.<hr></blockquote> Yeah, that attitude seems to pervade your thinking. Maybe you should try working with others, and you'll realize that disagreement doesn't always mean conflict. I'd really like to understand how I'm "picking on" anyone, but I'm sure you won't be able to tell me without shoving Eugene O'Neill, Jesus or yourself down my throat. "A crooked stick will cast a crooked shadow."

by **NavnDansk** » Thu May 11, 2006 2:54 am

being a painter or writer, unlike an actor or script writer to work mostly alone. Went back and on the past two pages of this thread, it was mainly Professor Pan picking on Fourth Base but you have done it too, to others, and Dream's End, not in her/his last post, but often angers people as s/he admitted and I was thinking of her name "Dreams END" and thought of The Iceman Cometh and Hickey's destruction of people's "pipe dreams" and the motivation for it and the results. And so looked it up earlier. And was still thinking of it when read the extremely angry and hurt responses on some of the preceding pages. Hickey was trying to convert everyone and DH Lawrence wrote that everyone is a Pharisee, including him and including me. I think A.S. Neil wrote something similar and Solzhenitzhen criticized Stalin for trying to control people like puppies pushing their face in the milk saying there drink. But Solz was also critical of himself in the character based on his ideas in First Circle for "trying to find the right way to live and forcing everyone around him to live according to it." But Solzhenitsen, DH Lawrence and myself while criticising others and having strong opinions can back off and look at what you are doing and that is the reason for exchanges between people but if it is too nasty then as Norman Mailer said of arguments between people during the Vietnam War that with every word, they were building a wall between each other. The Impressionists would argue fiercely in their cafes on what the new art should be and then rush off to paint a picture to prove the others wrong, but I think they were probably long time friends and so it had a different tone to it. The reactions by FourthBase to Professor Pan and the reactions to Professor Pan's and your provoking statements and to Dream's End in past posts show that these are not just friendly arguments, and the anger gets in the way of any kind of collaborative creative problem-solvingand it does not seem like the best way to find the answers that we desperately need to respond to the evil but successful collaborations of the Bush Crime Family, Bilderberg, Carlyle, etc., etc., etc. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=navndansk>NavnDansk</A> at: 5/11/06 1:17 am

by **NavnDansk** » Thu May 11, 2006 3:02 am

and artists whose work seems to speak truth to me and I am trying to share it not shove it down anyone's throat and the quote about the mote applies to me also. A.S. Neil wrote that "Every criticism of another is being Pharisee-ical". So that is a warning to everyone even the person doing the cautioning. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=navndansk>NavnDansk</A> at: 5/11/06 1:12 am

Why are 'they' scaring us away from the news?

Re: Scumbag

it's Qutb and Pan who "want to believe"

Re: it's Qutb and Pan who "want to believe"

Re: it's Qutb and Pan who "want to believe"

The Iceman Cometh

Re: The Iceman Cometh

Re: Any Kind of Creative Thinking Depends on FIRST Having A

Re: Any Kind of Creative Thinking Depends on First Having A

Re: nt

Re: Nope, once I prime the pump, it is hard to stop

Re: Go Ahead, I've finished for now and need a

Re:nt

Re: Whose pump can I prime but my own?

Re: It is in the nature of the work itself,

Re: The only ILLUSTRATIONS, I know are the work of writers

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