A New Europe: Anti-Semitism, Islamophobia, Nation-State

[jakell]

This is one part that is questionable above, note that it is just a statement, no modifiers:

.....They attract some Anarchists who think they’re changing the Nazis, but really the Nazis are changing them.” They’re becoming more nationalistic, they have more more anti-feminist views, etc. Now is when Anarchists need to speak out and be louder.

A return to the theme of infection and disease through mere proximity. I'm wondering just who it is who claims to be looking out for these 'babes in the wood' anarchists

[American Dream]

I'm wondering just who it is who claims to be looking out for these 'babes in the wood' anarchists

Vague aspersions from a source you can surely trust: a supporter of National Anarchism!

[jakell]

1.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&p=534778#p534778
2.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=465#p535229
3.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=480#p535369
4.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=495#p535502
5.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=510#p535750
6.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&p=535833#p535833
7.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=660#p536983
8.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=675#p537139
--------------------------------------------

9.).....

In this section I am going to try and describe the outward activity in the BNP section of the BDF at the time of the zenith of their success. Such as description is inseparable from my personal status at the time, so there willl be mentions of this also.


First of all, the British Democracy Forum is a big board with lots of sections covering most of the political spectrum, including defunct parties (like the BNP may soon be). Nontheless, the overall membership was right-leaning, and I'm sure that most internet forums eventually develop a particular flavour.
My own approach to such a board is to initially inhabit just one section to get the 'feel' of the place, this comes from appreciating my limitiations and not wanting to spread myself too thinly, as I was there to have a look at the BNP this did not really take much thinking about, I also try to limit myself to a few threads (ideally just the one). As it turned out, this section was the busiest one on the board at the time, so it would prove to be a good window.

A little aside now about forum 'busyness'.... From my experience on forums in general, I have come to realise that busy sections, and more importantly, busy threads, are not directly indicative of the quality of discourse there, or it's relevence, in fact often the opposite. A busy thread can simply be a result of the 'soap opera' effect ie lots of allegedly 'serious' posters looking in there for purely entertainment purposes (I use inverted commas on 'serious' because a poster acting in this way is not really such IMO). A lot of these posters in the BNP section were onlookers
In other words, in a busy section, you really have to learn to sort the wheat from the chaff if you are actually trying to learn something.

So, after a fairly steep learning curve, as when you're new anywhere, I started to realise that the serious posters here could be divided into two camps:

1) Genuine British Nationalists who were looking for practical solutions to problems they saw in their everyday lives, and also anticipated up ahead.

2) White Nationalists who occupied a much foggier realm of belief systems based around race, Jewish malevolence and guile, and a contradictory 'worldwide' nationalism.

3).... yes, I know I said two camps. This one is formed of an undefined mixture of the first two, and significantly, of the latter above wearing the clothes of the former. More of this in a later post.

The first hints I had of this division was in debates about ethnonationalism vs civic nationalism. The latter here is fairly easy to grasp, being based on citizenship, the former seemed to have a much more metaphysical dimension and was often vaguely expressed via race and culture, the two seeming to meet in the word 'ethnicity'. I say vaguely here, because this quality seemed at odds with the vehemence of the claims of it's significance.
It was much later that I started to frame this 'significant vagueness' in terms of religious sensibility and not merely cognitive difficulties.

As I was there to camp out for the long term, gain knowledge and find allies as well as foes, this internal division seemed a useful framework to develop. In the next post I'll try and describe this framework further.....

[American Dream]

The ‘New Right’: a British Tradition

[Troy] Southgate’s Nationalist Anarchist output (2010) prioritised “anti-Zionism” for its Part 1. If you can bear the verbosity, read its introductory paragraph:

ALTHOUGH people around the world are quite aware of the disproportionate influence of Jewish pressure groups within the various governmental and mass media appendages of Europe and North America, most of which are completely under their control, few are prepared to come out and say so for fear of persecution or incurring the usual threats of ‘anti-Semitism’. It is a fact, however, that ever since ambitious European monarchs first plunged us into the financial vortex of the burgeoning international debt system, an elite coterie of Jews and their allies have effectively manipulated world events for their own interests. This was achieved, not simply through usury, but also as a result of Jewish involvement in the bootlegging and criminal racketeering of 1930s America, something which eventually went on to finance the Zionist takeover of the Hollywood film industry and, by 1948, brought about the establishment of the bandit-state of Israel. But Zionism is not Jewish nationalism, as some like to claim, it is Jewish imperialism.

Got that? Good, then you’ll be glad to know that in the next paragraph we hear that they don’t hate Jews, only “a minority of parasitic vampires”:

National-Anarchists do not ‘hate’ ordinary Jews and neither do we wish to undermine them as a people with their own unique religious and cultural identity, but what we will not tolerate, however, is the ongoing enslavement of our people by a minority of vampiric parasites intent on carving up the world’s resources in an attempt to create a single, global market… Zionism is an enemy of all peoples and must be vanquished.

http://blog.thecst.org.uk/?p=3680

[American Dream]

This is odd but not surprising, though it will surely add fuel for the fire for much wankery by the most shallow thinking racists- see the previous for examples:


http://www.haaretz.com/news/world/1.577114

The ex-Israeli soldier who led a Kiev fighting unit

'Delta' has headed 'the Blue Helmets of Maidan' of 40 men and women - including several IDF veterans - in violent clashes with government forces.
By JTA | Feb. 28, 2014 |


Delta, the nom de guerre of the Jewish commander of a Ukrainian street-fighting unit, is pictured in Kiev earlier this month.

He calls his troops “the Blue Helmets of Maidan,” but brown is the color of the headgear worn by Delta — the nom de guerre of the commander of a Jewish-led militia force that participated in the Ukrainian revolution. Under his helmet, he also wears a kippah.

Delta, a Ukraine-born former soldier in the Israel Defense Forces, spoke to JTA Thursday on condition of anonymity. He explained how he came to use combat skills he acquired in the Shu’alei Shimshon reconnaissance battalion of the Givati infantry brigade to rise through the ranks of Kiev’s street fighters. He has headed a force of 40 men and women — including several fellow IDF veterans — in violent clashes with government forces.

Several Ukrainian Jews, including Rabbi Moshe Azman, one of the country’s claimants to the title of chief rabbi, confirmed Delta’s identity and role in the still-unfinished revolution.

The “Blue Helmets” nickname, a reference to the UN peacekeeping force, stuck after Delta’s unit last month prevented a mob from torching a building occupied by Ukrainian police, he said. “There were dozens of officers inside, surrounded by 1,200 demonstrators who wanted to burn them alive,” he recalled. “We intervened and negotiated their safe passage.”

The problem, he said, was that the officers would not leave without their guns, citing orders. Delta told JTA his unit reasoned with the mob to allow the officers to leave with their guns. “It would have been a massacre, and that was not an option,” he said.

The Blue Helmets comprise 35 men and women who are not Jewish, and who are led by five ex-IDF soldiers, says Delta, an Orthodox Jew in his late 30s who regularly prays at Azman’s Brodsky Synagogue. He declined to speak about his private life.

Delta, who immigrated to Israel in the 1990s, moved back to Ukraine several years ago and has worked as a businessman. He says he joined the protest movement as a volunteer on November 30, after witnessing violence by government forces against student protesters.

“I saw unarmed civilians with no military background being ground by a well-oiled military machine, and it made my blood boil,” Delta told JTA in Hebrew laced with military jargon. “I joined them then and there, and I started fighting back the way I learned how, through urban warfare maneuvers. People followed, and I found myself heading a platoon of young men. Kids, really.”

The other ex-IDF infantrymen joined the Blue Helmets later after hearing it was led by a fellow vet, Delta said.

As platoon leader, Delta says he takes orders from activists connected to Svoboda, an ultra-nationalist party that has been frequently accused of anti-Semitism and whose members have been said to have had key positions in organizing the opposition protests.

“I don’t belong [to Svoboda], but I take orders from their team. They know I’m Israeli, Jewish and an ex-IDF soldier. They call me ‘brother,’” he said. “What they’re saying about Svoboda is exaggerated, I know this for a fact. I don’t like them because they’re inconsistent, not because of [any] anti-Semitism issue.”

The commanding position of Svoboda in the revolution is no secret, according to Ariel Cohen, a senior research fellow at the Washington D.C.-based Heritage Foundation think tank.

“The driving force among the so-called white sector in the Maidan are the nationalists, who went against the SWAT teams and snipers who were shooting at them,” Cohen told JTA.

Still, many Jews supported the revolution and actively participated in it.

Earlier this week, an interim government was announced ahead of election scheduled for May, including ministers from several minority groups.

Volodymyr Groysman, a former mayor of the city of Vinnytsia and the newly appointed deputy prime minister for regional policy, is a Jew, Rabbi Azman said.

“There are no signs for concern yet,” said Cohen, “but the West needs to make it clear to Ukraine that how it is seen depends on how minorities are treated.”

On Wednesday, Russian State Duma Chairman Sergey Naryshkin said Moscow was concerned about anti-Semitic declarations by radical groups in Ukraine.

But Delta says the Kremlin is using the anti-Semitism card falsely to delegitimize the Ukrainian revolution, which is distancing Ukraine from Russia’s sphere of influence.

“It’s bullshit. I never saw any expression of anti-Semitism during the protests, and the claims to the contrary were part of the reason I joined the movement. We’re trying to show that Jews care,” he said.

Still, Delta’s reasons for not revealing his name betray his sense of feeling like an outsider. “If I were Ukrainian, I would have been a hero. But for me it’s better to not reveal my name if I want to keep living here in peace and quiet,” he said.

Fellow Jews have criticized him for working with Svoboda. “Some asked me if instead of ‘Shalom’ they should now greet me with a ‘Sieg heil.’ I simply find it laughable,” he said. But he does have frustrations related to being an outsider. “Sometimes I tell myself, ‘What are you doing? This is not your army. This isn’t even your country.’”

He recalls feeling this way during one of the fiercest battles he experienced, which took place last week at Institutskaya Street and left 12 protesters dead. “The snipers began firing rubber bullets at us. I fired back from my rubber-bullet rifle,” Delta said.

“Then they opened live rounds, and my friend caught a bullet in his leg. They shot at us like at a firing range. I wasn’t ready for a last stand. I carried my friend and ordered my troops to fall back. They’re scared kids. I gave them some cash for phone calls and told them to take off their uniform and run away until further instructions. I didn’t want to see anyone else die that day.”

Currently, the Blue Helmets are carrying out police work that include patrols and preventing looting and vandalism in a city of 3 million struggling to climb out of the chaos that engulfed it for the past three months.

But Delta has another, more ambitious, project: He and Azman are organizing the airborne evacuation of seriously wounded protesters — none of them Jewish — for critical operations in Israel. One of the patients, a 19-year-old woman, was wounded at Institutskaya by a bullet that penetrated her eye and is lodged inside her brain, according to Delta. Azman says he hopes the plane of 17 patients will take off next week, with funding from private donors and with help from Ukraine’s ambassador to Israel.

“The doctor told me that another millimeter to either direction and she would be dead,” Delta said. “And I told him it was the work of Hakadosh Baruch Hu.”

[American Dream]

http://threewayfight.blogspot.com/2014/ ... cists.html

Tuesday, March 04, 2014
Who are Ukraine's fascists?

My previous post attempted to make sense of the struggle that recently overthrew Ukraine's President Viktor Yanukovych. As Tash Shifrin points out, not only did fascist groups play a leading role in this struggle, but their success "set a new benchmark for fascists across Europe."


Right Sector flag, Kiev, 22 February 2014

Both of Ukraine's two main fascist organizations are represented in the new government. Members of Svoboda (Freedom) party were named to the posts of deputy prime minister; ministers of defense, ecology, and agriculture; and head of the general prosecutor's office. The leader of the more hardline Pravy Sektor (Right Sector) was appointed deputy national security director.

Who are these Ukrainian fascists? What do they stand for? How did they become so influential? And where do they fit in the geopolitical struggle that is suddenly making Ukraine a major point of contention between the western and Russian wings of global capital? This post will try to address these questions.

Svoboda was founded in 1991 as the Social-National Party of Ukraine (SNPU) and is a direct descendent of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists (OUN), the World War II-era Nazi collaborators who massacred tens of thousands of Jews and Poles in their quest to create a totalitarian, ethnically pure Ukraine. In 2004, in an effort to clean up its image, the SNPU changed its name to the All-Ukrainian Association Svoboda, dropped the Wolfsangel symbol (which had been used by the Waffen SS), and started advocating populist economic and social measures. Svoboda's program, writes Emanuel Dreyfus, "would renationalise a number of enterprises, introduce progressive taxation on business profits, and seek to reduce the dominance of the oligarchs over the political and economic systems."

Historian Per Anders Rudling writes that Svoboda's makeover followed the example laid down by other European far right parties such as the Austrian Freedom Party and the National Democratic Party of Germany. "Svoboda's official policy documents are relatively cautious and differ from its daily activities and internal jargon, which are much more radical and racist.... Svoboda subscribes to the OUN tradition of national segregation and demands the reintroduction of the Soviet 'nationality' category into Ukrainian passports" (p. 237). According to political scientist Anton Shekhovtsov, "although Svoboda... does not have a worked out doctrine, it is possible to distinguish several different ideological strands most commonly articulated by the party leaders, including anticommunism, anti-liberalism, racism, anti-Russian sentiments, glorification of Ukrainian historical right-wing extremism and fascism, and heterosexism."

Antisemitism is central to the party's ideology. Svoboda head Oleh Tiahnybok claimed in 2005 that Ukraine was ruled by a "Muscovite-Jewish mafia," and, according to Rudling, in 2011 party activists fought with police as part of a protest campaign against Hasidic Jewish pilgrims visiting the Ukraine.

Svoboda got only 0.7% of the vote in 2007 parliamentary elections, but this support jumped to 10.45% in 2012, and the party entered the Rada (national parliament) for the first time with 37 seats. As the BBC reported, "in addition to expanding its traditional base in the country's Ukrainian-speaking west -- it won close to 40% in the Lviv region -- Svoboda made inroads into central regions, capturing second place in the capital Kiev." Svoboda's support is mainly working class in the western Ukraine, but the party also attracted intellectual and middle class people in Kiev, according to Denis of the leftist Autonomous Workers Union.

The other major fascist group is Right Sector, which was formed in November 2013 by activists from several small neo-nazi groups. Right Sector is primarily a street-fighting organization, with an estimated 2,000-3,000 members, that criticizes Svoboda as too moderate. Max Blumenthal writes, "Armed with riot shields and clubs, the group's cadres have manned the front lines of the Euromaidan battles this month, filling the air with their signature chant: 'Ukraine above all!' In a recent Right Sector propaganda video... the group promised to fight 'against degeneration and totalitarian liberalism, for traditional national morality and family values.'"

Svoboda and Right Sector supporters were a small portion of the Euromaidan protesters against Yanukovych, but they gained legitimacy from the nationalism that pervaded the movement. Right Sector militants and their allies physically attacked leftists who tried to have a visible presence in the Euromaidan or join the movement's Self Defense groups. By mid February 2014, the Self Defense forces (including some 1,500 under separate Right Sector command) were confronting police with guns as well as Molotov cocktails. Shifrin writes, "The center of gravity shifted from mass participant in Euromaidan to the organized strength of the fighting force. And the fascists have far greater weight among the fighters than in the protest as a whole."

The resurgence of Ukrainian fascism is very recent, but its seeds were planted years ago. In broad terms, with the collapse of the Soviet Union in 1991 many ethnic nationalisms and right-wing ideologies gained visibility and support. In Ukraine specifically, the return of rightist emigres dovetailed with propaganda initiatives of the new government centered on the 1930s and 1940s. Rudling notes (p. 231) that former President Viktor Yushchenko's government (2005-10) promoted a historical myth of the fascist OUN as freedom fighters and democrats struggling to liberate Ukraine from Soviet tyranny, and that ultra-nationalist and antisemitic propaganda have become commonplace in Ukrainian academia. In western Ukraine, especially Lviv,

"ultra-nationalist ideologues have found both effective and lucrative ways to work with entrepreneurs to popularize and disseminate their narrative to the youth, [such as] the Jewish theme restaurant Pid Zolotoiu Rozoiu (Beneath the Golden Rose), where guests are offered black hats of the sort worn by Hasidim, along with payot. The menu lists no prices for the dishes; instead, one is required to haggle over highly inflated prices 'in the Jewish fashion'" (p. 233).

Commemorating the centenary of Stepan Bandera, Kiev, 2009

The modern celebration of the OUN and its military wing, the Ukrainian Insurgent Army (UPA), includes public festivals, nightclub events, and the renaming of streets and buildings after OUN leader Stepan Bandera. Rudling sees a basic contradiction in this historical cult: on one hand, ultra-nationalists celebrate the Waffen-SS Galizien, a German military division composed of Ukrainians that carried out many atrocities; on the other, they hail the OUN as resistance fighters against Nazi Germany, who supposedly even rescued Jews (pp. 231, 235).

Ukrainian far rightists today don't just replicate the OUN's classical fascism, but blend it with other currents of fascist ideology. Rudling writes that Svoboda has been influenced by European New Right thinkers such as Alain de Benoist, who have replaced open racial supremacism with the nicer-sounding "ethno-pluralism," and who have promoted the Conservative Revolutionaries of interwar Germany as a far right tradition mostly outside of the Nazi movement. In 2010, Svoboda intellectual Yurii Mykhal'chyshyn published an anthology of key texts that brought together Conservative Revolutionaries (Ernst Juenger, Oswald Spengler), "left" Nazis (Ernst Roehm, Otto and Gregor Strasser), mainstream Nazis (Joseph Goebbels, Alfred Rosenberg), and Italian and Spanish corporatist theoreticians (pp. 239, 243).

Mykhal'chyshyn has also served as a link between Svoboda and Ukraine's autonomous nationalists, who combine neo-nazi content with styles and slogans borrowed from left-wing autonomists and anarchist black blocks, such as black hoodies, masks, and a straight-edge lifestyle, while glorifying street violence against their opponents. Autonomous nationalism started in Germany as a sub-current within the neo-nazi scene, and has been visible in Ukraine since 2009, according to the German-language Antifaschistisches Infoblatt. The Infoblatt describes this as an effort by young neo-nazis to look more modern and more European. Ukrainian autonomous nationalists are not numerous, but they have worked closely with Svoboda and other far right parties.

Ukrainian fascists' international outlook is especially important, given that the movement which eventually toppled Yanukovych began by demanding a closer relationship with the European Union and not Russia. Svoboda has advocated Ukraine joining the EU, apparently to win favor with its electoral base. Alec Luhn of The Nation reports, "Yury Noyevy, a member of Svoboda's political council, admitted that the party is only pro-EU because it is anti-Russia. 'The participation of Ukrainian nationalism and Svoboda in the process of EU integration is a means to break our ties with Russia,' Noyevy said." Svoboda, along with the British National Party, Hungary's Jobbik, and several other far right parties, is part of the Alliance of European National Movements, which opposes EU centralization.

Right Sector, meanwhile, wants no part of the Europe Union. One of the group's coordinators told The Guardian, "'For us, Europe is not an issue, in fact joining with Europe would be the death of Ukraine. Europe means the death of the nation state and the death of Christianity. We want a Ukraine for Ukrainians, run by Ukrainians, and not serving the interests of others.' Tarasenko said the goal of the group was a 'national revolution' that would result in a 'national democracy' with none of the trappings of the 'totalitarian liberalism' that the EU represents for him."

Despite these sentiments, Right Sector, along with Svoboda, is now tied to a government that represents the pro-EU faction of the Ukrainian ruling class. Assuming that the new government isn't simply forced out by the Russian military, it's unlikely that the fascists could seriously pursue their national revolution against the oligarchs. The Right Sector hardliners might want to try, but I agree with Mark Ames that Svoboda will probably be coopted into embracing pro-Western policies, including EU austerity demands. "Neoliberalism is a big tent that is happy to absorb ultranationalists, democrats, or ousted president Yanukovych."

But that's very different from saying that Svoboda or Right Sector are just tools of the EU, or the United States, who have carried out a successful putsch on behalf of their masters. This is not the Cold War, when Ukrainian fascists were dependent on the CIA and loyal allies of the Reagan administration against the Soviet empire. Today's far rightists have to deal with great power geopolitics, but that doesn't mean they're happy about it. Remember that Osama bin Laden was once a Reagan ally, too.

[American Dream]

http://www.france24.com/en/20140304-fre ... ies-camps/

French National Front ally would 'concentrate' Gypsies in 'camps'


screengrab from a Canal+ broadcast

A far-right mayoral candidate of Paris’s upmarket 6th arrondissement has apologised after writing on his blog that Roma (Gypsies) should be “concentrated” in “camps”.

Paul-Marie Coûteaux, a candidate for a fringe party linked to France’s anti-Europe and anti-immigration National Front (FN) party, likened the presence of Roma in Paris as an “invasion of lepers” that undermined the “aesthetic order” of the city.

“What can the interior minister do other than concentrate these foreign populations into camps where they would no doubt feel that life there was so far removed from their traveling lifestyle that they would rather leave such an inhospitable country,” he wrote in the February 19 blog post.

On Monday, French rights group SOS Racisme said it planned to start legal proceedings against Coûteaux “in the coming days” for his “disgusting” and “anti-republican” statements.

And on Tuesday, Coûteaux appeared to backtrack. In an interview with Metronews.fr, the former MEP and head of the CIEL (Sovereignty, Independence and Freedom) party which is allied to the FN insisted that his words had been misunderstood.

“If by using the word ‘camps’ people misinterpreted what I wrote then I am sorry,” he said. “I am a Catholic and a Gaullist … how could I possibly demand the creation of concentration camps in 2014?”

In the interview Côuteaux put forward two possible “solutions to deal with the Roma question”.

The first would be to “put these people in administrative detention centres” that are currently used to house illegal immigrants.

But he added: “I visited one of these centres while I was an MEP. It was awful, inhuman.”

Another “more rational, humane and reasonable” solution, he said, would be to “suspend the Schengen treaty” that allows for free movement across the European Union (most European Gypsies come from EU member states Romania and Bulgaria).

In an interview with French daily Le Parisien, Wallerand de Saint-Just, FN spokesman and candidate to become mayor of Paris in France’s local elections later in March, said it was “not his place” to criticise Côuteaux, even if he would “not have expressed himself in quite the same manner”.


Date created : 2014-03-04

[American Dream]

The British Nazis: Sir Oswald Mosley’s Views Were – and are not – Uncommon

By Di Taylor / The Independent

The revelation last week that MI5 had infiltrated a network of homegrown Nazis during the war is just the latest chapter in a long, dishonourable story

March 1, 2014



As an impressionable young book reviewer, wading my way through one of those dense and well-nigh encoded late-period Iris Murdoch novels, there used to come a moment when, miraculously, the implausible suddenly became plausible. Such was the scent of authorial purpose that the unbelievable now turned almost matter-of-fact, and an elephant descending from the skies in pink tights to expound the works of Heidegger would have had me shaking my head in agreement. Curiously enough, exactly the same feeling is provoked by each fresh wave of revelation about that benighted but endlessly fascinating cadre, the British Nazis.

On the surface, nothing could be more outlandish than last week’s disclosure, contained in a series of files released by the National Archive, that MI5 had assembled and was secretly controlling a vast network of Nazi sympathisers throughout the Second World War. As for the supporting detail – the membership badges to be worn in the event of evacuation so the wearers could be quickly rounded up, the replica Iron Crosses used to reward adherents for their loyalty – this might seem to have been robbed wholesale from CJ Sansom’s alternative history novel Dominion. Until, that is, you pause to examine the substantial flock of pro-Nazis long known to have been at work in public life during the period 1939-45 and the exploits that are already in the public domain.

Consider, for example, the activities of Cpt Archibald Maule Ramsay, grand vizier of the notorious “Right Club”, Great War veteran, Conservative MP for Peebles and South Midlothian, interned in May 1940 as a threat to national security, but allowed, by dint of his office, to keep on submitting parliamentary questions about the number of Jewish personnel in the armed forces killed serving at the front.

Or, from the council chambers of mid-century local government, Philip Larkin’s father Sydney, treasurer of the city of Coventry, who corresponded with Hjalmar Schacht, Hitler’s minister of economics from 1934 to 1937, attended several Nuremberg rallies, kept a statuette of the Fuhrer on his desk and, when Coventry was bombed by the Luftwaffe, congratulated himself on having had the foresight to lay in a thousand cardboard coffins.

However respectably concealed, or shy of drawing attention to itself, what might be called the right-wing fanatic strain in British politics never really goes away. The history of the past century or so is, consequently, full of tense little moments in which it raises its head above the parapet. One came in the post-Suez era of the late 1950s when the League of Empire Loyalists began their campaign against Harold Macmillan’s “winds of change” speech and the gradual transfer of imperial power in Africa and the Far East. Another can be detected in the late 1960s and mid-1970s plots against the Labour government of Harold Wilson. And for current manifestations, one need look no further than the wilder fringes of some of the 21st-century English nationalist movements.

Naturally, home-grown fascism – to give it its proper name – transcends social class. There is the working-class hooligan strain exploited by Sir Oswald Mosley and picked up again by John Tyndall’s National Front in the 1970s, which made a point of recruiting on the football terraces. And if Britain, unlike France, has never run to a Poujadist party made up of small businessmen and shopkeepers, then Orwell’s legendary observation that “All tobacconists are Fascists” was not made wholly in jest. But the distinguishing mark of extreme right-wingery in this country has nearly always been its comparatively genteel tinge. The secret servicemen and women who infiltrated Cpt Ramsay’s organisation in the winter of 1939-40 certainly discovered a network of immensely sinister public figures plotting peace talks through the neutral embassies, but the specimen Right Club supporter was quite likely to be a fanatical old lady living in a service flat with a portrait of Mussolini on her mantelpiece.

And what makes an ornament of the local bridge parties, living off dividends in wartime Kensington, imagine that Mussolini is the answer to Britain’s ills or, a bit later on, that Harold Macmillan is a wicked betrayer doing us out of our empire and nasty Mr Wilson – quite a few people believed this in the period 1964-1976 – is taking his orders from Moscow? One of the main reasons why British fascism never made any great headway either in the 1930s or the decades thereafter was the lack of any centralising tendency or definite ideological focus. On the one hand, certain pre-war fascists tapped into the stream of almost mystical English nationalism that makes its heroes out of King Arthur and the Knights of the Round Table. To set against this there came all the bright, shiny futurism of properly managed societies where armies are sent in and the trains run on time and everything is hedged about with pattern and regularity that is so seductive to the office clerk whose journey to work is impeded by a bus strike.

When Nick Jenkins’ scapegrace Uncle Giles in Anthony Powell’s A Dance to the Music of Time remarks, to the scandal of his relatives, that he likes “the little man they’ve got in Germany now”, he is casting a vote for decency and order – or rather for a political system where these things will be encouraged without recourse to the ballot box.

But wherever British fascism sought its authentication – from King Arthur and the vision of Nuremberg to the extremer margins of inter-war Catholicism – it was nearly always garnished by good old- fashioned anti-Semitism. Most social historians tend to agree that genuine and systematic anti-Jewish feeling is comparatively rare in British life, but this has never stopped right-wing extremists from ascribing everything from unemployment to the editorial policies of national newspapers to the machinations of the Chosen Race. The Right Club stalwart A K Chesterton, for example, was quoted in 1939 as suggesting that lamp posts were “the only way to deal with the Jew”, while Cpt Ramsay’s last parliamentary intervention, around the time the Belsen ovens shut down, was to table a motion calling for the reintroduction of Edward I’s Statute of Jewry.

The most sinister aspect of this kind of extremism is that it should be propagated by an eminently respectable Old Etonian whose own son turns out to have died of pneumonia while serving with the Scots Guards. Significantly, according to the National Archive files, most of the fifth columnists to whom MI5 handed out their replica Iron Crosses were allowed to slip back into their ordinary lives once the war had ended, blissfully ignorant of the fact that they had been set up: a little alternate world living quietly on through the 1950s and, presumably, sorrowing secretly that the wrong team won.

Had British fascism ever amounted to anything, someone once speculated, it would have been the fascism not of lofted flags and marching men, but of the privet hedge and the pointed remark in the Mayfair drawing room. It would be absurdly optimistic to assume the key to this grim little compartment of our national life will never twitch in its lock again.

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/com ... views-were–and-are-not–uncommon-9162679.html

[jakell]

Ah Mosley at last. I had commented earlier on his conspicuous absence in this thread.

WTQB?

[American Dream]

http://www.constantinereport.com/mi5-th ... n-bandera/

MI5, the CIA and Ukrainian Nazi Collaborator Stepan Bandera

“… Bandera’s lieutenants … promised to work closely with Hitler, then helped to launch a pogrom that killed four thousand Lvov Jews in a few days, using weapons ranging from guns to metal poles. . … After the war Bandera lived in Munich. British intelligence used him to help run agents into Ukraine to gather intelligence and to help the Ukrainian underground against the Soviets. The CIA used some of Bandera’s former cronies for similar reasons …”

By Norman J.W. Goda
History News Network | 2-08-10

Norman J.W. Goda is Braman Professor of Holocaust Studies at the University of Florida. His most recent book is Tales from Spandau: Nazi Criminals and the Cold War (2007), and is co-author of US Intelligence and the Nazis (2005).

On January 22, 2010 Ukrainian President Viktor Yushchenko honored Stepan Bandera by posthumously bestowing on him the state honor, “Hero of Ukraine.” The Soviet KGB assassinated Bandera, a Ukrainian nationalist-in-exile, in 1959. Many Ukrainians, including Ukrainian émigré groups in Canada, pressed Yushchenko to grant the honor, which, according to one statement, “would restore justice and truth about the Bandera and the…struggle for liberation that he headed.” To this day, many Ukrainians view Bandera as a martyred freedom fighter.

As an uncompromising leader of the militant, terrorist branch of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists (OUN), Bandera became a Nazi collaborator who lived with his deputies under German protection after World War II began. In preparation for the attack on the USSR, the Nazis recruited Bandera’s followers to act as Ukrainian-speaking policemen and to serve in two Ukrainian volunteer army battalions. By working with the Nazis, Bandera hoped to free Ukraine from Soviet rule and establish his own government there. An independent Ukraine, Bandera promised, would remain friendly to Germany.

Historian Karel Berkhoff, among others, has shown that Bandera, his deputies, and the Nazis shared a key obsession, namely the notion that the Jews in Ukraine were behind Communism and Stalinist imperialism and must be destroyed. “The Jews of the Soviet Union,” read a Banderist statement, “are the most loyal supporters of the Bolshevik Regime and the vanguard of Muscovite imperialism in the Ukraine.” When the Germans invaded the USSR in June 1941 and captured the East Galician capital of Lvov, Bandera’s lieutenants issued a declaration of independence in his name. They further promised to work closely with Hitler, then helped to launch a pogrom that killed four thousand Lvov Jews in a few days, using weapons ranging from guns to metal poles. “We will lay your heads at Hitler’s feet,” a Banderist pamphlet proclaimed to Ukrainian Jews.

The Germans intended to keep Ukraine for themselves. They arrested Bandera for his intransigence on the issue of independence, but released him in 1944 when it appeared that his popularity with Ukrainians might help stem the Soviet advance. But whatever their disappointment with the Germans, the Banderists never disagreed with their Jewish policy in Ukraine, which eventually killed over 1 million Ukrainian Jews.

This is a truth that many in Ukraine, particularly in its western parts, deny. In his book Erased (2007), Omer Bartov discusses the large bronze statue of Bandera that stands in a park in the east Galician town of Drohobych, most of whose 15,000 Jews were murdered. The park stands on the site of the town’s former Jewish ghetto, but there is not so much as a plaque in the park to memorialize the Jewish dead. This and other examples like it make a condemnation of Yushchenko’s step necessary.

But the rest of the story, much of which is revealed in CIA records released in 2007, reveals irony in Yushchenko’s award. After the war Bandera lived in Munich. British intelligence used him to help run agents into Ukraine to gather intelligence and to help the Ukrainian underground against the Soviets. The CIA used some of Bandera’s former cronies for similar reasons, but never used Bandera himself, owing to Bandera’s infatuation with his own legend. “Bandera,” said one CIA report from 1948, “is by nature a political intransigent of great personal ambition [who] has…opposed all political organizations in the emigration which favor a representative form of government in the Ukraine, as opposed to a mono-party, OUN/Bandera regime.”

Ukrainian sources confirmed that “fighting people in the homeland … [were] not prepared to accept [Bandera] as a dictator,” and that Bandera’s program “was unacceptable to the resistance movement inside [Ukraine].” In 1952 Bandera temporarily resigned as head of the OUN, pressured “by the growing opposition to his leadership among … top-ranking nationalist leaders who opposed him on the grounds of his totalitarian tactics….” Bandera’s subsequent petulance and his insistence on directing all facets of the Ukrainian underground at home and abroad led the British to drop him in 1953. With no high level contacts to listen to him, Bandera was now on the outside looking in.

Owing to his self-promotion in print and on West German radio, Bandera remained popular with thousands of Ukrainian émigrés in West Germany. His superficial effectiveness prompted West German intelligence (the BND) to establish contact in 1956. By 1959 the BND was helping Bandera to run a new generation of Ukrainian agents from West Germany into the USSR. General Reinhard Gehlen, the head of the BND, had lead German Army intelligence in the USSR during the war. He and his subordinates were surely familiar with Bandera’s wartime record. They were less familiar with the fact that the BND was by now thoroughly penetrated with Soviet agents. On October 14, 1959, Bandera had lunch with senior BND officials to discuss the expansion of operations in Ukraine. The next day the KGB assassinated Bandera in his apartment building.

Because Bandera effectively promoted his own legend, and because the Soviets were behind his death, émigrés who did not know any better labeled him as the martyred leader of Ukrainians abroad. Fifteen hundred attended his funeral in Munich. US officials, on the other hand, noted that Bandera’s “strong arm tactics” and “competition with other émigré groups” meant that “many émigré figures clearly do not personally lament his passing.” His death meant nothing for CIA operations against Soviet rule in Ukraine, which depended on the very same émigré leaders who, though followers of Bandera during the war, had dumped their former chief as a self-promoting caricature. They continued their work under CIA tutelage until the USSR collapsed. Such is another story.

It is a sad comment on Ukrainian memory that the man declared a Hero of Ukraine in January headed a movement that was deeply involved in the Holocaust. It is more gratifying to know that by the time of Stepan Bandera’s death, most Ukrainian leaders had long rejected him as a dangerous charlatan who harmed his own cause. By the time of his death, Bandera was reduced to dancing with the Cold War’s most compromised intelligence agency, where the Soviets could watch his every move. Those who label him a hero today, in other words, are as foolish as they are offensive.

http://www.hnn.us/articles/122778.html

[American Dream]

The whole article is worth checking out:

The ‘New Right’: a British Tradition

June 11th, 2012 by Mark Gardner

Over 30 years ago, around the time of the death of Oswald Mosley, David Irving bemoaned the poor quality of the senior activists and thinkers of the British far Right. He hoped that groups such as the Clarendon Club and his own Focal Point Publications would help rectify this.

Irving failed, disappearing up a Holocaust denial alley: he and his projects ending up as yet another case study of the bizarre and egotistical misfits who have long populated the supposed Mensa end of the British far Right spectrum. Indeed, with the exception of Mosley, the British far Right has barely had a thinker who reached beyond the bierkeller.

Continuing this British tradition we have the ‘New Right’ group, organised by Troy Southgate and featuring Alexander Baron. The New Right recently held its 39th meeting, where it was addressed by none other than Rabbi Ahron Cohen of the anti-Zionist Jewish sect, Neturei Karta. (More often found in the company of far Left and Islamist anti-Zionists.)

Alexander Baron and Ahron Cohen first met in the back of a Tehran Airport taxi, on their way to Iran’s notorious 2006 Holocaust denial conference (where Cohen gave a counter-opinion, as stated by Baron when introducing him to the New Right meeting).

The paper that Baron intended to give to the Tehran denial Conference was entitled, “The Nazi Gas Chambers: Rumours, Lies And Reality – One Researcher’s View”. It can be read here on his website. (Sanity warning: it is practically unreadable. The offence of the Holocaust denial, or “revisionism”, is almost overwhelmed by the sheer ridiculousness of what is written.) A taster:

As the Nazis freely admitted their crimes – so we are told – why should not a re-enactment of a mass gassing be ordered? Or a simulation? Nowadays computers can do wonderful things. There have been simulations of the Kennedy assassination which dispel the numerous ill-informed claims that Lee Harvey Oswald was not the assassin; why not a simulation of a couple of thousand Jews being marched into a gas chamber and exterminated with a lighter than air gas that was dropped from the ceiling while the SS stood around drinking coffee and smoking Woodbines? If my tone sounds facetious I apologise not; the scenario really is that ludicrous.

Baron’s account of the New Right meeting suggests that he sees less “Zionist” plots than does Ahron Cohen. Nevertheless, a quick look at Baron’s output will show that he is prodigious and ludicrous in equal measure. His leaflets include: (links are provided but readers may be offended)

Adolf Hitler: Anti-Racist! The myth of Aryan evil exploded and the real roots of racial hatred exposed (Link)
If They’re Black Send Them Back. How Nelson Mandela went from working class hero to well-oiled Nazi machine. (Link)
The Menace of Sexism in Chess. (Link)
Exposed! The Homosexual Plot to Destroy Orthodox Judaism. (Link)
The World Zionist Conspiracy. Exposed by a Rabbi. (Link – unsurprisingly, the rabbi is from Neturei Karta.)

Then, there is Troy Southgate, organiser of this elitist New Right group and no stranger to ventures that hold themselves as intellectually superior to rank and file boneheads and football thugs. Best known of these was the International Third Position, which also included Nick Griffin, who gave up on the intellecshulism to be leader of the BNP.

On 30 May, Griffin tweeted this about David Cameron and ‘Tommy’ Lennon (leader of BNP’s rival, the English Defence League):

30 May Nick Griffin MEP‏@nickgriffinmep

. . . war for Israel is huge. From Camoron down to ‘Tommy’ Lennon, all in Zionists’ pockets.

“All in Zionists’ pockets”. Its unlikely that Southgate would be so concise, but he would agree with his former comrade. Indeed, Southgate’s Nationalist Anarchist output (2010) prioritised “anti-Zionism” for its Part 1. If you can bear the verbosity, read its introductory paragraph:

ALTHOUGH people around the world are quite aware of the disproportionate influence of Jewish pressure groups within the various governmental and mass media appendages of Europe and North America, most of which are completely under their control, few are prepared to come out and say so for fear of persecution or incurring the usual threats of ‘anti-Semitism’. It is a fact, however, that ever since ambitious European monarchs first plunged us into the financial vortex of the burgeoning international debt system, an elite coterie of Jews and their allies have effectively manipulated world events for their own interests. This was achieved, not simply through usury, but also as a result of Jewish involvement in the bootlegging and criminal racketeering of 1930s America, something which eventually went on to finance the Zionist takeover of the Hollywood film industry and, by 1948, brought about the establishment of the bandit-state of Israel. But Zionism is not Jewish nationalism, as some like to claim, it is Jewish imperialism.

Got that? Good, then you’ll be glad to know that in the next paragraph we hear that they don’t hate Jews, only “a minority of parasitic vampires”:

National-Anarchists do not ‘hate’ ordinary Jews and neither do we wish to undermine them as a people with their own unique religious and cultural identity, but what we will not tolerate, however, is the ongoing enslavement of our people by a minority of vampiric parasites intent on carving up the world’s resources in an attempt to create a single, global market… Zionism is an enemy of all peoples and must be vanquished.

Finally, to bring all of this back to David Irving (who almost looks normal amongst this particular cast) we have the sudden death of Jonathan Bowden, to whose memory this New Right meeting was dedicated. Bowden was well known to Irving and appears to be one of the few British right-wing thinkers whom he actually admired.

Many years have passed since Irving attempted to bring some intellectual rigour and leadership to these circles: but curiously British tradition of incompetent (and often plain bizarre) far Right intellectualism persists. And, contemplating the European far Right today, that is something for which we all should really be quite grateful…including Neturei Karta.

http://blog.thecst.org.uk/?p=3680

[solace]

Neturei Karta in bed with the far right weirdos? Poor searcher will have a fit. Or not.

[American Dream]

Lest we forget:


http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-enter ... 42204.html

Combat 18: Memoirs of a street-fighting man

Ten days ago the leader of the UK's most notorious neo-Nazi group was jailed for murder. In a terrifying series of interviews, published here for the first time, he and his companions talked openly about their beliefs

NICK RYAN Sunday 01 February 1998

NOVEMBER 1996: a pub in Holborn, central London. The gear is casual, but the faces are hard, sullen, full of mistrust. Angry-looking tattoos poke out from under smart shirt-sleeves. Mobile phones lie in a neat row, next to bottles of Bud and pints of Guinness. The talk, in a melting pot of accents from across London's council estates, is of football "firms", lads and "jobs" [robberies].

"We don't want to live with Africans and Pakis, we want to live with our own people - don't we?" quips a large, Humpty Dumpty figure with a receding hairline and a dull leer. Covered in a heavy lace of tattoos and carrying a bulky bag of CDs, Paul David "Charlie" Sargent is a leader not so much by charisma as by force and fear. He has a habit of putting a rhetorical question at the end of his sentences. It leaves little room for discussion. His three companions drag on cigarettes and pull baseball caps down over their tight-cropped hair as they talk of revolution - White Revolution.

"Our kids are learning 'their' way of life before their own," laments Scott, a gruff former squaddie. A clamour of guttural "yeahs", uttered into pints, supports him. "They're taking us over," adds Charlie in his animated, nasal voice. "The whole of London is just becoming a cesspit." The solution? "National Socialism." Which is? "Racism ..." he says, with a characteristically challenging look, "... the easiest politics in the world."

To Charlie and the others, "they" - meaning either the state, which they call Zog (Zionist Occupation Government), or the immigrant communities - are the Enemy. So now they want no part of the system. "I don't vote. What's the point? I'm not gonna play their fucking silly little games," says Charlie.

These are members of a paramilitary struggle, based on punishment beatings, control and fear. "I know perfectly well we're gonna win. I'm under no disillusions about it. Sooner or later we're gonna win." But win what? "The War." What war? "The war against the government and the people invading this fucking land."

FIFTEEN MONTHS after our first encounter, I met Charlie Sargent again - in very different circumstances. Ten days ago, the founder and leader of Combat 18 (C18), the UK's most notorious neo-Nazi group, was sentenced to life imprisonment at Chelmsford Crown Court. The court heard how Sargent, now 37, and one of his henchmen had killed a fellow C18 supporter, as part of an internal feud.

Together with his close friend Martin Cross, Sargent had lured Christopher "Catford Chris" Castle, aged 28, to a mobile home in Harlow, Essex, on 10 February last year. There, Castle was ambushed and stabbed in the back. Acting as a go-between for two rival C18 factions, he had come to exchange Sargent's plastering tools for membership lists and pounds 1,000 in cash.

The pathologist Dr Michael Heath noted how the 22cm wound which penetrated Castle's lungs and heart was caused by a 20cm knife. This required "severe force". The court heard that immediately after the attack, Cross had referred to Castle as "a casualty of war". Police described the stabbing as "an execution". Both Sargent and Cross had previous convictions for violence and other offences: Sargent had two drug-related convictions, in addition to one for possession of a gun; Cross was sentenced to two years imprisonment in 1992 after unlawfully wounding a man with an axe.

Castle's murder followed months of infighting over control of a lucrative and illegal neo-Nazi music business, and arguments about C18's strategy and direction. The faction opposed to Sargent made headlines last year when they initiated a letter-bombing campaign with help from Danish neo- Nazis. The bombs were sent to enemies on the far right, as well as to swimming star Sharron Davies, who has a black husband. This second, even more extreme faction - led by Charlie Sargent's former right-hand man (who cannot be named for legal reasons) - is now in the ascendancy, and has seized the Combat 18 name. In its magazine Strikeforce, it proclaims itself to be "revolutionary" and promises an international terrorist campaign, a threat that Special Branch is taking seriously.

The "new" C18 has promised further bloodletting against the faction remaining loyal to Sargent (now called the National Socialist Movement). At Sargent's trial a fortnight ago, the two sides traded insults and threats as they were kept apart by police. "The blood is going to flow," predicted Eddie Stanton, a Sargent loyalist.

Detective Superintendent Steve Reynolds, chief investigating officer in the Sargent/Cross murder case, said after the trial: "There is an intense rivalry between the two factions of Combat 18 and it would be naive to think that it's all ended now. There is a code of violence here which is absolutely frightening."

COMBAT 18 originally carved its name in history in the early Nineties. It was the first right-wing group in the UK to take the state head-on, entirely rejecting conventional politics. The group had originally promised a violent race war against "invading" immigrants and a system which it believed had abandoned working-class "white" people. It proved attractive to disillusioned young men across the country, and particularly on the council estates of the South-East, because it brooked no compromise and promised direct action against the "oppressors".

C18's origins were as a group providing security for the British National Party, the UK's principal far-right organisation. C18 took its name from the numerical position of Adolf Hitler's initials in the alphabet - "1" and "8" - aiming to terrorise its opponents. In a departure from previous right-wing ventures, C18 did not attempt to persuade ordinary people to its cause, or to win elections - it just acted. As Charlie Sargent told me when I first met him: "It would be a lie to think we are attractive to most people, because we're not. We are what we are. We don't pretend we're something we're not."

Instead, C18 looked for support among ultra-violent football hooligan firms and around the "white power" skinhead music scene. (Despite this, however, few of C18's supporters were actually skinheads, preferring the designer-casual image of the football hooligans: "Skinheads are basically wankers. The only skinheads are Reds and queers," laughed Steve Sargent, 32, Charlie's softer-spoken younger brother, when I asked him about their image.)

A number of members also worked (and still do) as cocaine dealers and illegal debt collectors in the criminal underworld. They were happy to show me how to "bosh" someone in the stomach with a knife, as a penalty for failing to pay up on a loan. Similarly, they mocked the Government's law and order strategy, claiming it was ineffectual and that the prisons were C18's natural recruiting ground. With their jailbird tattoos, they would casually refer to the police as "scum". By their own admission they were violent people. "We're thugs who follow an ideology," boasted Charlie.

C18 quickly attracted the street-hooligan elements of the Right, mainly from around London and the Home Counties area. Initially numbering just a few dozen members, the group grew rapidly as it went on the offensive, attacking left-wing bookshops, gay pubs and anti-apartheid activists. It began to produce its own bulletin, Redwatch, a tatty, photocopied sheet listing the names of its opponents. Battles with left-wing activists are remembered with a sense of tribal pride by many C18 members.

"The Reds were going around and they were beating the living daylights out of the right wing. They were kicking in doors, petrol-bombing people and beating old men black and blue with hammers [a reference to an attack by anti-Fascists on a right-wing meeting in Kensington Library during 1992]. Red Action [an extreme left-wing group] were absolutely battering the Right," recalled Charlie. "We decided we weren't having that and we thought we'd do something about it." Which meant? "We fuckin' battered 'em wherever we met, until there was no fucker left standing," he laughed, puffing out his chest. "Now we don't see them no more."

The relationship between C18 and the larger BNP began to deteriorate during 1993, however, as the latter became increasingly embarrassed by C18's violent behaviour. The election of Derek Beackon as the BNP's first- ever local councillor, in Millwall in September 1993, sealed the split between the two organisations. From then on, the BNP proscribed joint membership (sometimes to little effect, because C18 didn't have any "official" members as such).

As C18 developed a more extreme National Socialist/Nazi position, it attracted a hardcore of 200 or so followers from around the country. Although its numbers would sometimes swell with occasional support from football hooligans and skinheads from the "white power" music scene, this hardcore remained constant.

"Race not Nation - we're not British nationalists, we're racialists," Charlie told me 15 months ago. C18 believed in the white European/Aryan "race", as opposed to the BNP's belief in the British "nation". "The BNP's view is just bullshit," said Steve Sargent, "but we're not under no illusions. The BNP say they're gonna sweep the country in 10 years time, but that's bullshit, 'coz it's never gonna happen." Where the BNP had the idea of repatriating black and other communities to their "native" countries, C18 believed in building white powerbases from which to launch attacks.

In another departure from previous right-wing extremist thinking, C18 drew ideological inspiration from the USA, particularly from theories espousing "race war". Thus, in a French Nazi publication, Terror Elite, Charlie Sargent explained that the race war desired by neo-Nazis would not happen of its own accord: "We have to incite the niggers and Arabs. I and others are personally dedicated to declaring war on the system over the coming years. I know that could mean death or life imprisonment, but I hope to light a touchpaper to a fire so powerful that Zog will never put it out."

The group adopted, or at least claimed to adopt, a strategy known as "leaderless resistance". Using this strategy, small cells of activists would operate autonomously, theoretically making the organisation more resistant to infiltration. This system was devised by followers of The Order, a right-wing terrorist group in the USA which murdered law-enforcement officials and a prominent Jewish radio host in 1984. While it was eventually destroyed in a shoot out with the FBI, The Order became an inspiration for neo-Nazis across the world. Former followers are still in touch with C18 today.

Figures on both the Left and Right were regularly targeted by C18's "punishment squads". Indeed, many on the Right - including BNP members - grew to fear C18 more than the Left, as it viciously attacked members of what it saw as rival organisations. C18 leaders were always proud to boast that their organisation was larger and stronger than any other - including legal parties - on the Right. In reality, factional rivalry meant that they were often the ones who had most to fear from the group.

C18 also proved attractive to some on the Right because of its strong links with the Loyalist paramilitaries. While other right-wing groups paid lip service to this cause, C18 actively took up their struggle. In 1993, one follower was caught with six handguns in his car; while the following year, C18 supporter Terry Blackham was arrested trying to deliver sub-machine guns and a rocket launcher to the paramilitary Ulster Defence Association. This close relationship with the Loyalists led some to suggest that C18 was an MI5 honeytrap (this was disputed by security sources), created as a way of infiltrating the Loyalist terror world.

The group also allied itself with extremists from across Europe and the USA, as demonstrated by the letter-bomb campaign in January last year, which involved neo-Nazi's from Britain, Denmark and Sweden. Three Danish neo-Nazis are now serving between three and eight years each for their part in the plot.

Furthermore, C18 controlled a lucrative and illegal music business, making it the first such organisation with access to a significant amount of capital. White-power bands were promoted at secret gigs, and CDs and other merchandise were sold illegally throughout the world. Nazi bands which did not join, or criticised C18 control, suffered punishment beatings and regular intimidation.

Such influence could be seen on Europe's largest housing estate, Harold Hill, in Romford, Essex. The local C18 "cell" subjected an Asian family to several months of attacks and racial harassment. A boulder was thrown through the family's front door, graffiti was sprayed on the outside of their house, wheel nuts were loosened, and a corrosive liquid was thrown into the wife's face. When asked about this incident, Steve Sargent was coy but eventually said with a guttural laugh: "I only heard that the family dog was thrown through the front window - dead."

Another victim of C18's violence was Ross Fraser, a former editor of the Chelsea Independent soccer fanzine. Following remarks that racism had no place in football, Fraser was subjected to a vicious campaign of violence. In an attack on a London pub, Fraser was left needing seven stitches to his face and his sight was permanently damaged after he was struck with a broken bottle. Three others required hospital treatment, one with a slashed jugular vein. Two months later, Fraser only narrowly missed further injury after a C18 supporter tried to stab him in the face after a Chelsea game in Prague.

Despite the rhetoric, this was where C18 was most dangerous, attacking individuals and small, isolated groups rather than large "enemies" such as the State. C18's reputation grew beyond its actual, rather small, core following; for example, Charlie Sargent (wrongly) claimed that C18 had initiated the riots at the England v Ireland match in Dublin in 1995. The press, keen for an exclusive, went wild for the story. T-shirts were printed and distributed across Europe, with young skinheads proud to wear Combat 18 insignia. Thus the C18 name, and legend, grew.

WINTER 1996. The Railway Tavern is a small, grotty pub with peeling green paint, squatting inconspicuously opposite Chelmsford railway station. Inside, Charlie and Steve Sargent are sitting silently, awaiting my arrival. Charlie is in a dark, tetchy mood, answering questions with a brief "eah" or "naa". A baseball cap is perched precariously on his large head. As the "Big Man" of C18, he has already warned me at our previous meeting "not to stitch us up, or we'll fuck you over badly".

I have come to see the brothers on home territory - their power base - to try and understand something about them as people, about their motivation and their aims for the future.

This bustling Essex commuter town, with its territorial pubs and large, white council estates, will be the centre, C18 argues, for a paramilitary struggle. The group will slowly and surely take over the estates, populated as they see it by white East End emigres, and become the dominant political force in the area.

Like other such areas, Chelmsford has a schizophrenic character. On the one hand, there are quiet, suburban parks and green-belt areas. Marconi has its headquarters there. Bright Christmas lights hang over the old market area and a single tiny mosque nestles inconspicuously behind a curry house. From this angle, it seems a quiet, suburban commuter town. However, the street with the longest row of pubs is known locally as "The Road of Death", due to the number of fights which take place there. At weekends, young lads from the surrounding towns and villages pile into nightclubs - looking, as Steve Sargent says, "for booze, a shag and a fight". And the predominantly white, working-class estates have proved themselves to be an ideal breeding ground for the insularity and youthful discontent upon which C18 thrives.

"You go to any Essex town, and they've trebled in size, yeah?" says Charlie, chubby fist gripping a pint of lager. "They're building, building, building in every Essex town and the reason is that the whites are leaving London."

"It's always been a bit stronger for racist support, always," says Steve, waiting deferentially for Charlie to finish. He speaks slowly, in a more measured tone, than his elder brother. "The East End's always had its racist support, hasn't it? Now them racists that voted for the BNP and National Front in the Seventies, most of them now live in Essex." He emphasises the word "racist".

"If we stand for election, we'll get eliminated," Charlie butts in. "The loyalist paramilitaries or Sinn Fein when they stand for elections, they're humiliated basically, but as a paramilitary group they get respect. That's how we've got to go." He adopts his challenging look. "We're targeting certain estates, because we need more local support. I mean, we're not going to be able to go into the middle-class areas of Chelmsford and win support - we know that."

It is a working-class movement, full of anger and resentment at the bias of "The System". "Our community has been smashed," complains Charlie. "When I grew up, you knew everyone and everyone knew you. Now you have the blacks come in. Most of the blacks and whites, whether people like it or not, don't mix. Then you have the Asians. Then you have people who have mixed-race kids [whom they hate more than anything else]. It splits everyone up. You ain't got any real community left and that fucks everything up. That's how it is on any estate, on any street in London now."

Charlie argues that most white working-class people aren't interested in politics, but race. "They're either for it or against it," he states, with a chopping gesture. "And the ones that don't agree with us, well we've got to make them respect us, fear us, or however you want to say it," he says, adopting that look again.

In this scenario, Chelmsford would be part of an Aryan Homeland, with the paramilitary struggle taking place on the working-class estates while a kibbutz-style smallholding or commune is set up in the countryside. The Homeland would also contain a school and doctors, and would operate a bartering system instead of using money. It would function as a simpler, perhaps mythical form of community from which to attack the State and its organs.

Again stemming from an American concept, and inspired by the belief that the system is fixed against them, the plan was to withdraw as much as possible from society and to create a National Socialist state within Britain itself. One of C18's myriad (and illegal) publications states: "The inner cities are lost. We must realise this and take our only real option - converge as many of our people as we can in the Homeland area and gradually take control of it. One has only to look at Belfast to see that we can achieve our aim, the only difference being ours will be on racial not religious divides."

C18 even created a National Socialist Alliance (NSA) of various extreme right-wing groups, which would function as a cross-party forum, one aim of which was to support the Homeland. It gathered funds for the project (pounds 10 per "share", with 1,000 shares giving you the right to work permanently and reside on the site) and helped arrange accommodation for prospective recruits. C18's profits from its music business also supported the project.

Charlie is keen to extol the virtues of the Homeland, and the success he and Steve have had in attracting supporters. "The more powerful you become in that area, the more chance you've got," explains Steve. "You gotta do it bit by bit, you can't do it in the whole country straight away." In this way, drug dealers would be forced from estates ("He'll be told to leave and if he don't, his house is gonna go up and that's the end of it," says Charlie, "like the IRA and UDA") and local building and contract work (important to the likes of C18 supporters - both Charlie and Steve are plasterers by trade) would be controlled directly by C18. Any opposition would get "seriously fucking hurt" in a paramilitary-style struggle.

Would racial intimidation be used, as at Harold Hill? "Of course. They've got the whole fucking country to live in, in't they? If they come here, they're just trying to provoke us, in't they? Well, if they come here, that's what they can expect. Simple as that. I don't eat curries and I don't eat chapatis," he adds, laughing. "They're not the same as us, are they? You're English, you understand, don't you?"

So speaks Charlie. He is a man of simple answers. Challenging any of them too openly provokes an aggressive "What do you mean by that?" - his mouth set in a small, intimidating "o". And he already has a reputation as a man with a fearsome temper. He has survived at least one axe attack and always carries a knife, by his own admission. Steve later tells me that he once saw Charlie bite off an opponent's nose during a fight.

Steve is quieter, but when he looks down into his pint, he displays a rough set of scars upon his close-cropped head. These were sustained during a confrontation in which C18 attacked Asian shops in east London. He was slashed by machetes across his head and back, needing more than 100 stitches. He laughs when recounting this story, but his laugh is nervous.

When he does look up, his eyes are clear and honest, and his hands and mouth expressive. It is sometimes hard to believe both are family men, well-travelled (Steve lived in eastern Europe for a year and Charlie backpacked for three years) and can at times be warm and expressive. Both have a regular, if slightly rough, sense of humour. Charlie also has four kids and a partner in Harlow for whom he professes undying love. He is upset when they are targeted by the local press, or are sent "Jiffy bags full of excrement by anti-Fascists". He wants to protect them.

Why then such fanaticism, such hate? What terrible event set them on this course? The brothers both claim they had happy, uneventful childhoods, raised as they were in a family of three brothers and two sisters on an estate in Barnet, north London. Their father was a Loyalist supporter from Clacton, who brought up his children to be "proud racists". "He was hard but fair, our old man, I'll give him that," says Steve. "He brought us up to believe in certain things, just like if your dad was a Communist, you'd grow up believing Communist things," adds Charlie. What does this mean, exactly? "We were brought up as Fascists and nationalists."

Football and music were the gathering points for the young Sargents. Their older brother Billy had already gone off to become a heavy for various groups on the Right. To Charlie, fighting with 200 other fans at an Arsenal away game became "a way of proving your manhood". The talk turns to football firms, and how trust and loyalty to your mates are incredibly important (and no one should ever, ever, "grass" to the police).

"We were both involved in the hooligan thing and started out fighting,"says Charlie, munching with gusto on the lunch I have just bought him. Between mouthfuls, he adds: "It's always been that way, hasn't it? There's nothing wrong with that." From there it was a natural progression to shaving his head, joining National Front marches and becoming a heavy for the British Movement (a violent neo-Nazi group of the late Seventies).

When that group split in early Eighties, "about 30 of us left and that's when we got involved in robberies and all that," says Charlie matter-of- factly. The aim was to put away money for "projects" to do with the Right, but he is vague about specifics. He was just 20 at the time. Since then he has been imprisoned four times, including for possession of guns and drugs. They tell me that "some things went down this summer which were worth five to 10 [years]".

Both brothers reminisce about life "back then", a golden period when things were better. To Steve, for example, it meant only having "one Paki" in his school. To Charlie, the 1950s and the era of Ealing comedies were "a good time for this country. Everyone had work, London was one of the cleanest and most crime-free cities in the world. Now look at it. It's a fucking cesspit," he spits.

In their view, cultures should not mix - except white Europeans, of course: "We're all the fucking same, ain't we? What the fucking hell's the difference between a Norman and a Saxon in 1066?" Yet they admit admiration for "the Jews and Asians" for maintaining strong communities. Charlie also laments the lack of moral guidance in today's society. "The Church of England now is so full of poofs and every sort of scum, what can you expect?"

Respect, together with trust, loyalty and honour are the main virtues in this tribal society. Football battles with your mates are described in glowing terms. Steve in particular gets carried away, showing me how he bounces up and down before a fight between two sets of fans. His face flushes with excitement as he mimics these motions, while his mouth screams imaginary abuse.

Charlie understands that respect comes from being the toughest fellow. "You respect the geezer who can beat everyone up. Everyone wants to know who's the best fighter on the estate. It's always been the way. People arse-lick 'em." His is a highly territorial world. But it also revolves around control and Charlie's view of who should be doing it (usually him). Charlie, for example, dominates conversations both physically and verbally, often cutting others off. Steve stays unusually silent in his elder brother's company.

It is also a male world. "Our women are our partners, but not our equals and betters," says Charlie. "The flags, the drums, the Nationalist spirit - it's not really a thing for women. Their place is at home with the kids. They should be doing that, not out fighting. A lot of our women agree with us as well."

THE IDEOLOGICAL heavyweight behind all this talk is a man called David Myatt. An eccentric former monk, Satanist and widely travelled martial- arts expert, Myatt (who is 48) has previously attempted to establish a Nazi-occultist commune in Shropshire. He now produces a regular bulletin, The National Socialist, which espouses race war, the supremacy of the Aryan nation, and a fanatical devotion to "warrior values" of Loyalty, Duty and Honour.

A typical theme in his writings runs thus: "So-called racial hatred and racism itself are Nature's way of protecting her creations and protecting herself ... it is race mixing which is the ultimate evil. Race mixing is a crime against life itself." Elsewhere, he calls for a "holy war against our enemies, for these enemies are threatening our very racial existence".

Myatt provides much of the intellectual "legitimacy" which groups like C18 - mainly composed as they are of self-educated, working-class young men - lack. His writings go into great, often tortuous detail about National Socialist values, but he has the ear of people like the Sargents, in particular Steve (with whom he has now forged a new group called the National Socialist Movement).

However, unlike C18, Myatt draws inspiration from a fanatical devotion to Germany in the 1930s. "National Socialist Germany is the closest thing to there being a cultural expression of something which is natural and healthy for Aryan peoples," he says in a polite, soft-spoken accent when we meet at the tea shop in Malvern station, surrounded by oblivious old-age pensioners.

Listening to Myatt is a surreal experience. A slim, diminutive figure dressed in bright cycling gear and sporting a huge beard, he has a passion for toasted tea cakes and translating Greek literature. We talk for an hour about race war, Aryan supremacy and warrior values. He sees his role as educating and guiding young neo-Nazis. He expresses great admiration for both Spartan and ancient Japanese societies. In his ideal world, we would all be warrior-farmers - or enslaved to those who were.

Unlike C18's members, Myatt is well educated and, in his own words, "of independent means". His father worked "for the British Empire" and as a child, he lived in east Africa and Asia. He read widely about National Socialism and Hitler, becoming a convert in his teens. Yet even by his own admission he is a loner and a fanatic, who hates cities and motor cars, and who became disillusioned with groups such as the National Front. He even spent 18 months as a monk - but "I had a great struggle between my political beliefs and religious dogma. I finally decided they were incompatible."

We share several awkward silences. A shy man, he seems uncomfortable in company, and it is difficult really to find out why or how he was so drawn to Nazism. All he will admit is that he has been in prison twice for his beliefs and that he was profoundly affected by the death of a loved one. He has since decided that revolution and a great leader are needed to bring about the resurgence of the Aryan peoples. He admits to a similarity between himself and extremist religious figures: "I know I'm right," he states simply.

Yet his conversation and writings show little understanding or empathy with human nature. He stresses the need for fanatical values in bringing about his new society, attacking other cultures and "traitors" to the Aryan cause - and he admits to being continually disappointed by "real life". His vision of a Homeland - organic farming, horse-drawn equipment, no contact with the outside world - also differs sharply from the reality of the Sargent brothers.

THE REALITY on the ground for Combat 18 was really football violence and the far-right music scene. When I first met Charlie, for example, he was holding a large bag of illegal "white power" CDs, which he willingly displayed. These discs formed part of the highly profitable music business - ISD Records - which helped fund C18's activities. Over the last three years ISD produced nearly 30 CDs, with a total production run of more than 30,000 discs, and made more than pounds 200,000 in profit - the first time a right-wing group had controlled such a large money-making venture.

It was, however, these profits which provided one of the main reasons for the feud within C18, and which led to the events in which Chris Castle was murdered. Charlie Sargent's right-hand man and C18's new leader (who, as mentioned, cannot be named for legal reasons) controlled the music business. A man feared even by Steve Sargent ("All he does is train every day for the war"), he and Charlie differed over how to spend the funds. During the autumn of 1996 the two men began to argue over this, and over the future of the organisation. Sargent wanted to dominate the far-right scene, while his henchman preferred to create a smaller, terrorist-style organisation in order to launch attacks on the State.

This eventually resulted in the feud which saw Chris Castle's murder and the Danish letter bombings, with each side accusing the other of working for the State and acting as police informants. The remaining C18 faction is now committed to existing as a smaller, more hardline terrorist organisation.

FOR STEVE SARGENT, recreating a community is simply "the only realistic option we have". Like Charlie, he believes "their" community has been smashed. Wandering with him around the pubs of Chelmsford, he is less confident, less absolute, than Charlie. He is uncomfortable with the label of "Nazi", saying that the Right already attracts too many "bedsit weirdoes", and seems much happier describing old football days and tribal street battles than any notion of the future.

He yearns for a simpler life. "I've spent half my life punching and fighting my way through different people, and I just don't want it no more, you know. I'm too fucking old for it all. You get some 20-year-old come along and he's gonna knock the fucking shit out of ya." I ask him what he really wants. He pauses for a while. "I don't know really. It's whether you talk fantasy or reality. In fantasy, I want lovely clean streets and blue-eyed blonde birds. In reality," he pauses again, "pretty much like what it's like now."

And the reality was that the Homeland never took off. The Sargents only attracted one outsider, a French neo-Nazi, to the area. Although they had support from individuals, such as Martin Cross, already based in Essex, the dream remained just that - a dream. The group was rarely a national danger - despite its propaganda - other than to individuals or small groups. It was never really organised into cells or contained committed terrorists (with a few notable exceptions) - rather, it was an extended football hooligan firm, or tribal gang. The rhetoric was there, if not always the practice. C18's long-promised race war and attacks on the State never ignited.

24 JANUARY 1998, Holloway Road, north London: the march to mark the 25th anniversary of the Bloody Sunday killings. It is bitterly cold, and the Union Jack hangs limply from the railings. Forty or so ragged-looking skinheads from the National Front are outnumbered at least 50 to one by the marchers. The NSM "protection force", lurking out of sight in a couple of nearby pubs, is small and easily noticed by the police. Although they have a few faces from Chelsea and Romford, the right-wingers soon leave the area, which is already swarming with street fighters from Anti-Fascist Action.

Memories of the London pub in which I had first met the leaders of Combat 18 now seem very distant. In its heyday, C18 would have fielded several dozen hardmen, a mixed gang of hooligans and Fascists, "tooled up" and ready for confrontation with their traditional enemy, the "Reds". But things have changed dramatically for the Nazi streetfighters and the brothers who led them.

In the dock at Chelmsford Crown Court a fortnight ago, Charlie Sargent cut a lonely, almost sad figure, stripped of his reputation and coterie. When I first met him some 15 months ago, he seemed an intimidating figure, with his short, cropped hair, surrounded by followers and talking of a paramilitary struggle. Now wearing glasses, with his hair long and very much on his own, the myth was dispelled. I noticed for the first time just how physically small he really is. It seemed to highlight the difference between reality and the fantasy so often espoused in the far right's literature and lifestyles. Is this - finally - the reality of "Aryan man"?

[jakell]

1.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&p=534778#p534778
2.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=465#p535229
3.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=480#p535369
4.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=495#p535502
5.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=510#p535750
6.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&p=535833#p535833
7.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=660#p536983
8.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&start=675#p537139
9.) http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22490&p=537395#p537395

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10)...

I have mentioned previously that a large part of the BNP's success in the 00's, both electoral and in membership growth, was due to them moderating their image. This is often portrayed as merely a clever lie on the part of the BNP, but when it comes to membership, the moderation cuts both ways, there was quite a distinct difference between the recent members and the older hardline members, and this started to show, especially in the environment of a discussion forum.

The old-school 'anti-fascists', mainly from the Left, almost entirely failed to appreciate this change, and seemingly preferred the simplistic and cartoonish image of BNP members as Hollywood Nazis. Whatever the psychology behind this was, it was a tactical error and reinforced my view of the Left as ineffective in tackling these people.

Going back to the debate between ethnonationalism and civic nationalism, the older BNP members were solidly in the former camp, and as I said, because there was a large element of a belief system here with it's strong emotional undercurrents, it actually nearly always won the day, ie it won 'debates' by not debating.
I spotted a problem here. Here we were on a discussion forum, but non-discussion seemed to have the edge. Of course, I've seen this plenty of times before, but in this context the issues mattered to me a lot more, this was fairly up-close stuff, not speculative fiction from halfway around the world, and this made me look deeper.

This ethno/civic nationalism 'debate' rolled on, and seemed to be almost part of the scenery in that it would never be resolved, and folks seemed content for it not to be resolved until eventually I noticed a new element creep in. This was in the form a new poster who was quite eloquent and verbose and who also wrote in quite a compelling style, the majority of stuff he wrote about was about the malevolence and guile and of the Jews. To Americans this may not seem unusual, but in even hardline British Nationalism, you don't hear a great deal of antisemitism, even though it may be there in the background as a gereral hate thing, you mainly hear race hate directed towards specific groups of recent immigrants.


I wasn't the only one to be taken slightly aback by this guy, he was quite full on, and he soon got joined by a few others of the same ilk, but with varying styles and approaches, it was with these others that I started to see the outline of a third group that seemed to have a non British flavour to it. It would be a while yet before I was to give this group some form, but this turned out to provide a very good perspective...

[American Dream]

Cross-posting from "Fascists are the Tools of the State":


Ukrainian anarchist dispels myths surrounding Euromaidan protests, warns of fascist influence

http://tahriricn.wordpress.com/2014/01/ ... influence/

Asheville Fm radio: Do you have anything to say about the Ukraine National Assembly party?

Denys: “They’re not very influential now. They used to be a very powerful far-right party (back) in the `90s, when they really had their own para-military soldiers, and even a semi-army, and their fighters (participated in) the war in Chechnya, and in other Caucasus wars and in Transnistria, and, yeah, they were very scary. But today they are just mostly a club for the nazis who don’t like Svoboda.

Asheville Fm radio: I came across the website of Dimitrov Kutchinsky, that guy is crazy. There are also references to national-anarchism.

Denys: “Are you familiar with that concept at all?”

Asheville Fm radio: Yeah there are some idiots claiming to be that in the United States. In San Francisco, and New York and Chicago. Are they much of a thing in the Ukraine?

Denys: “Yes, actually yes. Because unfortunately this is a very popular trend – to mix with the leftist things, like (in adopting an) anticapitalism (narrative). The anarchist (position) is very trendy, cool and gives you some points immediately, but people mix it with national things, which also look very trendy and cool with the youth, mainly with teenagers who just don’t see any problem in trying to combine these things. And it’s especially funny in Ukraine because we have a very big myth about Makhno.

Today he’s an integral part of the national myth, he’s considered a nationalist, actually, because, well, he fought the Bolsheviks, therefore he must be for Ukraine, for independent Ukraine, and for the rule of the nation and so on. Obviously this is total bullshit, but this mythology is very popular and it adds to the popularity of that left-right synthesis, the third position actually, like Terza Posizione, the Italian fascist tradition.”

Asheville Fm radio: Yeah that’s the same phrasing that they use in the United States: third positionists. There’s also a lot of overlap of nationalism and regional bio-centric ecology, so that they seem to make invasions into Green Anarchism before they start to make it into the mainstream or before a lot of people became aware of who they were and what they were doing.

Denys: “I understand that, but here in Ukraine, apart from the New Age things, they are also very fascinated by the proper fascists, such as Mussolini, for example. They somehow are trying to mix it with anarchism.

Also you may be aware of the split in the Russian anarchist movement recently?

Asheville Fm radio: No, I’m not actually.

Denys: “Well there was a big split and that is repeated in Ukraine too.

It’s the split between the anarchists who support the minority rights, the feminist struggle, they pay attention to general issues, to the minority rights to the ethnical minorities, and the other macho-anarchists who don’t like all this ‘feminist b….t.’ They say, ‘We are cool guys, we do lots of sports and we are the proper anarchists, we don’t want anything to do with those pussies.’

Unfortunately, this manarchism is also gaining a lot of popularity lately.”

Asheville Fm radio: Is that a phrase you use in Ukraine, manarchism?

Denys: “Oh, we know that it’s originated in the United States, but for the lack of better word, yeah.”

Asheville Fm radio: It was quite surprising to hear it, I mean your English is very good but also the colloquial, the subcultural terms that you’ve pulled, they’re quite good. It seems in the United States that that’s always been a trend, that’s a possibility and that’s happened over and over again where people split off and say, “Oh, we need to have action now, no, these other ideas will happen after the revolution, we can wait to talk about race or sexism after the revolution and we’re gonna make the revolution right now so that we’d get on to those conversations,” and it seemed to a lot of people, starting about 10 years ago maybe in the United States among insurrectional currents of anarchism that that was a thing that people were tending towards, but I don’t think that there was actually a split in the United States, thankfully, I think there are people who have that perspective but usually they get put in their place by other people pretty fast.

They get called manarchists, and then internet videos are made about them and they are made fun of in public and then they don’t want to be that person anymore, hopefully.

Denys: “The difference is you don’t have such developed fascists, do you?”

Asheville Fm radio: No.

I mean we have a lot of far-right leaning groupings in the United States, some of which are para-military such as militias, or the KKK, though they’re not very big anymore, there are large pockets of neo-nazi subcurrents, but for the most part these groupings are at the political fringes, and the mainstream of America would not listen to them, although there have been large upsurges in anti-immigrant perspectives over the last 10 years that have led to armed groups on the border with Mexico for instance that have been deputized in certain states. In a way that kind of reflects from what I understand the Kozaks as an armed civilian militia that’s trained and armed by the state in Russia?

But, yeah, the integration of rasist and fascist elements, as (openly) fascists is not really a thing although people make the argument that the United States is a fascist State it’s definitely not Mussolini’s Italy and definitely not Hitler’s Germany.

Denys: “We have an additional pressure from the right and more people just tend to confuse these things. You know, all these things are against the power, against the government and, yeah, (they are like), “I’m too lazy to read anything about it yeah, so I should go into the street, and not even go into the street, but merely go into the gym.” There is a (Denys told Revolution News that this is a true story) joke, (about) the Kyiv manarchist (and it goes), “The day before yesterday they’ve issued a call of unity among the Kyiv left in the face of the Euromaidan like “We should be united and go together and do something social to raise some social issues and so on, but that call for unity contained one note: that if we see people with a black violet flag they would be considered provocateurs and all the necessary measures will be upon them.”

Asheville Fm radio: And black and violet being the color spectrum from the anarcha-feminist?

Denys: Yeah, right.