I had an important point to make...

[JackRiddler]

It was a pretty interesting argument, probably not controversial to most people on this board. Something that a lot of smart-thinking people can figure out for themselves, but nevertheless important in the big scheme of things and therefore a worthwhile research subject and conversation starter. Unfortunately, out of a number of articles addressing this matter online, I was unable to find one by Gilad Atzmon, David Icke, Ken O'Keefe, Wayne Madsen, or someone who had associated it with the Rothschilds and how they are the actual owners of the all-powerful Federal Reserve. So lacking one of these essential poison-pill prerequisites, I'm afraid there's no way to start this thread.

[American Dream]

Don't you know?: The State of Israel does so many bad things.

So how could you say that? Are you on the ADL payroll?

[seemslikeadream]

wow truth out of AD's mouth?


The Wall in East Jerusalem

Israel abuses Palestinian children, UN reports find

Saturday, July 27, 2013
By Steven Katsineris
Since it was founded in 1948, the Israeli state has neglected the rights of Palestinian children, who have been deliberately ill-treated. Many Palestinian children have been killed, injured, jailed, tortured or used as human shields by Israel.

In attacks on Palestinian territory, Israeli forces have intentionally targeted playgrounds, schools and other areas frequented by children. Between September 2000 and April 2013, the Israeli occupation forces killed 1518 Palestinian children. This is equivalent to one Palestinian child killed by the Israel army every three days for almost 13 years.

The number of Palestinian children injured by the Israeli military since September 2000 has reached 6000 — or four children injured every three days.

Moer than 9000 Palestinian children have been arrested, detained or jailed since September 2000. That’s six children jailed every three days.

These children have often been detained without charge and subject to abuse and mistreatment, including torture, by the Israeli army and prison officials.

Palestinian prisoner support group Addameer says most of these children report being subjected to ill-treatment and having confessions extracted from them during interrogations. Forms of ill-treatment used by Israeli soldiers include slapping, beating, kicking, violent pushing, threats and even sexual assault.

There are now 238 Palestinian children under the age of 18 being held in Israeli prisons. And 47 of these are under 16.

United Nations Children’s Fund (UNICEF) Report on Palestinian Children in Israeli Military Detention sin March said: “It is understood that in no other country are children systematically tried by juvenile military courts that by definition, fall short of providing the necessary guarantees to ensure respect for their rights.

“All children persecuted for offenses they allegedly committed should be treated in accordance with international juvenile justice standards, which provide them with special protection.”

After a growing number of allegations of ill-treatment of children in Israeli military detention, UNICEF conducted a review of Israeli military practices related to Palestinian children. The main report was based on 400 cases documented since 2009.

It said Palestinian children who were detained by Israeli military are subjected to “widespread, systematic and institutionalised” ill-treatment in violation of international law.

UNICEF estimated that in the West Bank, Israeli military and security forces arrest about 700 youths between the ages of 12 to 17 years old each year, often from their homes at night. They are blindfolded, often painfully restrained, and subject to physical and verbal abuse while transferred to interrogation, where they are coerced into confessions without access to lawyers or family.

Also, children have been shackled during court appearances and made to serve sentences in Israel. UNICEF stated these findings, “amount to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment according to the Convention on the Rights of the Child and the Convention against Torture”.

In a report on Israeli treatment of children in June, the United Nations Committee on the Rights of the Child condemned Israel’s army and police for a range of human rights abuses against Palestinian children.

The body expressed its “deepest concern about the reported practices of torture, and ill-treatment of Palestinian children arrested, persecuted and detained by the military and police.

The report said Palestinian children are routinely arrested by Israeli soldiers during night-time sweeps, with hands tied painfully and blindfolded. Israeli authorities then often also transfer youngsters to detention centres with informing their parents.

The detained Palestinian children then regularly subjected to, “physical and verbal violence, humiliation, painful restrains... (were) threatened with death, physical violence, and sexual assault against themselves or members of the family,” according to the report.

As well as spotlighting abuses in the occupied territories, the UN committee also expressed grave concern at the high number of Palestinian youngsters who have been held in Israeli jails.

The report estimated that 7000 children — mostly aged from 12-17 years of age, but some as young as nine — had been arrested, interrogated and detained since 2002 — an average of two a day. It stated that dozens of children aged between 12 and 15 are being held in Israeli detention centres.

The UN committee obtained information from a variety of sources, including UNICEF and other UN bodies, military informants and Palestinian and Israeli rights groups. Israel did not co-operated with the UN committee on requests for information on the issue and rejected the report.

The committee said: “These crimes are perpetrated from the time of arrest, during transfer and interrogation, to obtain a confession, but also on an arbitrary basis as testified by several Israeli soldiers as well as during pre-trial detention.”

The Israeli human rights group B’Tselem said the treatment of Palestinian children violates the Convention on the Rights of the Child and the Forth Geneva Convention. Although humanitarian groups stress that Israeli soldiers do not have the right to detain or arrest children under the age of 12, this frequently occurs in the occupied West Bank.

Addameer said a 12 year old Palestinian child could be held by Israel for up to 18 months before trial, unlike an Israeli child of the same age, who cannot be legally held.

Violence has been mounting in the occupied West Bank as Israeli settlement building has risen, reaching a seven year high according to the Peace Now group. With the rise and expansion of illegal Israeli settlements comes the confiscation of more Palestinian land, the destruction of their homes, olives and citrus groves and crops, creating more antagonism and conflict.

Last year, there was an unprecedented rise in the number of Palestinian children arrested by Israeli forces. Addameer reported that an average of 200 children were arrested and detained each month.

Most children were arrested after being accused of throwing stones at Israeli occupation forces or settlers, an offence that can carry a 20 year sentence. But children in high conflict-areas of the West Bank are frequently arrested indiscriminately and held in detention with little or no evidence.

These arrests are often used to deter Palestinian children from engaging in protests against the occupation. Palestinian children are also subject to attacks by Israeli forces and settlers on a daily basis.

Despite Israel ratifying international human rights treaties, it consistently breaks these international human rights laws, with Israeli military and prison ill-treatment of against Palestinian children being both widespread and systematic.

Israel continues to carry out systematic human rights violations against Palestinian children. Its soldiers and officials act with immunity, with those responsible for violence against children not held accountable.

The UN and various human rights groups have, over many years, documented many instances of abuse. But the international community has failed to act to protect or improve the situation of Palestinian children.

The world must demand Israel end its abuse of Palestinian children and respect their fundamental human rights. Otherwise, the words in the United Nations Declaration of the Rights of the Child are hollow statements without meaning, or and offer no protection to the children of Palestine.

- See more at: http://www.greenleft.org.au/node/54616# ... TuWHB.dpuf

Palestinian Children Targeted as Israel Crushes Unrest
by Mel Frykberg, June 17, 2011
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SILWAN, Palestine – "Father please help me! Don’t let them take me away," screamed 12-year-old Ahmed Siyam as approximately 50 heavily armed Israeli soldiers and police dragged the handcuffed and blindfolded boy away.

Last month Ahmed was pulled out of his bed at 4am by Israeli security forces led by Shin Bet agents from Israel’s domestic intelligence agency. He was taken to the Russian Compound police station in West Jerusalem where he was accused of throwing stones at Israeli soldiers and police during clashes with Palestinian youth in the volatile neighborhood of Silwan in East Jerusalem.

Silwan has become a regular point of friction and violent confrontation between illegal Israeli settlers, the Israeli soldiers and police who protect them, and Palestinian youngsters.

Hundreds of Palestinians have been driven out of their homes in East Jerusalem to make way for the Israeli settlers. Many Palestinian homes have been destroyed, and dozens more are under threat, as the Israeli authorities move Israeli settlers in – all this illegal under international law.

When the soldiers first arrived Ahmed’s father Daoud at first refused to open the door and demanded that the police produce a search or arrest warrant.

"But they threatened to break the door down if I didn’t open it. They asked me where Ahmed was and I asked them why they wanted him. They told me to shut up and assaulted me," Daoud told IPS.

"They then went to Ahmed’s bedroom and dragged him out and into a police vehicle outside. They would not tell me where they were taking him and physically prevented me from accompanying Ahmed.

"The next morning after many frantic telephone enquiries I found out Ahmed was being held at the Russian Compound. When I went there they wouldn’t let me see my son and denied he was even there. Eventually after I called my lawyer I was able to see him several hours later. He looked very traumatized and was crying," recalls Daoud.

"I was scared. I couldn’t see where we were going and my hands were handcuffed very tightly behind my back. At the police station they refused to give me water when I told them I was thirsty and when I asked to go to the toilet they kicked me. They questioned me for hours and accused me of throwing stones which I denied," Ahmed told IPS.

Two weeks ago Ahmed’s cousin, Ali Siyam, 7, was arrested under similar circumstances and also accused of stone throwing. When his father Muhammad tried to stop the dozens of Israeli security men from dragging his son away, he was beaten with the backs of guns on his head and subsequently required hospital treatment.

Ali’s aunt was shot in the leg with a rubber-coated steel bullet when she tried to intervene and she too required hospital treatment. Ali’s parents were forbidden from accompanying their son to the police station and when they went to the Russian Compound the police denied that Ali was in their custody.

When Ali’s Israeli lawyer Lea Tzemel tried to visit her young client in jail the security guards refused to allow her in. When she tried to walk past the guards she was detained. Following an argument she was granted access to the boy. Ali was released several hours later.

Meanwhile, Ahmed was initially ordered to a month’s house arrest and forbidden from attending school as the police investigation continued. He is due to appear in court next month on charges of stone throwing. Whether he is guilty or not remains questionable as does Israel’s interrogation techniques of young Palestinian children.

Defense International for Children (DCI) – Palestine Chapter, reports that Israeli police opened 1,267 criminal cases against Palestinian children between November 2009 and October 2010 for stone throwing in East Jerusalem. Israeli rights group B’tselem reports 31 of those children were from Silwan.

"Fifty percent of the children were interrogated without their parents or a lawyer present and many were threatened and assaulted," Gerard Horton, a lawyer from DCI, told IPS.

"Many of the children were screamed at, slapped and shoved, sometimes kicked and punched, during questioning and coerced into making statements of disputable accuracy. Some were threatened with further violence," said Horton.

"These kids had been taken from their homes in the middle of the night, many handcuffed and blindfolded," Horton said. "They were then interrogated hours later and by this time they were traumatized and disoriented, and not able to withstand the pressure."

The situation of Palestinian children in the West Bank is even worse where they are subject to military law. Minors can be held for up to eight days before they are brought before a military judge.

"We had one case where three kids were tasered while their hands were tied behind their backs by Israeli police during questioning on one of the settlements. Others were threatened with having their homes blown up, and several threatened with rape," Horton told IPS.

More than 25 Palestinian children have been arrested in Silwan during the last few weeks.

Milad Ayyash, 17, was shot dead in May by an Israeli settler security guard who claimed the boy had been involved in clashes.

Last year a video showing an Israeli settler from Silwan deliberately veering towards, and driving into a young Palestinian boy, who was allegedly throwing stones, caused outrage when an Israeli motor company used the video in an advertisement to promote the car’s endurance. The boy was hospitalized for fractures and subsequently arrested. No charges were brought against the driver.

[JackRiddler]

Yay, totally reflexive flood response! If I don't like it, I'm endorsing Israel!

[seemslikeadream]

Yay, totally reflexive flood response! If I don't like it, I'm endorsing Israel!

hey that was just a go along with what AD said...and you fuckin asked for it don't play victim now

but please do continue your game...don't let me interrupt

this is the lounge isn't it? this is where one comes to play games right?

[seemslikeadream]

lumpin' Gilad Atzmon with David Icke, Ken O'Keefe, Wayne Madsen...that's the game AD plays I guessed you were just trying to one up him with the addition of Madsen

[JackRiddler]

No, actually. Bringing up the same discredited losers over and over and over, supposedly to advance causes or arguments that in no way whatsoever require them. I threw in Madsen since it's the same kind of shit. Bored of it. Lowers the property values around here.

[seemslikeadream]

No, actually. Bringing up the same discredited losers over and over and over, supposedly to advance causes or arguments that in no way whatsoever require them. I threw in Madsen since it's the same kind of shit. Bored of it. Lowers the property values around here.

Then your beef is with AD not me....SO FUCKIN GO AFTER HIM

although I don't consider Atzmon a looser but surely AD does and he's the one that brought him up this time along with Icke so FUCKIN ADDRESS YOUR GRIEVANCES WITH HIM NOT ME

[seemslikeadream]

No, actually. Bringing up the same discredited losers over and over and over, supposedly to advance causes or arguments that in no way whatsoever require them. I threw in Madsen since it's the same kind of shit. Bored of it. Lowers the property values around here.

Hey here's an idea....why don't YOU post something worthwhile sometime ....raising the property values around here instead of just popping in occasionally to give your opinion on how things are going so horribly wrong....or managing thread posts ... you know like counteracting all the crap you think is being posted....be careful though don't post anything that would put Israel in a bad light...that's not suppose to happen around here and there are a couple of people here that will descend on you like stink on shit ....making sure in that anyone who has said anything that could be considered in anyway shape or form criticizing Israel last 50 years is called out as an anti-semite....and then lumping that person in with Icke to somehow make sure they are as evil as he is

Gilad Atzmon = David Icke.......give me a FUCKIN break.... what a bunch of "intellectual" bullshit crapolla...talk about lowering the property values around here...

And pretending not to see the threads AD starts about David Icke does not mean some of us don't buy the crap that you don't know exactly what AD is doing in regards to this...I'm positive that you are well aware of his tactics on this issue...I did notice that you were not involved in the latest RI war....I am damn sure you saw it and I guess you'd like to see it continue ...hence this obtuse OP

I don't know if we can even criticize Anthony Weiner here without being callled an anti-semite




I've made peace with 2 people here about all this...but there are two other people here that I will probably never make peace with and with you FANNING THE FLAMES and being such a helper.... the dust up is sure to continue...so carry on my friend facilitate AD and the transportation of that torch to the finish line

[JackRiddler]

No, actually. Bringing up the same discredited losers over and over and over, supposedly to advance causes or arguments that in no way whatsoever require them. I threw in Madsen since it's the same kind of shit. Bored of it. Lowers the property values around here.

Hey here's an idea....why don't YOU post something worthwhile sometime ....raising the property values around here instead of just popping in occasionally to give your opinion on how things are going so horribly wrong....or managing thread posts ... you know like counteracting all the crap you think is being posted....be careful though don't post anything that would put Israel in a bad light...

You've got some fucking nerve.

[seemslikeadream]

yes and so do you...for starting this fucking obtuse OP.....continuing the war (that's what I'm pissed about...Lowers the property values )....you left out that Gilad Atzmon with David Icke thingy and not putting the blame where it belongs


again take responsibility for your OP instead of blaming me for replying to it


are you saying you didn't have a clue what was going on around here in the past month?

or did you think it was some kinda joke that deserved ridicule in the lounge?

[Project Willow]

I share JR's general frustration about subjects that become hot distractions due to long standing interpersonal conflicts. One doesn't need to know all the particular ins and outs, who's upset with whom, etc. in order to feel it. He's got a right to blow off some steam. We've got enough eggshells to tip toe around already.

[JackRiddler]

The blame belongs with those who keep finding obtuse ways to reintroduce the likes of Atzmon and Icke every single day here, and then reflexively accuse anyone who doesn't swallow it of supporting Israel. This is how inconsequential non-thinkers but odious characters like Atzmon and Icke come to be the main subjects of a board that demonstrably has seen a lot better than this.

[seemslikeadream]

The blame belongs with those who keep finding obtuse ways to reintroduce the likes of Atzmon and Icke every single day here, and then reflexively accuse anyone who doesn't swallow it of supporting Israel. This is how inconsequential non-thinkers but odious characters like Atzmon and Icke come to be the main subjects of a board that demonstrably has seen a lot better than this.

and the ONLY person doing just that is AD

NO ONE else starts threads about Icke here except AD.....why don't you just tell him he's got a lot of fuckin nerve?

The BLAME belongs with AD

I'm fuckin tired of it also really fuckin tired of it ......and then you come along and bring it up again ....but you get steam and I'm supposed to get tippy toes

[slimmouse]

No, actually. Bringing up the same discredited losers over and over and over, supposedly to advance causes or arguments that in no way whatsoever require them. I threw in Madsen since it's the same kind of shit. Bored of it. Lowers the property values around here.

First "Stealth Bombers", now "Discredited losers" !

Sounds like a pair of pretty strong judgement calls to me, which is perfectly fair enough. Of course there are many equally active intellectual minds, who might , (having looked for example at those doing the discrediting wherever that may be) form a more rounded opinion.

Just a couple of thoughts on the Rothschilds.

Firstly that isnt their orginal name. Rather like the "Windsors", the Rothschilds are also Germanic.

What is interesting, particularly about the Rothshchilds, is how much additional baggage can be immediately attatched to anyone suggesting that these historically high finanancial architects still have their fingers in many of the worlds global finanancial pies, especially in todays age of ( in some instances) legally enforced political correctness. Which is not to mention of course the carefully programmed kneejerk reaction that the name espouses in relation to the vilest of racism. Mention the name and your already hafl tarred, or at least someone who's research needs to be viewed with suspicion on one primary count, before you even start.

Meanwhile I recently heard in an excellent Peter Levenda video ( thanks again slad) that any successful SS recruits had to be able to prove their own Ayrian Bloodlines going back several generations. Imagine the crossbreeding between the Bauers ( Rothschilds) and the Saxe-Coburg-Gothes ( Windsors) running through the veins of that lot. It might at least help explain how those Nazi fukn monsters were able to act as totally and utterly beyond empathy as they did.

And of course on a more familial level, there was some kind of marriage recently between the two dynasties, was there not?

Secondly, I remember a good few years ago, way before the name was as familiar to me (or the rest of the world no doubt ) watching an old Black and White "movie" about the Rothschilds, Wherein, courtesy of risking their entire forturnes they were apparently responsible for staving off a complete and utter Wall street crash single handedly. I'd love to see that again, or if anyone else can remember seeing it?