Football World Cup

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Re: Football World Cup

Postby Belligerent Savant » Sun Jun 27, 2010 4:40 pm

.

There is no other way to watch the World Cup than on the Spanish-Language channel [canal cuarenta y uno in the NYC area], if only for the highly animated "GOOOOOOOLL" outbursts -- even the near misses are far better to listen to than the rather dull American-based announcers.

Those 2 missed calls by the refs were beyond egregious [the atrocious missed call during the England-Germany game which would have made it 2-2 at halftime, and the clear offside non-call for Argentina's first goal]; that being said, Zhe Gehrmans and my Argentine squad were clearly the better teams today.

Time to bring in some technology, FIFA -- some sensors at the goal line and replay/ref review on offside calls that may nullify or confirm goals. Of course, the matches will be more difficult to fix/rig if such technology is implemented. Rest assured, however: wherever high stakes/monies are involved in Pro Sports [or elsewhere, needless to say], corruption is sure to follow.

Germany-Argentina will be a good one -- Germany's youth may ultimately cost them, or perhaps, salvage a win for them against an Argentinean team playing with plenty of momentum and talent.

[Edited more times than necessary]
Last edited by Belligerent Savant on Sun Jun 27, 2010 8:01 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby kenoma » Sun Jun 27, 2010 5:35 pm

Great stuff - England were shit! After the disallowed goal (which was a disgrace obviously), we got worried, not because they looked like winning - what with them being shit and all - but because they looked like they might get another one of their moral victories to bore us to death with for a few decades. But their innate shitness shone through, and here we are, Argentina v germany, great stuff
Argentina performance was worrying though
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby Searcher08 » Sun Jun 27, 2010 7:54 pm

Stephen Morgan wrote:That didn't go well.


:lol2: It could have been better.
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby JackRiddler » Sun Jun 27, 2010 9:06 pm

kenoma wrote:Great stuff - England were shit! After the disallowed goal (which was a disgrace obviously), we got worried, not because they looked like winning - what with them being shit and all - but because they looked like they might get another one of their moral victories to bore us to death with for a few decades. But their innate shitness shone through, and here we are, Argentina v germany, great stuff
Argentina performance was worrying though


It's far from a moral victory, since they were shite, but they will probably be boring us to death with it for a few decades.

Yes, on the basis of these two games I have to think Germany may be a bit of a favorite against Argentina. Which would be a shame, because Maradona is God and an Entertainer. Ironically, Germany may lose because they're proud and great, and therefore will not spend the entire match chopping down Messi from behind. (Did you see the Mexican who literally shoved down an Argentinean player from behind out of bounds at the end of the first half? There was no pretense of going for the ball. I couldn't believe that wasn't even a foul, it should have been a red card! The ref actually shook his hand!)
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby norton ash » Sun Jun 27, 2010 9:21 pm

England's pathetic exit
by Syd Lowe

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/fifawor ... -exit.html

Last words of the column, last word on the game:

For England, this was the same old story. Not that they were robbed. But that they were rubbish.
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby kenoma » Sun Jun 27, 2010 10:53 pm

England's failure was utterly predictable, but still a bit of an enigma on the whole, considering that they do have several players who are pretty essential to their clubs - Rooney, Gerrard, Lampard, maybe Terry (prick though he is).
So what explains the disparity between club & country for English players?
I don't buy fear-of-failure tabloid-pressure psychological explanations: the idea that England bottle it only for the most crucial nerve-wracking games gives them too much credit. They are consistently mediocre, a fact only masked by their habit of quailfying in so-so groups and winning a few lucky friendlies.
So there must be another explanation for why decent players perform so poorly for England. And it's got to have some correlation with the fact that English players also perform consistently poorly in any league other than the English league. I don't think any English player of note has gone abroad for about 16 years now (was Gazza the last?)
Compare to almost every other team in the last 16 - each team drawn from a variety of leagues, and each player knowing they must be prepared to adapt themselves to the different styles of the major leagues. Players from Spain or Argentina or Portugal are creatures of the international transfer market, where adaptability is as much of an asset as innate skill. And adapability is a crucial quality for the internaitonal game, when players have to be ready to slip into positions they might not be fully comfortable with at club level.
So what the English press think of as a gift - that all their players play for the Best League Ever (tm) is actually a bit of a curse: they all play in the same league, and none of them has played in any other, ever.
English players lack that adaptability at league level: even when they are very good, they are essentially dogsbodies whose roles are set in stone from a very young age. When they have to adapt to new conditions (as Rooney did when Ronaldo left Man U) they find it very hard going.
The Premier League is really an international Expo which just happens by pure chance to take place on English soil, one which benefits everyone but its hosts. It's the delusion that hosting that League in anyway benefits the English game that creates the tragicomedy of yesterday's game
The parallels with London's role in the financial world are too obvious to remark on.

Jackriddler wrote:Yes, on the basis of these two games I have to think Germany may be a bit of a favorite against Argentina.

Friend of mine who is an uncanny predictor of results said tonight that whoever wins that game will win the whole thing, which sounded right to me. And yeah, I'm worried for Argentina (who I think are now the official RI team, no?)
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby JackRiddler » Mon Jun 28, 2010 1:36 am

The oddsmakers like Argentina best (about 20% chance) and have Brazil at 16 and Germany at 8. But this is an unpredictable game. You can't break down what makes a good game to usable statistics, like in baseball or football. You have to watch the game, and Germany right now looks very strong.
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby semper occultus » Mon Jun 28, 2010 4:52 am

I'm sure the lack of experience playing a more sophisticated type of game abroad hinders their technical development & performance but have also believed for a long time that basically none of them actually give a shit

kenoma wrote:The Premier League is really an international Expo which just happens by pure chance to take place on English soil, one which benefits everyone but its hosts. It's the delusion that hosting that League in anyway benefits the English game that creates the tragicomedy of yesterday's game
The parallels with London's role in the financial world are too obvious to remark on.


I thought you were going to mention Wimbledon there !

well the players certainly do benefit - to the tune of.... what up to £150,000 a week or so ...

take a poorly educated & low-IQ group of people whose aspirations revolve around financial reward , conspicuous bling & the "celebrity" status so eagerly awarded by the fawning down-market Tabloids & supermarket magazines & you seem to create a weak & self-centred motivational environment which is inimical to the focus & dedication required to forge a team performance of anything approaching top international level

they don't really see the tournament as a shop-window or a step-up to a better way of life when they've already succeeded in their own terms & would rather be lazing by a swimming-pool somewhere with an equally talentless member of a girl-group
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby Jeff » Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:54 am

kenoma wrote:Friend of mine who is an uncanny predictor of results said tonight that whoever wins that game will win the whole thing, which sounded right to me. And yeah, I'm worried for Argentina (who I think are now the official RI team, no?)


A Better World Cup is Possible.

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Re: Football World Cup

Postby Belligerent Savant » Mon Jun 28, 2010 10:21 am

.

JackRiddler wrote:The oddsmakers like Argentina best (about 20% chance) and have Brazil at 16 and Germany at 8. But this is an unpredictable game. You can't break down what makes a good game to usable statistics, like in baseball or football. You have to watch the game, and Germany right now looks very strong.


Germany certainly looked strong against England, but as discussed here, England was overrated [by their fans at least], slower, and older versus a considerably faster, younger German team. That same youth and relative lack of World Cup experience [with the notable exception of Miroslav Klose] may play a role in the final outcome vs. Argentina -- it may help or perhaps cripple them by the time the final whistle blows. [Argentina is also considerably faster, younger and more talented than the English squad, which we would presume would offset the advantages Germany had against England... there's also the S. America v. Europe factor; in this World Cup, the S. American teams seemed to perform better against European teams, and each region have their own style of play -- this may also be a factor in the final outcome]

Another factor: how will Argentina handle adversity if they happen to NOT score first?

All conjecture at this point -- it really can go either way in the end [and I agree that the winner of this match will likely take it all]

What a diversion, huh? What would Fans do without sports? Pay more attention to the ample ills of the world, perhaps? Nah, many would simply resort to Reality TV programming instead..

Those Handlers really got us clamped down quite well, don't they?

At any rate, on to the Netherlands-Slovakia match... Go Oranje!
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby semper occultus » Mon Jun 28, 2010 11:43 am

Argentina is also considerably faster, younger and more talented than the English squad


....they also foul much more professionally...
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby beeline » Mon Jun 28, 2010 11:54 am

.

I suppose I should root for the Netherlands, as my mom is from there (family legend has it that my uncle was one of the resistance fighters that cut the German-laid cables on the bridges in Sept. of '44), but I really like Ghana's 'Black Stars.' Plus, losing to the eventual victor of the Cup would take some of the sting away.
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby Stephen Morgan » Mon Jun 28, 2010 1:02 pm

I think Uruguay should be our team, seeing as someone above put some money on them and they're still in it. Only got to beat Ghana to get to the semis.

Searcher08 wrote:
Stephen Morgan wrote:That didn't go well.


:lol2: It could have been better.


Well obviously if the ref had his eyes tested we'd have been better in the second half, kept the momentum from the two goals, and won the match. Oh!, the injustice.

kenoma wrote:Compare to almost every other team in the last 16 - each team drawn from a variety of leagues, and each player knowing they must be prepared to adapt themselves to the different styles of the major leagues. Players from Spain or Argentina or Portugal are creatures of the international transfer market, where adaptability is as much of an asset as innate skill. And adapability is a crucial quality for the internaitonal game, when players have to be ready to slip into positions they might not be fully comfortable with at club level.


Except the other major let downs have been the African teams, none of whose major players play in their own leagues. The big successes have been the Germans, the only team comparable to England in their lack of international travel. Besides, none of this stops them playing well in the Champions' League.

Belligerent Savant wrote:younger German team. That same youth and relative lack of World Cup experience [with the notable exception of Miroslav Klose]


And Posolski, and Lahm, and Sweinsteiger, and Mertesacker, and so forth.

there's also the S. America v. Europe factor; in this World Cup, the S. American teams seemed to perform better against European teams, and each region have their own style of play -- this may also be a factor in the final outcome]


I make it seven matches between South American and European teams, of which four were South American victories in which the European teams were teams you wouldn't expect to go through. Switzerland, Greece and Slovakia and the irrelevant match between Brazil and Portugal. France and Italy got draws. In fact of all the European teams left in the cup only Portugal have failed to beat a south american team, and that was Brazil in a dead rubber.

What a diversion, huh? What would Fans do without sports? Pay more attention to the ample ills of the world, perhaps? Nah, many would simply resort to Reality TV programming instead..


Is not diversion, is important. Periods of high attendance at football matches correlate with periods of high trade union membership, traditionally. Is also just about only area of modern life in which there is resistance to plutocracy. I'm not talking Newton Heath, I'm thinking more along the lines of AFC Wimbledon. Not much, but it's what there is.
Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that all was vanity; but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dream with open eyes, and make it possible. -- Lawrence of Arabia
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby American Dream » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:30 am

http://www.counterpunch.org/boykoff06292010.html

The World Cup and the Politics of Immigration

By JULES BOYKOFF



The World Cup has produced some mercurial moments, with defending champions Italy getting the early boot, all African teams but Ghana vanquished in the first round, and longshots like Japan and Slovakia advancing to the knockout round. We’ve heaped plenty of scrutiny on England’s lack of zest, South America’s well-deserved success, and France’s pathetic implosion. But the tournament has also provided compelling political undercurrents that deserve our attention.

For starters, several European countries with borderline draconian immigration policies have benefited massively from immigration. While the right-wing ratchets up its anti-immigrant rhetoric, it’s immigrants who have actually helped these countries achieve World Cup success. Take Germany. Without Mesut Ozil—the son of a Turkish guest worker—whose left-footed zinger against Ghana vaulted Germany to the second round, the Germans would not only be manifestly less imaginative but long ago would’ve been back in Deutschland nursing hefeweizen and watching the rest of the tournament on television. Brazilian-born Cacau has injected energy into Germany’s attack after securing citizenship last spring. His striking partner Miroslav Klose was born in Poland as was Lukas Podolski — and both were stars in Germany’s 2006 World Cup campaign.

In Switzerland, where leading political party, the Union Démocratique du Centre, has pushed anti-immigrant policy and tried to outlaw the construction of minarets, Gelson Fernandes, who was born in Cape Verde, scored the gamewinner against mighty Spain while Congo-born Blaise Nkufo has provided a consistent, muscular presence up front. And where would Portugal be without their skillful Brazilian-born trifecta of Pepe the enforcer, striker Liedson, and midfield stalwart Deco whose play was pivotal in getting Portugal to South Africa in the first place? Despite racist wailings from Arizona, the US squad has also benefited from immigration. Jozy Altidore—who was vital to US success in this World Cup—has parents who emigrated from Haiti. Altidore regularly wears a wristband with a Haitian flag on it to acknowledge his heritage — to be sure, the wristband also has an American flag on it.

Such immigrant success on the World Cup stage has induced a wave of Orwellian doublethink, with right-wing hyper-nationalists football aficionados simultaneously holding two contradictory ideas in their skulls at the same time. Veins bulging from their necks as they root for the home team, these fans spout xenophobia by day and don the national team strip by night.

But European reactionaries and conservatives aren’t the only ones suffering from doublethink. I suffer from it, too, though in a different sense. I realize South Africa is getting reamed by FIFA, with record profit outflows leaving the country and extravagant stadium building prioritized over the basic needs of the citizenry. FIFA and its boosters have trotted out the standard-issue, trickle-down claptrap used to rationalize all international sporting extravaganzas. There’s also the unsavory practice of corporate sponsors fiendishly enforcing their commercial pole position, hounding ambush marketers as if they were abject murderers. All together it’s red-card-abominable and I fully support the dissidents who are marching against these serious injustices.

And yet my heart can’t but help get fully immersed in the ups and downs of this World Cup. Sure, I love the game of football, but I also believe football players have the potential to press us collectively toward a more just society. Terry Eagleton recently wrote, “for the most part football these days is the opium of the people, not to speak of their crack cocaine.” The subtle key to that passage is “for the most part.” In fact, numerous footballers themselves have sliced against this zeitgeist, engaging in a wide array of charity work. Holland’s Dirk Kuyt runs a foundation that makes sport more available to the disabled. Joseph Yobo of Nigeria has done significant social-uplift work with youth in the Niger Delta, doling out more than 300 educational scholarships. Fellow Super Eagle Nwanko Kanu runs a foundation for people with heart ailments.

But charity work is not the same thing as taking a strong, public stand on controversial issues like immigration or war, let alone engaging in social-justice activism. Due to the hyper-commercialized nature of football, players don’t want to alienate sponsors (existing or potential), aggravate team owners and administrators, or deflect the venom of fans who screech that they should just shut up and play. It makes more sense to go the route of David Beckham, becoming a one-size-fits-all, polysemic athlete who spectators can read in any way they wish.

Yet I can’t let go of the glimmering hope that footballers could speak out. You may be mumbling to yourself that the odds of this happening are about as good as those of French coach Raymond Domenech being named World Cup Manager of the Year. But players have moved beyond charity work in the past, with Didier Drogba employing his football acumen as a platform to help reconcile political factions in the Ivory Coast.

And sportswriter Dave Zirin is right: “Sport is, at the end of the day, like a hammer. And you can use a hammer to bash someone over the head or you could use it to construct something beautiful. It's in the way that you use it.” In these final days of the World Cup, I’ll be relishing the luscious mélange of teamwork, individual skill, and artistry that only football can deliver. But I’m also hoping that a big-name footballer will brandish his socio-political hammer to build something bigger than himself and indeed bigger than the FIFA World Cup Trophy.



Jules Boykoff is a former professional soccer player who represented the US Olympic team in international matches. He is an associate professor of Political Science at Pacific University in Forest Grove, Oregon. He can be reached at: boykoff@pacificu.edu
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Re: Football World Cup

Postby JackRiddler » Wed Jun 30, 2010 12:38 am

So I'm rooting for Ghana, Holland, Argentina and Paraguay, but unfortunately I'm expecting Uruguay vs. Brazil and Germany vs. Spain and a Brazil-Germany final. Of course, some shoot-outs are likely, so anything goes.
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