Football World Cup

Moderators: Elvis, DrVolin, Jeff

Re: Football World Cup

Postby stefano » Mon Jun 21, 2010 6:32 am

AhabsOtherLeg wrote:I have wondered about the possible consequences for the visiting fans of whichever team happens to put SA out of the competition. It could be any team at this stage, and it's going to happen sooner rather than later, unfortunately.
Nah it'll be OK. We were basically cheering for the team to get through the group stages, we won't take it too badly. And we're already out, it was Uruguay what done it, and I predict conspiracy! Between Uruguay and Mexico to draw their game for both to advance.

JackRiddler wrote:Is it safe to say that France is doomed?
I think so. I think we'll beat France. Sorry for the French fans, this is a bit of an embarrassment but it was Ireland's place in the finals anyway. Weird selection to start with, leaving out Benzema, Nasri et Ben Arfa? Silly. And Domenech seems to bring out the worst in his players. I hope tomorrow's game is a thrashing.

Last night's game was fun, my team lost but Brazil deserved it, they looked better than last week and basically scored every time the defence slipped up. I couldn't watch Cameroon either, pity about that but that's sport. Ghana the only African team still in it but their hopes depend on a strong-looking Serbia not winning. Another momentous upset with NZ drawing against Italy. The Italians tend to go through in extra time and on penalties anyway, they're seldom very imposing. I'm wondering whether to watch Portugal just now.
User avatar
stefano
 
Posts: 2672
Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:50 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby AhabsOtherLeg » Mon Jun 21, 2010 7:11 am

stefano wrote:Nah it'll be OK. We were basically cheering for the team to get through the group stages, we won't take it too badly. And we're already out, it was Uruguay what done it, and I predict conspiracy! Between Uruguay and Mexico to draw their game for both to advance.


Ah. Sad to hear you's are out now, but glad to hear it'll be okay. I'm not really following the whole thing now, and have no clue about football generally, but we've all got a fiver riding on Uruguay for the win anyways, so nothing can really go wrong there even if there is some Mexico-Uruguay perfidy. Perfidy, I say!

Even if they fix it between themselves, it'll all be for a good cause. :D

stefano wrote:I'm wondering whether to watch Portugal just now.


You should. We got a fiver on them as well.

Portugal's currently 25/1

Uruguay is 33/1

Ivory Coast is 66/1

These are the current odds for the overall win.

(33? 66? Stephen, did you use the Golden Mean to pick these teams? 'Cos the Lord might frown on that or summat, as he sometimes does. I reckon it should be alright though.)

Classic vids, Vanlose, btw. Thanks for them. I am showing them to my brother now. :lol:
"The universe is 40 billion light years across and every inch of it would kill you if you went there. That is the position of the universe with regard to human life."
User avatar
AhabsOtherLeg
 
Posts: 3285
Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2007 8:43 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby Stephen Morgan » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:21 am

JackRiddler wrote:Is it safe to say that France is doomed?


If Anelka waits a couple of day he won't need to book a seperate flight from the rest fo the squad, now Domenech has chucked him out.

AhabsOtherLeg wrote:But it must be hard, as a team, to have your own fans boo you off the park. I don't understand a fanbase who would do that. Criticism is fine, and necessary at this point, but it seems churlish to pay a fortune to follow your team as they traverse the globe just so that you can turn nasty on them in the full view of the world after they perform less than spectacularly a few times. The sudden vocal denigration of the team also becomes a (perhaps comforting) self-fulfilling prophecy.


Deserved booing. You pay your dues, you get to boos.

They'll fail if their fans desire it, and some of them do, for some reason.


We remain, English.

stefano wrote:And we're already out, it was Uruguay what done it, and I predict conspiracy! Between Uruguay and Mexico to draw their game for both to advance.


Reasonable expectation.

JackRiddler wrote:Last night's game was fun, my team lost but Brazil deserved it, they looked better than last week and basically scored every time the defence slipped up. I couldn't watch Cameroon either, pity about that but that's sport. Ghana the only African team still in it but their hopes depend on a strong-looking Serbia not winning. Another momentous upset with NZ drawing against Italy. The Italians tend to go through in extra time and on penalties anyway, they're seldom very imposing. I'm wondering whether to watch Portugal just now.


Yeah, Brazil were good. Bit too much respect shown to them, as usual when they play Africans. These foreigners reverance Brazil. Second goal was dodgy though, double hand ball by that cheeky bugger Fabiano.

Watching Portugal thrash Korea now. 4-0 at present. Not looking good for the Ivorians. Technically only Cameroon are out of the African teams. Algeria can go through if they win and England don't, or if England win and Algeria better Slovenia on goal difference. Nigeria can go through if they beat South Korea and Argentina beat Greece, but only if their goal difference beats both Korea and Greece. South Africa can go through if they beat France and the other match isn't a draw, although it would take a heavy shift in goal difference. Cameroon are out. Ivory Coast can go through if they beat North Korea and Brazil beat Portugal, but would also require a heavy shift in goal difference. Ghana will go through if they draw with or beat Klose-less Germany or if they lose and Serbia lose to Australia as long as the two results don't add up to a goal difference shift of five or more in favour of Australia.
Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that all was vanity; but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dream with open eyes, and make it possible. -- Lawrence of Arabia
User avatar
Stephen Morgan
 
Posts: 3736
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 6:37 am
Location: England
Blog: View Blog (9)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby Stephen Morgan » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:28 am

AhabsOtherLeg wrote:(33? 66? Stephen, did you use the Golden Mean to pick these teams? 'Cos the Lord might frown on that or summat, as he sometimes does. I reckon it should be alright though.)


The goldie what? That's just how bookies work, lad. 100/30. 9/2. 1/3. Evens.

All being replaced now thanks to the government. 7/2 is going to be 3.5 from now on. Ought to be set in mathematical terms. 7 to 1 would be .125, not 7.
Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that all was vanity; but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dream with open eyes, and make it possible. -- Lawrence of Arabia
User avatar
Stephen Morgan
 
Posts: 3736
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 6:37 am
Location: England
Blog: View Blog (9)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby American Dream » Mon Jun 21, 2010 11:51 am

http://www.counterpunch.org/browne06212010.html

June 21, 2010

World Cup 2010

Anti-Imperialism 101

By HARRY BROWNE



That bastion of British liberalism and prince of online newspapers, the Guardian, adopted a familiar tone of sniggering bemusement as it reported last Friday:

“When football players seek inspiration they normally opt for a round of golf. Not the Algerians, though. Ahead of their big match with England tonight, the north Africans have made a trip to the cinema to watch a screening of The Battle of Algiers.”

Imagine, footballers going to see a serious film, especially one that is, the paper reports, “gritty, troubling” and “over two hours long”. The article proceeds to quote a player to the effect that the film was “moving” and, indeed, that “it was moving to spend the time together”. However, the Guardian sniffily concludes that “Gillo Pontecorvo’s 1966 classic” is hardly the sort of film to encourage a winning mentality, noting: “the movie’s history as an educational tool is a chequered one. It was also the subject of an infamous screening for Pentagon staff shortly after the invasion of Iraq in 2003.”

After a display of such post-imperial density, it appears that someone in the Guardian needs to sit in on a history class, perhaps ‘Anti-Imperialism 101’ -- the sort of course where The Battle of Algiers has been screened for the last 40 years. While it is true that the film does not flinch from atrocities committed in the name of the Algerian independence struggle, it is widely revered as a document and as a source of inspiration for capturing the passions and tactics of a guerrilla insurgency -- which is why, obviously, the Pentagon reckoned it was worth a look. Based on a revolutionary memoir by Saadi Yacef and banned in France on its release, it is a film whose sympathies and message anyone outside the Guardian understands.

Go figure why you, as Algerian soccer underdogs, might go to see such a film before playing against, say, England (with whom they drew 0-0 Friday) and the United States (whom they will play this Wednesday).

Just to underline the point, soccer was in fact specifically important in the Algerian independence struggle. When the FLN set up its government in exile in Tunis, it also established a national football team. Two players from the highly rated French national squad, Rachid Mekloufi and Mustapha Zitouni, slipped out of France not long before they were going to attend the 1958 World Cup to switch their allegiance to the new Algerian set-up -- a team that played exhibition games in Arab and communist countries and became famous for their dashing attacking play.

In this last respect, anyway, the current Algerian team doesn’t measure up. Although they played some nice, composed passing football against dismal England on Friday, the Algerians completely ignored the bit of the game that involves attempting to score goals. This fact may be sufficient to allow some American leftists to neglect their anti-imperialist duties and proceed to chant “USA! USA! USA!” on Wednesday. That is a matter for each fan’s conscience. What is certain is that the Algerian team management -- dealing with a group of young men drawn overwhelmingly from urban France, whose very visages speak of poverty more clearly than any other set of faces in this World Cup -- believes that the players can be inspired by their anti-imperialist heritage.

Whether it because of such inspiration or because of the awfulness of their qualifying group, Algeria now stand as one of the likeliest of all the African teams to advance from their group, though their chances aren’t very good. This World Cup has moved inexorably closer to the “disaster” for African football that I mentioned last Thursday. In a previous article I offered some generic reasons for African football’s failure to offer some inspiration against the game’s traditional power axis; in this tournament the African teams have failed even against teams from weaker regions, and to the generic reasons already discussed we can add some specific failings.

For one, that Algerian indifference to scoring goals is endemic. African teams have managed only six goals in 12 games. This is something of a carry-over from the African pre-tournament qualifying, where even the top teams rarely scored more than twice a game; only Ivory Coast had an impressive goal-scoring record before getting to the World Cup. Far from African football being, as the stereotype suggests, beautiful but unrigorous, it is -- largely under foreign management -- perhaps the grimmest, most cautious in the world.

Ghana, whose two goals at the World Cup have both come from penalties, are the only African team to have won a game in South Africa. Their hard work and organization will get them through if they can hold Germany to a draw this week, but their failure to really threaten a mediocre Australian team who were down to 10 men does not augur well. The sort of political point-scoring that often blights African football was highlighted when the Ghanaian president, John Evans Atta Mills, arrived at the team’s training camp last week to promise that all the squad would get per-diem payments for the duration of the tournament. And they’ve caught some of the French disease of dissension too, with top player Sulley Muntari griping about his substitute role: it appears his continuing participation is on a knife-edge.

At least Ghana’s on-field discipline has been good, which is more than you can say for Nigeria -- whose World Cup was essentially ended by a moment of touchline madness from Sani Kaita, needlessly shoving and kicking an opponent. Or for Ivory Coast, who lost all residual claims on our support with a couple of potentially leg-breaking tackles against Brazil, followed by Kader Keita’s play-acting to get Brazil’s Kaká sent off. (The rotten officiating that allowed a Brazilian goal despite a double handball is no excuse.) South Africa and Cameroon deserve at least some sympathy, having been undone by nothing more than some bad luck and their own ineptitude.

Even an African referee couldn’t do right, with Koman Coulibaly from Mali managing to conjure up some American passion about soccer when, in his first-ever World Cup finals game, he called a phantom foul against the USA in the build-up to a would-be winning goal against Slovenia.

The chaos in the French camp -- where players rebelled after Nicholas Anelka was sent home -- and the aborted rebellion among England players -- the poor boys are apparently fed up and bored both on and off the field -- show that you don’t have to be African to be miserable at this World Cup, though it helps. These failures among the old imperial powers at least made for a good few days in Ireland, where the sun made one of its rare appearances, and teams from the ‘global South’ playing in green jerseys embarrassed both our ancient political enemy, England, and our new footballing enemy, France.

No, you don’t need to give us any lessons about anti-imperialism.


Harry Browne lectures in the School of Media at Dublin Institute of Technology and is author of CounterPunch’s Hammered by the Irish. Contact harry.browne@gmail.com
American Dream
 
Posts: 19946
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2007 4:56 pm
Location: Planet Earth
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby JackRiddler » Mon Jun 21, 2010 3:26 pm

Morgan, your post of 8:21 am quotes me as saying something about Brazil and "my team" that I didn't write. Please correct if you see this in time.

---

Astoria, Queens, a neighborhood of at least 30 nations, is the place to be for the World Cup. Who needs a census of ethnicities when you can judge the size of each people's representation in the area from the relative volume of the cheering and car-honking at the end of a game?

Since their last win the Brazilians are out in force, the flags and t-shirts are everywhere. (Damn, pretty ladies! If I may say so...)

Today in front of the Ecuadoran center there was a news crew filming a crowd of about thirty, one side of which was made-up in the Spanish colors, the other side in Honduran blues. The Mexicans are very loud and the Italians are surprisingly audible from where I type, whenever either of their teams scores.

The huge goal run-up by Portugal made a moderate noise earlier today. I think the Brazilians and Portuguese are basically one community around here, until Friday's head to head match, which will be loud. (What Portugal did today was what I was expecting in the NK games: superpowers abusing them for goal differential. What a bunch of showboaters.)

Aha! There goes a Category 2 cheer for the Spanish goal! And what a goal that was, Villa sliding down to intercept the ball and launch a rocket off his toes and just off the tips of the goalkeepers' fingers.

Immigrant Africa is under-represented and nowadays the Koreans are all in Bayside, but there are plenty big populations from the Middle East and South Asia around here. They've little for which to cheer, although maybe I'll hear some tomorrow if Algeria outscores USA. I just read above that they watched The Battle of Algiers as a spiritual preparation. If USA wins, maybe we'll finally hear the extent of its fandom; however most of that cheering may actually be for Estados Unidos, which is a very popular team around here when they're not playing Mexico.

During Euro 2008 I saw a couple of drunk English fans, but hereabouts they are outnumbered by the Irish, who, along with the Italians and the now-extinct Germans, were the indigenous people of Astoria prior to the invasions of the Greek colonists in the 60s to 80s, and then everyone else in the last 20 years. The Irish are now almost only ever seen in their reservations, of which there is one serving Guinness every three or four blocks. The one across the street - Doyle's, you gotta love that - features karaoke along with the pool table, which has got to be some kind of end-times signal.

The big Red Croatian contingent you usually see aren't around, for obvious reasons. They don't seem to gather and cheer for Serbia. But I'll be in Little Athens on 30th Avenue tomorrow at 2:30 EDT, in the unlikely hope that there will be big rowdy Greek street parties by the end of the game against Argentina, who have got to be the Cup favorites at this early point. Their contingent isn't audible so far, but I expect it to multiply with front-runners by tomorrow night.
We meet at the borders of our being, we dream something of each others reality. - Harvey of R.I.

To Justice my maker from on high did incline:
I am by virtue of its might divine,
The highest Wisdom and the first Love.

TopSecret WallSt. Iraq & more
User avatar
JackRiddler
 
Posts: 16007
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:59 pm
Location: New York City
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby JackRiddler » Mon Jun 21, 2010 4:17 pm

Today, funniest example of a New York Times dog-bites-man headline:

When a Soccer Star Falls, It May Be Great Acting

Really?! I hear the ball is round.
We meet at the borders of our being, we dream something of each others reality. - Harvey of R.I.

To Justice my maker from on high did incline:
I am by virtue of its might divine,
The highest Wisdom and the first Love.

TopSecret WallSt. Iraq & more
User avatar
JackRiddler
 
Posts: 16007
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:59 pm
Location: New York City
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby Belligerent Savant » Mon Jun 21, 2010 6:27 pm

.

Ah, just caught this thread...

Being that my parents are from Italy and Argentina, I have early memories of prior World Cups in '82 and '86, with rooting interests in both teams, though after the sub-par/lame performance and disgraceful over-acting on the part of the Italians against the Kiwis [good for New Zealand for securing the tie], I'm leaning more towards Los Argentinos this year -- they're considerably more exciting to watch anyway [And Italy won in 2006, so..]

I'd like to see the U.S. make it to the next round, as the lads seemed to have worked hard to earn it, and got shafted in the final minutes against Slovenia...

I think someone has already pointed out the mediocre play of the Euros thus far, compared to the South Americans -- Chile, Brasil, Argentina, Uruguay, Paraguay are all performing well, whereas only Portugal and Spain have shown potential from the Euro teams [Although Serbia and even those tenacious Greeks have shown some promise, though I fear the Argentines may be too much for them tomorrow..]

And yes: Astoria is indeed the place to be for viewing the World Cup matches: plenty of Greeks, Latins of all stripes, Italians, etc... the bars tend to be swelled with various fans from across the globe, making for quite the eclectic/festive atmosphere...
User avatar
Belligerent Savant
 
Posts: 5596
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:58 pm
Location: North Atlantic.
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby JackRiddler » Tue Jun 22, 2010 12:37 pm

South Africa beats France but out on goal differential. That's really too bad. Uruguay & Mexico advance.

Ghana's the last African team with realistic shot (draw against Germany would do it, and probably oust the superpower). Alternatively, if Brazil wins against Portugal, Cote d'Ivoire could try to score enough goals against NK to overcome the current goal differential of 9. So if it's BRA 2-0 POR, Cote d'Ivoire would be going for 8-0 against NK.
We meet at the borders of our being, we dream something of each others reality. - Harvey of R.I.

To Justice my maker from on high did incline:
I am by virtue of its might divine,
The highest Wisdom and the first Love.

TopSecret WallSt. Iraq & more
User avatar
JackRiddler
 
Posts: 16007
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:59 pm
Location: New York City
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby Belligerent Savant » Tue Jun 22, 2010 1:27 pm

.

JackRiddler wrote:Alternatively, if Brazil wins against Portugal, Cote d'Ivoire could try to score enough goals against NK to overcome the current goal differential of 9. So if it's BRA 2-0 POR, Cote d'Ivoire would be going for 8-0 against NK.


I applaud you for presenting such a scenario with matter-of-fact coolness, JR

If the Ivory Coast somehow manages such a feat, I'd gladly eat my hat.. and my shorts, for that matter.

Then again, it has been a rather unpredictable WC thus far, so one never knows.
Last edited by Belligerent Savant on Wed Jun 23, 2010 9:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Belligerent Savant
 
Posts: 5596
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:58 pm
Location: North Atlantic.
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby Stephen Morgan » Tue Jun 22, 2010 2:27 pm

JackRiddler wrote:Morgan, your post of 8:21 am quotes me as saying something about Brazil and "my team" that I didn't write. Please correct if you see this in time.


Sorry, was too late. Never mind.

Immigrant Africa is under-represented and nowadays the Koreans are all in Bayside, but there are plenty big populations from the Middle East and South Asia around here. They've little for which to cheer, although maybe I'll hear some tomorrow if Algeria outscores USA. I just read above that they watched The Battle of Algiers as a spiritual preparation. If USA wins, maybe we'll finally hear the extent of its fandom; however most of that cheering may actually be for Estados Unidos, which is a very popular team around here when they're not playing Mexico.


The Arabs have done very badly. Strange, Egypt are champions of Africa, Iraq are champions of Asia, neither qualified for thr world cup.

JackRiddler wrote:Ghana's the last African team with realistic shot (draw against Germany would do it, and probably oust the superpower). Alternatively, if Brazil wins against Portugal, Cote d'Ivoire could try to score enough goals against NK to overcome the current goal differential of 9. So if it's BRA 2-0 POR, Cote d'Ivoire would be going for 8-0 against NK.


Seven nil would do it. On goals scored, in the event of a two nil Brazilian victory.

Belligerent Savant wrote:.I think someone has already pointed out the mediocre play of the Euros thus far, compared to the South Americans -- Chile, Brasil, Argentina, Uruguay, Paraguay are all performing well, whereas only Portugal and Spain have shown potential from the Euro teams [Although Serbia and even those tenacious Greeks have shown some promise, though I fear the Argentines may be too much for them tomorrow..]


Germany have shown some potential, I think. The Dutch, while not playing well, have quickly ensured progression by winning both of their games. The Greeks may be throughly humiliated.
Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that all was vanity; but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dream with open eyes, and make it possible. -- Lawrence of Arabia
User avatar
Stephen Morgan
 
Posts: 3736
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 6:37 am
Location: England
Blog: View Blog (9)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby Belligerent Savant » Tue Jun 22, 2010 3:10 pm

Stephen Morgan wrote:
Belligerent Savant wrote:.I think someone has already pointed out the mediocre play of the Euros thus far, compared to the South Americans -- Chile, Brasil, Argentina, Uruguay, Paraguay are all performing well, whereas only Portugal and Spain have shown potential from the Euro teams [Although Serbia and even those tenacious Greeks have shown some promise, though I fear the Argentines may be too much for them tomorrow..]


Germany have shown some potential, I think. The Dutch, while not playing well, have quickly ensured progression by winning both of their games. The Greeks may be throughly humiliated.


Agreed with the Germans and Dutch. The Greeks may yet squeak by if current score holds.
As I type, S.Korea just equalized with Nigeria.
Last edited by Belligerent Savant on Wed Jun 23, 2010 9:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Belligerent Savant
 
Posts: 5596
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:58 pm
Location: North Atlantic.
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby JackRiddler » Tue Jun 22, 2010 7:31 pm

Stephen Morgan wrote:.I think someone has already pointed out the mediocre play of the Euros thus far, compared to the South Americans -- Chile, Brasil, Argentina, Uruguay, Paraguay are all performing well, whereas only Portugal and Spain have shown potential from the Euro teams [Although Serbia and even those tenacious Greeks have shown some promise, though I fear the Argentines may be too much for them tomorrow..]


Belligerent Savant wrote:Germany have shown some potential, I think. The Dutch, while not playing well, have quickly ensured progression by winning both of their games. The Greeks may be throughly humiliated.


No humiliation, they kept it scoreless for 77 minutes (with a single thrilling opportunity) against an Argentine side that was near-unbeatable. Other than the Samaras miss, the biggest cheers in the bar were for the Nigerian goals. After the first Argentine goal, they trotted out their fancy pass moves and Greece barely touched the ball again (after managing just 1/3 ball possession until then). I don't know why the Greeks didn't go all-out offensively from the start. That might have meant losing by 3 or 4, but scoring first was their only chance.

Messi has these moments where he's just a monster.
We meet at the borders of our being, we dream something of each others reality. - Harvey of R.I.

To Justice my maker from on high did incline:
I am by virtue of its might divine,
The highest Wisdom and the first Love.

TopSecret WallSt. Iraq & more
User avatar
JackRiddler
 
Posts: 16007
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:59 pm
Location: New York City
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby Belligerent Savant » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:53 pm

.

It seems you misquoted me above, JRiddler -- that was not me who crafted those words.

The Greeks certainly played stout defense in the first half [albeit with the Argentines resting a couple of their starters], but defense alone would not have won the game for them...eventually, they needed to get aggressive and take some chances, but they never quite got around to it, with a couple of exceptions.

Some of these gameplans against Argentina seem much like those undertaken by Mike Tyson's opponents, back in his prime: they seem intimidated by the formidable Argentine aggressive offense and opt to play up the defense, hoping to sneak in a counterpunch and hopefully, a shocking upset.

In order to take the beast down, Argentina's looming opponents will need to employ the Buster Douglas gameplan: approach your opponent head on, without fear, and give 'em all you got -- don't allow intimidation to get in the way.

That being said, Argentina still haven't faced a 'top shelf' team, and when they do, their allegedly vulnerable defense will be tested. A team like Brasil, for example, has a staunch defense but also a still-potent offense, which would match up quite well against my paisanos.

We shall see how she plays out.
Last edited by Belligerent Savant on Wed Jun 23, 2010 9:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Belligerent Savant
 
Posts: 5596
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:58 pm
Location: North Atlantic.
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Football World Cup

Postby barracuda » Tue Jun 22, 2010 11:49 pm

You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
The most dangerous traps are the ones you set for yourself. - Phillip Marlowe
User avatar
barracuda
 
Posts: 12890
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 5:58 pm
Location: Niles, California
Blog: View Blog (0)

PreviousNext

Return to The Lounge & Member News

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests