Fuck Obama

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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby Elihu » Wed Aug 03, 2011 9:37 am

The thing is, people who should be watching KO's show don't. They just don't care...at least not yet. Not enough to get into the streets together and demand a change

But what should he have said? What should anyone have said that you would have liked better?

And I wouldn't exactly call Current TV mainstream media...


excellent points. apologies. i was really hasty in that post. i still want to make the case for my conclusion but by different means and will have to try later.

At that moment, the debate of what the dems/repubs will or will not do (or what they even think) becomes irrelevant.

dingdingdingding! this is where we've got to get to. neither of them is on our side. they work for somebody else. IMO, statements of protest should be aimed at the causes of the problem. else they miss the target, and serve the ends of the perps...
But take heart, because I have overcome the world.” John 16:33
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby freemason9 » Wed Aug 03, 2011 9:23 pm

hey, i just thought of something

what if everybody here is wrong, just like everybody in the tea party is wrong
The real issue is that there is extremely low likelihood that the speculations of the untrained, on a topic almost pathologically riddled by dynamic considerations and feedback effects, will offer anything new.
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby Simulist » Wed Aug 03, 2011 9:46 pm

freemason9 wrote:hey, i just thought of something

what if everybody here is wrong, just like everybody in the tea party is wrong

Precisely what point could "everybody here" be that wrong about?

Please inform us all.
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby Laodicean » Wed Aug 03, 2011 11:01 pm

Simulist wrote:
freemason9 wrote:hey, i just thought of something

what if everybody here is wrong, just like everybody in the tea party is wrong

Precisely what point could "everybody here" be that wrong about?

Please inform us all.


He can't. He would be wrong too since everybody else is.
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby Bruce Dazzling » Wed Aug 03, 2011 11:14 pm

freemason9 wrote:hey, i just thought of something

what if everybody here is wrong, just like everybody in the tea party is wrong


You haven't come full circle, have you freemason9?

freemason9 wrote:Fuck Obama?!?!? WTF?? Well, fuck YOU!! You folks need to relax. I posted a perfect response to a similar group of negative nellies earlier, in a different thread; it was such a perfect response, though, I thought I might just share it again:

I steadfastly remain supportive of Obama, and the reason is that I recognize a certain brilliance of competent management.

I read somewhere that most conspiracy advocates have never actually managed an organization or business; this is because only experienced managers understand just how difficult complex conspiracies would be to execute. And this is intensely true. Live the life of an organizational manager, and you will understand it. People are not so easily manipulated to the extent of predictable details and responses.

Any conspiracy that involves more than three core members will come undone, and it will be renamed a scandal, because individual tensions, competitions, and personality conflicts (not to mention independent affiliations beyond the group) will erode cohesion. Someone will say something to someone else. Someone will engage in passive aggressive behavior to undermine a competitor.

That's reality.

This economy . . . it's sad, that's all. It's coming apart, and there was no other way it could have ended. It was flawed from the beginning, with so many people earning incomes based upon little if any real production.

And the largest incomes were based upon the least production. This was all inevitable.

Obama is constrained, and you know the truth of it. He can't be as radical as you wish, because (1) most of the country would not support him, (2) he would lose Congress, (3) there are no clear alternatives to his strategy, (4) real, lasting change is incremental, and finally (5) the right wing would easily glide back into power as he is politically destroyed.

I'm just being truthful here. Sure, folks are conspiring to make money, but that isn't the same as a wide conspiracy to enslave us all and make a one-world government where people dress like Spock. Mostly, people are on their own, and they're doing their own things.

I love conspiracy theories, but I don't much believe in them. They read like novels, though, and they can be hard to put down.
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby 8bitagent » Thu Aug 04, 2011 2:03 am

Perhaps images of some of the countless dead Muslim villager children Obama has killed would be suffice to snap someone out of their blind allegiance to Hopemunculus.
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Aug 04, 2011 4:22 am

2012 Slogan

Barack: Better than Breivik
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby freemason9 » Thu Aug 04, 2011 11:26 pm

Bruce Dazzling wrote:
freemason9 wrote:hey, i just thought of something

what if everybody here is wrong, just like everybody in the tea party is wrong


You haven't come full circle, have you freemason9?

freemason9 wrote:Fuck Obama?!?!? WTF?? Well, fuck YOU!! You folks need to relax. I posted a perfect response to a similar group of negative nellies earlier, in a different thread; it was such a perfect response, though, I thought I might just share it again:

I steadfastly remain supportive of Obama, and the reason is that I recognize a certain brilliance of competent management.

I read somewhere that most conspiracy advocates have never actually managed an organization or business; this is because only experienced managers understand just how difficult complex conspiracies would be to execute. And this is intensely true. Live the life of an organizational manager, and you will understand it. People are not so easily manipulated to the extent of predictable details and responses.

Any conspiracy that involves more than three core members will come undone, and it will be renamed a scandal, because individual tensions, competitions, and personality conflicts (not to mention independent affiliations beyond the group) will erode cohesion. Someone will say something to someone else. Someone will engage in passive aggressive behavior to undermine a competitor.

That's reality.

This economy . . . it's sad, that's all. It's coming apart, and there was no other way it could have ended. It was flawed from the beginning, with so many people earning incomes based upon little if any real production.

And the largest incomes were based upon the least production. This was all inevitable.

Obama is constrained, and you know the truth of it. He can't be as radical as you wish, because (1) most of the country would not support him, (2) he would lose Congress, (3) there are no clear alternatives to his strategy, (4) real, lasting change is incremental, and finally (5) the right wing would easily glide back into power as he is politically destroyed.

I'm just being truthful here. Sure, folks are conspiring to make money, but that isn't the same as a wide conspiracy to enslave us all and make a one-world government where people dress like Spock. Mostly, people are on their own, and they're doing their own things.

I love conspiracy theories, but I don't much believe in them. They read like novels, though, and they can be hard to put down.
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Maybe I was right after all. Wouldn't that be the damnedest thing? Really, though, I don't think that "right" or "wrong" carries much water these days. Hell, politics in the U.S. has become a spectator sport of outrage and virulence; it's a talk radio theater of World Wrestling Federation proportion, with Mad Dog in one corner and Verne Gagne in the next. You think Michelle Bachmann is nuts? Hell, she thinks you're nuts. She thinks you're a goddam communist. And if you are outnumbered 2 to 1, what makes you so fucking certain you are right? I mean, Nixon was certain about his righteousness too, right? Was Nixon right? I have no fucking idea.

I'm not very clear about who makes these earthly rules anymore, and I've given up trying to interpret them.

And it turns out that I make a terrible, terrible partisan; I'm always catching a glimpse of another point of view, and that glimpse of clarity muddles my own vision. But a democracy doesn't infer that the tyranny of the majority is proper and appropriate; I believe that a social democracy should, instead, strive to find a balance (albeit an uneasy one at times) that 90% of the population can live with. The other 10% will simply forever remain the other 10%. The world is an imperfect dream.
The real issue is that there is extremely low likelihood that the speculations of the untrained, on a topic almost pathologically riddled by dynamic considerations and feedback effects, will offer anything new.
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby RobinDaHood » Fri Aug 05, 2011 12:40 am

Fuck Obama! And fuck the rest of em too!:D
Obama & the Fake Debt Ceiling Crisis: This President Is Really Just Smarter Than You Are
http://www.blackagendareport.com/obama-fake-debt-ceiling-crisis_smarter-than-you
So why won't the president call Republican and bankster bluffs and shut down the phony debt ceiling crisis? Why won't the Republicans take yes-may-I -have-another-tax-cut-for-the-rich for an answer? And why won't president Obama stand up and fight for the poor and working people who voted for him in their tens of millions, who have made his career possible.

Obama & the Fake Debt Ceiling Crisis: This President Is Really Just Smarter Than You Are

by BAR managing editor Bruce A. Dixon

It's taken a long while, but I'm finally coming around. I'm about ready to admit the truth. Supporters of the president have long insisted that The Man simply knows things most of us don't. After all, he's the president. He's got access to the facts, the figures. He's looking further, they say, seeing deeper, playing sixth dimensional chess while most of us can barely get our minds around checkers. You know, they just might be right. If there's one thing this phony debt ceiling crisis proves, it's that Barack Obama really is smarter than most of us, especiall smarter than the tens of millions who voted him into office.

Before we examine that any deeper, we'll need a working definition of “smartness.” Let's make it simple. We'll call it the ability to get things done your way in a complex world, a world where lots of other people would rather see them done some other way. By that yardstick, who is smarter? The voters and volunteers who made Obama's career possible? Or Barack Obama himself? Who's getting what he wants, and who's getting left out?

For useful answers, we need look no further than the current trumped up crisis over the federal debt ceiling. Debt ceilings have been raised scores of times in recent years, 14 times under the Bush-Cheney administration alone. This time is an emergency only because Wall Street banksters, corporate media and the good cops of the Democratic party along with the bad cops of the Republican party agree to say it is. The government and the economy then, will run out of money unless Medicare, Medicaid and social security are savagely cut so that “job creating” speculators and banksters can receive another round of tax cuts.

Obama supporters whine and wring their hands in impotent fury, pointedly threatening a loss of enthusiasm for his 2012 re-election campaign. But their good cop president and his party leaders are all about pre-emptive compromise, meeting the bad cop Republicans half, three quarters or nine-tenths of the way to a goal that moves further rightward every hour. The president's unwillingness to stand with the Democratic party's electoral base, the nation's poor and working people, is for many Obama supporters utterly inexplicable.

But what if President Barack Obama never intended to fight for jobs or justice? What if he believes the nonsense about Wall Street being “job creators” instead of economic vampires? What if Cornel West finally got it right? What if Black Agenda Report has been right all along? What if Barack Obama is a Reagan Democrat in every meaningful way, right down to a fanatical belief in trickle down economics? What if the president counts on corporate media and his army of careerists and sycophants to shut down and cover up cracks in the Obama consensus through which reality might leak? What if Obama is not weak, or timid, or vacillating or waiting for us to “make him do it”? What if what we've seen is all there is, all there ever was?

The truth is that Barack Obama's actions are entirely rational, understandable and even predictable if you suppose him to have been a vicious, vacuous and cynical right wing operative from the very beginning.

The historic pattern of post-sixties Democratic candidates has been to come in on the high tide of public disgust at Republican rule, but to push the pro-corporate agenda further than would be allowable under Republicans.

Jimmy Carter followed the disastrous administrations of Nixon and Ford. Nixon killed at least a million or two in Vietnam and Cambodia, committed numerous crimes and after narrowly escaping impeachment was pardoned by President Gerald Ford who like Barack Obama, preferred to look ahead rather than at crimes past. Carter declared Middle Eastern oil a vital US interest worth going to war over, signing secret treaties beginning the building of US super-bases, so-called “military cities” which were eventually used in the first Gulf War.

Bill Clinton was swept into office in 1992 after twelve years of Reagan and Bush misrule. Like Carter before him and Obama after, he rolled up criminal investigations of Reagan-Bush figures including Robert Gates, who would be Secretary of Defense under Bush 2 and Barack Obama. Clinton squashed the peace dividend and rounded up enough Democratic votes to go along with a solid Republican vote that passed NAFTA, which failed to make it through the Congress three times under Bush 1. Bill Clinton virtually ended public assistance programs in the US, privatizing and tying them to low-wage work and workfare schemes instead, another accomplishment that Republicans would have found impossible. The Clinton-Gore White House even launched what was called the “Reinventing Government” initiative, under which every state, county and city in the nation was required to put as many of its core functions, from building maintenance to fleet management to payroll to elections out to be bid upon by private contractors.

All of these achievements of the Carter and Clinton-Gore administrations were major victories for corporate power that could not have been accomplished under Republicans without massive protest and dislocation. They say that only Nixon could go to China. Only Democrats can double down on and enact Republican policies by disarming and disbanding opposition to those policies. When Clinton bombed Serbia, there was no antiwar movement in the street to oppose him. Would the same have been true of Reagan, Bush 1 or Bush 2?

Still don't believe it's the job of corporate Democrats to push the corporate agenda further than Republicans ever could? When Bush 2 couldn't even pass his own bankster bailout in September of 2008, he called Barack Obama in off the campaign trail to round up a sufficient number of Democratic votes, including votes in the Congressional Black Caucus, to pass the Bush bailout. Before even assuming office, Barack Obama was carrying out Republican policies even Republicans could not enact. Upon becoming president himself, Barack Obama quintupled down on the $3 trillion Bush bankster bailout with a further $16 trillion, the largest transfer of public wealth to private hands in the history of humankind.

So if you're an Obama supporter, and you're disappointed that your president won't fight for you --- if you're an Obama supporter and you wonder why the president won't stand up for Medicaid, Medicare and social security --- here's the answer. The president really, really is smarter than you. He knows what side he's on and you don't. He knows that the two-party system is a veal pen, where as long as “he can play good cop to the Republicans' ever worsening bad cop, the game is fixed, and not in your favor.

Look out! Over there! It's President Michelle Bachman!
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby ninakat » Fri Aug 05, 2011 3:41 am

8bitagent wrote:Perhaps images of some of the countless dead Muslim villager children Obama has killed would be suffice to snap someone out of their blind allegiance to Hopemunculus.


Now that's just too logical. Besides, those photos are just photoshopped propaganda from all those anti-war (anti-American) terists.

RobinDaHood, thanks for that. Black Agenda Report remains a favorite site for rational analysis.
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby Simulist » Fri Aug 05, 2011 3:02 pm

freemason9 wrote:Maybe I was right after all.

Doubtful. I mean, didn't you once say something about Obama being the best president Americans have had in the past thirty years?

(Unless by "best" you meant "cunningly manipulative"; in that case, you might have been onto something.)

freemason9 wrote:Wouldn't that be the damnedest thing?

Yeah. Just like if the law of gravity were "repealed" for a day.

freemason9 wrote:You think Michelle Bachmann is nuts? Hell, she thinks you're nuts. She thinks you're a goddam communist.

Wrong again. Michele Bachmann doesn't "think" — she just says stuff without thinking. A whole lot of it.

freemason9 wrote:And if you are outnumbered 2 to 1, what makes you so fucking certain you are right?

Being right shouldn't be confused with being in the majority — sometimes that's just being common.

Being right has to do with perceiving what's real, even when you don't want to see it.
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby Belligerent Savant » Fri Aug 05, 2011 8:43 pm

.

Don't know what the fuss is all about.

'Bama is doing what we should all expect him to be doing. Any anger towards the 'Bama would only make sense if we expected OTHERWISE.

And surely, no one here truly believed a "nationally elected" figurehead would be doing anything DIFFERENT, right?

Shoosh.. the 'Bama abides..

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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby freemason9 » Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:19 pm

But it's a damned funny thing when you think about it. I mean, all you white folks are sitting around bitching because the black fellow didn't save your asses. He let you down.

How thoughtless of him . . .

ahem
The real issue is that there is extremely low likelihood that the speculations of the untrained, on a topic almost pathologically riddled by dynamic considerations and feedback effects, will offer anything new.
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby 8bitagent » Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:21 pm

freemason9 wrote:But it's a damned funny thing when you think about it. I mean, all you white folks are sitting around bitching because the black fellow didn't save your asses. He let you down.

How thoughtless of him . . .

ahem



I look at it from a different angle. I ask, how are minorities or the poor any better WITH Obama? He may have served his Chicago community back when, but he serves the wallstreet/warpowers/corporations now.

Something is not right when ACORN gets defunded for helping black people with low income housing, but pedo-narco-terrorist private military contractors keep getting no bid contracts.
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Re: Fuck Obama

Postby Bruce Dazzling » Mon Aug 08, 2011 10:08 am

freemason9 wrote:But it's a damned funny thing when you think about it. I mean, all you white folks are sitting around bitching because the black fellow didn't save your asses. He let you down.

How thoughtless of him . . .

ahem


No, all of us critically thinking human beings are bitching because humanity has been sold out to the highest bidder yet again.

Period.

It just so happens that the seller this time around is, as you said, a "black fellow," but I assure you that I want to punch him in the face no more or less than Cheney, Perle, Bush, Rumsfeld, Bush, Ashcroft, Wolfowitz, Geithner, Summers, or any number of other assholes who have sold out humanity to the highest bidder.

In fact, if Obama and Cheney were in front of me right now, instead of choosing only one to punch, I'd clunk their fucking heads together like Moe.
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