John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby compared2what? » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:28 am

Hugh Manatee Wins wrote:
barracuda wrote:Pilger seems to believe there were hijackers, Hugh, and as far as I can tell has made no public statements in favor of a controlled demolition hypothesis. So since he doesn't seem to share your personal opinion, I suppose you'd have to lump him in with the war criminals promoting irrelevancy.


Pilger has not come up to full speed from LIHOP to MIHOP.

BUT. He has never ever promoted W.O.O. like 'aliens from outer space' or 'synchronicity' or 'universe winking' or 'magic teapot' or 'just a hologram'-type nonsense.

He also doesn't suggest that every viewpoint is mere "personal opinion" with no objective facts.


I don't see the "mere" or "with no objective facts" parts of that suggestion in the post to which you're imputing them, myself.

And some things are a matter of opinion with no objective facts, anyway, there's nothing necessarily wrong with it. I don't agree with John Pilger's personal interpretation of The Deerhunter, for example. Although I certainly don't dispute the foundational objective facts on which he bases it (ie -- the non-existence of torture by Russian Roulette in Vietnam), and don't have any particular problem with the general notion that he's entitled to his opinion, as I am to mine. And as you are to yours, whether they're subjective or objective.

There is such a thing as honest disagreement, is my point. And also for a world with some shades of gray, it doesn't all have to be black and white.

So why harsh on a thread for not exemplifying a case that you shouldn't really need it in order to make, given that you'd already made it conclusively to your own satisfaction before there even was such a thread?

It's just off-topic. And unnecessarily so.
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby AlicetheKurious » Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:24 am

JackRiddler wrote:But yeah I'd count post-9/11 as the fourth world war; US-UK leading a crusade against the outliers from global corporatocracy, and mounting a desperate, presumably final effort to maintain the Anglo-American empire and keep territorial control of the resource base.


"Empire" is a fancy word for armed robbery committed by one nation against others. That's the main reason states try to become empires: so they can get rich by taking what's not theirs. England became a fabulously wealthy country through the theft of foreign resources for its industries, which were in turn sold as finished products to the captive markets of its imperial subjects. Similarly, although America was a wealthy country to begin with, when it became an empire it became spectacularly rich, beyond anything the world had ever witnessed before or since.

What we're seeing now is very different. It's empire-building, alright, but those who are reaping the rewards are neither Britain nor America, both of which are on a steep decline economically, politically, socially, even militarily, in terms of their ability to deal with any actual threats to their national security. As each country's wealth and power are drained away in tar-baby wars that have no rational purpose, their politicians seem to be prepared to expand the losses in even greater and more catastrophically costly wars that also have no rational purpose, at least for either Britain or the U.S.

That both countries happen to host an extremely powerful and corrupting zionist "lobby" is not a coincidence; that those politicians who have been most instrumental in leading their countries to war just happen to owe their political and financial success to this zionist lobby is also not a coincidence. Neither is it a coincidence that both countries' current and projected war agenda perfectly dovetails with specific and longstanding zionist goals. Nor that, although both countries are sustaining serious economic and political damage as a consequence of these politicians' duplicity, they enjoy a teflon-like immunity from being held accountable; on the contrary, they continue to be richly rewarded even after leaving office, in contrast to the nations they've betrayed, whose people will continue to pay with their lives and their wealth for generations to come.

Given these realities, it makes no sense at all to assume that the UK and the US decisions were motivated by an effort "to maintain the Anglo-American empire and keep territorial control of the resource base", when the facts show that on the contrary, they had "territorial control of the resource base" which their actions have gravely and needlessly eroded. The disastrous results for both countries were entirely predictable at the time those choices were made. Like those who talked about the legality and morality of the invasions, genuine experts who tried to warn the American and British public that Afghanistan had defeated every empire since Alexander the Great, and that invading Iraq would be far from a "cakewalk" were shut out in favor of "experts" who faithfully stuck to the Israeli talking-points. Even without the benefit of hindsight, it was clear even back then, that the only ones who showed evidence of "desperation" in the push for these stupid and ruinous wars in the face of massive popular opposition and even from their own countries' intelligence agencies, just happen to be the same politicians who are most subservient to 'advisors' and financial benefactors whose primary allegiance is to a foreign state: the same foreign state for whom, contrary to the UK and the US, such wars represented vital strategic objectives on the way to achieving "a clean break" from its dependence on other empires in preparation for its final emergence as a global empire in its own right.

If any doubt remains, all we have to do is to watch the shameful spectacle of America's leaders groveling, obsequiously praising and declaring undying allegiance to a foreign state, even as they take more money from their own people and lavish it on Israel, a "client state" whose leaders can barely contain their contempt as they demand to be further placated with an even crazier attack on Iran, which by any objective assessment will finish off what's left of the American empire that was built up in the last two centuries, and perhaps even America as we know it.

It must take a prodigious effort of will to avoid seeing what they no longer even bother to hide. Bravo.
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby nathan28 » Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:49 am

Alice, your tired suggestion that the US's actions are entirely, completely predicated on the desires of "zionists" ignores the possibility that there might be people in the United States and elsewhere who are not "zionist" who have allied interests. Unless, by "zionist," you mean anyone who at any given moment 'supports' Israel or has shared interests with it in any way, which at the moment would include anti-Semite oilmen who want to open pipelines across Central Asia who happen to see Israel as useful in that endeavor--not to mention the entire human race, when you consider things like melting ice caps. If we weren't mostly talking about white people w/r/t the Anglo-Israel marriage, I'd call that contention racist. The simple fact that there is "groveling, obsequious[] praising" from the wealthier, better-armed party to their own cat's paw indicates as much: the cat's paw, in fact, belongs to another cat--it just happens to be your friend at the moment, but a testy one. I suspect that analogous arguments could be made about South Korea--after all, just look at the outsized influence of Rev. Moon, right?

Occult Means Hidden wrote:Why bring up W.O.O. condemnations when "woo" wasn't even brought up in this thread?


As usual, though, this, in an unholy alliance with HMWs own monomania--"Pilger is valid because he never talked about UFOs!!!"--is going to derail discussion. Or, discussion has already been derailed. So I'll see everyone in the car with the booze on it.

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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby Jeff » Fri Mar 26, 2010 10:06 am

nathan28 wrote:As usual, though, this, in an unholy alliance with HMWs own monomania--"Pilger is valid because he never talked about UFOs!!!"--is going to derail discussion.


I've sent Hugh a warning re the disruption of this thread, and I hope that's the last we'll hear of it.

Just doing my bit to get you useful engines back on track.

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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby Cedars of Overburden » Fri Mar 26, 2010 10:13 am

The Roman Empire never ended, the imperial virus just changed hosts. I think that if I looked more carefully into history I could see even more patterns among even more peoples, but it all would be the history of the imperial virus changing hosts through time and space. The world war is eternal because the empire is eternal, except -- under different names and banners --there are those lunatics among us who keep trying for the kingdom of heaven instead.

As a very white very western civ very Jesus freak kind of person, I want the virus run out of my people. But I don't want it fleeing into any other group of people.

Anyone up for an exorcism?
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby RocketMan » Fri Mar 26, 2010 10:32 am

HMW seems to be having a serious-to-alarming WOO breakdown. He's unable to contain his rage on the matter, regardless of the actual subject!
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby Luposapien » Fri Mar 26, 2010 10:41 am

<despair>So what the hell do we do? I'm not interested in playing this game any more. Pointing fingers at whichever "other" happens to be more successfully manipulating the stones on the board at the moment. It's never been anything more or less than base-level mammalian posturing and fearful territoriality. The back-brain urge to kill, fuck, eat or otherwise control everything we come into contact with. The problem isn't Zionists, or Nazis, or Americans; it's humans.

Don't get me wrong, some of my very best friends are human. In fact, there's a few that I'd be willing to watch the world burn to protect. And I'm uncomfortable aware that this is part of the problem.
</despair>

I'm trying really hard not to believe quite a bit of the above, but it's difficult not to when I see how much animosity get's thrown around between those who, for the most part, share a common dream for a more just an equitable world. There's too much argument about where we are, and not enough discussion of how to get where we'd like to be.

It's been dawning on me lately that the depression that dogs me has less to do with my dissatisfaction with the wicked ways of the world, and more to do with my dissatisfaction with myself over my failure to act in ways that are consistent with my intuition and perceptions.
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby Searcher08 » Fri Mar 26, 2010 2:23 pm

Hugh Manatee Wins wrote:deleted...senseless rationalism on a UFO board....


Ironic coming from someone who doesn't know one end of a double-blind trial from another.

I am really struck by how little an audience there seems to be for Pilger - from people in the U.K. - Lady Gaga doesn't seem to have landed any anti-war messages amongst her memes. :(
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby JackRiddler » Fri Mar 26, 2010 3:27 pm

compared2what? wrote:
JackRiddler wrote:It may be a trivial point of categorization, but the wars of imperialism, or of the originally European great powers against the rest of the world and amongst themselves, have been global and continuous throughout the last five centuries (and the five thousand years that preceded them weren't peaceful either). The Pax Britannica is a misnomer, the only thing remarkable about it was the relative infrequency of major interstate land wars in Europe itself, but as we know the formula for what constitutes History is supposed to be that Europe + Anglosphere = The World. The 19th C. was a time when they were busy assaulting everywhere else and fearful of revolutions at home. The Cold War is also a misnomer, as it was hot in every year, with tens of millions dead, just again not between states in Europe proper. I'd even call that a nuclear war, with hundreds of thousands of casualties, but waged by the superpowers in controlled fashion on their own territories (and those of their dependencies) in an effort to terrify each other and out of terror of what would happen if they acutally launched into the enemy's territory. But yeah I'd count post-9/11 as the fourth world war; US-UK leading a crusade against the outliers from global corporatocracy, and mounting a desperate, presumably final effort to maintain the Anglo-American empire and keep territorial control of the resource base.


Right on. But for practical purposes, I propose considering the wars we're formally fighting now (plus the Balkan conflicts in the '90s; plus all wars in the near and middle east subsequent to 1918) as direct continuations of WWI. Because that's what they are. They just went quiet for a while.

And another right on to smiths, if he was endorsing the WWI/WWII-as-a-single-conflict-with-an-intermission historical perspective. Because that's true, too.

In neither case is it the only truth. But it's still a truth worth taking the time to contemplate, imo. Because pick 'em from any place or any time, wars never ever really end, once they start. They settle down for a while, then they come right back same as they were before, except escalated, usually. Infinitely.

I guess that every now and again, an entire civilization dies out and its wars get such extreme cosmetic makeovers that it's difficult to recognize them as their former selves. But they're still the same wars. And that doesn't happen very often anyway.

Otherwise, I hold the above to be a universal truth and am now wide open to challenges to it that I won't be able to meet.


Okay, let's cut a deal then. Since the European "discoveries" (which were discoveries, to Europeans) the rising and falling "Great Powers" have been engaged in what we shall henceforth call the Magellanic Wars for Global Control. The first stage, of primary conquest and accumulation by European naval power applied to all of the world's coastal areas, got mixed up with a set of sectarian religious civil wars in Europe until, oh, 1648 or so. After that it was primarily interstate and Machiavellian, until the triple-revolutionary period (Industrial, American and French) turned it into a new secular/class civil war in Europe (climax 1815, major outbreaks for a century after that). Then a (relative) European interstate interregnum during the 19th C. imperial consolidation wars outside Europe (ON EDIT: which included some of history's worst genocides) conducted under various cynical-playful names like the "Great Game," "Scramble for Africa" and the "Monroe Doctrine." Then, as you describe it, the end of the consolidation and maturity of industrialism brought on the Modern World War that's been going for 96 years, which has included or influenced any number of civil wars and wars of national liberation, and which by my count breaks up in the standard history into at least six stages (14, 18, 33, 45, 89, '01), each with different main coalitions arrayed against each other. Okay? What's that, four stages since 1500? So we're in MWGC IV, which will be 100 years come August 2014.

Naming things is one way to deal with the unbearable. Or perhaps merely divert from.
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby JackRiddler » Fri Mar 26, 2010 3:29 pm

Luposapien wrote:It's been dawning on me lately that the depression that dogs me has less to do with my dissatisfaction with the wicked ways of the world, and more to do with my dissatisfaction with myself over my failure to act in ways that are consistent with my intuition and perceptions.


Honestly, I don't know how any more. Watch more TV?
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby Nordic » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:22 pm

Luposapien wrote:It's been dawning on me lately that the depression that dogs me has less to do with my dissatisfaction with the wicked ways of the world, and more to do with my dissatisfaction with myself over my failure to act in ways that are consistent with my intuition and perceptions.


Ah yes. That lovely monkey on the back called "helplessness".

Accept it. That's my advice.

Once I had this notion, a thought, "what if you were an idealistic Roman in the waning, corrupt days of Rome? What if you were a citizen of average wealth and power, and you could see where things were headed. What could you have possibly done to reverse what happened?"

In hindsight, it seems like there's no way anyone could have changed history. 99.9999% of people have absolutely no power over what course history takes.

So maybe it's better just to observe, stay alert, and hang on. If you see an opportunity to avoid the shipwreck, take it.
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby Luposapien » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:39 pm

JackRiddler wrote:Honestly, I don't know how any more. Watch more TV?


Nordic wrote:Ah yes. That lovely monkey on the back called "helplessness".

Accept it. That's my advice.

Once I had this notion, a thought, "what if you were an idealistic Roman in the waning, corrupt days of Rome? What if you were a citizen of average wealth and power, and you could see where things were headed. What could you have possibly done to reverse what happened?"

In hindsight, it seems like there's no way anyone could have changed history. 99.9999% of people have absolutely no power over what course history takes.

So maybe it's better just to observe, stay alert, and hang on. If you see an opportunity to avoid the shipwreck, take it.


I see where yall are coming from (believe me, do I ever), but I think what I'm trying to get at is the freedom that comes from accepting that you're not in control. All the shit that we put ourselves through, and compromises we make, in order to remain "in the game", when in reality, it's the game that's playing us.

Oh, and sorry if this takes things off the rails even further. I suppose this would fit better in the "How do we stop these morons?" thread.
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice W.O.O., folks

Postby Hugh Manatee Wins » Sat Mar 27, 2010 12:49 am

I originally intended to show how John Pilger's essay here pointed at precisely the danger of fascism being enabled by W.O.O., a case I've been trying to make for a few years here at RI.

But I decided this would only lead to admin. banning me so after a few minutes of reconsidering getting into this seemingly futile subject, I deleted my initial post in frustration.

But a 'moderator,' barracuda, grabbed at my post before I deleted it and made ad hominem comments followed by an interrogative about my views of John Pilger...which I responded to. Yes, I responded to a moderator's inquiries. Mea Culpa.

Sure enough, I've been threatened by Jeff with suspension for "disruption." So much for moderator accountability.

To keep the thread on the op, Pilger's essay, here are the points he makes that I assert are totally about psyops and therefore also about spook W.O.O.>>

John Pilger 25 Mar 2010 wrote:
......
According to an American general, the invasion and occupation of Afghanistan is not so much a real war as a “war of perception”. Thus, the recent “liberation of the city of Marja” from the Taliban’s “command and control structure” was pure Hollywood. Marja is not a city; there was no Taliban command and control. The heroic liberators killed the usual civilians, poorest of the poor. Otherwise, it was fake. A war of perception is meant to provide fake news for the folks back home, to make a failed colonial adventure seem worthwhile and patriotic, as if The Hurt Locker were real and parades of flag-wrapped coffins through the Wiltshire town of Wooten Basset were not a cynical propaganda exercise.

“War is fun”, the helmets in Vietnam used to say with bleakest irony, meaning that if a war is revealed as having no purpose other than to justify voracious power in the cause of lucrative fanaticisms such as the weapons industry, the danger of truth beckons. This danger can be illustrated by the liberal perception of Tony Blair in 1997 as one “who wants to create a world [where] ideology has surrendered entirely to values” (Hugo Young, the Guardian) compared with today’s public reckoning of a liar and war criminal.

Western war-states such as the US and Britain are not threatened by the Taliban or any other introverted tribesmen in faraway places, but by the anti-war instincts of their own citizens. Consider the draconian sentences handed down in London to scores of young people who protested Israel’s assault on Gaza in January last year. Following demonstrations in which paramilitary police “kettled” (corralled) thousands, first-offenders have received two and a half years in prison for minor offences that would not normally carry custodial sentences. On both sides of the Atlantic, serious dissent exposing illegal war has become a serious crime.

Silence in other high places allows this moral travesty. Across the arts, literature, journalism and the law, liberal elites, having hurried away from the debris of Blair and now Obama, continue to fudge their indifference to the barbarism and aims of western state crimes by promoting retrospectively the evils of their convenient demons, like Saddam Hussein. With Harold Pinter gone, try compiling a list of famous writers, artists and advocates whose principles are not consumed by the “market” or neutered by their celebrity. Who among them have spoken out about the holocaust in Iraq during almost 20 years of lethal blockade and assault? And all of it has been deliberate. On 22 January 1991, the US Defence Intelligence Agency predicted in impressive detail how a blockade would systematically destroy Iraq’s clean water system and lead to “increased incidences, if not epidemics of disease”. So the US set about eliminating clean water for the Iraqi population: one of the causes, noted Unicef, of the deaths of half a million Iraqi infants under the age of five. But this extremism apparently has no name.

Norman Mailer once said he believed the United States, in its endless pursuit of war and domination, had entered a “pre-fascist era”. Mailer seemed tentative, as if trying to warn about something even he could not quite define. “Fascism” is not right, for it invokes lazy historical precedents, conjuring yet again the iconography of German and Italian repression. On the other hand, American authoritarianism, as the cultural critic Henry Giroux pointed out recently, is “more nuance, less theatrical, more cunning, less concerned with repressive modes of control than with manipulative modes of consent.”

This is Americanism, the only predatory ideology to deny that it is an ideology. The rise of tentacular corporations that are dictatorships in their own right and of a military that is now a state with the state, set behind the façade of the best democracy 35,000 Washington lobbyists can buy, and a popular culture programmed to divert and stultify, is without precedent. More nuanced perhaps, but the results are both unambiguous and familiar. Denis Halliday and Hans von Sponeck, the senior United Nations officials in Iraq during the American and British-led blockade, are in no doubt they witnessed genocide. They saw no gas chambers. Insidious, undeclared, even presented wittily as enlightenment on the march, the Third World War and its genocide proceeded, human being by human being.

In the coming election campaign in Britain, the candidates will refer to this war only to laud “our boys”. The candidates are almost identical political mummies shrouded in the Union Jack and the Stars and Stripes. As Blair demonstrated a mite too eagerly, the British elite loves America because America allows it to barrack and bomb the natives and call itself a “partner”. We should interrupt their fun.

http://www.johnpilger.com/page.asp?partid=570


"...a popular culture designed to divert and stultify...WE SHOULD INTERRUPT THEIR FUN."

This is precisely the position regarding spook-generated amoral onanistic W.O.O. that I share with John Pilger.
But "interrupting their fun" can get you banned from RI.

I hope this makes sense to you Jeff.
Because I think you agree with Pilger's essay here. Don't you?
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice world war, folks

Postby AhabsOtherLeg » Sat Mar 27, 2010 1:41 am

I'm reading "Tell Me No Lies" right now, Pilger's compilation of seriously unpopular, and unpopulist, investigative journalism, by various authors, from the Hiroshima bomb up to nowadays - taking in the Falklands, the British miner's strike, and many other wars that were portrayed in the mass media as bloodless victories for the righteous over the poor and venal.

It is ace. And it shows how much we've lost - how far journalism as a profession has degenerated, and how happy most journalists are nowadays with their vastly reduced role. If the recent Wikileaks scare is to be believed, it takes online activists and archivists to expose the murder of journalists by the military - the other journalists must either be too busy filing their copy, or just too scared to mention it.

We can be sure they will have heard of any murders of journalists. We have.

But as C2W said, quoting Janet Malcolm, in the latest Fatal Vision thread:

"Every journalist who is not too stupid or too full of himself to notice what is going on knows that what he does is morally indefensible. He is a kind of confidence man, preying on people's vanity, ignorance or loneliness, gaining their trust and betraying them without remorse. Like the credulous widow who wakes up one day to find the charming young man and all her savings gone, so the consenting subject of a piece of nonfiction learns—when the article or book appears—his hard lesson. Journalists justify their treachery in various ways according to their temperaments. The more pompous talk about freedom of speech and "the public's right to know"; the least talented talk about Art; the seemliest murmur about earning a living."

All that is undoubtedly true, but I would like to post a small antidote to it, from the introduction by John Pilger to a book that does not feature his own work:

"Printed on the back of this book is a favourite quotation of mine by the American journalist T.D. Allman: "Genuinely objective journalism," he wrote, is journalism that, "not only gets the facts right, it gets the meaning of events right. It is compelling not only today, but stands the test of time. It is validated not only by 'reliable sources' but by the unfolding of history. It is journalism that ten, twenty, fifty years after the fact still holds up a true and intelligent mirror to events."

I'm not entirely sure what I'm doing in this thread, other than to say that John Pilger is one of the good journalists. He has been warning us for decades about what we've been doing - now that he is telling us what we are currently gearing up for, I'm inclined to believe him.
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Re: John Pilger: Have a nice W.O.O., folks

Postby MinM » Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:44 am

@ggreenwald: John Pilger column on how Liberal Hollywood is returning to its roots of producing US Government propaganda

https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/3 ... 1253652480

The new propaganda is liberal. The new slavery is digital
As Leni Riefenstahl said: "Propaganda always wins if you allow it".

By John Pilger Published 14 March 2013
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What is modern propaganda? For many, it is the lies of a totalitarian state. In the 1970s, I met Leni Riefenstahl and asked her about her epic films that glorified the Nazis. Using revolutionary camera and lighting techniques, she produced a documentary form that mesmerised Germans; her Triumph of the Will cast Hitler’s spell.

She told me that the “messages” of her films were dependent not on “orders from above”, but on the “submissive void” of the German public. Did that include the liberal, educated bourgeoisie? “Everyone,” she said.

Today, we prefer to believe that there is no submissive void. “Choice” is ubiquitous. Phones are “platforms” that launch every half-thought. There is Google from outer space if you need it. Caressed like rosary beads, the precious devices are borne headsdown, relentlessly monitored and prioritised. Their dominant theme is the self. Me. My needs. Riefenstahl’s submissive void is today’s digital slavery.

Edward Said described this wired state in Culture and Imperialism as taking imperialism where navies could never reach. It is the ultimate means of social control because it is voluntary, addictive and shrouded in illusions of personal freedom...

Hollywood has returned to its cold war role, led by liberals. Ben Affleck’s Oscar-winning Argo is the first feature film so integrated into the propaganda system that its subliminal warning of Iran’s “threat” is offered as Obama is preparing, yet again, to attack Iran. That Affleck’s “true story” of good-guys-vbad- Muslims is as much a fabrication as Obama’s justification for his war plans is lost in PR-managed plaudits. As the independent critic Andrew O’Hehir points out, Argo is “a propaganda movie in the truest sense, one that claims to be innocent of all ideology”. That is, it debases the art of film-making to reflect an image of the power it serves.

The true story is that, for 34 years, the US foreign policy elite have seethed with revenge for the loss of the shah of Iran, their beloved tyrant, and his CIA-designed state of torture. When Iranian students occupied the US embassy in Tehran in 1979, they found a trove of incriminating documents, which revealed that an Israeli spy network was operating inside the US, stealing top scientific and military secrets. Today, the duplicitous Zionist ally – not Iran – is the one and only nuclear threat in the Middle East.

In 1977, Carl Bernstein, famed for his Watergate reporting, disclosed that more than 400 journalists and executives of mostly liberal US media organisations had worked for the CIA in the past 25 years. They included journalists from the New York Times, Time and the big TV broadcasters. These days, such a formal nefarious workforce is quite unnecessary. In 2010, the New York Times made no secret of its collusion with the White House in censoring the WikiLeaks war logs. The CIA has an “entertainment industry liaison office” that helps producers and directors remake its image from that of a lawless gang that assassinates, overthrows governments and runs drugs. As Obama’s CIA commits multiple murder by drone, Affleck lauds the “clandestine service . . . that is making sacrifices on behalf of Americans every day . . . I want to thank them very much.” The 2010 Oscar-winner Kathryn Bigelow’s Zero Dark Thirty, a torture-apology, was all but licensed by the Pentagon...

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/po ... ry-digital

Hugh Manatee Wins wrote:I originally intended to show how John Pilger's essay here pointed at precisely the danger of fascism being enabled by W.O.O., a case I've been trying to make for a few years here at RI.

But I decided this would only lead to admin. banning me so after a few minutes of reconsidering getting into this seemingly futile subject, I deleted my initial post in frustration...

It's worth noting that in the 3 years since this thread started, Hugh has been banned, and I can't see this...
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