CIA declares Mission Accomplished, Mubarak says not so fast

[lupercal]

Please explain how ditching a civilian government for military dictatorship advances "democracy" or any other benefit to Egyptians. How it benefits BP, Boeing, Wall Street, and the IDF is manifestly clear.

Civilian govt?

Man I thought I was smoking the best gear on the planet, but obviously not.

No less civilian than any other "democracy" I can think of. And what do you call the one they have now?

[slimmouse]

A vital point Lupercal to people who live on $2 a day.

It's a vital point. When $2 buys half of what it does today three months from now, and half of that next year, you'll see why.

In getting rid of Mubarak, it seems to me that Egypt at least has made a start.

A start at what, exactly? Please explain how ditching a civilian government for military dictatorship advances "democracy" or any other benefit to Egyptians. How it benefits BP, Boeing, Wall Street, and the IDF is manifestly clear.

Its buying half of what it did a real short while ago already you schmuck, and its gonna buy them less soon enough regardless, without some seriously cataclysmic alterations in the way things are run on this planet.

Or does your Myopian analysis, neither understand the neccesity of how this change at least feels to the Egyptians, nor the importance of the signal it sends to anyone with more than 2 functioning brain cells ?

[lupercal]

Or does your Myopian analysis, neither understand the neccesity of how this change at least feels to the Egyptians, nor the importance of the signal it sends to anyone with more than 2 functioning brain cells ?

This "change" sends a feel-good "signal" on your telly, period. Some of us have seen this show before, many times, and it never ends well.

p.s. better get a sandwich before the next exciting episode begins somewhere and you can forget all about Egypt and its troubles.

[lupercal]

Its buying half of what it did a real short while ago already you schmuck, and its gonna buy them less soon enough regardless, without some seriously cataclysmic alterations in the way things are run on this planet.

And I would seriously like to know how a military coup is going to do anything but exacerbate Egypt's inflation, unemployment, and the raft of new catastrophes brought on by the last three weeks of fake revolution. You seem to have missed this:

DUBAI, Feb 9 (Reuters) - Political turmoil in Egypt may more than halve the Arab country's economic growth this year, push its budget deficit into double digits and weaken its currency, boosting already high inflation.
. . . . .
Lower private consumption, which accounts for around 70 percent of GDP, a drop in foreign investments and higher unemployment are also expected to hurt economic performance.

Egypt's economy was worth an estimated $217 billion last year, half of oil giant Saudi Arabia, and relies on foreign investments, tourism and Suez Canal fees, but faces challenges such as poverty, high unemployment of at least 10 percent -- but many suggest the real figure is much higher -- and stubborn inflation.

Some analysts warn that the central bank could raise borrowing costs, with the overnight lending rate now at 9.75 percent, to stem capital outflows. Citi estimates outflows of $500 million to $1 billion per day.

http://www.trust.org/alertnet/news/anal ... n-to-rise/

And no, I don't expect an actual answer, because there isn't one. This is a disaster for Egypt and only disaster capitalists and their spook outfits and assets profit from disaster. See Haiti.

[Joe Hillshoist]

Please explain how ditching a civilian government for military dictatorship advances "democracy" or any other benefit to Egyptians. How it benefits BP, Boeing, Wall Street, and the IDF is manifestly clear.

Civilian govt?

Man I thought I was smoking the best gear on the planet, but obviously not.

No less civilian than any other "democracy" I can think of. And what do you call the one they have now?

Tonight is a party nite then its back to the streets tomorrow apparently as only one of the many demands have yet been met. Right now I'd say Egypt has a bunch of jerks who think they are running the country and thousands of people who know they aren't.



Mubarak is a former Military general acting on behalf of the rest of them. For the last 30 years the country has been in a military declared "state of emergency". IE there is no civillian democratic govt, there is no opposition and whenever one emerges it gets shut down. The MB is allowed cos it keeps the west onside.

[justdrew]

I don't really think Egypt is too much of an economic mess, I suspect this period could well lead to a real renaissance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Egypt

[slimmouse]

Its buying half of what it did a real short while ago already you schmuck, and its gonna buy them less soon enough regardless, without some seriously cataclysmic alterations in the way things are run on this planet.

And I would seriously like to know how a military coup is going to do anything but exacerbate Egypt's inflation, unemployment, and the raft of new catastrophes brought on by the last three weeks of fake revolution. You seem to have missed this:

DUBAI, Feb 9 (Reuters) - Political turmoil in Egypt may more than halve the Arab country's economic growth this year, push its budget deficit into double digits and weaken its currency, boosting already high inflation.
. . . . .
Lower private consumption, which accounts for around 70 percent of GDP, a drop in foreign investments and higher unemployment are also expected to hurt economic performance.

Egypt's economy was worth an estimated $217 billion last year, half of oil giant Saudi Arabia, and relies on foreign investments, tourism and Suez Canal fees, but faces challenges such as poverty, high unemployment of at least 10 percent -- but many suggest the real figure is much higher -- and stubborn inflation.

Some analysts warn that the central bank could raise borrowing costs, with the overnight lending rate now at 9.75 percent, to stem capital outflows. Citi estimates outflows of $500 million to $1 billion per day.

http://www.trust.org/alertnet/news/anal ... n-to-rise/

And no, I don't expect an actual answer, because there isn't one. This is a disaster for Egypt and only disaster capitalists and their spook outfits and assets profit from disaster. See Haiti.

There is an answer Lupercal. Ive actually written it. You just dont see it.

Egypts econonomy for the working man is going to fold into disaster ?

WTF are you on about ?

I guess when you got 15 dollars a week to live on, youre gonna be shouting Spook spook spook at every opportunity as your grasp of what is fair and just on this earth is governed by your own conception of imprisonment. Am I right , or are you not getting where Im coming from ?

May the force be with the Egyptians. For all its limitations, mine certainly is.

Not to mention the Cambodians, or the Somalis, or the Indonesians, or any of the other victims of the great Ayryan world wide fuck up.

[Kate]

They have certainly demonstrated a willingness to directly participate in removing their government. They should have no problem at all in directly participating in their future self-governance.

They have a golden opportunity to show the rest of the world what direct democracy can look like.

Amen, 23, amen.

I had to laugh out loud when that evil weasel Sillyman said that Egypt wasn't "ready" for democracy, because Egyptians didn't have "a culture of democracy."

OK, so let's say wherever he was he didn't have any windows looking out on Midan Tahrir, or even on other Cairo streets. But FFS, couldn't he look at his (surely expensive) TV screen at Aljezeera (and you know those authoritarian creeps watched, too, their much-hated "sedition-inducing foreign satellite networks").

The way the protesters organized their own committees, providing for their own security in the face of thugs, coordinating every provision for the long haul, feverishly finding new ways to communicate with the outside world despite censorship, formulating their assertive list of reasonable demands, supporting the mourning families of the dead, helping the wounded, inspiring union strikes, etc. etc. sure as hell looked like a "culture of democracy" to me!

They proved how serious and committed and cooperative and dignified they were through their peaceful actions on the public squares throughout Egypt. Any idiot pundit who asked, "are Arabs ready for democracy?" in the face of the evidence was being wilfully blind.

[lupercal]

There is an answer Lupercal. Ive actually written it. You just dont see it.

Egypts econonomy for the working man is going to fold into disaster ?

WTF are you on about ?

I guess when you got 15 dollars a week to live on, youre gonna be shouting Spook spook spook at every opportunity as your grasp of what is fair and just on this earth is governed by your own conception of imprisonment. Am I right , or are you not getting where Im coming from ?

May the force be with the Egyptians. For all its limitations, mine certainly is.

Sorry slim, "May the force be with the Egyptians" is not an actual answer, it's a slogan from a Hollywood space opera. The actual answer is you don't have an actual answer but you think you do because you've been hoodwinked yet again by propagandists like George Lucas who are good at what they do. And no, privatization and IMF loans won't do jack shit for the "working man" or anyone else but a few filthy rich banksters in London and Wall Street. Quite the contrary. The world is littered with economies ruined by banksters and their fake revolutions but you won't hear that on your telly.

Not to mention the Cambodians, or the Somalis, or the Indonesians, or any of the other victims of the great Ayryan world wide fuck up.

Funny you should mention Indonesia.. more on that in a few.

[Joe Hillshoist]

Lupercal what yopu say more closely mirrors the MSM than anything else wrt to Egypt that I've read here. Just saying cos its one of the reasons I find it hard to take your idea about this uprising seriously.

[lupercal]

Lupercal what yopu say more closely mirrors the MSM than anything else wrt to Egypt that I've read here. Just saying cos its one of the reasons I find it hard to take your idea about this uprising seriously.

Prove it.

[wordspeak2]

"I'd suggest that the Egyptians solicit the assistance of the Swiss in adding certain aspects of direct democracy to their future representational democracy system. I.e. initiative, referendum (plebiscite), and recall.
They have a golden opportunity to show the rest of the world what direct democracy can look like."

Yeah, in your delusional anarchist pipe dream. In reality the real powers-that-be will find a new, more fitting, person to do the job and appease the Twitter crowd. The western media is gloating about all this. I just read the entirety of "The Economist's" coverage of it- everyone should read it. This is a good thing, they say, the west should embrace it, the west has looked bad by prioritizing "stability" over "democracy," and now is our change to change all that. It's a Facebook-facelift regime change, clear as fucking day. Looks like George Soros' fingerprints on it, too, hardly unusual. If you want to see what the capitalists are thinking read their publications. It's been nothing but hoots and hollers on this one.

Meanwhile, interestingly, it's very likely not good for Israel. That's what they're all saying, at least, especially in Israel. Israel may lose its only regional ally.
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld ... ?track=rss

Things in the Middle East may be on the verge of getting a lot muddier than they already are. Don't think intelligence agencies aren't playing their little chess games. It was already a perilous situation in the Middle East, with Israel poised to strike Iran at any point, and this will most certainly make it worse, as a "friendlier fascist" face is installed.

[wordspeak2]

A revolution led by a Google executive, btw. This is some 2011 postmodernism. This is what you all are ecstatic about. It's pretty surreal.

[lupercal]

Lupercal what yopu say more closely mirrors the MSM than anything else wrt to Egypt that I've read here. Just saying cos its one of the reasons I find it hard to take your idea about this uprising seriously.

Let's see:

AL JAZEERA ENGLISH (AJE) - Triumph as Mubarak quits http://english.aljazeera.net//news/midd ... 05699.html

MSNBC - 'Egypt is free,' crowds cheer after Mubarak quits; 'Egyptians have inspired us,' Obama says http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41526422/ns ... tn_africa/

NYT - Egypt Erupts in Jubilation as Mubarak Steps Down http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/12/world ... ss&emc=rss

FOX - Egyptians Cheer End of Mubarak Era http://www.foxnews.com/world/2011/02/11 ... rak-steps/

Looks like you're the putz singing Murdoch's tune, Joe. As usual.

[wolf ticket]

Saying that the Egyptian revolution is being orchestrated by the CIA or PTB or whomever is ridiculous and insulting to the courageous people of Egypt. Murbarak was our boy—why would the PTB want him ousted? Of course, the Egyptian revolution has a strong likelihood of going the way of the French or Iranian revolutions, but that doesn't change the fact that a real change was made possible by real people power.