I am not rabidly organic tho, we have a garden at work that isn't exactly organic, but the stuff in it looks great. (Picked the first zucchinis off it today, so I'll find out what they are like soon enough.)
But organic dope always tasted better than other stuff.
populistindependent wrote:
Good point. Something of a paradox there. Perhaps we can make this distinction - is the self-improvement for the ultimate purpose of contributing to and living in a cooperative community for the benefit of many, or merely to enhance an atomized and isolated individual at the expense of others who then become "losers?"
Thats why Stanford reasearch institute's "changing images of man" report is so interesting.
Never in history has a 'religious movement" existed in isolation for individuals growth and benefit, cept now. Its not just New age tho. I get the sense that evangeist "wealth means God is rewarding you, and is good" Christianoty, a la Hillsong Church in sydney.
I don't think feminism is a bad thing tho, getting back to your first post. It may have effects similar to those you talked about, but ...
I know there are numerous cases of males who belt women, it isn't a class thing btw, it happens in every socio economic group. But until the rise of feminism and women getting the opportunity to work, many women were powerless to escape a relationship where the man abused his power, and his wife. I don't think economic power for wom,en is a bad thing. Far from it.
but if it becomes a men v women battle instead of a battle between those with everything and those with not that much, then it certainly serves a ruling class agenda.
Feminism outside the west, or in indigenous communities in the US and Australia is a very different thing from the "liberal" feminism you describe.
In Australia the crisis in male identity you were talking about is really effecting indigenous communities. As a result there are huge problems with alchohol violence and sexual abuse. But in those communities it is the women that are doing the most effective work, especially as I said ealier, older women. Tho younger women are just behind in experience on that scale. While I know many aboriginal men who are doing great stuff as well, the percentage isn't the same between the 2 gender groups.
Personally I don't see being a breadwinner as part of my gender role.
Sometimes I am the primary breadwinner sometimes my wife is. It doesn't matter which is which, but in the old mull growing days I used to do all the risky stuff myself. That brought in a litltle cash, but I guess the risk taking was the role I saw for myself (Bio pointed that out on another thread, how it fits aussie male gender stereotyping, hes probably right about that).
But I do play contact football, australian rules, and am a long standing member of a local bush fire brigade, and both those things seem to fit with male gender roles more than actually earnbing a living. I also coach juniors, and that seems to fit as well. (Plenty of females in the bush fire brigade btw, a few I happily take orders off too cos i trust them to know what they are doing and all that, only a few males in that position too; and in junior football, too so there is nothing in that gender role thing that is inherent in the actual roles. I just do what I like and what feels right.)
I think tho that one of the reasons I agree with the premise of this thread is actually violence.
I have had really violent periods in my younger days, and can still dish it out, well I'd hope so, its been a while. But it took me a while to learn that controlling my inherent violence was actually the most effective way of being a "real man". And I don't kno that many men who have come to that place. It seems many either revel in it or run from it.
However most of the women I can think of have the violence thing under more control. I mean real nasty violence by that, not pseudo violence, and stupid comments about pms. they aren't all liberalised feminists either.
Then again i know a bloke in the phillipines who is leader of a 350, 000 strong tribe. His people are subject to all sorts of capitalist violence and he is one of the most peaceful men i have ever met.
So perhaps its a question of maturity and intelligence, not gender.
