Hillary Clinton is Seriously Dangerous

[JackRiddler]

Just to return some focus, here was the post on which our resident defenders of Trump went insane with extreme insults against me, of which I've returned little more than a fraction (which is then quoted over and over as if I started the exchange).

Also they have no interest in repairing any rift. Their power exists only because of the rifts. The LAST thing they want is for the citizens of this country to suddenly get along and unite. It would literally be extremely dangerous for them.

Yay! At last, united around an explicitly racist agenda.

I wish people understood that. The disdain and scorn people in most of my universe rain down upon Trump supporters is the nastiest, most condescending, elitist shit you can imagine. It's no different from racism, but without the race aspect. The Trump supporters I know actually don't fit the model of the banjo-twanging rabid redneck retards that the Snooty Dems think they are.

The only redneck banjo player I know personally (and very well) correctly thinks Trump is a racist beast. That is because he understands English, including the debased English used by Donald Trump, which is quite explicit and clear to everyone except his apologists when they happen to traffic with people who do not like him. It's like that. Most people who play instruments well also have a bit of those curious qualities known as empathy and the ability to understand communications, which, in regard to Trump, you clearly lack, no matter how clearly he tells you what he is about.

This is perhaps the most embarrassing and ridiculous statement you have ever made on this board. White man, man who has always been identified as White or as "just a guy" by strangers when he walks down the street, man who has no clue, it is so sad and disheartening that anyone needs to explain this to you. And I know also how pointless it is of me to do so. But let's do it, for the record:

Two years ago, Trump supporters were not Trump supporters. There wasn't a single one, because there was no Trump campaign. No one was ever born a Trump supporter. "Trump supporters" were not born with exterior characteristics that identified them as members of this group to the society in which they grew up, from infancy forward. They were not subjected to systemic and socially approved prejudice on the basis of exterior characteristics, unless of course they happened to be born black or something comparable, in which case they were, but not because in some future they would make the CHOICE to be Trump supporters. No one ever knows someone is a Trump supporter if they do not identify themselves as such. They never have to fear automatic attention and possible violence from the police on the basis of their exterior characteristics, before even doing anything or opening their mouths. They were never offered higher interest rates on a loan, or denied for one, on the basis of their exterior characteristics.

Trump supporters were never owned as chattel slaves, murdered in lynchings as a regular festival event, had their leaders targeted for assassination, or had their churches burned, all because they happened to be born with certain exterior characteristics, and independently of their other qualities, opinions, beliefs, actions or affiliations. Other than that and about a thousand other things, hey, thinking Trump supporters are stupid based on the things they actually say they believe, voluntarily, is just like racism. Something of which you obviously know nothing, which is inexcusable.

The first person I can remember from my youth who made a statement that prejudice against men with moronic opinions and moronic voluntary associations (with groups that engage in systematic mob violence) was "no different than racism" was, for the record, a skinhead. He was trying to defend the brutal beating of a friend of mine by his fellow skinheads the day before. (He may have been among them.) That's your associate here. I often think you can do better than this, but no more. The KKK that just endorsed Trump, that's your associate now. Own it, or show some fucking minimum of class and acknowledge the awesome horribleness of what you just said, and maybe actually think and revise before you post your racist trash here.

.

[seemslikeadream]

To be a Trump supporter is either to be oh so very ignorant of reality

or to believe and want a Right Wing Fascist Coup d'état to take place

Because that is EXACTLY what is happening

Rogue elements of the FBI are interfering in this election .....this is Fascism

Played out by Mercer/Bannon/Breitbart/Giuliani/rogue FBI/Military/Kallstrom/Schweitzer....

USING Trump ....these people are not republicans...these people are real honest to goodness Fascists

Trump wasn't picked so Clinton would win...Trump was picked so he would win..so Fascists would win ...this is the truth ...it has been proven here over and over and over again

This election is not about Dems and Repubs.....this election is about eliminating Fascists from our government not electing one as President of the Untied States


This election is not about electing Clinton ...this election is about defeating Fascism

Nobody really wants Clinton....but she is no Fascist

That has to take priority over everything else

Once Fascists are in power ...good luck with that


This board was created as anti-fascist.....it should stay that way...

Websites pretending to be anything other than what they truly are should have no place here

[seemslikeadream]

FBI

Email review over no new info




well Mr. DotCom?

where's the indictment before the election?

well Fox News

where's the indictment before the election?


FBI: Review of new emails doesn't change conclusion on Clinton
http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/06/politics/ ... nclusions/

[Spiro C. Thiery]

That JackRiddler doesn't know the potential difference between his skinhead and a Trump supporter surprises me. There is overlap to be sure, but there is a major ignorance factor also. There are the willfully ignorant people out there, the ignorant unaware of their latent bigotry, and some people that are just not paying attention enough to even be aware of their ignorance. It's safe to assume that most Trump supporters don't attend rallies and receive their information through a filter of their ignorance assisting choosing. Quite simply, there are people who support this guy from reality TV who are wholly unaware of their kinship with the likes of the KKK. Contrarily, (though hardly), there are ignorant people who think there is nothing fascist already about a country that forces its taxpayers to subsidize the murder of people suspected of crimes, or detaining them indefinitely (changing the name to "extended detention" to make it all better and murdering via remote to "keep the troops out of harm's way"), further subsidize corporate profit via privatized schools & prisons, sending the cops out to protect big business by sicking dogs, shooting rubber bullets, and tasing & pepper spraying protesters, when not outright murdering them. As long as the country that does this has a person at the helm to say inspirational and wholly unracist things, or at worst, a candidate successor who uses double secret dog-whistling like "bringing super predators to heel" -- why, it's just not fascism at all.

[seemslikeadream]

No, Actually, This Is What a Fascist Looks Like
Friday, 18 January 2013 11:07
By The Daily Take Team, The Thom Hartmann Program | Op-Ed

Whole Foods CEO, John Mackey, doesn’t know what a fascist is.

Speaking with NPR this week, multimillionaire Mackey tried to express how much he hates Obamacare. Back in 2009, he hated Obamacare so much that he called it “socialism.” But now, in 2013, Mackey thinks Obamacare is “fascism.”

“Technically speaking, [Obamacare] is more like fascism,” he said. “Socialism is where the government owns the means of production. In fascism, the government doesn’t own the means of production, but they do control it, and that’s what’s happening with our healthcare programs and these reforms.”

Mackey has since walked back this description saying he “regrets using that word now” because there’s “so much baggage attached to it.”

But, whether Mackey meant to or not, it’s about time someone injected the word fascism back into our political debate. Especially now that corporations wield more power today than they have in America since the Robber Baron Era.

First, let’s take on Mackey’s definitions of socialism and fascism, which he likely procured from the Google machine after typing in, “What are the differences between socialism and fascism?”

Yes, socialism encourages more democratic control of the economy. Or, if Mackey insists, more government ownership of the economy – in particular, ownership of the commons and natural resources.

Fascism, on the other hand, is something completely different. Reporter Sy Mukherjee, who blogged about this story over at ThinkProgress.org notes, “Although fascist nations do often control their ‘means of production,’ Mackey seems to have forgotten that they usually utilize warfare, forced mass mobilization of the public, and politically-motivated violence against their own peoples to achieve their ends.”

The 1983 American Heritage Dictionary defined fascism as: "A system of government that exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with belligerent nationalism."
Fascism originated in Italy, and Mussolini claims to have invented the word itself. It was actually his ghostwriter, Giovanni Gentile, who invented it and defined it in the Encyclopedia Italiana in this way: "Fascism should more appropriately be called corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power."

In other words, fascism is corporate government – a Libertarian’s wet dream. It’s a government in which the Atlas’s of industry are given free rein to control the economy, just how they’re regulated, how much they pay in taxes, how much they pay their workers. It should be noted here that, ironically, John Mackey describes himself as a Libertarian.

In 1938, Mussolini finally got his chance to bring fascism to fruition. He dissolved Parliament and replaced it with the "Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni" - the Chamber of the Fascist Corporations. Members of the Chamber were not selected to represent particular regional constituencies, but instead to represent various aspects of Italian industry and trade. They were the corporate leaders of Italy.

Imagine if the House of Representatives was dissolved and replaced by a Council of America’s most powerful CEOs – the Kochs, the Waltons, the Blankfeins, the Dimons, the Mackeys, you get the picture.

Actually, that’s not too difficult to imagine, huh? But, that’d be similar to what Mussolini defined as fascism.

As we know, fascism was eventually defeated in World War 2. But just before the end of the war, with the fascists on the ropes, the Vice President of the United States at the time, Henry Wallace, penned an op-ed for the New York Times warning Americans about the creeping dangers of fascism – or corporate government.

He defined a fascist as, “those who, paying lip service to democracy and the common welfare, in their insatiable greed for money and the power which money gives, do not hesitate surreptitiously to evade the laws designed to safeguard the public from monopolistic extortion.”

Under that definition we can throw those CEOs who’ve decided to evade Obamacare’s mandate to provide health insurance to their employees, like New York City Applebee’s franchise owner Zane Terkel, Papa John’s CEO John Schnatter, and executives at Darden Restaurants.

Or, perhaps, Wallace is referring to the banksters at Goldman Sachs who knowingly evaded laws and sold investors “shitty deals” or scammed entire cities into bankruptcy or illegally foreclosed on thousands of Americans through fraudulently robo-signing all in the name of short term profits and all in the name of preserving their monopolistic, too-big-to-fail status.

Either way, evading laws meant to protect the public in order to pad your own pockets has become the name of the game in Corporate America today.

Wallace goes on to write, “The American fascists are most easily recognized by their deliberate perversion of truth and fact. Their newspapers and propaganda carefully cultivate every fissure of disunity, every crack in the common front against fascism.”

Can anyone say Fox News, or the rest of the Conservative media complex? Or, those on the Right who divide working people and turn them against each other: makers versus takes, public sector workers versus private sector workers, and white people versus brown people.

“They use every opportunity to impugn democracy,” wrote Wallace. Does that sound familiar after months of Republican efforts to disenfranchise large swaths of the electorate with voter suppression ID laws, as well as restrictions on early voting and voter registration in largely Democratic areas?

Or what about what Republicans in Pennsylvania are doing right now to rig the next Presidential election by changing how Electoral votes are counted in the state?

Wallace continues, “They demand free enterprise, but are the spokesmen for monopoly and vested interest. Their final objective toward which all their deceit is directed is to capture political power so that, using the power of the state and the power of the market simultaneously, they may keep the common man in eternal subjection.”

We often hear of free enterprise from the likes of Wall Street, Big Oil, and the defense industry. Yet these are the same corporations that also lobby to keep generous taxpayer subsidies, bailouts, and no-bid contracts in place that allow them to reign supreme over the markets and crush their smaller, more independent competition.

And the common man suffers as a result. Wages as a percentage of GDP are lower than they’ve ever been. Unionization rates are lower than they’ve ever been in more than a half-century. And yet, corporate profits as a percent of GDP are higher than they’ve ever been in American history.

At the time Wallace was writing this op-ed, he was confident that the fascists had been adequately held in check in America by the Roosevelt Administration. As he wrote, “Happily, it can be said that as yet fascism has not captured a predominant place in the outlook of any American section, class or religion.”

But, he went on to warn that in the future, “[Fascism] may be encountered in Wall Street, Main Street or Tobacco Road. Some even suspect that they can detect incipient traces of it along the Potomac.”

Sure enough, the bastions of fascism can be found on Wall Street. Main Street, which used to be lined with local independent businesses, is now lined with predatory, transnational giants. And along the Potomac, we find politicians who are more than happy to do the bidding of their corporate overlords.

Today in America, we are dangerously close to seeing Wallace’s fascistic, dystopic America come into fruition. We see the traces of it everywhere.

Unfortunately, too many Americans just didn’t have a word to define what’s happening. But, thanks to John Mackey, and thanks to the foresight of Vice President Henry Wallace, we do have the right word now: Fascism.
http://www.truth-out.org/opinion/item/1 ... looks-like

[Novem5er]

So are the FBI good guys or bad guys now? I'm not sure which narrative to follow anymore

About Trump supporters being automatically vile, racist people or enablers of such . . . have skinheads and racist rednecks never voted before? I'm assuming that many of them have, so which candidates did they support in past elections? I'm just guessing that every skinhead and racist asshole in America likely voted for Mitt Romney in 2012 and McCain/Palin in 2008. I'm willing to bet that racist voters go all the way back to Dole in 1996. Maybe even further . . .

Maybe racist trolls are a louder presence than they used to be, but also keep in mind that this is the first Twitter Election. Yes, social media was around in 2012 and 2008, but it's exploded exponentially since then. Even the Russians have now figured out how to use the internet!

So what is a die-hard Republican supposed to do now that a vocal minority of racists have tagged along with their Grand Old Party? Is a Pro-Lifer suddenly supposed to vote for a Democrat?! LOL not likely. Is a small business owner who wants less government bureaucracy supposed to suddenly vote Democrat? Unlikely.

As vile as Donald Trump is (and he is vile), the Democratic platform is still unappealing to millions of Americans.

[seemslikeadream]

FBI .....still bad guys with Comey "trying" to cover his ass before the hearings start on his outfit

Democracy is not a spectator sport.....

Is a small business owner who wants less government bureaucracy supposed to suddenly vote Democrat?

That's his problem ...that's the republican party's problem...they created this monster

Pro-Lifer

?

be pro life and stay the fuck out of my life

[Morty]

[coffin_dodger]

That JackRiddler doesn't know the potential difference between his skinhead and a Trump supporter surprises me. There is overlap to be sure, but there is a major ignorance factor also. There are the willfully ignorant people out there, the ignorant unaware of their latent bigotry, and some people that are just not paying attention enough to even be aware of their ignorance. It's safe to assume that most Trump supporters don't attend rallies and receive their information through a filter of their ignorance assisting choosing. Quite simply, there are people who support this guy from reality TV who are wholly unaware of their kinship with the likes of the KKK. Contrarily, (though hardly), there are ignorant people who think there is nothing fascist already about a country that forces its taxpayers to subsidize the murder of people suspected of crimes, or detaining them indefinitely (changing the name to "extended detention" to make it all better and murdering via remote to "keep the troops out of harm's way"), further subsidize corporate profit via privatized schools & prisons, sending the cops out to protect big business by sicking dogs, shooting rubber bullets, and tasing & pepper spraying protesters, when not outright murdering them. As long as the country that does this has a person at the helm to say inspirational and wholly unracist things, or at worst, a candidate successor who uses double secret dog-whistling like "bringing super predators to heel" -- why, it's just not fascism at all.

Refreshing to hear a little sanity, occasionally.

[seemslikeadream]

[Novem5er]

FBI .....still bad guys with Comey "trying" to cover his ass before the hearings start on his outfit

Democracy is not a spectator sport.....

Is a small business owner who wants less government bureaucracy supposed to suddenly vote Democrat?

That's his problem ...that's the republican party's problem...they created this monster

Pro-Lifer

?

be pro life and stay the fuck out of my life

Regardless of our personal feelings towards small business owners or Pro-Lifers, they are not going to suddenly abandon their principles and vote Democrat, and thus their support for Donald Trump is not rooted in racism or support for the racist elements of their party (or his campaign). Now, their support may end up electing a racist, fascist dictator that brings America back to terrible times or forward to even more terrible times, but that is not their intent nor their purpose.

Much like how GOP voters for Bush back in 2000 ushered in the Iraq War, but that wasn't their intent. Much like how Obama supporters ushered in most of everything that Bush had before him, including increased corporate influences to our public education, the Drone Wars, and the destruction of Lybia.

When Hillary wins next Tuesday, as I believe she will, I wonder what horrors her supporters will have innocently ushered in? We've made some good guesses here on RI these last few months, but I bet the future will still surprise us.

[seemslikeadream]

oh please nobody is going to usher in anything .....did you forget the repubs still hold the house

[brekin]

That JackRiddler doesn't know the potential difference between his skinhead and a Trump supporter surprises me. There is overlap to be sure, but there is a major ignorance factor also. There are the willfully ignorant people out there, the ignorant unaware of their latent bigotry, and some people that are just not paying attention enough to even be aware of their ignorance. It's safe to assume that most Trump supporters don't attend rallies and receive their information through a filter of their ignorance assisting choosing. Quite simply, there are people who support this guy from reality TV who are wholly unaware of their kinship with the likes of the KKK. Contrarily, (though hardly), there are ignorant people who think there is nothing fascist already about a country that forces its taxpayers to subsidize the murder of people suspected of crimes, or detaining them indefinitely (changing the name to "extended detention" to make it all better and murdering via remote to "keep the troops out of harm's way"), further subsidize corporate profit via privatized schools & prisons, sending the cops out to protect big business by sicking dogs, shooting rubber bullets, and tasing & pepper spraying protesters, when not outright murdering them. As long as the country that does this has a person at the helm to say inspirational and wholly unracist things, or at worst, a candidate successor who uses double secret dog-whistling like "bringing super predators to heel" -- why, it's just not fascism at all.

I would also say that most Trump supporters aren't aware of their similarities with Skinheads either. Most Trump supporters (from what I can tell) are aligned with him out of a "defensive sense" of "losing ground" to global powers, elites, immigrants, minorities (concerns if not special rights), etc. So in their mind they aren't creating a situation, they are reacting to it. Most Skinhead, extremist groups, are seen from the outside as actively agitating situations against people, and aren't victims, but victimizers. But if you talk to them to, they see themselves as also reacting defensively against a threat and are victims, trying to defend themselves. Right or wrong, that is their song. Blatantly saying that either of the two aren't victimized, doesn't do any good but to further entrench them, because everyone in their mind believes they are a victim. And for someone to hold to extreme views, they were probably victimized in some way in their life or they wouldn't have such a reservoir of resentment to exploit.

One unfortunate thing is that Obama didn't do a very good job his two terms of dealing with the sense of America falling behind, white resentment, and racial unrest growing. I know a fixed income white educated elderly progressive lady who voted for Obama twice but is now voting for Trump. Why? All I can guess is, is that things didn't get better for her these last 8 years, they got worst, and she doesn't feel like she's responsible at all (she's a victim remember) so Trump promises change and someone for white people to blame, whereas democrats promise whites more terms to blame themselves (but especially white republicans). Some people think America can never be great again, because it never was, slavery, genocide, oppression, etc. Whereas others want to believe it can be great again, which means prosperous and guilt free. People who aren't making it, living paycheck to paycheck, are two missed payments from being homeless, don't want to hear how privileged they are.

Obama really ushered in and allowed to bloom identity politics to a huge degree, when many thought his presidency would be about celebrating the plurality but unity of being American. Some of that was his fault, but most of it lies in the cesspool of internet racism. Sadly, Hilary getting elected may also set gender relations back as many of the attacks on her will be generated as, or later misconstrued to be, about simply gender and not policy.

The truth is presidents usually never help the common people in the short term. Feeling that they should have, just creates butt hurt that will be exploited. When a president puts change back on the people, then most of the people start blaming each other for holding the country back.

What black America won't miss about Obama
http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/30/politics/ ... -obama-go/

[MacCruiskeen]

List of Republicans opposing Donald Trump presidential campaign, 2016

It's a triumphant demonstration of National Unity:

Public officials

Former Presidents


Former President George H. W. Bush - George H. W. Bush, President of the United States (1989–93); Vice President of the United States (1981–89) (sources say he will vote for Hillary Clinton)[1][2]


Former 2016 Republican presidential primary candidates

All candidates signed a pledge to eventually support the party nominee. The following have refused to honor it.

Jeb Bush, Governor of Florida (1999–2007)[3]

Carly Fiorina,[a][b] CEO of Hewlett-Packard (1999–2005); 2010 nominee for U.S. Senator from California[4][5]

Lindsey Graham, United States Senator from South Carolina (2003–present)[6]

John Kasich, Governor of Ohio (2011–present); U.S. Representative from Ohio (1983–2001)[7] (wrote in John McCain)[8]

George Pataki, Governor of New York (1995–2006)[9]


Former federal cabinet-level officials


Former Secretary of State Colin Powell

Former Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice

William Bennett, [a] Director of the Office of National Drug Control Policy (1989–90); United States Secretary of Education (1985–99)[10]

Bill Brock, United States Secretary of Labor (1985-87); United States Trade Representative (1981-85); U.S. Senator from Tennessee (1971-77); Chairman of the Republican National Committee (1977-81)[11]

Michael Chertoff, United States Secretary of Homeland Security (2005–09); Judge of the United States Court of Appeals for the Third Circuit (2003–05) (endorsed Hillary Clinton)[12][13]

Bill Cohen, United States Secretary of Defense (1997–2001); United States Senator from Maine (1979–97) (endorsed Hillary Clinton)[14][15]

Robert Gates, United States Secretary of Defense (2006–11); Director of Central Intelligence (1991–93)[16]

Carlos Gutierrez, United States Secretary of Commerce (2005–09) (endorsed Hillary Clinton)[17]

Carla Anderson Hills, United States Secretary of Housing and Urban Development (1975–77), United States Trade Representative (1989–93) (endorsed Hillary Clinton)[12][17]

Ray LaHood, United States Secretary of Transportation (2009–13), U.S. Representative from Illinois (1995–2009)[18]

Greg Mankiw, Chair of the Council of Economic Advisers (2003–05)[19]

Mel Martinez, United States Secretary of Housing and Urban Development (2001–03); United States Senator from Florida (2005–09); General Chair of the Republican National Committee (2007)[20][21]

Michael Mukasey, United States Attorney General (2007–09)[22]

John Negroponte, United States Ambassador to the United Nations (2001–04); Director of National Intelligence (2005–07); United States Deputy Secretary of State (2007–09) (endorsed Hillary Clinton)[12][17]

Henry Paulson, United States Secretary of the Treasury (2006–09) (endorsed Hillary Clinton)[23]

Colin Powell, United States Secretary of State (2001–05), National Security Advisor (1987–89) (voting for Hillary Clinton)[24]

William K. Reilly, Administrator of the Environmental Protection Agency (1989–92) (endorsed Hillary Clinton)[17]

Condoleezza Rice,[b] United States Secretary of State (2005–09), National Security Advisor (2001–05)[25]

Tom Ridge, United States Secretary of Homeland Security (2003–05); Homeland Security Advisor (2001–03); Governor of Pennsylvania (1995–2001)[12][26][27]

William Ruckelshaus, Administrator of the Environmental Protection Agency (1970–73, 1983–85) (endorsed Hillary Clinton)[17]

George P. Shultz, United States Secretary of Labor (1969–70); Director of the Office of Management and Budget (1970–72); United States Secretary of the Treasury (1972–74); United States Secretary of State (1982–89)[19]

Louis Wade Sullivan, United States Secretary of Health and Human Services (1989–93) (endorsed Hillary Clinton)[28]

Christine Todd Whitman, Administrator of the Environmental Protection Agency (2001–03); Governor of New Jersey (1994–2001) (endorsed Hillary Clinton)[29]

Robert Zoellick, United States Deputy Secretary of State (2005–06); U.S. Trade Representative (2001–05); President of the World Bank Group (2007–12)[12]

Governors

[...]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_R ... aign,_2016

The USA is a one-party state. A vote for "Hillary" is a vote for The Party.

[coffin_dodger]

^^ Jesus, that's a who's who list of the people most expected to support Clinton from The Cartel. Nice of them to confirm it in print.