The peoples voice.

[seemslikeadream]

I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race has come in and taken their place.

Winston Churchill

[solace]

Hmmmm. I googled "when did the truth need laws to protect it," because I had never heard the phrase before and wondered if was from some kind of ideology and here's the first 3 links that came up:

Truth Does Not Need Protection - HugeQuestions.com
hugequestions.com/Eric/Separating_truth_from_lies.htm‎
The truth can be placed in the open; exposed naked to the entire world. The truth does not need any laws to protect it, and it does not need secrecy to protect it.
You visited this page on 18/12/13.

Holocausts - HugeQuestions.com
hugequestions.com/Eric/Holocausts.html‎
Amazing holocaust facts ... The truth does not need laws to protect it ... Supposedly this is to protect the Jews from Nazi propaganda. Don't be a sucker! The truth ...

Holocaust Fundamentalism - You WILL Believe - Rense
rense.com/general69/hol.htm‎
The typical rhetoric goes: "these bigots deny the facts and lessons garnered ... where nearly anything goes, why does the truth need special laws to protect it?

The first 2 are sites of nasty antisemite and Holocaust denier Eric Hufschmid while the third is from Rense by another antisemite and Holocaust denier. Geeze, I hope this is not where slim gets his talking points from but I'm awful wary now.

[seemslikeadream]

"I think we shall have to take the Chinese in hand and regulate them. I believe in the ultimate partition of China. The Aryan stock is bound to triumph."

Winston Churchill

[Grizzly]

NSA Officials Tell Reporter It's Time To Reform The First Amendment

https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20131216/16384425584/tone-deaf-nsa-officials-tell-reporter-its-time-to-reform-first-amendment.shtml

from the how-about-reforming-the-nsa-out-of-existence dept
Daniel Drezner has a fairly incredible short blog post over at Foreign Policy magazine about his experience visiting the NSA as the organization is seeking to ramp up its PR campaign about how it's not actually evil. We've already covered the 60 Minutes debacle, but in many ways this piece is just as enlightening, as he notes just how incredibly tone deaf NSA officials appear to be -- unable to understand why people are upset about what they're doing.

The NSA's biggest strategic communications problem, however, is that they've been so walled off from the American body politic that they have no idea when they're saying things that sound tone-deaf. Like expats returning from a long overseas tour, NSA staffers don't quite comprehend how much perceptions of the agency have changed. The NSA stresses in its mission statement and corporate culture that it "protects privacy rights." Indeed, there were faded banners proclaiming that goal in our briefing room. Of course, NSAers see this as protecting Americans from foreign cyber-intrusions. In a post-Snowden era, however, it's impossible to read that statement without suppressing a laugh.

It might be an occupational hazard, but NSA officials continue to talk about the threat environment as if they've been frozen in amber since 2002. To them, the world looks increasingly unsafe. Syria is the next Pakistan, China is augmenting its capabilities to launch a financial war on the United States, and the next terrorist attack on American soil is right around the corner. They could very well be correct -- except that the American public has become inured to such warnings over the past decade, and their response has been to tell politicians to focus on things at home and leave the rest of the world alone. A strategy of "trust us, the world is an unsafe place" won't resonate now the way it did in the immediate wake of the Sept. 11 attacks.

But, perhaps the most tone deaf of all, was the statement from one NSA official suggesting that it's time to reform the First Amendment, because he's not at all happy about how reporters have covered the NSA recently. As Drezner notes, he's not sure if it's a joke or not, but it really doesn't matter. That seems like something you should not joke about if you're an NSA person, given everything that's going on.

The NSA's attitude toward the press is, well, disturbing. There were repeated complaints about the ways in which recent reportage of the NSA was warped or lacking context. To be fair, this kind of griping is a staple of officials across the entire federal government. Some of the NSA folks went further, however. One official accused some media outlets of "intentionally misleading the American people," which is a pretty serious accusation. This official also hoped that the Obama administration would crack down on these reporters, saying, "I have some reforms for the First Amendment."

It seems that the public might have some reforms for the intelligence community as well. And those would actually be constitutional, unlike what that particular NSA officials had in mind for free speech and the press. There's even more in the Drezner piece that is well worth reading, including the how the NSA was unable to properly manage his own personal information which he had to send them in order to get his pass to come for a visit...

[slimmouse]

Hmmmm. I googled "when did the truth need laws to protect it," because I had never heard the phrase before and wondered if was from some kind of ideology and here's the first 3 links that came up:

Truth Does Not Need Protection - HugeQuestions.com
hugequestions.com/Eric/Separating_truth_from_lies.htm‎
The truth can be placed in the open; exposed naked to the entire world. The truth does not need any laws to protect it, and it does not need secrecy to protect it.
You visited this page on 18/12/13.

Holocausts - HugeQuestions.com
hugequestions.com/Eric/Holocausts.html‎
Amazing holocaust facts ... The truth does not need laws to protect it ... Supposedly this is to protect the Jews from Nazi propaganda. Don't be a sucker! The truth ...

Holocaust Fundamentalism - You WILL Believe - Rense
rense.com/general69/hol.htm‎
The typical rhetoric goes: "these bigots deny the facts and lessons garnered ... where nearly anything goes, why does the truth need special laws to protect it?

The first 2 are sites of nasty antisemite and Holocaust denier Eric Hufschmid while the third is from Rense by another antisemite and Holocaust denier. Geeze, I hope this is not where slim gets his talking points from but I'm awful wary now.

Im awfully wary of anyone who can't answer the question. No matter where it came from. Its a few simple and logical words, which make no sense to the rational mind.. Why is saying the truth needs laws to protect it, somehow miraculously turned into "antisemitism".?

If you cannot see and accept that, then Im especially wary.

[American Dream]

Hmmmm. I googled "when did the truth need laws to protect it," because I had never heard the phrase before and wondered if was from some kind of ideology and here's the first 3 links that came up:

Truth Does Not Need Protection - HugeQuestions.com
hugequestions.com/Eric/Separating_truth_from_lies.htm‎
The truth can be placed in the open; exposed naked to the entire world. The truth does not need any laws to protect it, and it does not need secrecy to protect it.
You visited this page on 18/12/13.

Holocausts - HugeQuestions.com
hugequestions.com/Eric/Holocausts.html‎
Amazing holocaust facts ... The truth does not need laws to protect it ... Supposedly this is to protect the Jews from Nazi propaganda. Don't be a sucker! The truth ...

Holocaust Fundamentalism - You WILL Believe - Rense
rense.com/general69/hol.htm‎
The typical rhetoric goes: "these bigots deny the facts and lessons garnered ... where nearly anything goes, why does the truth need special laws to protect it?

The first 2 are sites of nasty antisemite and Holocaust denier Eric Hufschmid while the third is from Rense by another antisemite and Holocaust denier. Geeze, I hope this is not where slim gets his talking points from but I'm awful wary now.

Im awfully wary of anyone who can't answer the question. No matter where it came from. Its a few simple and logical words, which make no sense to the rational mind.. Why is saying the truth needs laws to protect it, somehow miraculously turned into "antisemitism".?

If you cannot see and accept that, then Im especially wary.

So you don't even care that you're repeating a talking point from racists and Holocaust deniers?

[slimmouse]

Does asking the question turn me into a racist or holocaust denier? I ask since youre obviously happy perpetuatibng that particular nonsensical claim against me.

I dont beileve it does, personally. Nor of course does anyone else in their right mind.

AD. perhaps you can rationalize it for me?

Theres actually a pretty important point to all of this, in case you couldnt tell. It concerns you very much AD, since you appear hell bent on ridding the world of fascist extremism, whilst at the same time remaining it appears unclear on whether truth needs laws.

Then perhaps we might consider who defines them, because if its the state, then I think with very good reason, we should all perhaps "be wary" . Dont you?

[American Dream]

Does asking the question turn me into a racist or holocaust denier? I ask since youre obviously happy perpetuatibng that particular nonsensical claim against me.

I dont beileve it does, personally. Nor of course does anyone else in their right mind.

AD. perhaps you can rationalize it for me?

Theres actually a pretty important point to all of this, in case you couldnt tell. It concerns you very much AD, since you appear hell bent on ridding the world of fascist extremism, whilst at the same time remaining it appears unclear on whether truth needs laws.

Then perhaps we might consider who defines them, because if its the state, then I think with very good reason, we should all perhaps "be wary" . Dont you?

I'm incredibly bored and disgusted by your line of "argument", slim. Instead of taking your hand and being led down that road by you, I'm going to post a bunch of quotes from and about the Man himself, Mr. David Icke:

http://aconstantineblacklist.blogspot.c ... -nazi.html

David Icke is a Neo-Nazi (Part One): Fascist Conspiracy Theories


" ... Icke enthusiastically embraced the classic Nazi conspiracy theory [in Robots' Rebellion], alleging that the world is controlled by a secret cadre of "The Elite." He openly endorsed The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, the Tsarist anti-Semitic forgery that informed Hitler's notion of a global Jewish conspiracy. ... "
http://www.publiceye.org/Icke/IckeBackgrounder.htm


Re: "...and the truth shall set you free." - "The book repeated Icke's previous claims that the Protocols were true, and went on to state: 'I strongly believe that a small Jewish clique which has contempt for the mass of Jewish people worked with non-Jews to create the First World War, the Russian Revolution, and the Second World War.... They then dominated the Versailles Peace Conference and created the circumstances which made the Second World War inevitable. They financed Hitler to power in 1933 and made the funds available for his rearmament.'"
http://www.publiceye.org/Icke/IckeBackgrounder.htm


Wikipedia: "Icke has cited white supremacist, neo-Nazi and other far-right publications in his books. British journalist Simon Jones notes that the bibliography of … And the Truth Shall Set You Free lists The Spotlight, formerly published by the now-defunct Liberty Lobby, and which Icke calls "excellent," and On Target, published by the Australian League of Rights, which has organised speaking tours for Holocaust denier David Irving. Jones writes: "It's tempting to dismiss David Icke as a confused and ignorant man, manipulated by extremists in order to present their philosophy in a socially acceptable format. But Icke clearly understands the implications of his words."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Icke


http://aconstantineblacklist.blogspot.c ... t-two.html

David Icke is a Neo-Nazi (Part Two): Holocaust Denial


David Icke and the Far-Right

Stephen Roth Institute for the Study of Anti-Semitism and Racism: " ... Exposure, a glossy magazine sold by subscription and at newsstands, was influenced by the worldview of UK eccentric David Icke and publicized the material of several far right Australian groups. In February, editor David Summers sold the magazine, which is now called Hard Evidence. Judging by its promotion during the year of The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion, videos of speeches by League of Rights stalwart Jeremy Lee, a half-page advertisement for Nexus magazine (see below), and aggressive advertising for past issues of Exposure, the magazine’s content remains little changed. ... "

http://www.tau.ac.il/Anti-Semitism/asw2 ... tralia.htm


Icke's Audience

" ... The demographic breakdown of his audience is, in and of itself, an interesting phenomenon. Icke appeals equally to bohemian hipsters and right-wing reactionary fanatics. As regards the latter, in England the British Nazi Group Combat 18 supports his writings, and in America the ultra right-wing conservative group Christian Patriots often attends his lectures (Taylor; Crumey). But they are just as likely to be sitting next to a 60-something UFO buff, a Nuwaubian, a Posadist, a Raelian, or New Age earth goddess. ... "

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_7 ... n28280155/


"Holocaust denier Alex Beck, who claims below, after Hitler, that Jewish people control world communism, defends Icke and claims that Jews constitute the "Iluminati." " ... Holocaust investigators are labeled holocaust deniers ... How does a man like Hitler revitalize a worthless economy with money not worth the paper it is printed on into a first rate nation in less than a decade. He got mad loans. But the Jews wouldn't cause the death of other Jews? Your not realizing that nobody in Zion or the Priory died in the holocaust, and all their gold and precious stuff was returned at the end. Usually only circumcised Jews died and the Jewlluminati and Illuminati are rarely ever circumcised. The Jewlluminati cornered the entire European residential/industrial/commercial market. Now anybody that is a Jewlluminati conspiracy theorist is equated with Hitler, even people who are investigating the holocaust. Also the war enabled the communist revolution that was originally under the control of the Jewlluminati. When the Soviet Union got the H-bomb they planted it in critical regions of the Free World and subsequently rebelled, joining the Rebel Alliance. ... "

http://www.freeworldalliance.biz/Jewllu ... story.html

•••••••
"HITLER A JEW?" - http://reactor-core.org/hitler-jew.html

••••••
Subject: XPOST:David Icke and Conspiracy theories
To: Multiple recipients of list H-ANTIS

" ... But what worries the Jewish community most is that Icke's veiled anti-Semitic references are now attracting the attention of more sinister British forces, in particular Combat 18, the neo-Nazi group which recruits among football's violent hooligan fringe.

"The Jewish Chronicle has reported how Combat 18 has taken to publicizing Icke's current tour in its internal journal, Putsch. Citing Icke's recent lecture in Glastonbury, Putsch claimed that Icke spoke of 'the sheep' and how the Zionist-operated government, sorry 'illuminati', uses them for its own ends. ... "

http://www2.ca.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/orgs/ ... ard.052695
•••••••

More Holocaust Denial

" ... He began to flirt explicitly with Holocaust denial, saying 'why do we play a part in suppressing alternative information to the official line of the Second World War? How is it right that while this fierce suppression goes on, free copies of the Spielberg film, Schindler's List, are given to schools to indoctrinate children with the unchallenged version of events. And why do we, who say we oppose tyranny and demand freedom of speech, allow people to go to prison and be vilified, and magazines to be closed down on the spot, for suggesting another version of history.' He also denounced the Nuremberg Trials as 'a farce' and 'a calculated exercise in revenge and manipulation.' ... "

http://direland.typepad.com/direland/20 ... about.html


" ... This flirtation with revisionism can still be seen today, with Icke’s support for the Canadian Holocaust denier Ernst Zundel. Icke’s support centres around Zundel’s freedom of expression. One would imagine however that a more worthy symbol could be found than a pro-Nazi propagandist who has appeared at a trial in a concentration camp uniform and who has disseminated stickers such as 'Holocaust teaching is Child Abuse'. ... Like David Irving and Holocaust revisionism, Icke has seen a change in how the public perceive him. Much more high–profile than Irving, he has been openly ridiculed by many. Also, like Irving, Icke has entered into the murky world of Holocaust denial. Both self-taught, they have become embroiled in a need for continuing revealment of cover-ups to sell more books, organise tours and finance their cause. ... "

http://www.skeptics.org.uk/article.php? ... d_icke.php

[slimmouse]

Well , Ive probably read all of your Icke Quotes, about a thousand times already.

In fact quickly screening your list, there doesnt appear to be a single quote from Icke there, Rather a series of qoutes from people who doubtless have views similar to MIB., Ignorant, Bigots.

Its a frustration that Im sure regular users of this board are all too familiar with, when asking you to engage in any kind of dialogue which doesnt suit your specious claims wrt me.

Does truth need laws to uphold it , AD?

If so, can you articulate why and how?

Dr Evil.

Did the holocaust occur ? Yes. Did many millions of people die. Yes. Were Millions of them Jewish? Yes.

I've never taken the trouble to look into any of the details, since to me theiy arent particularly in need of revision. But I sure as hell aint gonna start telling people what the "truth" about the holocaust was, or punishing them legally for so doing. .

Thats approaching totalitarian fascism in my book.

[American Dream]

Well , Ive probably read all of your Icke Quotes, about a thousand times already.

Its a frustration that Im sure regular users of this board are all too familiar with, when asking you to engage in any kind of dialogue which doesnt suit your specious claims wrt me.

Does truth need laws to uphold it , AD?

If so, can you articulate why and how?

The quotes are not primarily for you slim but it's sad- and telling- that you have no comment.

As to the Nazi Holocaust, you oughta know by now that I'm not really for state intervention in communications, that I don't think that the mainstream Holocaust narrative is given from God on a tablet and that I do think it is used to manufacture support for the Israeli State and its oppressive policies.

And that all goes hand in hand with my complete disgust for the sleazy crypto-racist, neo-fascist shit that passes for "anti-Zionism" in the far right, as exemplified by the loathsome activities of David Icke, as given just above.

What about you, slim, do you agree with and support the activities of Icke and his allies, as described in the Alex Constantine articles given above?

[slimmouse]

What activities are you reffering to.

Someone arguing that to tell people what the truth about any historical event is a step towards totalitarian mind control?

I would argue that it very much is. Who has the fucking right to tell you, or me, or anyone else how it "officially" happened.

9/11 will be next, if some of these maniacs have their way you know.

[American Dream]

What activities are you reffering to.

" ... Icke enthusiastically embraced the classic Nazi conspiracy theory [in Robots' Rebellion], alleging that the world is controlled by a secret cadre of "The Elite." He openly endorsed The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, the Tsarist anti-Semitic forgery that informed Hitler's notion of a global Jewish conspiracy. ... "
http://www.publiceye.org/Icke/IckeBackgrounder.htm


Re: "...and the truth shall set you free." - "The book repeated Icke's previous claims that the Protocols were true, and went on to state: 'I strongly believe that a small Jewish clique which has contempt for the mass of Jewish people worked with non-Jews to create the First World War, the Russian Revolution, and the Second World War.... They then dominated the Versailles Peace Conference and created the circumstances which made the Second World War inevitable. They financed Hitler to power in 1933 and made the funds available for his rearmament.'"
http://www.publiceye.org/Icke/IckeBackgrounder.htm



David Icke and the Far-Right

Stephen Roth Institute for the Study of Anti-Semitism and Racism: " ... Exposure, a glossy magazine sold by subscription and at newsstands, was influenced by the worldview of UK eccentric David Icke and publicized the material of several far right Australian groups. In February, editor David Summers sold the magazine, which is now called Hard Evidence. Judging by its promotion during the year of The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion, videos of speeches by League of Rights stalwart Jeremy Lee, a half-page advertisement for Nexus magazine (see below), and aggressive advertising for past issues of Exposure, the magazine’s content remains little changed. ... "

http://www.tau.ac.il/Anti-Semitism/asw2 ... tralia.htm




"Holocaust denier Alex Beck, who claims below, after Hitler, that Jewish people control world communism, defends Icke and claims that Jews constitute the "Iluminati." " ... Holocaust investigators are labeled holocaust deniers ... How does a man like Hitler revitalize a worthless economy with money not worth the paper it is printed on into a first rate nation in less than a decade. He got mad loans. But the Jews wouldn't cause the death of other Jews? Your not realizing that nobody in Zion or the Priory died in the holocaust, and all their gold and precious stuff was returned at the end. Usually only circumcised Jews died and the Jewlluminati and Illuminati are rarely ever circumcised. The Jewlluminati cornered the entire European residential/industrial/commercial market. Now anybody that is a Jewlluminati conspiracy theorist is equated with Hitler, even people who are investigating the holocaust. Also the war enabled the communist revolution that was originally under the control of the Jewlluminati. When the Soviet Union got the H-bomb they planted it in critical regions of the Free World and subsequently rebelled, joining the Rebel Alliance. ... "

http://www.freeworldalliance.biz/Jewllu ... story.html

•••••••
"HITLER A JEW?" - http://reactor-core.org/hitler-jew.html

••••••
Subject: XPOST:David Icke and Conspiracy theories
To: Multiple recipients of list H-ANTIS

" ... But what worries the Jewish community most is that Icke's veiled anti-Semitic references are now attracting the attention of more sinister British forces, in particular Combat 18, the neo-Nazi group which recruits among football's violent hooligan fringe.

"The Jewish Chronicle has reported how Combat 18 has taken to publicizing Icke's current tour in its internal journal, Putsch. Citing Icke's recent lecture in Glastonbury, Putsch claimed that Icke spoke of 'the sheep' and how the Zionist-operated government, sorry 'illuminati', uses them for its own ends. ... "

http://www2.ca.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/orgs/ ... ard.052695
•••••••

More Holocaust Denial

" ... He began to flirt explicitly with Holocaust denial, saying 'why do we play a part in suppressing alternative information to the official line of the Second World War? How is it right that while this fierce suppression goes on, free copies of the Spielberg film, Schindler's List, are given to schools to indoctrinate children with the unchallenged version of events. And why do we, who say we oppose tyranny and demand freedom of speech, allow people to go to prison and be vilified, and magazines to be closed down on the spot, for suggesting another version of history.' He also denounced the Nuremberg Trials as 'a farce' and 'a calculated exercise in revenge and manipulation.' ... "

http://direland.typepad.com/direland/20 ... about.html


" ... This flirtation with revisionism can still be seen today, with Icke’s support for the Canadian Holocaust denier Ernst Zundel. Icke’s support centres around Zundel’s freedom of expression. One would imagine however that a more worthy symbol could be found than a pro-Nazi propagandist who has appeared at a trial in a concentration camp uniform and who has disseminated stickers such as 'Holocaust teaching is Child Abuse'. ... Like David Irving and Holocaust revisionism, Icke has seen a change in how the public perceive him. Much more high–profile than Irving, he has been openly ridiculed by many. Also, like Irving, Icke has entered into the murky world of Holocaust denial. Both self-taught, they have become embroiled in a need for continuing revealment of cover-ups to sell more books, organise tours and finance their cause. ... "

http://www.skeptics.org.uk/article.php? ... d_icke.php

[slimmouse]

OK.

I briefly decided to look at your quotes. Ive stopped after the first.


here is is.

" ... Icke enthusiastically embraced the classic Nazi conspiracy theory [in Robots' Rebellion], alleging that the world is controlled by a secret cadre of "The Elite." He openly endorsed The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, the Tsarist anti-Semitic forgery that informed Hitler's notion of a global Jewish conspiracy. ... "

Here, from your own quotes is what Icke said,

Some say they were a forgery made public only to discredit Jews, and I use the term "Illuminati Protocols" to get away from the Jewish emphasis. If they were a forgery, something that is quite possible, what were they a forgery of, and by whom?"

Where do any of your panel of Icke experts you have embedded somewhere, tell me that Icke admits that it is quite possible that they are a forgery?

Of course we're back in the 20years ago stage here again with AD, I havent read anything Icke wrote recently to see if he's managed to make thie point that they may well be forgeries or with regards to his thinking about this 18 YEARS LATER ( have your views changed much over the last 18 years AD, cos mine sure as hell have?

BPH. Would I have Kollerstrom on as a guest, knowing what I now know. The answer is yes, but he wouldnt be talking about 7/7 again, which btw was good information regardless of his personal background. However this time, He'd be asked to defend his views against a holocaust expert. I assume threre are such people.

[brainpanhandler]

BPH. Would I have Kollerstrom on as a guest, knowing what I now know. The answer is yes, but he wouldnt be talking about 7/7 again, which btw was good information regardless of his personal background. However this time, He'd be asked to defend his views against a holocaust expert. I assume threre are such people.

You can go to the CODOH website and read the two articles he published there, The Auschwitz 'Gas Chamber' Illusion and The Walls of Auschwitz. I did. It's what got him kicked out of UCL. And he would be warned and/or banned for posting it here on our anti-fascist board.

This is an anti-fascist board. Propagation of fascist, neo-Nazi and "white pride" causes, including sympathetically linking to sites which advocate such, will not be permitted. This includes revisionist histories of the Holocaust.

The way that is worded might not be perfectly clear. In case it isn't.... Propagation of revisionist histories of the Holocaust will not be permitted. Since Jeff writes THE holocaust I think we all know what he means. I think we can also assume he doesn't give a shit about any other genocides as he does not specifically mention them.

Of course we're back in the 20years ago stage here again with AD, I havent read anything Icke wrote recently to see if he's managed to make thie point that they may well be forgeries or with regards to his thinking about this 18 YEARS LATER ( have your views changed much over the last 18 years AD, cos mine sure as hell have?

It seems to me that if you gave a fuck you might have researched whether Icke had changed his views of the pez.

[American Dream]

OK.

I briefly decided to look at your quotes. Ive stopped after the first.


here is is.

" ... Icke enthusiastically embraced the classic Nazi conspiracy theory [in Robots' Rebellion], alleging that the world is controlled by a secret cadre of "The Elite." He openly endorsed The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, the Tsarist anti-Semitic forgery that informed Hitler's notion of a global Jewish conspiracy. ... "

Here, from your own quotes is what Icke said,

Some say they were a forgery made public only to discredit Jews, and I use the term "Illuminati Protocols" to get away from the Jewish emphasis. If they were a forgery, something that is quite possible, what were they a forgery of, and by whom?"

Where do any of your panel of Icke experts you have embedded somewhere, tell me that Icke admits that it is quite possible that they are a forgery?

Of course we're back in the 20years ago stage here again with AD, I havent read anything Icke wrote recently to see if he's managed to make thie point that they may well be forgeries or with regards to his thinking about this 18 YEARS LATER ( have your views changed much over the last 18 years AD, cos mine sure as hell have?

BPH. Would I have Kollerstrom on as a guest, knowing what I now know. The answer is yes, but he wouldnt be talking about 7/7 again, which btw was good information regardless of his personal background. However this time, He'd be asked to defend his views against a holocaust expert. I assume threre are such people.

You're not as dumb as you (play) act.

C'mon- who do you think you're fooling?