ACLU"wear orange"+Cheetos "OrangeUndergound

[FourthBase]

Sorry to be blunt, but at the most this is COINTELAMATEUR, not PRO.

Nobody cared about the "Orange Underground" and the top response from YouTubers (mouse potatoes?) was pro-health and anti-war. Certainly not a greatest hit by any stretch of the imachination.

I would copyright "mouse potatoes" ASAP, Alan!

[professorpan]

Wrong, Pan. That's a gross distortion and denial of facts about:
>two ongoing,
>specifically detailed,
>parallel, and
>competing campaigns
>using 'orange' as a symbol for a REAL political purpose
>and for a FAKE 'political' purpose.

Okay, Mr. Smartypants -- go to the ACLU page. Look at all the flyers, downloads, posters, web banners, and so forth. They ALL feature the date very prominently: January 11, 2008. Go to the MySpace page, too: the last blog entry, from January 7th, is about the "wear orange on January 11, 2008" event. Nothing since then. The ACLU blog suggests that people "keep it up," they just link to the materials about the (now passed) January 11 event.

Also, the Cheetos Underground campaign was launched in mid-January. The first video was uploaded to YouTube on January 13th -- 2 DAYS after the ACLU campaign events. Good timing there, eh?

Don't let the chronology and the facts deter you, though. I'm sure you can brainstorm a convoluted explanation to prove you're right.

I'm sure the Goodby Silverstein agency and Frito-Lay decided to spend their money (and lots of it) not to increase their sales and brand recognition, but to discredit and ACLU campaign that was due to expire before their viral marketing campaign even commenced. Yeah, I'm sure that's exactly what happened.

Good find, Hugh. You are a genius. Go have a snack to reward your superb psyop sleuthing skills.

[FourthBase]

Yeah, it may very well be a simple greedy piggyback, not a hijack.

[professorpan]

Not coincidently, disrupting social movements is an FBI COINTELPRO "greatest hit"-

http://mediafilter.org/MFF/USDCO.PsyWar.html

Disinformation to Prevent or Disrupt Movement Meetings and Activities:

Illogical, Captain. The fact that real, provable psyops have taken place in no way supports your lunatic examples.

[Hugh Manatee Wins]

Sorry to be blunt, but at the most this is COINTELAMATEUR, not PRO.

Nobody cared about the "Orange Underground" and the top response from YouTubers (mouse potatoes?) was pro-health and anti-war. Certainly not a greatest hit by any stretch of the imachination.

My Point:
This IS DELIBERATE and psy-ops devices are all over the place and in places not suspected, in little ways not suspected.

Don't confuse your idea ofeffectiveness with whether it is deliberate psy-ops or not.

There are many functions of "effectiveness" and some are simply pre-emptively grabbing a slogan or cool name or url or search engine result so it can't be used for social activism.

Suppose some outraged activists form up an anti-torture themed movement just for youth.
Now they can't use the name "Orange Underground," can they?

The potential allure of a 'forbidden youth movement' has been hijacked.

But knowing that this CRAP is planned and marketed to hide crimes is important to know, not just how "effective" it is.

[professorpan]

It's not just the color orange, man.
The closest thing there is the AIDS awareness thing.
And it's not in the same ballpark, theme or size wise.

Oh, yeah? Hugo Boss is a huge corporation, with a Nazi past (seriously... they designed and produced Nazi uniforms). They feature the color ORANGE predominantly in their campaigns.

Why is that example any more silly or unlikely than Hugh's?

[professorpan]

Yeah, it may very well be a simple greedy piggyback, not a hijack.

Or the two campaigns may have NOTHING AT ALL in common except the color orange. Why is that so difficult to consider, FB? What, exactly, about Hugh's example is even the slightest bit persuasive?

[Hugh Manatee Wins]

Okay, Mr. Smartypants -- go to the ACLU page. Look at all the flyers, downloads, posters, web banners, and so forth. They ALL feature the date very prominently: January 11, 2008.

Now this may be too complicated for you, Pan.

This is a non-stop movement TO CLOSE GITMO despite the calander day event.
Like Christianity not being just about December 25. Duh.

http://www.aclu.org/safefree/detention/closeguantanamo.html

As long as Guantánamo continues to hold detainees, we'll be calling for its closure. We need your help. Download the CLOSE GUANTÁNAMO Toolkit now to find out how you can organize events at home, in your office, on campus, in your community, and online.

And that you would deny that is very telling of your...viewpoint.
You suggest that a movement to stop torture and CLOSE GITMO was about a 24 hour window and nothing more?

What an insult to our intelligence.

Also, the Cheetos Underground campaign was launched in mid-January. The first video was uploaded to YouTube on January 13th -- 2 DAYS after the ACLU campaign events. Good timing there, eh?

Read my op atleast once, OK?

Blog launched 12/15/07. Right in front of your eyes.
USAToday ad on 1/8/08. Right in front of your eyes.

The first action date was 1/11/07. Last year.
The second time around there was a Cheetos campaign perfectly mirroring and upstaging it.

Don't let the chronology and the facts deter you, though. I'm sure you can brainstorm a convoluted explanation to prove you're right.

You speak of yourself. See above.

[FourthBase]

I'm backing away from this one. Not worth it.
I can sympathize with both Pan and Hugh, and don't feel like taking sides.

Hugh, how about bumping the "Deal of the Century" thread?

[annie aronburg]

So portraying Zappa as instead a sex-obsessed deviant, and his lyrics were designed to push sexuality right in your face making it easy to do this, is an obvious tactic to point kids at instead of 'Concentration Moon.'.

But Hugh, FZ was a sex-obsessed deviant, created by the military industrial complex to jump start the "sexual revolution".

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/fact ... gealradium

Because of its proximity to the treatment area, the pituitary gland received a higher radiation dose than either the thyroid or brain (about six to seven times greater), but a lower dose than that delivered to the nasopharnyx (25 times lower). Some scientists have speculated that damage to the pituitary gland from NRI treatment might affect circulating hormone levels, growth, and reproductive characteristics, such as fertility and early menopause. Such effects have been seen in children exposed to radiation doses much greater than that received from NRI.

They even threw him in the clink on a trumped up obscenity charge, to ensure that he would obsess about it to the end of his days.

http://www.zappa.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.p ... 6a3220dd17

FZ: Who knows? It was baffling to me. I didn't know what was going on. And they arrested me and they arrested the girl. They took us to jail in San Bernadino. And meanwhile, they are driving us to jail, and the guy with the wrist radio is in the back seat of the car and he's interviewing us and it's being broadcast to the truck again, and I found out that these tapes existed because while I was in the tank, they took the girl out and were playing them, saying [Frank uses a mock-State Trooper voice here] "This is really incriminating, and we got this and we got that and we got all these other tapes... We're breaking up this smut ring..." and all this shit. I mean, it was totally preposterous.

I didn't have any money. My father had had a heart attack and he was out of work. He had been in the aerospace industry in California and he was out of work. He was broke, and he had to scrounge around to get enough money for me to get bailed out. I got out and I went to LA and a guy from a record company there who had released one of my songs owed me some money and I picked up a couple of hundred dollars from him, and went a bailed the girl out. And we went a got a lawyer.

The lawyer told me that if the thing really went to trial, since they had taken all those tapes I had, they would play every tape I had in evidence at the trial and it would make a lot of trouble. His advice to me -- for a thousand dollars -- was to plead nolo contendre. So I said, what the fuck. even if I wanted to take it any further than that, I didn't have the money to do it. My father had to get a loan from the bank in order for me to fight the thing. I tried to get ahold of the ACLU, but they wouldn't touch it. They said the case was too small and insignificant, even though it was a matter of illegal entrapment and all the rest of that stuff.

So they take me to jail. When the thing finally goes to a hearing, they play the tape in the judge's chambers. There's a 26 year old D.A. who is out to get me. And there's a judge, there's a vice squad guy, and there's me and this girl. And we're sitting in the judge's chambers and playing the tape and he's laughing, and going, "Hey, this is pretty good! It's a funny tape, right? What is this?"

So they plea-bargained the thing so I would get 3 years' probation and a six month suspended sentence. But the deputy DA insisted that I must spend time in jail. I had to have at least 10 days.

LR: We have to keep dangerous people like you off the streets, right?

And Zappa video clips have become hot on YouTube for him warning of a fascist theocracy in the US.

Rather than the current porno-capitalist's paradise he envisioned with his buddy Larry Flynt?

Zappa's hot on YouTube right now because his lunatic widow is sending C&Ds to anybody who posts ANYthing relating to her business interests.

Nothing rhymes with orange.

@.@.

[Hugh Manatee Wins]

So portraying Zappa as instead a sex-obsessed deviant, and his lyrics were designed to push sexuality right in your face making it easy to do this, is an obvious tactic to point kids at instead of 'Concentration Moon.'.

But Hugh, FZ was a sex-obsessed deviant, created by the military industrial complex to jump start the "sexual revolution".
.....
They even threw him in the clink on a trumped up obscenity charge, to ensure that he would obsess about it to the end of his days.
.....

FZ: "Who knows? It was baffling to me. I didn't know what was going on. "

A vice-squad provocateur commissioned Zappa to make a 'sex audio tape.'
Then busted him.
A formative event linking sexual repression and fascism, long before naked piles of prisoners at Abu Ghraib and panties-on-the-head and fake-menstrual-blood at Gitmo.

Zappa was a strong Free Speech-er, a Lenny Bruce with a wah pedal and conducting baton.

Zappa was the first one to teach me about the US-Nazi connection several decades ago, before the internet exposed Prescott Bush's financing of Hitler.

His avant-garde 1970 film, '200 Motels,' put the London Symphony Orchestra on a movie set designed to be a...
concentration camp.
And included that industrial vacuum cleaner, too.

And starred Beatle, RINGO STAR and award-winning Jewish performer, THEODOR BIKEL.
Both very heavy cats, nevermind the London Symphony Orchestra.

THIS is probably the reason for the Cheeto hijacking of Zappa to deflect away from "things that might remind us of US, torture, camps, and Nazis."

http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/Strasse/3374/200about.html

THE CAST

Larry the Dwarf.....Ringo Starr (Beatles' drummer)
.....
Rance Muhammitz (the devil).....Theodore Bikel (Jewish singer and actor)
.....
The Industrial Vacuum Cleaner.....Dick Barber (The Mothers road manager)

[annie aronburg]

But Hugh, FZ was a sex-obsessed deviant, created by the military industrial complex to jump start the "sexual revolution".

Zappa was a strong Free Speech-er, a Lenny Bruce with a wah pedal and conducting baton.

Just like his pal Larry Flynt!
http://home.online.no/~corneliu/thingfish2.html

Zappa was the first one to teach me about the US-Nazi connection several decades ago, before the internet exposed Prescott Bush's financing of Hitler.

What was he teaching with this clip I wonder?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNKMB9o0ooU

THIS is probably the reason for the Cheeto hijacking of Zappa to deflect away from "things that might remind us of US, torture, camps, and Nazis."

I'm more concerned with his widow trying to destroy free speech
http://www.killuglyradio.com/hot-poop/2 ... s-imminent
and highjacking the FACTS about FZ's past. That interview she did with Alex Jones was a piece of poo.

Zappa's former secretary Janet Ferguson, who was in Uncle Meat and 200 Motels, is a paralegal for Disney now.

His former roadie Dunt Sloatman is a keyword salesman, no lie.

kill yr idols,
@nnie @.

[orz]

THIS is probably the reason for the Cheeto hijacking of Zappa to deflect away from "things that might remind us of US, torture, camps, and Nazis."

Man this is your most tenuous nonsense yet... Wait what was even the connection again? I can't quite be bothered to read back... Cartoon vacuum cleaners or something? Is Henry in on it too?

[Joe Hillshoist]

orz that thing you did with the quotes was brilliant.

Beats JackR's "all work and no play.." by a mile. (And I did like JackRs thing.)

[Hugh Manatee Wins]

orz that thing you did with the quotes was brilliant.

What you missed, Joe, was that I had try to edit my post and accidentally hit "quote."

It took me a coupla minutes to fix the error and orz decided that frivolous fun with graphics was more important than Gitmo and torture.

I don't share the urge to play on these subjects.