Orlando / Pulse Mass Shooting Thread

[Elihu]

4b, there can't b nexus of conversation around "suicidal terrorist(s)".

Unless u think that's what went on here.

Isn't it obvious?

Anyone want this one to be the last massacre?

The spy agencies are outta control

[FourthBase]

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/06/indiana ... -violence/

Howell’s Facebook account lists him as a former security guard at Universal Protection Services in Clarksville, Indiana. He also claimed to work at Geek Squad City in a position he labeled CIA.

What is this, an episode of fucking "Chuck"?

If there's a remotely-legitimate source for what those Santa Monica cops are supposed to have said Howell said, then this whole thing will get a lot more interesting. Let's imagine for a moment that it's not bullshit and Howell actually told the cops that stuff. What in the fuck kind of CIA agenda would be advanced by simultaneous gun attacks against gay targets on each coast, one by a radical Muslim and one by a white reactionary? I'm stumped.

[82_28]

I think we're all stumped, FB. All analysis is welcome in my book.

[FourthBase]

4b, there can't b nexus of conversation around "suicidal terrorist(s)".

Unless u think that's what went on here.

Isn't it obvious?

Anyone want this one to be the last massacre?

The spy agencies are outta control

My priors on this are something like 75% chance it's "just" a suicidal Islamic terrorist, 25% chance it's some other manner of conspiracy including the farthest-out possibilities. Four years ago, those priors would've been reversed.

[MacCruiskeen]

Yeah, it's almost certainly bullshit, attributed to one (1) unnnamed "former Los Angeles County prosecutor who works for Get Off the BS" [sic!!] , i.e., he's a "source". And this "source" in turns claims to be quoting two anonymous "Santa Monica police officers that have been issued gag orders", who in turn supply what purport to be direct verbatim quotes from Howells himself:

The real truth of the story was released to a former Los Angeles County prosecutor who works for Get Off the BS by two Santa Monica police officers that have been issued gag orders under threat of Federal prosecution for talking further talking about the incident.

According to two department sources, Howell called the Santa Monica police on Sunday morning claiming that he needed protection from the CIA. Howell further elaborated to the dispatcher stating that he “had been set up by the CIA – they are going to kill me.”

According to Howell, he was in LA to meet with another person in a collaborated attack on the gay communities in both Florida and Los Angeles.

Howell additionally stated that, “everything has gone south. Dan was gone when I got here. They killed the leader of the Florida attack this morning. They are going to kill me. I need protection.”

According to sources within the police department’s investigation Howell indicated to officers who first made contact with him that Howell claimed he was one of five people involved in a planned Sunday attack on both the east and west coasts.

Howell stated that he was suppose to “hook up” late Saturday night with his contact in LA who was suppose to have more weapons and chemicals to mix with the Tannerite he was in possession of.

“When I got here, Dan was gone. I went to his apartment and he had cleared out….I tried calling him but he never answered me,” said Howell.

...

As it stands and without further corroboration the story is close to worthless. It's mere alleged hearsay from anonymous sources, and brought to us by a far-from-trustworthy-looking website to boot. Which is not to say that it might not be well worth investigating. (But who will have the resources and the guts to investigate it seriously?)

[82_28]

4b, there can't b nexus of conversation around "suicidal terrorist(s)".

Unless u think that's what went on here.

Isn't it obvious?

Anyone want this one to be the last massacre?

The spy agencies are outta control

My priors on this are something like 75% chance it's "just" a suicidal Islamic terrorist, 25% chance it's some other manner of conspiracy including the farthest-out possibilities. Four years ago, those priors would've been reversed.

Mine still are reversed. Again, who was working the door?

[FourthBase]

Yes, but as it stands, there is still the matter of Howell. The odds of two separate mass violence attacks on gays coming from two separate subsets of hate being planned on separate coasts for the same day is...not impossible, but pretty fucking hard-to-believe.

[elfismiles]

As I said when I posted the source: "Anonymous Sources? Sus site for sure..." http://getoffthebs.com

Anonymous Sources? Sus site for sure...
Howell and Four Other Suspects Involved in Planned Sunday Massacres - GetOffTheBS.com
http://getoffthebs.com/five-suspects-in ... d-attacks/

I found this through willyloman: We Are Change??

http://wearechange.org/manufactured-ter ... onnection/
Howell Says CIA and Four Other Suspects were Involved in Planned Sunday Massacres

===============================

chump, thanks for that.

Has this been widely reported elsewhere? Have any of you looked closely into this? This is the first I've heard of it.

Google News search results for James Wesley Howell CIA ...

[MacCruiskeen]

As I said when I posted the source: "Anonymous Sources? Sus site for sure..." http://getoffthebs.com

chump, thanks for that.

Has this been widely reported elsewhere? Have any of you looked closely into this? This is the first I've heard of it.

Google News search results for James Wesley Howell CIA ...

Yeah, miles, but I was getting persistently distracted by something there.

Anyway, that's one distraction less.

[FourthBase]

I mean, I hate to indulge in any Alex Jones gungrab paranoia, but in the case of Mateen/Howell, if there's a conspiracy, and if it's being orchestrated by the proverbial PTB, then what other goal would work better as an explanation?

[Elihu]

Well"shoot" then. This shows over. Turn your investigative musings to try to predict the next one. Whatever it will be it will jive with politics, pop culture, incite hate, and beg to expand war. Bombing runs are ok, no investigations, minimal tv. That's why there has to be a next one. Motivates people to vote.

[82_28]

As a non gun owner, I don't give a shit if people get their assault weapons taken away. That's their problem for being our problem. A hunting rifle is just fine because that shit takes skill. Fuck, even military bases weapons need to be checked in and tagged. I do not see a problem with this approach.

[FourthBase]

I've got that 25% humming right now, lol.

But seriously, I can kind of visualize the aborted Howell event being like the 4th plane on 9/11. With it only being Mateen, that might have complicated and undermined the thrust of planned event, maybe even caused it to backfire. Instead of a unifying (improbably unifying, almost perfectly unifying) national panic against guns, there's just the Islamic terrorist, who might as well have used a pressure cooker. And yet a purely anti-gun and anti-homophobia response was rolled out, almost as if Howell hadn't been stopped.

I realize this is veering into Freeper territory, but surely there's room for RI's lefties to interpret the same scenario in a non-Freeper way.

[FourthBase]

As a non gun owner, I don't give a shit if people get their assault weapons taken away. That's their problem for being our problem. A hunting rifle is just fine because that shit takes skill. Fuck, even military bases weapons need to be checked in and tagged. I do not see a problem with this approach.

The idea would not be to stop at assault weapons. Jonesthink: Once they're banned, there'd probably be mass shootings involving handguns, shotguns, hunting rifles. At which point the "conversation" is recycled. Until the 2nd is repealed. Around which time, shortly before or shortly after, there'd be a civil war, or revolution depending on which side you're looking at it from. Problem is, in this case, I don't think Jonesthink is wrong enough.

[MacCruiskeen]

Well"shoot" then. This shows over. Turn your investigative musings to try to predict the next one. Whatever it will be it will jive with politics, pop culture, incite hate, and beg to expand war. Bombing runs are ok, no investigations, minimal tv. That's why there has to be a next one. Motivates people to vote.

Jesus christ, Elihu. It only just took place.

What has happened to people's attention spans? And when did people stop expecting investigations, due process, respect for the burden of proof, close questioning of eyewitnesses and police chiefs, trials, legality, all that old-school stuff? When did it all become just one huge spectacle?

People are consuming these mass murders like movies now: as entertainment. Or like popcorn. "When's the next show? Any good?"

Meanwhile, from the memory hole: 1) The Feds are still grilling his wife. 2) No eyewitness has yet identified the killer(s). 3) It is far from ruled out that many if not most of the victims were killed by police bullets.