One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby 8bitagent » Thu Apr 25, 2013 12:27 am

justdrew wrote:
According to U.S. officials the killing of Abdulrahman al-Awlaki was a mistake; the actual target was an Egyptian, Ibrahim al-Banna. Abdulrahman al-Awlaki was reported to have gone out in the desert to search for his missing father but was sitting in a cafe when he was killed.


Abdulrahman was never put on the kill list. "the administration" had no idea he was going to die.

As for al-Awlaki Sr. - he knew exactly what he was doing and accepted the risk. Do you REALLY think ANY nation on earth is going to do anything other than kill a known terrorist leader recruiter and motivational expert out to kill citizens of that country? He made himself a target and ended up in a predictable manner. These are not sympathetic victims.

None the less, "the left" you love to slag off is the only political force ACTUALLY trying to reign in the (popular) use of these damn drones, which you can see some movement on in the last post on the last page.


The real left, of course. Not the Obama worshipping mainstream left. Or the online gatekeeping left.

Awlaki bought some of the hijacker plane tickets. He was a high level al qaeda operative for bin Laden as of 1999. Under Saudi intelligence he welcomed two of the hijackers in San Diego then led them to another safehouse
in Falls Church Virginia. He was pretty much on speed dial with Ramzi bin Alshidh and Khalid Sheikh Mohamed.

Yet this guy is invited to a power luncheon with Pentagon brass a few months after 9/11. And after FBI agents finally arrest him in 2002, they are told to "let him go".

Now...sure seems convenient that AFTER he's made into the "NEXT BIN LADEN" in the news media, they allegedly kill him. Or so we've been told. Who knows what's real.
Yeah he was a 'bad guy', but he was nothing more than a puppet for the powers that be. Just like most if not all Islamic extremism.
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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby 8bitagent » Thu Apr 25, 2013 12:32 am

elfismiles wrote:SkyNet DroneWar seems like bipartisan continuation of Bill Clinton's "Cruise Missile Diplomacy" to me ...

So we have 1/3 of domestic terror cases in the US fomented by the FBI's entrapment strategem, some other portion possible covert-ops for various agendas, and still other portions are "legitimately" caused as blowback from American Foreign Policy.

Yeah, we're fucked - might as well keep bombing everyone everywhere.

justdrew wrote:This direction was set by bush, FOX, and republicans in congress, it's going to take time to turn it around.



Agreed. And deregulating wall street, the IMF fleecing of southeast asia, the brutal sanctions and daily eight year carpet bombing that killed many innocent Iraqis...
Bill Clinton is definitely not this cool daddy-oh saint as the mainline left seems to paint. And once again, the GOP attacked him(as they do Obama) for all the wrong reasons


justdrew wrote:
Awlaki knew damn well he was putting his own as well as the lives of his family in jeopardy, and he didn't give a damn. If anyone runs off to war with their child in tow, that parent is damn well responsible for the entirely predictable consequences.


So if Timothy Mcveigh had gotten away and had a son, who was say one month into being 16...and that son was visiting family, it'd be ok for the government to just wantonly go after the whole clan?
The kid's family was in Yemen. Yeah the dad ended up preaching bad things, but according to the family the kid had nothing to do with terrorism.

The bottom line is the US government HAD Awlaki in 2002 after quite a lot of evidence he was deeply involved with al Qaeda and 9/11 and they let him go. At some point the "incompetence" meme can only go so far.
Also there can be no defense of the drone program given the fact the white house authorizes "double tap" strikes which are a war crime. Its the same thing Eric Rudolf did when he bombed the womens clinic and then blew up the rescue responders. Thats what Obama and the CIA do on a routine basis. I definitely do not see Awlaki as more evil than the US government
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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby seemslikeadream » Thu Apr 25, 2013 6:20 am

The Strange Billionaire Brothers Behind America's Predator Drones -- And Their Very Strange Past
Linden Stanley and James Neal Blue's General Atomics has a massive stake in the drone industry. But that's just the start.
April 24, 2013 |

This article first appeared at the Not Safe for Work Corporation.

Gray Butte, CA: It's around 1 p.m. when my buddy Dave and I finally spot the General Atomics drone base, way out in the wastelands of the Mojave Desert.

We're on the border of San Bernardino and Los Angeles Counties. There's not much around for miles--nothing but sandy soil, rocks, Joshua trees, an abandoned trailer here and there, heaps of trash and tires. There's also a salvage yard full of airplane parts a few miles down the road, as well as a dairy plant and a foul-smelling high density feed lot crammed with miserable dairy cows reeking of shit and piss, baking in the desert sun. Next door to that is a trailer with a sign offering baby goats for sale.

We stop short of the gate, pulling over on the shoulder. Dave is a Victorville native whose dad was in the Air Force. He' s been around drones since they started popping up here in the 1990s. Right after high school, he even scored a brief gig with the infamous Pinkertons, guarding an early prototype of the Predator. But today in our drop-top Mustang rental car--a perfect car for drone hunting--Dave and I look just like a couple'a tourists. I pretend to fumble with the roof controls while we check out the scene.

From afar, the base itself doesn't look like much--just a jumble of low-slung prefab structures and warehouses and random industrial machinery flanked by vivid green alfalfa crop fields, and a solar field just beyond. That base could be anything. But it isn't just anything. We are looking at what used to be an abandoned WWII-era airfield, but today ranks as possibly the largest private drone base in the United States.

General Atomics took the base over in 2001 and converted it into a testing and quality control facility for its drone fleet. This is where the company tests experimental drone technology--like the newfangled stealth bomber jet drone. But mostly the base is where General Atomics techs assemble and test their Predator and Reaper drones before breaking them down again and shipping them to eager customers in the Air Force, Border Patrol, National Guard and the CIA.

The Guardian estimated that U.S. armed forces had about 250 General Atomics drones in 2012. And a good number of them first came through Grey Butte.

As we peer through the outer perimeter fence of the base, I can make out a couple of Reapers parked outside, their motors revving up louder and faster, as they were about to take off. The fence has a couple of smallish signs warning people to stay the fuck away, or else. Beyond the whirring Reapers we see warehouses, hangers, an air control tower and stacks of long rectangular plastic crates that are used to transport the disassembled Predators.

At one point, we spot a Predator hovering very high overhead. It circles a few times and then disappears from view.

I'm suddenly paranoid.

When people talk or think about drones these days, it's usually in very crude, naive, B-sci-fi ways: vague images of big brother robots menacingly hovering over us, observing, recording and tracking our every move…

But I'm not so much spooked by the Predator drones hovering above me, as I am by the spooky brothers who make them: Linden Stanley and James Neal Blue, the mysterious Blue brothers who own and run General Atomics.

You probably don't know about the Blue brothers, and neither did I until a few months ago. There's very little current information available about their lives, and the parts that are known are murky and incomplete.

What we do know with a fair amount of certainty is that Linden Stanley Blue and James Neal Blue were born to a wealthy family in Colorado during the Great Depression, went to Yale, served as Air Force pilots, and have been involved in some very heavy business activities since then: They've enriched uranium, dumped radioactive waste on a Native American reservation, infiltrated and spied on environmental activists, operated plantations with one of the South America's most brutal dictator clans and tried to turn Telluride, the quaint Colorado ski town, into a giant McTractHome development.

Today the Blue brothers reside in separate mansions in the wealthy, pasty-white beach enclave of La Jolla -- the Beverly Hills of San Diego -- not far from the headquarters of General Atomics. The brothers are both approaching 80, and are extremely wary of the press.

The Blue's weren't always as shy of the spotlight as they are today.

Back in 1957, Neal Blue and his brother Linden made the cover of LIFE magazine as "The Flying Blue Brothers.” It showed them crammed into the cockpit of a small blue single-prop plane, with big creepy smiles, ready to fly around the perimeter of South America.

The Blue brothers of Yale make a hazardous hemispheric odyssey
The tiny plane above, dodging through cloud openings among the treacherous peaks of the Colombian Andes, is the vehicle of a unique, exciting modern odyssey. Last summer, piloted alternately by Yale men Neal and Linden Blue (left), the Blue Bird flew 25,000 miles in 110 days--from Denver. Colo, to Mexico, down along the rugged west coast of South America, across the Andes to Argentina, back north again over the Caribbean to Miami, and at last to New Haven. The log of their trip was packed with colorful and hazardous incident. With oxygen but without a supercharger in their single-engined plane, they Hew at dangerous altitudes of 16,000 feet They made 44 stops along the way, dropping in on affable plantation owners and friendly head-hunters; they landed lightheartedly where no plane had ever been before and then were forced down dangerously where no plane should have been.
One of these "affable plantation owners” was none other than Anastasio Somoza, the brutal dictator whose family had run Nicaragua like their own private slave plantation for three generations, until being ousted in from power in 1979 after a bloody popular uprising led by the Sandinistas.

One of the LIFE spreads is a picture of the brothers hanging up hammocks to dry on their plane, with a caption explaining that "the boys and their bedding had got soaked when they slept out in a tropical shower” in Nicaragua, "where they interviewed the late President Somoza.”

The Blue brothers did more than just interview President Somoza, they went into business with his family, partnering up on several agricultural ventures, including cocoa and banana plantations, as well as a 100,000-acre ranch of some kind. The details are murky, but it seems the partnership continued until the very end of Somoza rule.

These are the same Somozas whose security forces were caught on camera executing an American reporter for ABC News in 1979, shooting him point-blank in the head as he lay on the ground face-down. That reporter had come to Nicaragua to cover the revolution. When American TV showed the reporter getting his brains blown out, that was the last straw forcing Carter to withdraw U.S. backing for the Somoza family.

Their hold on power collapsed, the Sandinistas took over Nicaragua, and the Blue brothers' business partners went into exile in the U.S. The execution of a nosy journalist wouldn't have interested the Blue brothers much, but losing their agricultural holding to a bunch of commie peasants wounded their pride. It's a wound that festers to this very day.

In 1961, four years after making the cover of LIFE magazine, the Blue brothers again made national headlines--this time, in connection with Communist Cuba.

It was another bizarre story, but the gist of it is this: Linden Blue was on his way to Nicaragua when, for some inexplicable reason, he decided to fly his private prop plane straight over Fidel Castro's Havana. This happened at a time of escalating tensions. The U.S. had just closed down its embassy in Havana and severed diplomatic relations. Meanwhile, Castro had advanced knowledge that the CIA's was planning its Bay of Pigs invasion, which was just a month away. Not surprisingly, as Linden flew over Havana, he was intercepted by a Cuban fighter jet, forced to land, and thrown in jail along with his sole passenger, a buddy/business partner who worked as an executive for a baby food company.

Here's a clip from a 1961 story in the Miami News published after their release 11 days later:

They had set out from Key West on March 24 In Blue's twin-engine private plane on a flight to Managua, Nicaragua, where Blue is partner in a banana plantation. [Donald] Swenson, executive for a baby food manufacturing firm, said he went along to see the plantation and possibly to enter into a business relationship with Blue. They were about 70 miles from Havana when Blue, piloting the plane, contacted the Havana airport by radio to ask permission to fly over the area on his way to Nicaragua. "About 20 miles from Havana, they ordered me to remain near the city at 8,000 feet,” Blue said. ”Shortly after that an American-made jet fighter appeared. He came very close once, apparently to check on our plane's identification marks." Next, Blue was ordered to land. I was in no position to argue about it," he said. Blue and Swenson were hustled away to a large house in the city. They soon learned that they were at the head-quarters of the Cuban secret police.
Linden Blue and his buddy Gerber were released on April 5. Less than two weeks later, the CIA launched the Bay of Pigs invasion--an operation in which Nicaragua's Somoza clan happened to play a crucial role, allowing the CIA to use Nicaragua as a base of operations. The Cuban exile "army” trained in Nicaragua, and part of their invasion was launched from there.

H'mmm, makes me wonder about that plantation business the Blue brothers were running in Nicaragua. Was it simply a cover for clandestine spook work? Or was it a legitimate business? Maybe it was both?

The Blue brothers are coy about their intelligence connections. In 2007, Neal told the New York Times that he and his brother were "enthusiastic supporters” of the CIA-run Contra army in the 1980s, a brutal death squad that terrorized Nicaraguan peasants and sabotaged infrastructure in order to destabilize the Sandinistas' rule. That raised an obvious question about intelligence connections; but Neal Blue "declined to discuss if they have worked for the Central Intelligence Agency.”

Wink, wink. Nod, nod.

Then, in 1982, Linden Blue, was appointed CEO of Beech Aircraft Corporation, which at the time had just been bought out by mega-military contractor Raytheon, the world's premier manufacturer of guided missiles.

Two years later, his brother Neal bought up most of the valley below Telluride and hatched plans to subdivide and turn the small ski town into a massive McMansion subdivision. The plan ultimately failed, but Neal fought with local residents for 25 years to push it through, even lobbying the Colorado's legislature to pass a retroactive law that would allow him carry out his plans--a law that was later struck down by Colorado's Supreme Court.

But the Blue brothers really came into their own after buying General Atomics from Chevron in 1986 for a reported $60 million.

At the time, General Atomics was a struggling company primarily involved in building civilian nuclear reactors, and losing out to bigger, badder nuclear behemoths like Westinghouse.

After packing their company's "advisory panel” with big names like Reagan's loopy Secretary of State, Gen. Alexander Haig, the Blue brothers began expanding into nuclear-related technologies: nuclear waste disposal, maglev trains and, most lucratively, mining and enriching uranium.

They acquired the largest known uranium deposit in the United States, located in New Mexico. They also bought a decrepit uranium processing facility in Oklahoma that had had a radioactive leak the size of Three Mile Island just a few years earlier. But General Atomics kept operating the leaky facility, cranking out specialized uranium metal used in fuel rods and armor-piercing munitions for five more years before finally shutting it down after the plant experienced yet another major release of radioactive material. An investigation found that ground water near the plant was 35,000 times above the legal limit, and that the company had known the plant was leaking radioactive waste but did nothing.

General Atomics also developed a massive uranium operation in Australia, where it owned one of the country's largest uranium mines. In 2001, it was discovered that the company had hired private spooks to infiltrate an Australian environment group that had been protesting one of its mines.

Here's the Australian branch of Friends of the Earth describing what happened:

The infiltrator, known as Mehmet, had previously infiltrated green groups as part of an undercover police operation before he moved into the private sector to set up his own security company, Universal Axiom. He also provided personal protection to visiting GA executives. When asked about the company's tactics, a Heathgate spokesperson said the company was privately owned and had a policy of not responding to media questions.
Neal Blue bragged to Fortune Magazine in 2008 that he had snapped up uranium deposits in Australia for nothing in the 80s, when uranium mining was still illegal in that country, "gambling” that a new government would eventually rewrite the laws and make the Blue brothers a lot of money--which of course they did.

”For our size, we possess more significant political capital than you might think,” Blue once told a defense trade mag.

Indeed.

That "political capital” is a big reason GA's Predator drones are now a household name.

A few years after buying General Atomics, Neal Blue set up a special "advanced technology projects” division in order to identify and develop undervalued military technology.

Such a venture required some serious connections and lobbying muscle, so Neal found the perfect man for the job: former Navy admiral Thomas J. Cassidy Jr.

Cassidy had a cameo role in Tom Cruise's "Top Gun,” a movie which was made with massive support from the U.S. Navy. Cassidy was a celebrity, but was also very experienced in navigating the halls of the DoD. A few years before he was hired by General Atomics, Cassidy had been disciplined in a major corruption scandal triggered by reports that the Navy had been buying ashtrays from Grumman Aerospace Corp for $659 a pop under his command.

So in 1992, Cassidy and the Blue brothers realized that locally-manufactured UAVs were gonna be the next big thing, and decided to get in early on the UAV racket. A decade later, their little company dominated the drone market, producing the cheapest and most dependable product.

To hear the Blue brothers tell it now, they all but invented the Predator drone. Neal told Fortune magazine in 2008 he got the idea to build drones decades ago, while fighting Sandinistas in Nicaragua.

Back then Blue was a Denver oilman and real estate investor who happened to spend a lot of time thinking about how to defeat communists. He was particularly interested in seeing the overthrow of the Soviet-backed Sandinistas, who had recently seized control of Nicaragua. He had known the Somozas, the ousted ruling family, from his cocoa and banana days, and, well, he hated Reds. Crippling the regime, Blue figured, was simple: just send GPS-equipped unmanned planes on kamikaze missions to blow up the country's gasoline storage tanks. "You could launch them from behind the line of sight,” he recalls matter-of-factly, "so you would have total deniability.” Blue pauses, leans back in his white-leather swivel chair, and quickly adds that he had nothing to do with any of the Reagan-era operations there - nor, of course, did he launch his own attack.
It's a nice story, except for all the bullshit.

The Predator drone was actually created by Israeli named Abroham Karem, who had helped design Israel's first drones for use in the Yom Kippur war. In the 1980s, Karem moved to Orange County and set up a small shop with DARPA funding to replicate and improve the technology here.

His company was called Leading Systems, and had already developed a working Predator drone prototype that was cheaper and more reliable than what good ol' boy defense companies like Lockheed Martin could crank out. Karem made an elegant and efficient product it, but it wasn't getting much love in the DoD.

It needed a power-salesman and a lot of money to grease the procurement process. And that's what the Blue brothers, and their man Cassidy, brought to the table.

"Behind its success in winning government contracts has been a formidable and at times controversial lobbying effort,” wrote the Financial Times.

H'mmm… "formidable and at times controversial” is one way of putting General Atomics' lobbying efforts. Another way would be to say the company flooded Congress with money.

A 2006 investigation by the Center for Public Integrity found that General Atomics was among the biggest sponsors of congressional trips, outspending other defense contractors by 50 times or more--and that's not counting the roughly $2.5 million a year it spends on lobbying.

San Diego-based General Atomics largely targeted congressional staff members, spending roughly $660,000 on 86 trips for legislators, aides and their spouses from 2000 to mid–2005, according to an analysis of travel disclosure records by the Center for Public Integrity, American Public Media and Northwestern University's Medill News Service.

While on trips to Turkey in 2004 and Australia in 2005 -- some valued at more than $25,000 -- staffers attended meetings with officials of foreign governments being solicited to buy the company's unmanned spy plane, the Predator.

Among those aides was J. Scott Bensing, chief of staff to Sen. John Ensign, R-Nev., a member of the Senate Armed Services Committee's Airland subcommittee. Two of his trips cost more than a combined $46,000.

Bensing said that he and his wife, Lia, went to Italy and Turkey in 2004 and Australia in March 2005 on the company's tab. His disclosure forms list more than $37,000 in transportation expenses and nearly $4,400 worth of meals for the two weeklong trips.

Bensing indicated on his forms that the Australia trip's purpose was to discuss "the international war on terror,” while the Turkey trip included discussions on "NATO interoperability and other international military issues.” However, other aides who went on the trips indicated that staffers also sat in on meetings with officials of foreign governments interested in buying the Predator and other robotic planes developed by General Atomics.

"I was not there to advocate [for General Atomics],” he said. "That was not our purpose. It certainly wasn't why I was there.” Bensing asserted that he did not go on the two trips to help sell aircraft. He said the meetings were focused on national security, and that if the Predator came up in conversation, it was because foreign officials raised the topic.

One of General Atomics' biggest fans was Rep. Randy "Duke” Cunningham, a Republican whose district included General Atomics headquarters in San Diego. Cunningahm's office took more than $50,000 worth of trips from 2002 to 2005.

In 2006, Cunningham got eight years for evading taxes and accepting a couple of million in bribes, including a house and a boat christened the "Duke-stir,” from a couple of defense contractors not connected with General Atomics. Cunningham was the poster boy for Bush-era defense corruption: He even worked out a bribe-scale which valued the bribe amount based on the size of contracts he secured for his clients.

While staffers denied their roles as drones salesmen, General Atomics' Admiral Cassidy was more honest, explaining that this was simply a sensible way of doing business: "[It's] useful and very helpful, in fact, when you go down and talk to the government officials to have congressional people go along and discuss the capabilities of [the plane] with them.”

Cassidy admitted that "Without congressional support in the beginning, I am not sure the Predator would have ever seen the light of day.”

Neal Blue explained this practice to the Center for Public Integrity in similar terms: "A somewhat smaller enterprise is at a disadvantage in competing with very large embedded defense companies. It became imperative upon us to find a better way … independent of the bureaucratic procurement grind.”

General Atomics does not disclose its financial information, but stats gleaned from public data show that they took in just under $5 billion from U.S. taxpayers from 2000 to 2009. Current annual revenue is estimated to between $600 million and $1 billion, with about 80 percent coming from government defense contracts.

Today, General Atomics dominates 25% of the UAV market--a market that will only keep getting bigger and bigger.

Recently, General Atomics tested a new stealth jet bomber drone that will compete with Lockheed Martin's RQ–170 Sentinel--the one that got hacked into by Iran's cyber-mullahs and redirected to land in Tehran.

I wanted to ask the Blue brothers about all of these things, given the still escalating controversy in this country about the use of drones, both abroad and here at home. I'd tried getting in touch with the Blue brothers through official channels, of course. But my request for an interview, or a tour of the base, was denied. Their press person explained that GA's owners are "very selective” when it comes to granting interviews. Which is why I'd come to the base in person, in the somewhat optimistic attempt to talk my way inside for a look around.

I didn't even make it to the gate.

The moment Dave and I step out of the car, two security guards materialize out of a trailer and come racing out of the gate towards the car, yelling.

"You can't stand here! You can't stand here!"

"Isn't this public property?" I ask, doing my best impression of a confused tourist.

"Yes, but you can't stop here. You have to move."

"Why? What is this place?"

I can't tell you that, sir. Please, sir. Move."

"I think they're from Securitas," explains Dave. "That's what the Pinkertons are called these days."

I slam the car into reverse, gunning the Mustang away from the base, back out into the desert. Finally we stop and I look left and right, ahead and behind, expecting to see a General Atomics' security goon bearing down us, ready to drape sacks over our heads and drag us to some private black site dungeon from which we'd never emerge.

But there's nothing. Not even a drone in the sky. Just a couple of vultures circling overhead.
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby conniption » Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:57 am

charlesfrith

Drone operator who killed 1626 Doesn't Want To Do It Any More



Written by Charles Frith at 6/10/2013

A former Air Force drone operator who says he participated in missions that killed more than 1,600 people remembers watching one of the first victims bleed to death Brandon Bryant says he was sitting in a chair at a Nevada Air Force base operating the camera when his team fired two missiles from their drone at three men walking down a road halfway around the world in Afghanistan. The missiles hit all three targets, and Bryant says he could see the aftermath on his computer screen -- including thermal images of a growing puddle of hot blood.

"The guy that was running forward, he's missing his right leg," he recalled. "And I watch this guy bleed out and, I mean, the blood is hot." As the man died his body grew cold, said Bryant, and his thermal image changed until he became the same color as the ground.

"I can see every little pixel," said Bryant, who has been diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder, "if I just close my eyes."

Bryant, now 27, served as a drone operator from 2006 to 2011, at bases in Nevada, New Mexico and in Iraq, guiding unmanned drones over Iraq and Afghanistan and taking part in missions that he was told led to the deaths of an estimated 1,626 individuals. .In an interview with NBC News, he provided a rare first-person glimpse into what it's like to control the controversial machines that have become central to the U.S. effort to kill terrorists.

He says that as an operator he was troubled by the physical disconnect between his daily routine and the violence and power of the faraway drones. "You don't feel the aircraft turn," he said. "You don't feel the hum of the engine. You hear the hum of the computers, but that's definitely not the same thing."

At the same time, the images coming back from the drones were very real and very graphic.

"People say that drone strikes are like mortar attacks," Bryant said. "Well, artillery doesn't see this. Artillery doesn't see the results of their actions. It's really more intimate for us, because we see everything."

A self-described "naïve" kid from a small Montana town, Bryant joined the Air Force in 2005 at age 19. After he scored well on tests, he said a recruiter told him that as a drone operator he would be like the smart guys in the control room in a James Bond movie, the ones who feed the agent the information he needs to complete his mission.

He trained for three and a half months before participating in his first drone mission. Bryant operated the drone's cameras from his perch at Nellis Air Force base in Nevada as the drone rose into the air just north of Baghdad.Bryant and the rest of his team were supposed to use their drone to provide support and protection to patrolling U.S. troops. But he recalls watching helplessly as insurgents buried an IED in a road and a U.S. Humvee drove over it.
"We had no way to warn the troops," he said. He later learned that three soldiers died.



*

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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby Canadian_watcher » Tue Jun 11, 2013 8:19 am

I am happy that he's speaking out, but frankly I hope that his PTSD eats him alive. 5 years???
COWARD.
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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby Elihu » Tue Jun 11, 2013 11:27 am

The missiles hit all three targets, and Bryant says he could see the aftermath on his computer screen -- including thermal images of a growing puddle of hot blood.

"The guy that was running forward, he's missing his right leg," he recalled. "And I watch this guy bleed out and, I mean, the blood is hot." As the man died his body grew cold, said Bryant, and his thermal image changed until he became the same color as the ground.

i will have to beg forgiveness for stirring this pot, mainly because i don't see how a guy with one leg could run, but in light of the foregoing, are we still going to believe the bone-sticking-out-of-lower-leg-wheelchair-actor-guy at the boston publicity stunt bombing (fibia or tibula? how did it get one and not the other? blunt force trauma instantly cauterized against five quarts of blood? thank goodness or we would have no ceremonial puck drop at the bruins game)? if we could only get a thermal reading of the scene we would know instantly whether the blood was real or not wouldn't we?

anyway, it's not the point. brown people non-americans do not feel the same sense of devastation when their loved ones are suddenly anniahlated and that makes it all right. need to get those guns regulated so real humans won't get hurt.

"I can see every little pixel," said Bryant, who has been diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder, "if I just close my eyes."
omg, get with the new morality. such retrograde sentiment is an obstacle to military efficiency peace and security. i'm an ass i know...
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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby elfismiles » Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:30 pm


FBI confirms it uses drones on United States soil
By Alex Walsh | awalsh@al.com al.com
on June 19, 2013 at 10:42 AM

FBI Director Robert Mueller confirmed to U.S. Sen. Chuck Grassley, R-IA, that his agency uses unmanned drones for domestic surveillance purposes.

Grassley spoke to Mueller during a hearing before the Senate's Judiciary Committee. Mueller confirmed that the FBI does use drones -- "for surveillance," the director said -- and clarified that the agency's drone "footprint is very small," before Grassley asked a more specific question.

"Does the FBI use drones for surveillance on U.S. soil?" Grassley asked.

"Yes," Mueller said.

The senator was ready to move on at that point, but Mueller took an opportunity to clarify his statement. "Let me just put it in context, though. In a very, very minimal way, and very seldom," he added.

Mueller also told Grassley that the FBI is working to develop guidelines and rules that will govern the agency's use of drones domestically. "We are in the initial stages of doing that," he said.

http://blog.al.com/wire/2013/06/fbi_con ... es_on.html

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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby seemslikeadream » Wed Jun 19, 2013 4:52 pm

FBI is working to develop guidelines and rules that will govern the agency's use of drones domestically. "We are in the initial stages of doing that," he said.



we're in the process of thinking about making up some guidelines that we may ignore later on after we get around to...you know using them
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby crikkett » Thu Jun 20, 2013 11:53 am

http://sojo.net/magazine/2013/07/drones-christ

Drones for Christ
by David Swanson | July 2013

How Jerry Falwell's Liberty U.—the world's largest Christian university—became an evangelist for drone warfare.


LIBERTY UNIVERSITY in Lynchburg, Va., was founded by televangelist Jerry Falwell. Its publications carry the slogan "Training Champions for Christ since 1971." Some of those champions are now being trained to pilot armed drones, and others to pilot more traditional aircraft, in U.S. wars. For Christ.

Liberty bills itself as "one of America's top military-friendly schools." It trains chaplains for the various branches of the military. And it trains pilots in its School of Aeronautics (SOA)—pilots who go up in planes and drone pilots who sit behind desks wearing pilot suits. The SOA, with more than 600 students, is not seen on campus, as it has recently moved to a building adjacent to Lynchburg Regional Airport.

Liberty's campus looks new and attractive, large enough for some 12,000 students, swarming with blue campus buses, and heavy on sports facilities for the Liberty Flames. A campus bookstore prominently displays Resilient Warriors, a book by Associate Vice President for Military Outreach Maj. Gen. (Ret.) Robert F. Dees. There's new construction everywhere you look: a $50 million library, a baseball stadium, new dorms, a tiny year-round artificial ski slope on the top of a hill. In fact, Liberty is sitting on more than $1 billion in net assets.

The major source of Liberty's money is online education. There are some 60,000 Liberty students you don't see on campus, because they study via the internet. They also make Liberty the largest university in Virginia, the fourth largest online university anywhere, and the largest Christian university in the world.

More than 23,000 online students are in the military—twice as many as students who live on campus. Liberty offers extra financial support to veterans and those on active duty, allowing them to be credited for knowledge learned in the military and to study online from a war zone.

Liberty has been turning out "Christ-centered aviators" for a decade. In fall 2011, Liberty added a concentration in Unmanned Aerial Systems (UAS, aka drones), making it one of the first handful of schools to do this. Now at least 14 universities and colleges in the U.S. have permits from the Federal Aviation Administration to fly drones, and many institutions, including community colleges, offer drone training.

If one chooses to concentrate studies on piloting drones, the load will include a half dozen courses on "intelligence." Liberty students can also pick up a minor in strategic intelligence and take courses in terrorism and counterterrorism. (Liberty's school of government brags that Newt Gingrich helped develop its course on "American exceptionalism.")

Currently, the vast percentage of drone pilots are training for war, but that is widely expected to change in the next few years. Congress has instructed the FAA to integrate drones into U.S. domestic airspace by September 2015.

Liberty's School of Aeronautics has six faculty members, five of whom have spent 15 to 30 years in the military—four in the Air Force, one in the Navy. Dave Young, dean of the SOA, spent 29 years in the Air Force and retired as a brigadier general. Last summer, Virginia Gov. Bob McDonnell appointed Young to serve on the Virginia Aviation Board.

"[Drones] are going to be a viable part of the aviation industry," Young said in a Liberty Journal article last summer. "It offers a grand opportunity for employment during a time when college graduates are entering a highly competitive job market." He also acknowledged that the technology could be misused. "Our mission is to produce graduates who are not only skilled, but who are going to go out in the world as strong Christians," Young said.

John Marselus, SOA associate dean, concurred. "We want to have graduates serving the Lord in this area of aviation," he said.

I exchanged emails with Young about Liberty's drone program. He described it as a four-year degree program in Unmanned Aerial Systems and said that it includes "flying UAS vehicles in an authorized and controlled environment." But, he added, "the focus on the program is not only on actual drone operations, but the command and control aspect, management of resources, and the various missions that UAS are capable of supporting."

The Virginia legislature recently became the first in the nation to impose a moratorium on drone use—lasting two years. That might have been a concern for Liberty. But before he would sign the bill, Gov. McDonnell made some exceptions to the drone ban, including emphasizing quite strongly that educational drone programs, including Liberty's, would not be affected.

"We very much appreciate the governor's continuing support of the development of the Unmanned Aerial Systems presence in the Commonwealth," Young wrote to me. "Particularly as it is a rather contentious issue due to the lack of understanding concerning the missions UAS can perform that aid the public at a much reduced cost."

I asked Young about drones' most common use today, namely war fighting. "Is that kind of drone use Christian?" I asked.

"I can only offer my perspective as a Christian," he replied. "UAS are like any other aerial vehicle that can be used for a variety of missions including law enforcement, aerial surveillance, search and rescue, and crop spraying as well as for military reasons. As a former military combat aviator, I believe that UAS can be employed just like a manned aircraft and that there should not be a distinction between the two."

A brochure promoting the Liberty School of Aeronautics features a photo of Dan McCready, First Lieutenant USAF, who is quoted, "Since I was very young, I've dreamed about becoming a pilot in the U.S. Air Force. Liberty's aviation program gave me the opportunity to make my dream a reality, helping me to realize that I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me."

Tim Carentz obtained his undergraduate degree from Liberty, works for the Air Force now, and is pursuing a master's in divinity from Liberty. Carentz told me he could not speak for the Air Force, but as a Liberty student and a pastor he believes "it's biblical to have a national pride."

"I believe authorities are put in place with the approval of God," Carentz assured me. "If he didn't want them there, he could easily remove them."

He also discussed how good members of the military can be and how there are opportunities for evangelism.

"If there were no Christians in the military, how would they instill love and discipline?" he said. "There are people pulled right from the ghetto who have nothing and who come into the military. And maybe their first supervisor is a Christian, and he takes them to the foot of the cross and leads them to Christianity, and they share that with their family, and you save generations."

At Liberty, the military is considered a tool for Christian missionaries. But what, I asked, about killing people with drones?

"I can understand why some support [them], and I can understand why others don't support [them]. Our job is to pray," said Carentz, "and to understand that things will continue to get worse until Christ returns."

Richard Emery obtained a bachelor's in finance from Liberty and went to Afghanistan with the Air Force. But Emery left the military in 2010. He told me he was troubled by what he saw as a pursuit of vengeance rather than justice.

"I've thought about this a lot, how we're supposed to be forgiving and yet fight wars against enemies," he said. "We blame Osama bin Laden for what happened on Sept. 11; one time I was in Japan, and they had a picture of him in a urinal. You were supposed to pee on his face. I thought, 'I don't feel right about this.' I'm not going after some kind of vendetta. I just want to bring justice. You're supposed to be forgiving, but you're supposed to do your job. I'm not going over there holding a grudge against Osama bin Laden. All the people we're killing, you know, I'd like to see them get saved."

"I have no problem taking another person's life," said Emery, "if it would promote peace and liberty and the interest of the country we're in. I have no problem giving my life for it. I'd end up going to heaven, so it doesn't really bother me. But it becomes a problem when I start to doubt what we're there for."

Emery proposed the nuclear bombing of Japan as a model for how Afghanistan should be handled. "It was painful, but we dropped a couple of atomic weapons and they quit fighting, and now Japan is one of our closest allies."

Emery expressed general disagreement with President Obama on "moral issues" until I asked about drones, and then he praised him.

"They're cheaper. They're effective. They're tiny," he said. "The difference between an F-15 and a drone is just the cost. If a baby is killed by a drone or an F-15 or a gun, the problem is with the intelligence, not with the drone."

Emery, however, was clear on one thing. He doesn't want drones patrolling our own skies or listening in on our cell phone conversations. In the view of this graduate, and others at Liberty, that wouldn't be a godly thing to do.

David Swanson, host of Talk Nation Radio, is the author of War is a Lie and When the World Outlawed War.
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Drones for Christ

Postby Allegro » Thu Jun 20, 2013 1:49 pm

crikkett » Thu Jun 20, 2013 10:53 am wrote:http://sojo.net/magazine/2013/07/drones-christ
Drones for Christ
by David Swanson | July 2013

How Jerry Falwell's Liberty U.—the world's largest Christian university—became an evangelist for drone warfare.
O.M.G., crikkett. I’ve repeated the link to the original article. Thank you for posting. There’s already evidence pointing to U.S. Christian fundamentalist militarism in the Pentagon and Department of Defense, and, perhaps in the Department of Justice. It looks like I’ll have to review and reconstruct the below references since some unconcealments of NSA actions, alleged or not, have mounted.

Tag: aerospace, airspace
Robert F. Dees.

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REFERENCES ARE PERIODICALLY ADDED: The Prosperity Gospel; Prosperity Theology | White Savior Industrial Complex | Joshua Project | 1040 Window | Campus Crusade for Christ | Focus on the Family | American Family Association | Family Research Council | The Family | Chaplains Alliance for Religious Liberty | Opus Dei | Dominion Theology | Reconstructionism | Christian Fundamentalism | Christian Dispensationalism | Christian Evangelism | Pentecostalism | Muscular Christianity | Fellowship of Christian Athletes

National Association of Evangelicals | World Vision International | Traditional Values Coalition | Christian Coalition of America | International Center for Religion & Diplomacy | International Christian Concern | National Christian Foundation | Evangelical Council for Financial Accountability | ONE Campaign


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Edit: added a tag
Thanks, conniption.
Last edited by Allegro on Thu Jun 20, 2013 2:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby conniption » Thu Jun 20, 2013 2:00 pm

With God on Our Side

6:09 min

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eKEe3VzA4Y
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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby elfismiles » Fri Jun 21, 2013 3:29 pm

FBI has received aviation clearance for at least four domestic drone operations (Video)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/nat ... story.html

Newly developed micro robot bird able to perform reconnaissance, surveillance (Video)
http://www.myfoxdc.com/story/22654036/n ... rveillance

Hawk attacks drone bird...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjOWpwbnmTw
Complete individual wing control allows crazy aerobatics like back flips and dives, previously not possible with mechanical birds! Hawk attack at 1:49.

Check out Dr. S.K. Gupta's blog for the full story: http://unorthodoxideas.blogspot.com

Music written and recorded by Luke Roberts.
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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby seemslikeadream » Sat Jun 22, 2013 10:34 am

[url=http://warisacrime.org/content/anti-drone-activists-stopped-us-canadian-border-due-“orders-protection”-given-court-commande]Anti-Drone Activists Stopped at U.S. Canadian Border due to “Orders of Protection” given by court to Commander of Drone Base[/url]
By davidswanson - Posted on 22 June 2013

By Charley Bowman

In mid-June, 2013, Western New York Peace Center board member Valerie Niederhoffer was stopped and interrogated for several hours at the U.S.-Canadian border when returning to the US from an afternoon doing Tai Chi in Canada with friendsi.

The U.S. immigration and customs officer entered Val's name into his computer system and discovered Val had an Order of Protection. He then asked her to pull over for an extended interview.

Orders of Protection (restraining orders) are generally given for spousal abuse, but this unique Order of Protection has been given to activists who have been arrested for challenging the U.S. assassin drone policies.

In a Gandhian action at the Drone Convergence on April 29, 2013 at Hancock Field near Syracuse NY, Valerie Niederhoffer and 30 others were arrested at the main gate. The 31 arrestees were protesting our government's drone policy by lying down in front of the main entrance to the Hancock Field drone base and covering themselves with "bloodied" sheets.

The protests at Hancock Field have been going on since 2010, with the first arrests on April 22, 2011. Town of DeWitt NY authorities are trying to discourage such non-violent protests through judicial means. The current judicial methodology is two fold: upping bail for repeat "offenders" and applying an "Order of Protection".

Western New York Peace Center board member Bonny Mahoney was charged $2,500 for bail and Peace Center member Russell Brown, $2,000. First-time arrestee Val was charged $500 for bail.

The WNY Peace Center bailed our Bonny and Russell, while the Peace Education Fund of Riverside Salem UCC/DC bailed out Valerie.

Val was charged with two crimes: disorderly conduct and obstructing governmental administration in the second degree.

The latter charge read".....Valerie Niederhoffer, after being advised by Onondaga County Sheriff's Deputy .... to disperse and get out of the roadway, they [sic] refused and they [sic] continued to intentionally cause public inconvenience, annoyance by congregating with other persons in a public place, standing in the roadway obstructing/blocking vehicular and pedestrian traffic from entering and exiting the NY Air National Guard base entrance at E. Molloy Rd T/o Dewitt [sic]. This action prevented the Onondaga County Sheriff's Office from performing an official governmental function of keeping the road way clear for vehicular traffic and to prevent injuries to protestors/pedestrians. "

Val received a temporary "ORDER OF PROTECTION" (non-family offence -- not involving victims of domestic violence).

In Val's Order of Protection, the victim of Val's alleged act of non-domestic violence, was Col. Greg A. Semmel, Commander of Hancock Field 174th Drone Attack Wing.

The Order of Protection continued….."It is hereby ordered that [Val] observe the following conditions of behavior:

1. "Stay away from Col. Greg A. Semmel, the home of Col. Greg A. Semmel, the business of Col. Greg A. Semmel, the place of employment of Col. Greg A. Semmel and other [sic] Col. Greg A. Semmel."

2. "Refrain from communication or any other contact by mail, telephone, e-mail, voice -mail or other electronic or any other means with Col. Greg A. Semmel."

3. "Refrain from assault, stalking, harassment, aggravated harassment, menacing, reckless endangerment, strangulation, criminal obstruction of breathing or circulation, disorderly conduct, criminal mischief, sexual abuse, sexual misconduct, forcible touching, intimidation, threats or any criminal offense or interference with the victim ....members of family, household ....."

4. "Refrain from intentionally injuring or killing without justification the following companion animal(s), pet(s):........"

5. "Surrender any and all handguns, pistols, revolvers, rifles, shotguns and other firearms owned or possessed...."

6. " .....other conditions defendant must observe for the purposes of protection: No contact at all" "....this order of protection shall remain in force until and including 04/28/14"

If Val fails to observe this Order of Protection, she may be put in jail for 7 years. There are several problems with the Order of Protection. Val (and 30 others) are clueless as tp what Col. Greg Semmel looks like, where he lives, if he's married, or if he has a dog and/or cat.

Secondly, there has never been a nano-hint of a wisp of violence at any of the Hancock Field vigils, and no one knows if Col. Semmel observed the vigil behind the fence at Hancock Field. More likely, he was enjoying time with family/friends that sunny Sunday afternoon. In all probability, Town of DeWitt Court Judge Donald Benack, Jr. knew this prior to signing the many Orders of Protection.

Whether he was present or not, Col. Semmel is perhaps the most protected person in the history of jurisprudence ever to benefit from a restraining order protecting him from silent prone/supine civilians covered with “bloodied” sheets.

And what does "...other Col. Greg A. Semmel" mean? If Val thinks of Col. Semmel, is she committing a crime? If Val drives the Thruway through Syracuse NY, is she committing a crime? Is Val violating the Order of Protection by living in Buffalo NY? Maybe Col. Semmel lives in Buffalo NY....who knows? And so traveling back to the US from Canada can be a problem for people with restraining orders.

Val waited an hour prior to her interview with the Border Patrol. The agent, charged with protecting the United States of America from terrorists, wanted to know why Val had such an order. Val began describing the drone base at Hancock Field, the extrajudicial killing in Afghanistan, the many arrests at the peaceful protests at Hancock Field, why such killing is illegal, etc. The agent allowed Val entry to the US.

No doubt the Border Patrol agent has heard all the stories sexual assault, abuse, strangulation, criminal obstruction of breathing and forcible touching from many served with a restraining order -- and allowed them entry into the United States too.

Although the delay put a dent in Val’s afternoon, there is a silver lining in Val's story: there can be no doubt the agent is text messaging and facebooking all his colleagues and friends saying...."You won't believe what I just heard!".

Getting the word out about our drone policies has always been a serious problem. So it's vital to utilize other means of communications from reliable sources. Unwittingly, Val did just that that afternoon, following Tai Chi exercises with friends.

About the Author: Charley Bowman has been the interim executive director of the Western New York Peace Center, Buffalo, New York since 2011. He receive a PhD in cell biology in 1982. From 1982 to 1986, he worked on the electrical properties of brain cells in a laboratory at Albany Medical College before moving to Buffalo in January 1987 to continue work on brain cells at the University of Buffalo.
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby elfismiles » Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:14 pm

Dronestream: Every US drone strike

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WypX2FHf7eU

Published on Jun 21, 2013

Excerpts of Josh Begley's graduate thesis presentation. Filmed at New York University. Full version here: http://vimeo.com/67691389

http://twitter.com/dronestream

www.DroneStre.am
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Re: One Drone Thread to Rule them ALL

Postby elfismiles » Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:03 pm


Local 6 finds drone hovering over Central Florida (Video)
Lawmaker now looking into video voyeurism concerns
Author: Matt Papaycik, Producer, mpapaycik@wkmg.com
Published On: Jun 24 2013 11:12:36 PM EDT Updated On: Jun 25 2013 09:09:38 AM EDT

ALTAMONTE SPRINGS, Fla. - Local 6 has obtained nearly two hours of footage from a small, unmanned drone that was hovering over Central Florida -- watching and recording people.

It literally fell out of the sky, crashing into a tree, where a Local 6 employee found it and turned it over.

On the high-definition GoPro camera that was attached to the drone, you can see each flight starts innocently enough. But you can see the potential for bad behavior.
In one shot, the drone races toward an apartment window, getting within feet of the glass.

In another shot, the drone hovers over a female sunbather at a pool. She's completely unaware that it's there, and she never looks up.

But the scariest shot of all shows the drone wobbling high over I-4 as cars zoom by down below. The drivers have no idea that the drone was out of control at that point, and only seconds away from crashing.

There are also shots of the pilot. By carefully analyzing the footage, we discovered exactly where he lives -- an apartment in Altamonte Springs, right next to I-4.

His name is Guimy Alexis -- a student who built the drone, and many other.

"The only thing I want to do is essentially record a flight, put some music on it, and put it on YouTube," says Alexis. "There's nothing nefarious going on."

But Alexis also admits that there easily could be something nefarious going on if the controls get into the wrong hands.

"I worry that someone will do something stupid," says Alexis. "But if someone does do something stupid, they're the bad apple, the bad egg. They're the exception, they're not the vast majority of us. The vast majority of us just do this for fun."

But what happened to Jimmy and his drone was not part of the fun. The electronics on board interfered with each other, giving the drone a mind of its own, and sending it -- of all places -- over I-4.

"It's right above me, I'm just looking at it, and it just flies off, and I can't control it," says Alexis.

He also couldn't see it, which is illegal. Under regulations from the Federal Aviation Administration, you can only fly a radio-controlled aircraft if it's in your line of sight.

Jimmy is fully aware of the rules, and insists that this was just an accident. In fact, he swears that it's never happened before.

"I was worried when it did go next to the highway, and that was a fear," says Alexis. "I don't trust it anymore, I'll tell you that much."

"I would not be surprised at all if people are abusing this technology," says State Representative Dana Young, (R) Tampa. Young created Florida's video voyeurism law last year, which makes it illegal to secretly record someone for arousal, amusement, or abuse.

Rep. Young is afraid that could happen with drones that cost as little as $300.

"From watching your investigative report, now that I know about this technology, and now that I can see that the limits are almost nonexistent, it does make me want to go back and look at the law we passed last year, and see if there are ways to tweak it," says Rep. Young.

As of now, there's only one piece of legislation in Florida that deals with this technology. It regulates how police agencies, not regular people, can use drones.



http://www.clickorlando.com/news/local- ... index.html
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