Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby justdrew » Thu May 09, 2013 3:11 am

GOP Star Witnesses Debunk Right-Wing Benghazi Conspiracy Theories[url][/url]
By Hayes Brown on May 8, 2013 at 5:00 pm


The “whistleblowers” at today’s House Oversight Committee hearing on what really happened in Benghazi, Libya last September were supposed to break the dam that would lead to President Obama’s eventual downfall, in the eyes of conservatives. Instead, these witness actually served to debunk several theories that the right-wing has pushed on Benghazi, leaving the hearing a fizzle for the GOP:

1. F-16s could have been sent to Benghazi

Part of the prevailing theory surrounding the events the night of the Benghazi attacks is that the Obama administration did not do enough militarily to respond to the crisis. Gregory Hicks — a Foreign Service Officer and the former Deputy Chief of Mission at the U.S. Embassy in Libya — claimed during his pre-hearing testimony that fighter jets could have been flown over Benghazi, preventing the second wave of the attack from occurring.

Ranking Member Rep. Elijah Cummings (D-MD) questioned that statement, asking Hicks whether he disagreed with Chairman of the Joint Chief of Staff Gen Martin Dempsey’s assessment that no air assets were in range the night of the attack. Hicks didn’t disagree, saying he was “speaking from [his] perspective” and what “veteran Libyan revolutionaries” told him, rather than Pentagon assessments.

2. Hillary Clinton signed cables denying additional security to Benghazi

House Republicans came to the conclusion in their interim report on Benghazi that former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton lied to them about what she knew and when during her testimony this January. This includes her statement that at no time was she aware of requests for additional security at the diplomatic facility in Benghazi prior to the attack.

Rep. Carolyn Maloney (D-NY) used her time to take issue with this claim, asking all three witnesses about standard protocol for cables leaving the State Department. All three agreed with Maloney, that the Secretary of State’s name is placed at the bottom of all outgoing cables and telegrams from Foggy Bottom, whether the Secretary has viewed them or not, shooting down the GOP claim.

3. A Special Forces Team that could have saved lives was told to stand down

One of the most shocking reveals in the lead-up to today’s hearing was that a team of Special Forces in Tripoli were told not to deploy to Benghazi during the attack. That decision has led to an uproar on the right, including claims of dereliction of duty towards Joint Chiefs of Staff chairman Gen. Martin Dempsey for not taking actions that could have saved lives.

During questioning, Hicks confirmed that the team was ready to be deployed — not to join the fighting at the CIA annex — but “to secure the airport for the withdrawal of our personnel from Benghazi after the mortar attack.” Hicks also confirmed that it was the second such team to be readied for deployment, with the first having proceeded to Benghazi earlier. Despite the second team not deploying, the staff was all evacuated first to Tripoli, then to Germany, within 18 hours of the attack taking place.

4. The State Department’s Accountability Review Board isn’t legitimate

Republicans have been attacking the State Department’s official in-house review of the shortcomings seen before, during, and after the assault in Benghazi. That criticism prompted House Republicans to write their own report. When asked point blank about the recommendations of the Board, however, the witnesses didn’t cooperate with the GOP narrative. “Absolutely,” Eric Nordstrom, the Regional Security Officer for Libya prior to the assault in Benghazi, answered when asked if he believes implementing the recommendations would improve security. “I had an opportunity to review that along with other two committee reports. I think taken altogether, they’re fairly comprehensive and reasonable.” Hicks, when questioned, said that while he had some issues with the process by which the Board gathered its information, he demurred on criticizing the report itself.
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby 8bitagent » Thu May 09, 2013 3:49 am

‘The policy of guiding the evolution of Islam and of helping them against our adversaries worked marvelously well in Afghanistan against the Red Army. The same doctrines can still be used to destabilize what remains of Russian power, and especially to counter the Chinese influence in Central Asia.

- Graham Fuller

Yes, Russia, Syria, etc commit attrocities. As did Bosnia, Iraq, etc. But its interesting how strategically it seems to work out when hardcore Islamic militants help destabilize America's enemies.
So when we hear Libya's consulate was attacked, are these the same Islamic militants the US is supporting? I don't call this blowback at all, but intended consequences.

Its long been my belief that most 9/11 truthers miss the real question. The real question is not "was al Qaeda behind 9/11" but who truly controls and manipulates al Qaeda and Sunni extremism worldwide?
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby FourthBase » Thu May 09, 2013 3:55 am

Okay, okay, so maybe it was a setup. Maybe it's fake joke-store donkey poop being solemnly investigated, and the real hill of elephant crap is lurking behind a bush, stinking so bad it makes it seem like the fake donkey crap is the one that stinks. So, let's investigate Benghazi to the umpteenth degree, then, right?
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby justdrew » Thu May 09, 2013 4:25 am

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ansar_al-Sharia_%28Libya%29

Ahmed Abu Khattala, one main leader-type in the nebulous Ansar al-Sharia. Well, let's find out WHY he was released from jail shortly before the 'revolution' he helped start started.

At this point is sounds to me like he was released shortly after the infamous Graham, McCain & Lieberman trip to Libya. Did they encourage his release in any way officially or unofficially?



Khattala was a member of the Islamist opposition when Muammar Gaddaffi was alive and was imprisoned in the notorious Abu Salim jail. He was released last year and helped the rebels topple Gaddafi from power.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2219483/Islamist-group-leader-Ahmed-Abu-Khattala-named-mastermind-U-S-consulate-massacre-Benghazi.html



on edit:
I'm seeing other reports indicating he was released BY revolutionaries rather than by Gaddaffi.

I don't know :shrug:
Last edited by justdrew on Thu May 09, 2013 4:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby justdrew » Thu May 09, 2013 4:53 am

you know, it's incredibly hard to know what the fuck is ever going on about anything. and that's an understatement.

anyway, start with Ahmed Abu Khattala (various other spellings exist), he apparently admits at least being in the attack, if not leading it. but it's remarkable he apparently goes on with life A-OK after seeing his friends wiped out, the attackers lost at least 75% of they're force, 3 out of 4 died. Although most of that was only after attacking the CIA annex.

If google would fix their damn news search so it would ACTUALLY honor the time ranges specified it would be a hell of a lot easier. I suppose maybe we should take up a fund and buy a lexis/nexus account or something. Probably too expensive.

Anyway, going much deeper is unlikely to yield results and there are many people getting paid to research this, so I'm done for now. Maybe I'll look into it more later. Not sure what's up. You'd think the US would have killed Ahmed Abu Khattala by now. But no. Why? Well, the delay sure seems to be making some republicans nervous as hell.
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby Hunter » Thu May 09, 2013 10:41 am

justdrew wrote:you know, it's incredibly hard to know what the fuck is ever going on about anything. and that's an understatement.

anyway, start with Ahmed Abu Khattala (various other spellings exist), he apparently admits at least being in the attack, if not leading it. but it's remarkable he apparently goes on with life A-OK after seeing his friends wiped out, the attackers lost at least 75% of they're force, 3 out of 4 died. Although most of that was only after attacking the CIA annex.

If google would fix their damn news search so it would ACTUALLY honor the time ranges specified it would be a hell of a lot easier. I suppose maybe we should take up a fund and buy a lexis/nexus account or something. Probably too expensive.

Anyway, going much deeper is unlikely to yield results and there are many people getting paid to research this, so I'm done for now. Maybe I'll look into it more later. Not sure what's up. You'd think the US would have killed Ahmed Abu Khattala by now. But no. Why? Well, the delay sure seems to be making some republicans nervous as hell.

And that is kinda what I was getting at Drew, its hard to know wtf is going on, I am not saying Obama is behind though I dont think his hands are clean, this could very well be another neo con set up. The whole thing stinks and I hope whoever is behind it is exposed but that seems unlikely.
Last edited by Hunter on Thu May 09, 2013 10:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby seemslikeadream » Thu May 09, 2013 10:48 am

justdrew wrote: Well, the delay sure seems to be making some republicans nervous as hell.


No...what makes republicans nervous as hell is that a black man is in the White House and a white WOMAN is going to be the next president...and she will appoint the next 2 to the Supreme Court

that and that alone is why
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby seemslikeadream » Thu May 09, 2013 10:55 am

when we get to the bottom of who did 9/11 2001 then we can move on to Benghazi

Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby seemslikeadream » Thu May 09, 2013 12:51 pm

What Darrell Issa really wants out of Benghazi hearing
I worked on the GOP lawmaker's House oversight committee. He wasn't exactly known for his zest for oversight
BY ANTHONY CLARK

According to Darrell Issa, the Chairman of the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, his hearing on Benghazi Wednesday was designed to reveal, among other potentially “explosive” points, that he has evidence of the Administration’s “premeditated lying to the American people.” Issa previously said that there’s “no question” that someone from Hillary Clinton’s “circle” was involved in a “cover-up” following the attack on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi.

How seriously should Americans take Issa’s hearing and claims?

For almost four years, I worked in close proximity to him, first on the Democratic staff of the Oversight Committee (when he was Ranking Member) and then as Legislative Director for a senior Member of the Committee, when he was Chairman. Here’s what I learned: If Darrell Issa says something – based on the record, his statements, and my personal observations of him up-close – there is a strong likelihood it will be baseless and easily disproven.

Others have covered many aspects of his story. They have written about his alleged misdeeds, before and after he entered Congress. They have ably discussed Issa’s illegal disclosure of wiretaps; his irresponsible release of sensitive unredacted State Department documents; his political misuse of official funds; his use of his public office for personal gain; his inability to be honest about his own military service record; his treatment of his private business partners; his youthful (and not-so-youthful) experimentations with borrowing other people’s cars without permission; his failed attempt to recall and succeed Gray Davis as governor of California (and his Boehner-esque acceptance of his failure); his characterization of the September 11 attacks as “simply a plane crash”; and his disregard for tradition, House rules, and plain decency in the selection of Democratic Minority witnesses.

Sure, these and other issues call into serious question Issa’s integrity, or fitness to serve in the United States Congress, much less Chair a House committee vested with personal subpoena power.

But I’d like to look instead at Darrell Issa, Oversight Chairman. More so than most Republicans who’ve held that post – particularly in opposition to the party controlling the White House – he is exceedingly unsuccessful. (Full disclosure: right after I started on the Oversight Committee, Issa protested my appointment because I had been critical of the Reagan Foundation’s efforts at political hagiography; nonetheless, I remained on the job.)

Observing him, it quickly became clear that, like all bullies, Issa is not prepared to fight. He counts on his opponents to back down. His M.O. is to make outrageous, unsubstantiated claims, follow them with a lot of bluster, and then quietly fold at the first sign of being challenged. And here’s his “tell”: the more bombastic he is, the more he hungrily seeks out the cameras, the more he promises “explosive revelations,” the less he actually has. Bullies don’t win fights; they win defaults. Push back just the tiniest bit, and it’s all over.

Even before Republicans took over the House after the 2010 elections, Issa made bold, empty assertions. He called President Obama “one of the most corrupt presidents in modern times.” He boasted that he would hold “seven hearings a week, times 40 weeks” (that would be 560 hearings in just one Congress). He claimed he would save taxpayers $200 billion by rooting out waste, fraud and abuse. He said that he planned hundreds of investigations (he even promised to go after George W. Bush – which, not surprisingly, he has yet to do).

More than two years later, Issa hasn’t met any of his goals. Almost immediately, he was forced to walk back his baseless “corruption” charge. In the 112th Congress, he didn’t call as many hearings as Henry Waxman, Democratic Chairman, held during the last two years of the Bush Administration. Now, with Benghazi, he says he really has something solid. Just like he did with Solyndra. And “job-killing” regulations. And Fast and Furious. The list goes on.

The effectiveness of any committee is measured first by its legislative output and second by the quality and success, or failure, of its investigations. In the first instance, it’s about those bills that pass through the committee and become law, not the bills that are introduced and referred to the committee (thousands are introduced each session of Congress). And it’s not about the bills that the committee sends to the Floor but that never pass. It’s about the laws that are enacted. In the second instance, it’s about how you investigate as much as it is about what or whom. On both measures, Issa’s record speaks for itself.

His committee not only has jurisdiction to investigate the federal government, but is the authorizing body for a wide range of federal agencies and programs. So has he successfully shepherded bills to root out waste, fraud and abuse? To make the government more efficient? To create more jobs? To save taxpayers money? His first, and what I guess must be called his most significant legislative accomplishment to date, was extending the charter for the Ronald Reagan Centennial Commission.

That’s right. Despite his extravagant claims and his loud calls for accountability, after six months of empty threats, by June 2011 the only bill from his committee to be enacted into law was H.R. 1308, to extend the Commission’s termination date. Well, that, and one bill renaming a post office.

By June 29, 2012 – the date of Issa’s Third Semiannual Activities Report – after eighteen months of partisan hearings and so-called investigations and inflammatory accusations, the total number of bills from his committee enacted into law was exactly four: The Reagan Centennial extension; the Civilian Service Recognition Act (authorizing the presentation of a flag to the family of a federal employee killed in the line of duty); the Scholarships for Opportunity and Results Technical Corrections Act; and S. 1302, “a bill to authorize the Administrator of General Services to convey a parcel of real property in Tracy, California, to the City of Tracy.” Oh, and twenty-five additional postal renamings.

He hasn’t done much more. That is, other than the plan he engineered to hold Attorney General Eric Holder in contempt of Congress – the one that only brought shame on Issa, rather than his intended target. In his underlying “investigation” Issa ignored the pre-Obama origins of the Fast and Furious operation and appeared never to have any intention of getting to the bottom of Brian Terry’s death; he simply smelled “scandal,” took advantage of a tragedy and irresponsibly fanned the flames.

Issa’s also not what one might call a student of Congressional process. On July 14, 2011, during a hearing on the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, he became confused about subpoenas; as the only Chairman in the House to hold personal subpoena power, it was disconcerting to learn that he was unclear about such a basic – and, in this hearing, relevant – procedure. He recessed the hearing to consult with the House Parliamentarian. When the Committee reconvened, John Tierney, a Massachusetts Democrat and attorney, ably explained to Issa how subpoenas work, but Issa was getting more argumentative and/or lost. Tierney, clearly frustrated, finally asked Issa, “What part of the English language, sir, don’t you understand?” and drove home his point. Issa’s weak response was a timid, “I appreciate that.”

It’s not just hearings, Hill social functions, and Real Time with Bill Maher where Issa is awkward and ineffective. With his Chairmanship comes the responsibility to manage Committee bills on the Floor of the House, where he’s unfamiliar with proper procedure – odd, given his length of service and current position as Chairman. When Issa wings it, he just embarrasses himself.

My favorite example of this came on February 11, 2011, when the newly-empowered GOP staged a stunt on the House Floor to “debate” H.Res. 72, a non-binding resolution directing agencies to review their so-called “job killing” regulations. It had overwhelming support from both parties and passed the House the next day 391–28. Despite the fact that Democrats publicly announced their intention to vote for the resolution and requested that the GOP spend the time more effectively, the Majority went ahead with nine and an half hours of debate, divided among and controlled by the respective chairs and ranking minority members of the standing committees of the House.

I was on the Floor during this debate, staffing my boss (having written the statement he would give as a Member of the Oversight Committee). When it came time for Chairman Issa to control the time, he didn’t handle it well – especially not when Democrats were allowed to speak. He became argumentative and testy, nitpicking minor items about what the Majority said.

After my boss finished speaking, Issa was visibly upset, and tried to do something very serious, and rare: have a Member’s words taken down as “inappropriate.” This is a procedure that, if successful, not only strikes the words from the Record but prevents the Member from speaking on the Floor again that day without the permission of the House.

Except, unsure of himself and of the rules – and whether Clay’s statement did indeed violate House rules (it didn’t) Issa messed up the entire thing. He asked hypothetical questions (not in order), never had the courage to actually move that Clay’s words be taken down, and ended up muttering something about the words being “likely to have been inappropriate.” Here’s the official transcript from the Congressional Record:

Congressional Record, Page H703 – February 11, 2011

(Video, beginning at 2:52:52)

Mr. ISSA: Madam Speaker, I have a parliamentary inquiry.

The SPEAKER pro tempore: The gentleman will state his inquiry.

Mr. ISSA: Under the rules of the House, isn’t it true that the limitation on taking down somebody’s words based on casting aspersions or specific actions against an individual, for example, not caring about Americans or wanting children to die for lack of regulation – isn’t it true that we can only do that if they cite a person, not the Republican Party as a whole?

The SPEAKER pro tempore: The Chair does not respond to such a hypothetical question.

Mr. ISSA: Further parliamentary inquiry, Madam Speaker.

The SPEAKER pro tempore: The gentleman will state his inquiry.

Mr. ISSA: Would it be in order for me to bring a motion to take down the words based on that accusation that was just made against my entire party, alleging that we want to roll back so that children are not protected and the like?

The SPEAKER pro tempore: The Chair can not issue an advisory opinion. Is the gentleman from California making such a demand?

Mr. ISSA: Would it be in order for me to make such a demand?

The SPEAKER pro tempore: The Chair can not respond to such a hypothetical question. If a demand is made, the Chair will follow the regular process.

Mr. ISSA: Madam Speaker, I think we’re bigger than those accusations, regardless of it being likely to have been inappropriate by any standard. With that, I yield 2 minutes to the gentlewoman from New York.

That’s Darrell Issa, Oversight Chairman. The one Democrats are supposed to fear.
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby seemslikeadream » Thu May 09, 2013 1:07 pm

Rush recently made headlines for a "sarcastic" tweet he sent following the Boston Marathon bombings saying that all Muslims should be killed. Despite his history of outrageous commentary, Rush has made repeated appearances on Fox News, including several on Hannity (Rush has also appeared on Sean Hannity's radio program).

WND has a long history of publishing outrageous conspiracy theories. The site has been the main proponent of conspiracy theories about President Obama's birth certificate. More recently, WND columnist Bradlee Dean suggested the mass shooting in Newtown was staged in order to aid the passage of the UN Arms Trade Treaty. In addition to Rush, the site also publishes writers like NRA Board Member Ted Nugent and former Republican presidential candidate Rick Santorum.


Conservative Columnist Thinks Obama "Orchestrated" Benghazi Attack
Blog ››› 1 hour and 53 minutes ago ››› BEN DIMIERO

Conservative columnist Erik Rush thinks President Obama or his administration "orchestrated" the attacks on the U.S. diplomatic compound in Benghazi.

In a column for conspiracy website WND, Rush writes that he has "always leaned in the direction of the administration having orchestrated the attack for reasons of its own" because of the president's supposed connections "to the Muslim Brotherhood and legendary understanding of all things Islamic."

As Right Wing Watch points out, Rush cites the "unresolved Trinity United murders" as evidence that Obama could be capable of planning such an attack. This is the outlandish conservative conspiracy that President Obama or his associates murdered members of Obama's old Chicago church in order to conceal his supposed hidden homosexuality.

From Rush's May 8 column:

I suppose that depends on two things: One, what is revealed in the hearings, and two, whom one asks. I have always leaned in the direction of the administration having orchestrated the attack for reasons of its own - given his connections to the Muslim Brotherhood and legendary understanding of all things Islamic, it is possible that President Obama could even have arranged for the assault on the compound without the foreknowledge of his Cabinet.

A bold charge, to be sure, but I am operating with such questions as the unresolved Trinity United murders before me. Then there are the possibilities that the tragedy came about as the result of less grave criminal action or a series of irresponsible and craven decisions.

The burning question at present (and which may remain so for some time) is why efforts were not made to rescue the beleaguered staff at the facility and whether or not a stand-down order was given to military personnel in the area. If the latter becomes the case, then obviously we want to know who issued the order. Depending on the outcome, measures might be as severe as charges filed against Cabinet officials or the impeachment of Obama himself. While this president reasonably deserves to be occupying a cell in some federal penitentiary anyway, impeachment presents many troublesome aspects.

Rush recently made headlines for a "sarcastic" tweet he sent following the Boston Marathon bombings saying that all Muslims should be killed. Despite his history of outrageous commentary, Rush has made repeated appearances on Fox News, including several on Hannity (Rush has also appeared on Sean Hannity's radio program).

WND has a long history of publishing outrageous conspiracy theories. The site has been the main proponent of conspiracy theories about President Obama's birth certificate. More recently, WND columnist Bradlee Dean suggested the mass shooting in Newtown was staged in order to aid the passage of the UN Arms Trade Treaty. In addition to Rush, the site also publishes writers like NRA Board Member Ted Nugent and former Republican presidential candidate Rick Santorum.
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby Canadian_watcher » Thu May 09, 2013 1:15 pm

nm
Satire is a sort of glass, wherein beholders do generally discover everybody's face but their own.-- Jonathan Swift

When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him. -- Jonathan Swift
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby FourthBase » Thu May 09, 2013 1:26 pm

Yeah, wow, Issa is a partisan assclown, to be sure, as we could all already tell. He sucks, lmao. I would literally rather listen to a WEEEE-OOOOOW-Weeeee-Owwwww kind of car alarm for ten minutes than him, almost always. Doesn't mean he can't be a proverbial broken clock. He might be right or half-right or a quarter right about Benghazi, probably despite his boneheaded self. Also, I don't see on his rap sheet the kind of heinous corruption to be found in most other Repubes. Just curious, point of order, lol:

They have ably discussed Assange’s illegal disclosure of wiretaps; his irresponsible release of sensitive unredacted State Department documents


They have ably discussed Manning’s illegal disclosure of wiretaps; his irresponsible release of sensitive unredacted State Department documents


Not equivalency-ing.

But, usually, those charges -- purely the words, at least -- get a somewhat warmer reception here.
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby lupercal » Thu May 09, 2013 1:28 pm

I don't know it's been mentioned but lately but it's hard to see Benghazi outside the double frame of US electoral politics (nasty coda to Hillary's SOS record, nasty October surprise aimed at sinking BO's reelection, which it nearly did) and international politics, i.e. the long march to Iran. Israel's recent attack on Damascus make it hard not to see them as a major player, but I still think it's mainly a UK policy, and has been since 1953.

...........................

On another note: Drew or Willow, or anyone, is it possible to log in and adjust the number of posts that show up in thread, making it say, 20 or 30 instead of 15? Hard to catch up on some of these longer ones . . . just wondering! :bigsmile
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby seemslikeadream » Thu May 09, 2013 1:34 pm

what's not going to get a warm reception for me here is bringing right wing conspiracy crap to this board as something to believe has any merit whatsoever...as if the old white male misogynistic bigoted theonomic reconstructionist fascismo wing bullshit has any truth in fact
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: Could somebody please explain Benghazi to me?!

Postby FourthBase » Thu May 09, 2013 1:38 pm

seemslikeadream wrote:what's not going to get a warm reception for me here is bringing right wing conspiracy crap to this board as something to believe has any merit whatsoever...as if the old white male misogynistic bigoted theonomic reconstructionist fascismo wing bullshit has any truth in fact


Ring-ring, ring-ring.

Epistemic closure is on the phone.

Asking for you. Sounds urgent.

Should I...?

Oh wait, someone else is calling, too...

Hello? Yes? Yes, they are. Okay.

Says the name is Cognitive Dissonance?

Does that name mean anything to you?
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