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For sometime now the right-wing media has been promoting a "Nazis as Leftists" meme. They are quick to point out that Nazism stood for "National Socialism", placing a special emphasis on the "Socialism" part.

Now there's one historical event that I've always felt contradicted this and I'm wondering if anyone can confirm that my understanding is correct:

June 30, 1934 - "The Night of the Long Knives"

This night saw the purge of the Sturmabeitlung (SA) from the Nazi regime. From my understanding the reason for this was a perception that the SA's leader, Ernest Roehm, posed a threat to Hitler's power. It is also to my understanding that Roehm took the "Socialism" in "National Socialism" a bit too seriously for the Nazis' liking, hence one of the reasons he was seen as a possible threat.

And a note: just to clarify - I'm not defending Roehm in anyway.

Now there's one historical event that I've always felt contradicted this and I'm wondering if anyone can confirm that my understanding is correct:

June 30, 1934 - "The Night of the Long Knives"

This night saw the purge of the Sturmabeitlung (SA) from the Nazi regime. From my understanding the reason for this was a perception that the SA's leader, Ernest Roehm, posed a threat to Hitler's power. It is also to my understanding that Roehm took the "Socialism" in "National Socialism" a bit too seriously for the Nazis' liking, hence one of the reasons he was seen as a possible threat.

that's pretty much the way i also understand things. Roehm and his follower were counting on a "second revolution" which made the industrialists who'd supported hitler very nervous. hitler was not about the let the second revolution happen.

by 1934 roehm was probably more powerful than hitler himself among the hardcore party rank and file, the old fighters and the freikorps vets that had stood by hitler since the putsch. what sealed roehm's fate and led to the purge was his demand that the SA be accorded status as the regular army, which offended the professional officer class of the german aristocracy.

hitler's particular political genius was to present his movement as a populist one, but his power was very specifically class-based. it rested on the agreement of industrialists and the army, and in many ways represented the desires of a military-industrial complex. national socialism was a corporate entity that convinced the german people it served their best interests, when in fact it was utterly elitist and self-interested. the parallels to the kind of class warfare the GOP has waged on middle america through its own popular rhetoric, with reagan as its mouthpiece and ideological godfather, are pretty astonishing. the night of the long knives is one of the key events of the twentieth century, not in the particulars of the purge itself per se, but in its demonstration of how power is consolidated in the hands of a few, and at the expense of many, through a carefully crafted appeal to emotion and prejudice based on utterly false pretenses.

Yeah, Kelley, I agree, the comparison between the way the Republican Party has siezed a lot of "middle America" by playing to God and guns is apt. Maybe that's because the Republican Party is full of ex-Nazis.
The Nazis *co-opted* socialism, which was widely popular in Germany. But it took very little time for the Nazis to expose themselves as the party of big business- funded by transnational capitalism, such as granddaddy Bush's Union Banking Corporation. The Nazis were a capitalist front army, and they assaulted populations which were poor and Leftist; the Jews were both, as well as the Serbs, etc. And, of course, they killed 30 million Russian communists, before the Russians eventually defeated them.
The Nazi eugenics effort post-war continued, through Operation Paperclip (etc.), as high-level Nazi scientists proliferated throughout the U.S., western Europe, and Latin America. Particularly, the Nazis took root in the Republican Party.

But the Republican party is the party of Lincoln! He freed the slaves!

With knowledge of history on my side and a healthy intuitive sense of others' feelings, I still have never been able to successfully argue the fallacy of that with anyone.

Wow. This thread was an eye-opener, I was totally unaware of this.

2010 is all about cheerfully admitting my own ignorance, I think. Been the smart kid for too damn long.

Not sure if I made myself clear in that comment, yet again. . . It's a problem I have.

Many a racist republican can be found arguing that, because they are republicans and so was Lincoln, that means ergo, it is impossible for them to be racist. That is the fallacy I have attempted to take on in the past to no avail. It's like throwing a second soccer ball onto a field of five year olds -- they'll chase after that one too.

Truth4Youth wrote:For sometime now the right-wing media has been promoting a "Nazis as Leftists" meme. They are quick to point out that Nazism stood for "National Socialism", placing a special emphasis on the "Socialism" part.

And the US is communist because it is a Republic, like the Peoples Republic of China, which is communist.

Standing in a garage doesn't make you a car...

Truth4Youth wrote:For sometime now the right-wing media has been promoting a "Nazis as Leftists" meme. They are quick to point out that Nazism stood for "National Socialism", placing a special emphasis on the "Socialism" part.

Now there's one historical event that I've always felt contradicted this

Just one event? Rightist love to claim the Nazis were leftist. They were ultra-rightists. Not a surprise because there is plenty of evidence they purged active socialist/communists like Ernest Roehm all the time. I don't believe this is a big revelation. North Korea is called the Democratic People's Republic of Korea. Doesn't mean it's Democratic, the People's, or a Republic.

and I'm wondering if anyone can confirm that my understanding is correct:

Correct, according to my understanding.

82_28 wrote:But the Republican party is the party of Lincoln! He freed the slaves!

With knowledge of history on my side and a healthy intuitive sense of others' feelings, I still have never been able to successfully argue the fallacy of that with anyone.

We didn't defeat the Nazis, we assimilated them.

There's so much irony in life.

The Nazis wanted people to think they were at times christian, "fighting occultism", when they were the perveyors of the blackest of occult groups and agendas. (they also tried to wipe out Freemasonry even tho they loved occult groups like the Vrill, Thule, etc)

The Nazis said they hated non whites, but were literally obsessed with Tibetan culture(yeah, go figure)

And Republicans today...isnt it funny how the American abortion agenda was for the longest time the creation of proto Nazi eugenicists trying to wipe out blacks...yet today, those who are the most anti abortion are often white supremest nutty republicans?

They claim to be "pro life", but have no problem seeing america, allies and Israel murder countless Muslim children.

And again, I have to wonder...who or *what* was really behind the Nazis. The Nazis and even Hitler himself seem like puppets themselves. One has to wonder if WW2 was orchestrated just to create Israel, the atom bomb, nukes, the cold war and many other things we saw materialized.

Occult Means Hidden wrote: North Korea is called the Democratic People's Republic of Korea. Doesn't mean it's Democratic, the People's, or a Republic.

discuss.

Just finished reading "Explaining Hitler" : recommended !

Dick Gregory at the 2002 COPA conference stated, in relation to his gay friends wanting to be more open about their sexuality, warned against it and cited the Nazi Night of the Long Knives as being a purge of a homosexual sect of the Nazi SS. He was of course comparing the Bush administration to the Nazi regime.