rigorousintuition.ca

I found this very enlightening. Despite extensive experience with the effects of zionist brainwashing, I really knew very little about how the process actually worked, and certainly never from such an 'insider's' point of view. The film-maker is an Israeli, a former soldier in the Occupied Territories, and a current member of the Israeli "peace camp". Although it hardly addresses the Palestinian question, and in fact never strays from the almost suffocatingly insular world of Jewish 'identity', this film can help to answer otherwise perplexing questions like: how do you transform normal-seeming, middle-class teenagers into coldblooded, brutal and murderous racist oppressors with an unshakable belief that they are the victim?

Through this hour and a half long video, the audience gets a unique opportunity to observe how self-appointed leaders of a very sectarian, self-obsessed subculture devote enormous resources to nurturing and perpetuating a disturbing and distorted world-view, for fun and profit, and in service of the monstrous state that genuinely does represent them. Throughout the film, we witness how members are encouraged to, as Gilad Atzmon has phrased it elsewhere, 'celebrate their symptoms':

[Ariel] Sharon, like Max Nordau, realised that Zionism is all about reviving Jewish solitude, Zionism is all about the re-invention of a metaphysical shtetl. Zionism should be grasped as the re-reading of the Ghetto narrative in glamorous, positive terms. The Ghetto, says Nordau, “was for the Jew of the past not a prison, but a refuge. …In the Ghetto, the Jew had his own world; it was to him the sure refuge which had for him the spiritual and moral value of a parental home.”

Sharon couldn’t agree more. He has managed to envisage what ‘Jewish craving’ was all about. It is the yearning for the tribal parental condition of the Jewish home. He has managed to internalise Nordau’s message: Zionism is all about the abolition of the ‘other’, the re-creation of the condition in which Jews can celebrate their symptoms, where they can love themselves for who they are. Or at least for who they think they are. Link

The entire film can be watched here:

http://www.informationclearinghouse.inf ... e24529.htm

or here:

http://pulsemedia.org/2010/01/26/yoav-s ... efamation/

AlicetheKurious wrote:I found this very enlightening.

yes very enlightening, too bad I cannot post the video where more people can see it. But that is the way of the internet world, is it not?

and I was banned from 2 websites for posting anti-semitic stuff, what a bunch of crap, I would like to state to the owners of DU and PI that I am not, never was never will be anti-semitic, JHC I am a child of the Irish Holocaust. There's been more than one holocaust on this planet. Not a good idea to wear it eternally on your sleeve or live in the past. Maybe the Native Americans could hire someone as compelling to protect and preserve their history

It is important to remember all the holocausts and all the many people affected, not as a rationale for perpetuating more abuses, more oppression, but rather to prevent them from continuing now or in the future.

"Never again!" means all of us, and the perpetuation and sanctification of a carefully story of "the Holocaust" in order to facilitate the ongoing abuses of the Israeli State is so wrong, it's hard to know where to start. Of course European Jews were victimized, and not just by Nazi leaders either, but how are we going to universalize our principles here and now?- that is the most important question. Norman Finkelstein does a good job of taking apart the myths concerned...


...

American Dream wrote:It is important to remember all the holocausts and all the many people affected, not as a rationale for perpetuating more abuses, more oppression but rather to prevent them form continuing now or in the future.

"Never again!" means all of us, .

yes all of us, regrettably others are drowned out, forgotten, aren't even allowed to use the word, or so it seems

seemslikeadream wrote:

AlicetheKurious wrote:I found this very enlightening.

yes very enlightening, too bad I cannot post the video where more people can see it. But that is the way of the internet world, is it not?

and I was banned from 2 websites for posting anti-semitic stuff, what a bunch of crap, I would like to state to the owners of DU and PI that I am not, never was never will be anti-semitic, JHC I am a child of the Irish Holocaust. There's been more than one holocaust on this planet. Not a good idea to wear it eternally on your sleeve or live in the past. Maybe the Native Americans could hire someone as compelling to protect and preserve their history

Eh, don't worry about it, slad. The way it's been set up by these self-appointed Masters of Discourse, you can either be a Judeo-supremacist zionist apologist for racism, ethnic cleansing and genocide, or a sniveling moral coward, or get called an "anti-semite". To me, it's a no-brainer.

Dershowitz: Goldstone is a traitor
JPOST.COM STAFF
31/01/2010 10:34

Top lawyer says conduct comparable to Jew endorsing Protocols of Elders of Zion.

Two days after Israel submitted its response to the Goldstone report that accused the IDF of possible crimes against humanity during last year's Operation Cast Lead, prominent lawyer and political commentator Professor Alan Dershowitz said that the jurist, someone he once considered a friend, was "a traitor to the Jewish people."

Speaking to Army Radio, Dershowitz said the “Goldstone report is a defamation written by an evil, evil man." ... Link

Atzmon's article that you linked is a strong read too.

This Israeli film has caused a lot of people to stop and think.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... nt=safari#

American Dream wrote:It is important to remember all the holocausts and all the many people affected, not as a rationale for perpetuating more abuses, more oppression, but rather to prevent them from continuing now or in the future.

"Never again!" means all of us, and the perpetuation and sanctification of a carefully story of "the Holocaust" in order to facilitate the ongoing abuses of the Israeli State is so wrong, it's hard to know where to start. Of course European Jews were victimized, and not just by Nazi leaders either, but how are we going to universalize our principles here and now?- that is the most important question. Norman Finkelstein does a good job of taking apart the myths concerned...


...

What myths?

The myths that the Nazi slaughter affected only or mostly Jews and that this kind of mass murder was a uniquely reprehensible event in all of history- these are two that stand out. They are of course used to leverage support for Israeli atrocities today.

See Norman Finkelstein's The Holocaust Industry for further thoughts on the subject.

American Dream wrote:The myths that the Nazi slaughter affected only or mostly Jews and that this kind of mass murder was a uniquely reprehensible event in all of history- these are two that stand out. They are of course used to leverage support for Israeli atrocities today.

See Norman Finkelstein's The Holocaust Industry for further thoughts on the subject.

So what other group lost more than 6 million or so at the hands of the Nazis?

I do think the Nazi genocide was a very, very serious crime- don't misunderstand my position.

While I don't think it's a simple number game, I believe that the Soviet Union lost 12 to 14 million in civilian deaths and 9 or 10 million in military casualties.

The main point though is that the Nazi Holocaust was not the only mass murder spree in all of history, and that the "official history" neglects a lot of very real victims.

These things do present a serious moral challenge to us all, and I'm not minimizing the importance, just pointing out that the mainstream telling is not the only, or necessarily the best, version of what happened...

American Dream wrote:I do think the Nazi genocide was a very, very serious crime- don't misunderstand my position.

While I don't think it's a simple number game, I believe that the Soviet Union lost 12 to 14 million in civilian deaths and 9 or 10 million in military casualties.

The main point though is that the Nazi Holocaust was not the only mass murder spree in all of history, and that the "official history" neglects a lot of very real victims.

These things do present a serious moral challenge to us all, and I'm not minimizing the importance, just pointing out that the mainstream telling is not the only, or necessarily the best, version of what happened...

Ok thanks. FWIW, I personally don't think I can accept the theory that Holocaust remembrance or renumeration is some kind of conspiracy to protect modern Israel. Fuck, a lot of Jews died and should be remembered and compensated. It may be that some Jews might attempt that just as some Jews might commit any behavior; but, an INDUSTRY? Give me a break.

I do agree that all the victims should be remembered and reparations made.

I don't though think that the very real crimes of the Nazis be used to condone and protect crimes of the Israeli State.

Really though- much better to check out something about Finkelstein's book if you want to understand his position.

American Dream wrote:I do agree that all the victims should be remembered and reparations made.

I don't agree that the very real crimes of the Nazis be used to condone and protect crimes of the Israeli State.

Really though- much better to check out something about Finkelstein's book if you want to understand his position.

I have read it. It's a pile of shit. Sorry.

We probably just see things very, very differently, and I'm not really interested in hashing it all out, but what's your opinion of the Israeli military campaigns in Gaza and Lebanon?

American Dream wrote:We probably just see things very, very differently, and I'm not really interested in hashing it all out, but what's your opinion of the Israeli military campaigns in Gaza and Lebanon?

They sadden me as all loss of life does.

Now what does that have to do with Finkelstein's archaic canard that a small group of Jews control world opinion and actions? I mean really, even if it's only Zionists he and others refer to isn't it a little ludicrous and deja vu to attribute that much power to such a small part of the world's population?