Bring Your Sidearms To The Banks of the Potomac.

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Re: Bring Your Sidearms To The Banks of the Potomac.

Postby barracuda » Sat May 15, 2010 2:39 am

23 wrote:...


Srill not even a quantum of solace.
The most dangerous traps are the ones you set for yourself. - Phillip Marlowe
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Re: Bring Your Sidearms To The Banks of the Potomac.

Postby AhabsOtherLeg » Sun May 23, 2010 7:29 pm

barracuda wrote:8000 home invasions every day? Wow. That's 2,920,000 per year.

One in five homes? Wow. That's 22,000,000 home invasions.

Sounds like an epidemic. Better be prepared to defend yourself.

But wait...

elfismiles wrote:Thursday, April 29, 2010
Behind the Arizona law and illegal immigration

... 200 home invasion assaults in a single year...

http://cuumbaya.blogspot.com/2010/04/be ... legal.html


The number of households in Arizona is almost two million. With only two hundred home invasions in a year? That's one in ten thousand.

No wonder everyone wants to live there.

(Those statistics have some 'splaining to do, 'cause I'm confused.)


I'm confused too, and it gets worse, because I've been reading up on the recent, increasingly frequent, rash of violent home invasions by armed men in the US.

4.5 SWAT Raids Per Day
Maryland's SWAT transparency bill produces its first disturbing results


Over the last six months of 2009, SWAT teams were deployed 804 times in the state of Maryland, or about 4.5 times per day. In Prince George's County alone, with its 850,000 residents, a SWAT team was deployed about once per day. According to a Baltimore Sun analysis, 94 percent of the state's SWAT deployments were used to serve search or arrest warrants, leaving just 6 percent in response to the kinds of barricades, bank robberies, hostage takings, and emergency situations for which SWAT teams were originally intended.

Worse even than those dreary numbers is the fact that more than half of the county’s SWAT deployments were for misdemeanors and nonserious felonies. That means more than 100 times last year Prince George’s County brought state-sanctioned violence to confront people suspected of nonviolent crimes.


If we take Prince George as being a typical county (I know - it's not), and Maryland as being a typical state (I don't know whether it is or not - I know there are huge variations between the states in how the laws are enacted and applied, and Maryland might be an extreme case, but bear with me here) then that means (multiplying 4.5 per day by the fifty states) that there are now ...

225 police SWAT raids per day, nationally, and 82125 police SWAT raids each year, nationally, in recent times. Approximately.

Those numbers sound a lot more realistic to me, and they also sound like a more realistic thing to fear, especially considering that:

They can threaten you and get away with it: http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/19/1967.asp

They can torture you and get away with it: http://open.salon.com/blog/kimhartman/2 ... d_buttocks

They can kill your dogs and get away with it: (the affidavit for the warrant to search Kinloch Court, Missouri, where the cops recently shot the dogs, can be found here): http://www.gocolumbiamo.com/Police/Docu ... arrant.pdf

Even if you are the mayor of the town: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 00884.html

They lie, both under oath and outwith it:
Prosecutors have dropped charges against a Myrtle Beach lawyer arrested in Five Points last year after the arresting officers refused to testify, fearing they might incriminate themselves. ...Prosecutors told the judge the three officers involved in McCoy's arrest refused to testify because they did not want to incriminate themselves and would simply plead the fifth. http://www.wistv.com/Global/story.asp?S=12517487


It helps if you're a lawyer.

But not if you are the mayor of the town: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 00884.html

Then just look at all the recent noise about how the 47-year-old grandmother of Aiyana Stanley-Jones was (according to the original police and media story) able to shrug off the effects of a flash grenade thrown unexpectedly through her window, and immediately begin trying to wrestle the gun from one of the SWAT officers, because she is, apparently, simultaneously a worthless drain on the state (according to some commenters) and a Spec-Ops Ninja-Fighter that the SEALs would be proud of according to others (though both sides agreed that the fault was hers, till recently).

Also, they can terrorise your grandmother: http://wsbradio.com/localnews/2010/05/w ... ing-b.html

And abduct your kids into a van in plain clothes: http://blogs.houstonpress.com/hairballs ... arrest.php

And if you resist, armed or otherwise, justified or otherwise, you will end up like Cory Maye:

Cory Maye, sometimes spelled Corey Maye (born September 9, 1980), is a prisoner in the U.S. state of Mississippi. He was convicted of murder in the 2001 death of Prentiss, Mississippi police officer Ron W. Jones during a drug raid on the other half of Maye's duplex. Maye has said he thought that the intruders were burglars and did not realize they were police. He pleaded not guilty at his trial, citing self-defense. Nevertheless, Maye was convicted of murder and was sentenced to death. On September 21, 2006, the death sentence was overturned by Judge Michael Eubanks, and Maye was sentenced to life in prison.

His case attracted little attention until late 2005, when Reason magazine senior editor and police misconduct researcher Radley Balko brought it to light on his blog "The Agitator." [1] Maye's supporters say his conviction and sentence raise issues about the right to self-defense, police conduct in the War on Drugs, and racial and social inequities in Mississippi. They have also raised questions about whether he has received competent legal representation.


And it doesn't matter if they got the wrong house:



.

Eh, sorry, that was verging on the off-topic. Also, I am still not American, so I am not here to argue about Second Ammendment rights or gun ownership - just about the practical worth of firearms as a means of self-defence in a modern, mostly urban, society. And I would rather not argue about that either, to be honest.

If you suffer a home-invasion at the hands of the police, then owning a firearm, drawing a firearm, warning them of your ownership of a firearm, moving suddenly, staggering around in the aftermath of a flash or gas grenade they have fired into your home, and, above all, trying to protect your loved ones, will probably result in the deaths of you or those you love, or get you life in prison. And this happens to non-criminals, all the time. Castle Doctrine is waived when it comes to the police.

And if you suffer a home-invasion at the hands of criminals, you'll either die or you won't - but even if you prevail over the baddies in a stylish shoot-out, and then call the police to the scene yourself, be sure to dump your gun somewhere before they arrive, and be lying face down on the floor with your arms behind your back before they walk in the door (and make sure your family and your pets are doing likewise). You would be taking your life in your hands otherwise.

And don't have any marijuana.

As an afterthought, I should say, I'm not particularly anti-cop or anti-law-and-order or anti-gun-ownership.... but this is getting ridiculous, on all sides.
Last edited by AhabsOtherLeg on Mon May 24, 2010 3:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bring Your Sidearms To The Banks of the Potomac.

Postby compared2what? » Mon May 24, 2010 2:47 am

Thanks. Those really are home invasions, and deserve that appellation. Without the propaganda-indicating quotation marks and everything!

But even if you kept a gun for self-defense purposes in your home, the least advisable time to think about using it would be when the SWAT team came crashing in, unless you had a reason to think that they were going to kill you anyway.

Because people who shoot cops overwhelmingly end up doing stuff like, I don't know, beating themselves to death in their cells, or committing suicide just before they're arrested, or otherwise murkily dying in some outlandish way that the Civilian Review Board investigation (when they finally get around to doing one) inevitably finds to have been exactly what happened, no matter how unlikely it might have seemed in the press reports at the time.

That might not be true everywhere. But it's sure the custom around here, at least.

Anyway. Good point, regarding home invasions.
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Re: Bring Your Sidearms To The Banks of the Potomac.

Postby Iamwhomiam » Sat Jun 05, 2010 3:06 pm

Another one bites the dust.

I suppose that this fellow too, was well trained.

But we all do make foolish mistakes from time to time, even those that have received the very best training.


Man accidentally shoots himself in testicles

Originally published May 30, 2010 at 7:06 PM; modified May 30, 2010 at 7:47 PM

A man accidentally shot himself in the testicles at Lowe's Home Improvement store in Lynnwood Sunday afternoon, police said.

The man's handgun, which was in the waistband of his pants, went off at about 12:30 p.m. — an apparent "accidental discharge," according to Shannon Sessions, a Lynnwood police spokeswoman.

"It made a loud noise and scared a lot of people in the store," Sessions said. "I believe he shot himself in the testicles and he also had some injuries to his leg and foot. He was obviously in shock."

Nobody else was hurt and no one appeared to be with the man, she said.

Police and fire responded, and the man was rushed to Harborview Medical Center in Seattle before police had a chance to interview him extensively. Sessions had no further details about the man.

Lynnwood police are continuing to investigate but "at this point it does look like it's accidental," Sessions said. A manager at Lowe's said store personnel are not commenting on the incident.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2011994648_accident31m.html

~~~~~~~~~~

Shoppers recall silence, fear in Lynnwood Lowe's store when man shot himself in testicles

Friday, June 4, 2010 - Page updated at 02:52 PM

By Erik Lacitis
Seattle Times staff reporter

For a few seconds, there was total silence at Lowe's Home Improvement in Lynnwood just after the gunshot went off at 12:30 on Sunday afternoon.

"It was dead quiet," remembers Jim Fischer, a Shoreline Fire Department paramedic who happened to be at the checkout line with his wife, Kim. They're doing a bathroom remodel.

These days, you hear a loud bang while shopping, and it's hard not to think the worst.

"I'm thinking, if it's an active shooter, we're bolting," Fischer says.

Then a Lowe's employee shouted for somebody to call an ambulance, that somebody had shot himself.

OK, Fischer decided, I better go see if I can help the victim.

It turned out to be a story that by the next day would go viral on the Web:

A 41-year-old Lynnwood man had accidentally shot himself in the testicles at Lowe's.

For those at the scene, it would be something they'll remember as initially scary, and then, as they learned the details ... the guy did what?

Helping the victim, who was wearing black sweatpants, Fischer asked how it happened.

"He says, 'It was in my waistband, and I felt it starting to slip, reached for it, and I must have positioned my finger so the trigger went off," Fischer remembered Thursday.

A Lynnwood police report about the incident says the gun was a Glock 30, a compact pistol described by the manufacturer as "the legendary .45 caliber."

The man had a concealed-weapons permit to carry the gun, said Shannon Sessions, spokeswoman for Lynnwood police.

The Times is not naming the man because no crime was committed.

The report says the man was "joking with staff members" at Harborview Medical Center after medics took him there.

But on Wednesday afternoon, back at his apartment after being released from the hospital Tuesday, he wasn't in much of a joking mood.

"I'm up. I'm walking. I'm good. I don't want to talk to you," he said.

He then closed the door.

Harborview said it could not disclose the extent of his injuries.

Fischer says that as he helped the victim as they waited for medics to arrive "by applying pressure to the wound, and by cutting away the sweatpants while leaving on the underwear” he could see the groin area was injured, and that there was a wound in middle of the left thigh, and swelling on the top of the left foot.

He surmised that was the trajectory of the bullet.

Those familiar with guns wonder why someone would carry a loaded pistol in his sweatpants.

"It's not the brightest way to carry it. Sweatpants are loose and not held against your body by a belt," said Dave Workman, senior editor of Gun Week and author of "Washington State Gun Rights and Responsibilities."

Workman said the bullet wounded the man "at literally point-blank. Think about that for a second."

The Glock 30 sells for about $630 and weighs 1-½ pounds empty, 2.1 pounds when carrying its 10-round capacity.

Glock advertises the pistol as having a "Safe Action" system. For example, it includes a mechanism that prevents unintentional firing if the pistol is accidentally dropped on the floor.

But Glock also warns, "One operating element, one rule. Finger away from the trigger ... "

Workman says that in the "adrenaline rush" of reaching for a gun that's slipped, it's natural for the index finger to then also close on the trigger.

Then, bang.

For the shoppers who were at Lowe's on Sunday afternoon, it'll certainly be a memorable spring Sunday.

Kim Fischer will remember that after deciding there wasn't a random shooter in the store, "nobody got panicky. There was nobody running down the floor screaming."

What Michael McDougall, of Snohomish, who was there with his wife, Connie, and their 5-year-old daughter, Bridgette, will remember also is that initial moment of fear.

"Initially I thought it was maybe gang-related. I was afraid for my wife and daughter, and I thought, 'I think we should be leaving.' " he says.

He commends the Lowe's employees for their calm actions in getting help. A manager at Lowe's said store personnel are not commenting on the incident.

And he remembers the initial scream, "Oh, my God, I shot myself in the groin!"

That's a quote you remember for years.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2012026554_shooting04m.html

~~~~~~~~~

He now goes by the name "Uno"
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Re: Bring Your Sidearms To The Banks of the Potomac.

Postby LilyPatToo » Sat Jun 05, 2010 3:34 pm

The absolute only bright spot in that incident is that it's possible that the gentleman has thus removed himself from the breeding population.

Otherwise, *ouch*! :o

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Re: Bring Your Sidearms To The Banks of the Potomac.

Postby norton ash » Sat Jun 05, 2010 3:38 pm

Shoppers recall silence, fear in Lynnwood Lowe's store when man shot himself in testicles


A headline for the ages. It was only later that they could laugh about it, I guess.
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Re: Bring Your Sidearms To The Banks of the Potomac.

Postby operator kos » Sun Jun 06, 2010 9:25 pm

http://www.wilx.com/home/headlines/50233892.html

Man Accidentally Runs Over Sleeping Family

Police in western Michigan say a man fell asleep at the wheel of his parked vehicle and accidentally ran over a tent containing his wife and two young children.

Norton Shores police Lt. Jon Gale tells The Muskegon Chronicle the accident happened around 6 a.m. Wednesday at P.J. Hoffmaster State Park.

The man was trying to warm up the family vehicle but fell asleep behind the wheel. The vehicle then rolled forward over the family's camping tent.

The Grand Rapids Press reports a 6-year-old child was flown to a Grand Rapids hospital for treatment. The woman and a 2-year-old child were taken to a Muskegon hospital but weren't seriously injured.
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Re: Bring Your Sidearms To The Banks of the Potomac.

Postby Iamwhomiam » Sat Nov 22, 2014 6:17 pm

operator kos, In some thread I mentioned the probability of someone living in a home where a gun was present being more likely to be injured by a gun than would be if no gun was present. You replied saying something to the effect that you've long had guns in your home and no one's ever been injured.

I have searched and searched looking to find that specific thread to respond to your comment, but to no avail. Do you know which it was?

(In finding this thread, I notice your comment is OT) However, automobiles are not firearms and are more regulated than any firearm anywhere in our country. Surely you're not suggesting we regulate guns to the same level we do autos, are you?
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