Is The Trump Thing Serious?

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Re: Is The Trump Thing Serious?

Postby stillrobertpaulsen » Tue Jul 21, 2015 5:34 pm

Luther Blissett » Tue Jul 21, 2015 3:45 pm wrote:I hope he wins the popular vote in the primaries and the people who voted for him riot when he's not nominated to run by the GOP.


Me too. Because if the demand is there, he won't shy away from running as an independent. He might even do better than Perot. He won't win, but he'll show the world the exact statistical dimensions of racist America.

Speaking of racism, not that Trump being racist is news, but did anyone else catch this?

‘Get To The WHITE House’ — Donald Trump Retweets Shockingly Racist Tweet
"Huey Long once said, “Fascism will come to America in the name of anti-fascism.” I'm afraid, based on my own experience, that fascism will come to America in the name of national security."
-Jim Garrison 1967
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Re: Is The Trump Thing Serious?

Postby 8bitagent » Fri Jul 24, 2015 8:13 am

Never imagined when I made this thread over four years ago, Trump would return as a serious contender...literally polling higher than the GOP frontrunner.

Whatever it takes to get Bernie Sanders in and shut down another Bush/Clinton white house Im all for.
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Re: Is The Trump Thing Serious?

Postby Nordic » Fri Jul 24, 2015 7:42 pm

8bitagent » Fri Jul 24, 2015 7:13 am wrote:Never imagined when I made this thread over four years ago, Trump would return as a serious contender...literally polling higher than the GOP frontrunner.

Whatever it takes to get Bernie Sanders in and shut down another Bush/Clinton white house Im all for.



You're joking, right? Another guy with a D after his name?

Please. If you're gonna take the rigged WWE election seriously, at least think outside the box and go third party or whatever.
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Re: Is The Trump Thing Serious?

Postby justdrew » Fri Jul 24, 2015 9:45 pm

Nordic » 24 Jul 2015 15:42 wrote:
8bitagent » Fri Jul 24, 2015 7:13 am wrote:Never imagined when I made this thread over four years ago, Trump would return as a serious contender...literally polling higher than the GOP frontrunner.

Whatever it takes to get Bernie Sanders in and shut down another Bush/Clinton white house Im all for.



You're joking, right? Another guy with a D after his name?

Please. If you're gonna take the rigged WWE election seriously, at least think outside the box and go third party or whatever.


probably the purpose is that lil donny will make jeb look sane and reasonable by comparison.

he's jeb's wingman and is currently negging all the right blocks
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Re: Is The Trump Thing Serious?

Postby Nordic » Fri Jul 24, 2015 10:05 pm

justdrew » Fri Jul 24, 2015 8:45 pm wrote:
Nordic » 24 Jul 2015 15:42 wrote:
8bitagent » Fri Jul 24, 2015 7:13 am wrote:Never imagined when I made this thread over four years ago, Trump would return as a serious contender...literally polling higher than the GOP frontrunner.

Whatever it takes to get Bernie Sanders in and shut down another Bush/Clinton white house Im all for.



You're joking, right? Another guy with a D after his name?

Please. If you're gonna take the rigged WWE election seriously, at least think outside the box and go third party or whatever.


probably the purpose is that lil donny will make jeb look sane and reasonable by comparison.

he's jeb's wingman and is currently negging all the right blocks



That's exactly what I'm thinking. He's used to having a reality show after all. Like Bruce Jenner.
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Memory Lane - 1999

Postby IanEye » Sun Jul 26, 2015 9:02 pm

NEW YORK (CNN) -- Billionaire businessman Donald Trump has a plan to pay off the national debt, grant a middle class a tax cut, and keep Social Security afloat: tax rich people like himself.
Trump, a prospective candidate for the Reform Party presidential nomination, is proposing a one-time "net worth tax" on individuals and trusts worth $10 million or more.

"The plan I am proposing today does not involve smoke and mirrors, phony numbers, financial gimmicks, or the usual economic chicanery you usually find in Disneyland-on-the-Potomac," Trump said.

Trump would exempt the value of an individual's principal home from the net worth total.

"By my calculations, 1 percent of Americans, who control 90 percent of the wealth in this country, would be affected by my plan," Trump said.
"The other 99 percent of the people would get deep reductions in their federal income taxes," he said.


- http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1999/11/09/trump.rich/index.html
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Re: Is The Trump Thing Serious?

Postby brekin » Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:59 pm

Been thinking on the Trump phenomenon and two things I think account for his popularity.

First, he is so completely unapologetic in a very apologetic culture. Especially in the political realm now there is a whole ritual of not wanting to offend and fucking up and "got to go to rehab now" to get reprogrammed. Repubs definitely have always catered to original sin with everything except power and have done a good job of making their base not feel guilty about inequities in wealth, education, jobs, etc. Trump goes one step farther and removes the original sin from the traditional conservative behaviors in having to play politician and not expressing what one really thinks except when the mic is off. Trump's wealth has bought him some freedom to speak his mind and that plays well with a whole nation that basically sounds like Trump with their on line personas but in the real world have to play the politician game. Trump is basically a god level internet troll incarnated and by proxy the country of minor trolls secretly pledge their allegiance to their demon king.

Second, Trump exudes the power that most people recognize and covet in comparison to career politicians who have the globe under lock and key but have to play humble pie, simple folk politician. Bush Sr./Clinton/Bush/Obama have to pretend to be All State insurance salesman when they can disrupt entire nations and vaporize the planet with a push of the button. Trump is more in line with what the guy on the street thinks power looks like: hotels/casinos/reality show/model wives/telling celebrities they are pigs, etc
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Believe in America

Postby IanEye » Thu Jul 30, 2015 7:39 pm

brekin » Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:59 pm wrote:First, he is so completely unapologetic in a very apologetic culture.


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Re: Is The Trump Thing Serious?

Postby stillrobertpaulsen » Thu Jul 30, 2015 7:51 pm

brekin » Thu Jul 30, 2015 4:59 pm wrote:Been thinking on the Trump phenomenon and two things I think account for his popularity.

First, he is so completely unapologetic in a very apologetic culture. Especially in the political realm now there is a whole ritual of not wanting to offend and fucking up and "got to go to rehab now" to get reprogrammed. Repubs definitely have always catered to original sin with everything except power and have done a good job of making their base not feel guilty about inequities in wealth, education, jobs, etc. Trump goes one step farther and removes the original sin from the traditional conservative behaviors in having to play politician and not expressing what one really thinks except when the mic is off. Trump's wealth has bought him some freedom to speak his mind and that plays well with a whole nation that basically sounds like Trump with their on line personas but in the real world have to play the politician game. Trump is basically a god level internet troll incarnated and by proxy the country of minor trolls secretly pledge their allegiance to their demon king.

Second, Trump exudes the power that most people recognize and covet in comparison to career politicians who have the globe under lock and key but have to play humble pie, simple folk politician. Bush Sr./Clinton/Bush/Obama have to pretend to be All State insurance salesman when they can disrupt entire nations and vaporize the planet with a push of the button. Trump is more in line with what the guy on the street thinks power looks like: hotels/casinos/reality show/model wives/telling celebrities they are pigs, etc


I think you nailed it, brekin. James Howard Kunstler has written how are divisive culture and depleted environment would propel a "corn-pone Nazi" to the White House, but your internet troll analogy made me envision the more potent scenario: a Nazi Reality Show Host in the White House.
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Re: Believe in America

Postby brekin » Thu Jul 30, 2015 8:56 pm

IanEye » Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:39 pm wrote:
brekin » Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:59 pm wrote:First, he is so completely unapologetic in a very apologetic culture.


*
Image
you say you’re lookin’ for someone
never weak but always strong



to protect you and defend you
whether you are right or wrong

*



Mitt Romney apologizes for high school pranks that ‘might have gone too far’
Mitt Romney apologized Thursday morning for pranks he helped orchestrate in high school that he said “might have gone too far,” including an incident in which he pinned down a fellow student and cut his hair.
The presumptive Republican presidential nominee was responding to an article published a few hours earlier by The Washington Post documenting the episode with first-hand accounts from Romney’s classmates at the Cranbrook Schools in Michigan.
“Back in high school, I did some dumb things, and if anybody was hurt by that or offended, obviously I apologize for that,” Romney said in a live radio interview with Fox News Channel personality Brian Kilmeade. Romney added: “I participated in a lot of hijinks and pranks during high school, and some might have gone too far, and for that I apologize.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/ ... story.html

stillrobertpaulsen wrote:
brekin » Thu Jul 30, 2015 4:59 pm wrote:Been thinking on the Trump phenomenon and two things I think account for his popularity.

First, he is so completely unapologetic in a very apologetic culture. Especially in the political realm now there is a whole ritual of not wanting to offend and fucking up and "got to go to rehab now" to get reprogrammed. Repubs definitely have always catered to original sin with everything except power and have done a good job of making their base not feel guilty about inequities in wealth, education, jobs, etc. Trump goes one step farther and removes the original sin from the traditional conservative behaviors in having to play politician and not expressing what one really thinks except when the mic is off. Trump's wealth has bought him some freedom to speak his mind and that plays well with a whole nation that basically sounds like Trump with their on line personas but in the real world have to play the politician game. Trump is basically a god level internet troll incarnated and by proxy the country of minor trolls secretly pledge their allegiance to their demon king.

Second, Trump exudes the power that most people recognize and covet in comparison to career politicians who have the globe under lock and key but have to play humble pie, simple folk politician. Bush Sr./Clinton/Bush/Obama have to pretend to be All State insurance salesman when they can disrupt entire nations and vaporize the planet with a push of the button. Trump is more in line with what the guy on the street thinks power looks like: hotels/casinos/reality show/model wives/telling celebrities they are pigs, etc


I think you nailed it, brekin. James Howard Kunstler has written how are divisive culture and depleted environment would propel a "corn-pone Nazi" to the White House, but your internet troll analogy made me envision the more potent scenario: a Nazi Reality Show Host in the White House.


I think one saving grace is that Trump is not a very eloquent or impressive speaker. He's not horrible from what I've seen and has got a rough, no-nonsense edge but he comes across as ultimately petty. One of those rich, powerful people whose day is ruined and flies into rage if his Fanta isn't the right temperature, kind of resembling L. Ron Hubbard.

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Re: Is The Trump Thing Serious?

Postby km artlu » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:01 am

Kind of telling that, to me, Hubbard comes across as the better person in that photo comparison.
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my Bush in the ghosts of life.

Postby IanEye » Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:57 am

Image


“I don’t mind apologizing for things, Geraldo, but I want to apologize when I’m wrong.”


IanEye » Sun Jul 26, 2015 9:02 pm wrote:

"By my calculations, 1 percent of Americans, who control 90 percent of the wealth in this country, would be affected by my plan," Trump said.
"The other 99 percent of the people would get deep reductions in their federal income taxes," he said.

.


- http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1999/11/09/trump.rich/index.html





America is waiting.




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Re: Is The Trump Thing Serious?

Postby brainpanhandler » Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:44 am

km artlu » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:01 am wrote:Kind of telling that, to me, Hubbard comes across as the better person in that photo comparison.


Maybe. Trump looks petulant, imperious and pouty; a spoiled manchild. Hubbard looks more comfortable in his skin but has a more sinister, malevolent look to him.
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Re: Is The Trump Thing Serious?

Postby brekin » Fri Jul 31, 2015 10:32 am

brainpanhandler » Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:44 am wrote:
km artlu » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:01 am wrote:Kind of telling that, to me, Hubbard comes across as the better person in that photo comparison.


Maybe. Trump looks petulant, imperious and pouty; a spoiled manchild. Hubbard looks more comfortable in his skin but has a more sinister, malevolent look to him.


Both look pretty bored at the Inquisition.
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Re: Is The Trump Thing Serious?

Postby Belligerent Savant » Fri Aug 07, 2015 1:13 pm

.

http://theconcourse.deadspin.com/stop-p ... 1722504250


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Stop Pretending Donald Trump Is Running For President

Tonight, hot pork balloon Donald Trump will participate in a televised debate with nine Republican presidential candidates. He is pretending to campaign for president, and the political press has agreed to pretend to believe him for a little while. It’s cynical and farcical and boring and stupid and insulting to ... [counts on fingers] ... yep, pretty much everyone except Donald Trump.

Here’s the New York Times, working like hell to glean some larger political meaning from Trump’s “support”—which, mind you, exists solely in the form of opinion polls about an election to be held more than a year from now—and finding “the first post-policy candidate”:

What some have called “Trumpism” is founded not on a specific agenda, like the bullet-point Contract With America in 1994 that led to the Republican takeover of the House.

Rather, it is built on boiling grass-roots anger over the ineffectiveness and scripted talking points of conventional politicians on matters like illegal immigration and America’s global power.

“Everybody in the establishment misunderstands the game he’s playing,” said Newt Gingrich, the author of the Contract With America and onetime House speaker who was himself a Republican presidential candidate in 2012. “His opponents want to talk about policies. He’s saying if you don’t have a leader capable of cutting through the baloney, all this policy stuff is an excuse for inaction.”


“What some have called ‘Trumpism.’” Some. Wonder who they are. If you listen closely you can hear poor David Brooks pausing Peggy Sue Got Married to whip up a treatise about the unplumbed electoral power of Post-Policy Uncles.

The Times is far from the only outlet doing this, of course. Google “Donald Trump frontrunner” to marvel at how many by-reputation-and-presentation savvy and gimlet-eyed reporters and pundits have gotten in on the hustle, selling the garbage notion that Trump’s polling numbers indicate a meaningful advantage in pursuit of the Republican presidential nomination—that he is the “frontrunner” in any real sense at all, that the poll results can be read as anything other than an indictment of the practice of polling voters a year before the election. Each and every one of them knows better than to believe that. Each and every one is bullshitting their readers.

In order to pretend that Trump is at risk of doing harm to his presidential prospects in tonight’s debate, you must pretend that he has any, and that he genuinely intends to have any, and that his recklessness and ridiculousness are not the precise and only reasons why he is in position to say things, in a televised presidential debate, that smart and thoughtful writers who know better may then pretend have done damage to a candidacy that is itself a figment of various imaginations. And if you’re the sort of person who’s up for this, it’s near-certain that you’ll do all of this only after assuming an equally phony position of amused agnosticism about Trump’s actual articulated policy positions, so that you may feign a kind of detached admiration for his willingness to say unpresidential things without examining their actual content.

That’s a lot of work! The alternative—covering his “candidacy” only as a gross professional famous person’s branding ploy, covering his participation in tonight’s debate only as a ratings-grab by a profoundly cynical news network, and covering the poll numbers as indicators of how little anyone cares about the presidential election from the shade of a beach umbrella—has the disadvantage of stripping away the borrowed gravity of implied potential consequences for American government, and the advantage of being honest. It’s an alternative the politics press rejects every four years, with a predictability that makes you want to punt your own head into the ocean.

A version of this deeply phony shit has happened in every Republican nomination cycle since Ronald Reagan’s presidency: Some race-baiting nativist or apocalyptic culture warrior (depending on which way the wind is blowing out on the lunatic fringe) runs up superficially good-looking early numbers and scores a debate appearance. Rick Santorum or Tom Tancredo or Michele Bachmann or Alan Keyes or Pat Buchanan or David Duke or Pat Robertson or Herman Cain are buoyed meaninglessly by an off-year poll question about a far-away television character’s entertainment value, and by the campaign press’s determination to treat these poll results as gauges of anything other than how few fucks anybody gives about presidential candidates a year before they’ll be asked to cast a vote, and the press pretends to take them seriously for a few months, and then everybody moves on as if it never happened.

And so it is with Donald Trump—except that, unlike many of the sweaty careerists and movement maniacs typically occupying this role, Trump knows the score full well. Whatever else he may or may not be—a lifelong fraud, an inheritance baby in possession of zero traits worth taking seriously, a living refutation of the entire concept of meritocracy—he is not a sucker. He’s not campaigning for a new job; he’s doing his current one, which involves enjoying the lifestyle of a billionaire and the rapt attention due a celebrity business magnate despite a résumé of actual accomplishments and distinctions that consists mainly of renting his name to other people.

The point, here, is not to poke a hole in Donald Trump. (That would be impossible, anyway: the man is a hole, where marks dump their money and attention.) What he’s doing is what he does; what any shithead would do if wholly unearned lifelong wealth and privilege not only removed all the stakes from his own behavior but left him entirely unable to conceive of what stakes might be. He’s gratifying himself. He’s playing the heel. He’s flaunting the ease with which he can invite himself to the center of attention, the readiness with which the media will shame itself for the sake of extracting some copy from his clown show. Why not do it? What can it cost him? His reputation? Being a heedless, big-talking showman is his reputation. His political clout? That’s safe for as long as he remains rich.

The closest this nominal campaign comes to an actual goal is its capacity to enhance the value of Donald Trump’s personal brand. He’ll stick with it as long as he can do it on his terms, and then he’ll leave, after he has raised funds and soaked attention and extracted uncomfortable handshakes from people he delights in repulsing, but before actual formal results threaten to make an actual formal loser of him. In order for this to work, he needs the press to treat him like an actual presidential candidate with an actual campaign and an actual chance of making a difference in actual voting now, so that he’ll have gotten what he wants from this venture well before the primaries and can cash out before the tide changes. He needs the press to pretend that his lead in opinion polls juiced by the volume of their own faux-breathless coverage reflects more than a feedback loop of their own creation.


And, sure as you are born, the tide will change. Donald Trump knows it; the campaign press knows it; you know it. It always does, in every Republican nomination cycle, beaching the race-baiting nativist or apocalyptic culture warrior so that the candidates pre-approved for a higher grade of fake seriousness can receive it. This would be the fate of Donald Trump’s put-on candidacy even if intentionally causing it to happen, and then casting himself as the irascible truth-telling capitalist who tired of the dishonesty and pageantry of campaigning, were not just as attractive an option for Trump himself as winning the presidency.

In the meantime, while we wait for precisely the end of this branding exercise we all know is coming, we get this, from Daniel Strauss at Politico (where else?):

Trump, Republican consultant Ed Rollins said, has benefited from an “incredible voter disconnect” by the rest of the Republican primary field and now stands to carve off a large slice of conservative Palin followers.

“At this point in time, there’s a lot of people that still like her,” Rollins said. “There’s a significant tea party out there that she can tap into.”


Jesus fucking Christ. “Can Sarah Palin sell Donald Trump to ‘Joe Six-Pack’?” Analyzing the electoral prospects of a fake campaign by interrogating whether it can borrow credibility from the most ridiculous, least-credible media invention on earth, to win favor with a phony, ginned-up, profoundly insulting caricature of the regular people about whom not a one of the story’s principals has a single fucking iota of curiosity? It’s a question premised on and presented with compounded dishonesty and contempt. You couldn’t fool fucking hitchBOT with this shit. How fucking stupid does Daniel Strauss think you are?

Political coverage that ignores actual policy in favor of gauging public perception and election prospects often is called “horse race journalism” for treating politics as a pure competition, the only goal of which is electoral victory. That’s a pretty apt descriptor of how this stuff gets covered, except in one respect. The reporters who cover actual horse-racing have the dignity and professional pride not to grant phony import and stature to an early show that sprints out of the gate but has no chance of hanging around to decide the outcome. The reason is pretty simple: They value not making themselves look like craven fucking idiots. Maybe that’s why they cover farm animals running in a circle, rather than presidential campaigns.


AND:

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/don ... s-of-doom/

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