The Methane Thread

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The Methane Thread

Postby stillrobertpaulsen » Fri Nov 21, 2014 7:16 pm

I've been wanting to start a methane thread separate from the gargantuan global warming thread for some time now. Not that I won't be posting in the other thread, but I wanted to start something with a distinction where the subject of methane releases doesn't have to be tied to having a stake in the RI debate on AGW. I'll try not to push anyone's buttons where triggers on that subject are concerned and I would appreciate it if everyone else who wants to participate here would do the same. We'll see how long that lasts.

What reinvigorated my interest in the subject was this story by Time. As usual for our corporate media, they fucked it up again:

4 Possible Explanations for That Mysterious Flash of Light Over Russia

Sam Frizell

Nov. 20, 2014

A meteor, a military launch — or something much more sinister?

The sky above Russia’s remote Sverdlovsk region erupted in light last Friday, and despite it having been captured on numerous video recordings—particularly dashboard cameras, it seems—no one seems to know what the flash of light was.

Theories abound, ranging from the reasonable to the completely nonsensical. We’ve collected the most interesting, but first, some of the video footage:



1. Meteor

An explosion that took as long as the one captured on Friday (about 10 seconds) could have been a meteor burning up in the atmosphere, as one astronomer told 66.Ru, according to the Christian Science Monitor. “Looks like a falling bolide,” or meteorite, which evaded detection by the usual array of watchers before hitting our atmosphere, said astronomer Viktor Grokhovsky. Russia, of course, is no stranger to explosive meteors being caught on film. But meteorites usually explode white after streaking across the sky, and whatever this one was didn’t. Marco Langbroek of the Dutch Meteor Society told a meteor blog, “I doubt this one is a meteor.”

2. Military explosion

Was the military were behind the flash? A scheduled explosive ordnance disposal could have taken place,local city officials said, with ammunition lighting up the sky. It could have been a military launch too. Although there’s no launch vicinity in that immediate area, the region is reportedly in the flight path of a launch base. That means a rocket could have blown up en route; the brevity and brightness of the blast seem consistent with that. The Russian military has denied any involvement — but that’s hardly a surprise.

3. Chemical plant explosion

One local news site suggested that there’s an old chemical plant outside the nearby town of Rezhevskoy that could have exploded, causing such a bright light. But we’d surely have heard about such a disaster by now.

4. Aliens

Okay, so no one has seriously claimed that extraterrestrial beings are responsible for the blast, but some say that a UFO crashed in the Sverdlovsk region in 1969. And there’s grainy, ambiguous video footage to prove it!



Now if anyone here wants to explore the four possibilities mentioned above, that's fine. But it pisses me off that Time completely missed possibility 5. Methane explosion. Other sites have mentioned that possibility. The reason why is because there has been an exponential increase in the amount of methane being released in the Arctic region. I've posted about this on my own blog. Here is a recent article detailing the scope of this evolving danger:

Wednesday, August 13, 2014

Horrific Methane Eruptions in East Siberian Sea

A catastrophe of unimaginable propertions is unfolding in the Arctic Ocean. Huge quantities of methane are erupting from the seafloor of the East Siberian Sea and entering the atmosphere over the Arctic Ocean.

Image

As the top image above shows, peak levels as high as 2363 ppb were recorded at an altitude of 19,820 ft (6041 m) on the morning of August 12, 2014. The middle image shows that huge quantities of methane continued to be present over the East Siberian Sea that afternoon, while the bottom image shows that methane levels as high as 2441 ppb were recorded a few days earlier, further indicating that the methane did indeed originate from the seafloor of the East Siberian Sea.

On August 12, 2014, peak methane levels at higher altitudes were even higher than the readings mentioned on above image. Levels as high as 2367 ppb were reached at an altitude of 36,850 ft (11,232 m). Such high levels have become possible as the huge quantities of methane that were released from the seafloor of the Arctic Ocean over the period from October 2013 to March 2014, have meanwhile descended to lower latitudes where they show up at higher altitudes.

Methane eruptions from the Arctic Ocean's seafloor helped push up mean global methane levels to readings as high as 1832 ppb on August 12, 2014.

Ironically, the methane started to erupt just as an international team of scientists from Sweden, Russia and the U.S. (SWERUS-C3), visiting the Arctic Ocean to measure methane, had ended their research.

Örjan Gustafsson describes part of their work: “Using the mid-water sonar, we mapped out an area of several kilometers where bubbles were filling the water column from depths of 200 to 500 m. During the preceding 48 h we have performed station work in two areas on the shallow shelf with depths of 60-70m where we discovered over 100 new methane seep sites.”

Örjan Gustafsson adds that “a tongue of relatively warm Atlantic water, with a core at depths of 200–600 m may have warmed up some in recent years. As this Atlantic water, the last remnants of the Gulf Stream, propagates eastward along the upper slope of the East Siberian margin, our SWERUS-C3 program is hypothesizing that this heating may lead to destabilization of upper portion of the slope methane hydrates.”


Image
Schematics of key components of the Arctic climate-cryosphere-carbon system that are addressed by the SWE-C3 Program. a,b) Sonar images of gas plumes in the water column caused by sea floor venting of methane (a: slope west of Svalbard, Westbrook et al., 2009; b: ESAO, Shakhova et al., 2010, Science). c) Coastal erosion of organic-rich Yedoma permafrost, Muostoh Island, SE Laptev Sea. d) multibeam image showing pockmarks from gas venting off the East Siberian shelf. e) distribution of Yedoma permafrost in NE Siberia. f) Atmospheric venting of CH4, CO2. (SWERUS-C3)

Örjan Gustafsson further adds that SWERUS-C3 researchers have on earlier expeditions documented extensive venting of methane from the subsea system to the atmosphere over the East Siberian Arctic Shelf.

In 2010, team members Natalia Shakhova and Igor Semiletov estimated the accumulated methane potential for the Eastern Siberian Arctic Shelf alone to be as follows:
- organic carbon in permafrost of about 500 Gt;
- about 1000 Gt in hydrate deposits; and
- about 700 Gt in free gas beneath the gas hydrate stability zone.

Back in 2008, Shakhova et al. wrote a paper warning that “we consider release of up to 50 Gt of predicted amount of hydrate storage as highly possible for abrupt release at any time.”

Last year, a team of researchers including Professor Peter Wadhams calculated that such a 50 Gt release would cause global damage with a price-tag of $60 trillion.

As Prof Wadhams explains in the video below: “We really have no choice except to seriously consider the use of geoengineering.”



Image

Sea surface temperatures as high as 18.8°C are now recorded at locations where warm water from the Pacific Ocean is threatening to invade the Arctic Ocean.

At the same time, huge amounts of very warm water are carried into the Arctic Ocean by the Gulf Stream through the North Atlantic. The image below illustrates how the Gulf Stream brings very warm water to the edge of the sea ice.

Waters close to Svalbard reached temperatures as high as 62°F (16.4°C) on July 29, 2014 (green circle). Note that the image below shows sea surface temperatures only. At greater depths (say about 300 m), the Gulf Stream is pushing even warmer water through the Greenland Sea than temperatures at the sea surface.

Since the passage west of Svalbard is rather shallow, a lot of this very warm water comes to the surface at that spot, resulting in an anomaly of 11.1°C. The high sea surface temperatures west of Svalbard thus show that the Gulf Stream can carry very warm water (warmer than 16°C) at greater depths and is pushing this underneath the sea ice north of Svalbard. Similarly, warm water from greater depth comes to the surface where the Gulf Stream pushes it against the west coast of Novaya Zemlya.

Image

Image

As Malcolm Light writes in an earlier post: The West Spitzbergen Current dives under the Arctic ice pack west of Svalbard, continuing as the Yermak Branch (YB on map) into the Nansen Basin, while the Norwegian Current runs along the southern continental shelf of the Arctic Ocean, its hottest core zone at 300 metres depth destabilizing the methane hydrates en route to where the Eurasian Basin meets the Laptev Sea, a region of extreme methane hydrate destabilization and methane emissions.

The images below give an impression of the amount of heat transported into the Arctic Ocean.

Image

The image below gives an idea how methane eruptions from the seafloor of the Arctic Ocean could unfold over the coming decades. For more on this image, see this post and this page.

Image

As said, the situation is dire and calls for comprehensive and effective action, as discussed at the Climate Plan blog at climateplan.blogspot.com and as illustrated by the image below.

Image


How bad could this get? Well, just taking into account that methane is a greenhouse gas, here's a scenario from the book Six Degrees by Mark Lynas that spells out what our planet at that global temperature might physically exhibit: spontaneously generated hypersonic methane fireballs rocketing out of the sky and incinerating everything in their path. Hypercanes (not Hurricanes) which pound coastal areas for days with enough water to wash out every living thing for dozens of kilometers inland. Giant 70 foot sea level rises which turn most great cities into Atlantis. 130-40 daytime temperatures. Lifeless, acidic oceans with hot tub temperatures.

So, yes, I think this subject deserves its own thread here.
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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby slimmouse » Sat Nov 22, 2014 2:10 am

Thanks for the post SRP. Did I read on here somewhere recently that some residents of somewhere or other were complaining about a horrible noxious smell that appeared that couldnt be explained ..apparently attributed to sulphur dioxide...the infamous rotten eggs thing?

I could be way off the mark here......but looking at these huge methane emissions just rang that particular bell.
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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby norton ash » Sat Nov 22, 2014 2:45 am

Bump for the organic chemistry and our illustrious past and the lovely shale and the dreadful tundra. BTW, North Dakota and Northern Alberta are now super-rich and nobody wants to live there because its's disgusting and wrecked, and everyone HATES the Trans-Cunt world-killer pipeline.

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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby brainpanhandler » Sat Nov 22, 2014 5:42 am

stillrobertpaulsen » Fri Nov 21, 2014 6:16 pm wrote:
How bad could this get? Well, just taking into account that methane is a greenhouse gas, here's a scenario from the book Six Degrees by Mark Lynas that spells out what our planet at that global temperature might physically exhibit: spontaneously generated hypersonic methane fireballs rocketing out of the sky and incinerating everything in their path.
...



Interesting hypothesis for the Sverdlovsk Oblast blast. I hadn't considered it. The Sverdlovsk Oblast is not anywhere near the east Siberian Sea however.

Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sverdlovsk_Oblast

And it doesn't appear as though the blast originates out of the sky, nor at hypersonic speed, although admittedly it's hard to tell from the videos. But it is clear from one or two of the videos that some related phenomena probably occurs at ground level. What comes first is difficult to tell.

Apparently the Sverdlovsk region has been extensively mined. Perhaps the Russians mined too deep and awoke something else:

Image

So, yes, I think this subject deserves its own thread here.


One of the scariest and most plausible scenarios for an extinction level event? Meh.
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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby zangtang » Sat Nov 22, 2014 8:51 am

full marks. Have been 'struggling' with the clathrate gun for most of this year. Difficult subject to broach, even down the pub with the folk whose job it is to suffer and love you. Compounded by those who have children. Dont even think about it if the woman is pregnant because.....honour and stuff.

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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby elfismiles » Sat Nov 22, 2014 10:59 am

Very interesting...

Re: Tsunami bomb: NZ's devastating war secret - elfismiles » 12 Aug 2010 14:47 wrote:Thanks for the lead BD...

NASA: Future Strategic Issues: Detonate Seabed Methane to “Produce Tactical/Strategic Level Tidal Waves Against Littoral Regions”
http://cryptogon.com/?p=16971
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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby Iamwhomiam » Sat Nov 22, 2014 3:33 pm

slim, that was in Moscow. 82's thread here:
Airborne Toxic Event in Moscow
http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=38550&p=555286&hilit=Moscow+smell#p555286

Robert, thank you for posting this. I hope you'll consider cross-posting it in the global warming thread.

Methane is worthy of discussion as a chemical compound, but its impacts upon our climate, especially now as the warming Arctic clathrates are releasing their methane into our atmosphere at such a rapid pace, should be a topic for discussion in How Bad is Global Warming.

Considering that Sverdlovsk is approximately 2,628 km or 1,633 mi from Svalbard (bearing 333.8 NNW) I doubt methane released by Arctic clathrates could be dense enough at that latitude to explode. But more interesting is that no noise was reported being heard anywhere the Bright Skies were observed. If it was an explosion from any cause, there would be sonic repercussion that would have been heard by someone, and this would be true if the brightness of the sky was caused by an underground explosion in a coal or some other mine. No shock wave was reported being heard by anyone.

Please remember I cannot view the videos.
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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby brainpanhandler » Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:36 pm

zangtang » Sat Nov 22, 2014 7:51 am wrote: Difficult subject to broach, even down the pub with the folk whose job it is to suffer and love you. Compounded by those who have children. Dont even think about it if the woman is pregnant because.....honour and stuff.


I know, right. Even climate change in general. If there are still trillions of recoverable hydrocarbons in the ground and the petro giants and their horizontal cronies continue to dominate the political landscape and our civilization continues to rely entirely on cheap fossil fuels simply to function then I see no way around the fact that the biosphere is going to change so radically in the next 50 to 100 years that we will be hard pressed to avoid extinction. That's not a message anyone wants to hear and it's one most cannot hear. And the fucking madmen are going to try to tap, sell and burn the methane clathrates. Good god. I speak it quietly now. No sense shouting except that it makes me feel better. Mea Culpa future peoples. Sorry.
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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby Searcher08 » Tue Dec 02, 2014 8:56 pm

I just wanted to echo this, bph.

People just are not interested - I remember showing a friend the youtube video of a geologist drilling into a frozen lake bed and then setting the hole on fire, with a resulting flame that was about 12ft tall that looked like a hotroad on afterburn and the only response was 'Wow!' then a changed conversation subject. I am sure that if it was a decision between using this as a new energy source for keeping our present way of life going vs having to change consumption of energy patterns and experience inconvenience, there was no debate :(

brainpanhandler » Mon Dec 01, 2014 9:36 pm wrote:
zangtang » Sat Nov 22, 2014 7:51 am wrote: Difficult subject to broach, even down the pub with the folk whose job it is to suffer and love you. Compounded by those who have children. Dont even think about it if the woman is pregnant because.....honour and stuff.


I know, right. Even climate change in general. If there are still trillions of recoverable hydrocarbons in the ground and the petro giants and their horizontal cronies continue to dominate the political landscape and our civilization continues to rely entirely on cheap fossil fuels simply to function then I see no way around the fact that the biosphere is going to change so radically in the next 50 to 100 years that we will be hard pressed to avoid extinction. That's not a message anyone wants to hear and it's one most cannot hear. And the fucking madmen are going to try to tap, sell and burn the methane clathrates. Good god. I speak it quietly now. No sense shouting except that it makes me feel better. Mea Culpa future peoples. Sorry.
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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby Luther Blissett » Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:38 pm

You marxists really want a carbon tax, don't you?

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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby Iamwhomiam » Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:46 pm

I'd love to see a carbon tax placed upon a company and country extracting fossil fuels and those exporting them.

I'll share some more on Methane from my files.
Methane contamination of drinking water accompanying gas-well drilling and hydraulic fracturing April, 2011
http://tinyurl.com/p4nf4eh

Methane and Nitrous Oxide Emissions From Natural Sources April, 2010
http://www.epa.gov/outreach/pdfs/Methane-and-Nitrous-Oxide-Emissions-From-Natural-Sources.pdf

Waste Not Common Sense Ways to Reduce Methane Pollution from the Oil and Natural Gas Industry Nov, 2014
http://catf.us/resources/publications/files/WasteNot_Summary.pdf

It’s Time for Obama to Tighten Rules on Gas Leaks Nov., 2014
Image
An oil storage tank looks unremarkable through a conventional camera but can be seen to be leaking plumes of methane in an infrared image (video).Credit EPA
http://dotearth.blogs.nytimes.com/category/energy/fossil-fuels/gas/

And the resources of our friends at the Energy Justice Network:
http://www.energyjustice.net/naturalgas

I've got 245 pdf documents on file that mention methane! along with many more news reports.
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Yeah, I'm in favor of an appropriately placed carbon tax.
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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby stillrobertpaulsen » Fri Dec 05, 2014 8:12 pm

slimmouse » Sat Nov 22, 2014 1:10 am wrote:Thanks for the post SRP. Did I read on here somewhere recently that some residents of somewhere or other were complaining about a horrible noxious smell that appeared that couldnt be explained ..apparently attributed to sulphur dioxide...the infamous rotten eggs thing?

I could be way off the mark here......but looking at these huge methane emissions just rang that particular bell.


That sounds logical. Guy McPherson speaks of the possibility in the future of a methane "burp" of 50 gigatons, but considering how methane smells, it may be more appropriate to describe that as a 50 gigaton "fart."
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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby stillrobertpaulsen » Fri Dec 05, 2014 8:26 pm

brainpanhandler » Sat Nov 22, 2014 4:42 am wrote:
stillrobertpaulsen » Fri Nov 21, 2014 6:16 pm wrote:
How bad could this get? Well, just taking into account that methane is a greenhouse gas, here's a scenario from the book Six Degrees by Mark Lynas that spells out what our planet at that global temperature might physically exhibit: spontaneously generated hypersonic methane fireballs rocketing out of the sky and incinerating everything in their path.
...



Interesting hypothesis for the Sverdlovsk Oblast blast. I hadn't considered it. The Sverdlovsk Oblast is not anywhere near the east Siberian Sea however.

Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sverdlovsk_Oblast

And it doesn't appear as though the blast originates out of the sky, nor at hypersonic speed, although admittedly it's hard to tell from the videos. But it is clear from one or two of the videos that some related phenomena probably occurs at ground level. What comes first is difficult to tell.


Yeah, it's a hypothesis that should be explored in whatever official investigation is being conducted on this incident, but not a strong theory at this point. There really hasn't been much news on this in the last couple weeks.

However, there does seem to be a much stronger consensus that the most likely explanation for the huge craters found in northern Russia is a giant methane release:

Mysterious Craters Are Just the Beginning of Arctic Surprises

Researchers are rethinking century-old observations as they witness the unexpected and peculiar perils that are emerging from thawing Arctic permafrost

August 5, 2014 |By David Biello

It's not just craters purportedly dug by aliens in Russia, it's also megaslumps, ice that burns and drunken trees. The ongoing meltdown of the permanently frozen ground that covers nearly a quarter of land in the Northern Hemisphere has caused a host of surprising arctic phenomena.

Temperatures across the Arctic are warming roughly twice as fast as the rest of the globe, largely due to the reduction in the amount of sunlight reflecting off of white, snow-covered ground. "At some point, we might get into a state of permafrost that is not comparable to what we know for 100 years or so, some new processes that never happened before," says geologist Guido Grosse of the Alfred Wegener Institute for Polar and Marine Research in Germany.

The mysterious craters in far northern Russia are just such an example. "There is nothing described in the scientific literature than can really, fully explain those craters," says Grosse, who is headed to the Lena River Delta in Siberia this summer, which hosts a joint German-Russian research station. The most likely explanation for the newly discovered craters in Russia is an accumulation of methane over centuries or more that then burst out of the thawing ground sometime in the last few years. "High pressure built up and [the ground] literally popped open," explains biogeochemist Kevin Schaefer of the U.S. National Snow and Ice Data Center. "If it is indeed caused by melting methane ice, we should expect to see more."

These craters will then become lakes, which further thaw the permafrost around and beneath them as the water traps yet more heat from the sun. Similar new lakes are forming in depressions in the newly thawing lumpy landscape across the Arctic known as thermokarst. Such thermokarst lakes and surrounding marshes create the muddy conditions favoring microbes that break dead plant material down into methane. That methane then bubbles out of the lakes and ground and, where concentrated, can even be lit on fire, leading to cases of flames dancing above the ice.

Even more widespread than blast craters or burning ice are drunken trees. When permafrost thaws, soil that was once as solid as concrete becomes mud, due to the fact that ice makes up as much as 80 percent of the ground in some parts of the Arctic. And because ice takes up more space than water, the ground subsides, causing trees that grew upright to lean as the ground liquefies beneath them. Whole forests have listed like an army of drunkards as a result. This is also bad news for modern infrastructure in the Arctic as well: Roads, pipelines and building foundations sink into mud and crack or entire landscapes subside. "Long term, there are huge economic and social impacts to permafrost degrading," Schaefer notes.

Where the ground slopes, even worse can occur: slumps, which are like slow-moving mudslides that can undermine areas of 40 hectares or more and stretch more than a kilometer across. The largest megaslumps can eat into the landscape at rates of a kilometer per decade and seem to show no signs of stopping. One slump in Russia that has mystified scientists extends more than 70 meters deep into the permafrost and is still growing after starting in the 1970s, Grosse says.

Perhaps the biggest concern of thawing permafrost is a massive and sudden release of methane from the Arctic Ocean and/or permafrost. Methane traps at least eight times more heat than carbon dioxide over decades, driving global warming even faster. The bad news on the belch front are noticeable upticks in the amount of methane produced in the Arctic—an increase of roughly 8 percent over 30 years at the Canada’s Alert Station in the Northwest Territories. And ocean expeditions have observed methane bubbling out of methane ice at the bottom of the Arctic Ocean. The good news is that satellite data encompassing broad swathes of the Arctic and stretching back for decades now shows little change in atmospheric concentrations of the potent greenhouse gas. "Why that is, we don't know yet," Grosse says.

Most of the greenhouse gases released by this Arctic thaw will be CO2. And the permafrost thaw will continue as rising levels of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere trap ever more heat, kicking off a feedback cycle that then further melts the Arctic. By mid-century, computer simulations predict that as much as a third of the permafrost area in Alaska could thaw, at least at the surface, with similar amounts in Canada and Siberia. Once the melt has kicked in—and the frozen dead plants that make up the top three meters or so of the permafrost become food for microbes that release CO2—the process is irreversible. "You can't refreeze it," Schaefer says. "Once the decay turns on you can't turn it off, and it persists for centuries."

The permafrost already holds vast stores of carbon, as much as 1.7 trillion metric tons according to estimates—or more than twice as much as is currently in the atmosphere today. Not all of that will thaw in the near future—some areas of permafrost extend 700 meters deep—but as much as 120 billion metric tons could be released by 2100. That's enough to raise global average temperatures by nearly a third of a degree Celsius. "These are big numbers," Schaefer notes. But "they are in fact small when compared to those projected from burning coal and oil and natural gas. Those emissions are just immense."

The computer models that deliver these estimates of how much of that carbon might come out assume a gradual thaw of the permafrost. That prediction could prove erroneous, based on observations to date. Already, thawing processes like slumps and lakes are happening faster and affecting larger regions than expected. As Grosse puts it: "we might be very conservative in our estimate."

Thawing sets in motion a set of complex natural forces, some of which could run counter to the seemingly inexorable warming trend. Trees and shrubs will continue to move north, thanks to warmer temperatures and a longer growing season. Those trees in turn suck CO2 out of the air. NASA’s new Orbiting Carbon Observatory should help clarify how much CO2 this greening of the Arctic will draw down. And even the thermokarst lakes may be burying some carbon, at least over thousands of years as lake sediments bury dead plants and algae.

Even the amount of thawing guaranteed by greenhouse emissions to date remains unclear. "We are trying to figure that out," Schaefer says. And the very rules that have governed Arctic processes during the last 100 years or so of modern exploration may no longer hold. The speed of this ongoing meltdown could accelerate and happen in decades or slowly thaw over centuries and millennia. "What are the limits of permafrost thaw?" Grosse asks. "We don't really know."

There are attempts to expand the monitoring of the Arctic, but huge gaps persist because of its vast extent and harsh conditions. As in most sciences, observations to date are limited to where it is easy for scientists to get to, rather than where one would place monitoring to ensure maximum coverage. Of emerging research questions surrounding the Arctic in the Anthropocene—a putative new geologic epoch tied to relatively recent human impacts on the planet of planetary scope—the fate of the permafrost looms large as a known unknown, as the National Academy of Sciences acknowledged in a report this past April.

One thing is clear, however: the Anthropocene has proved unfriendly to ice so far, and that will get worse as a new Arctic emerges. "This situation is unprecedented," Schaefer says. "The faster you burn fossil fuels, the faster the Arctic is going to warm."
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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby Iamwhomiam » Mon Dec 08, 2014 6:40 pm

Guy McPherson speaks of the possibility in the future of a methane "burp" of 50 gigatons, [b]but considering how methane smells, it may be more appropriate to describe that as a 50 gigaton "fart."[/b]
Robert, Methane gas is odorless. It's also colorless. Your confusing that low-tide smell of decomposing vegetation, Hydrogen sulfide, with methane.

That was the 'rotten eggs' odor smelled by Muscovites, slimmouse, and it probably came from their sewers, or sewage treatment facility, but of course it could have been caused by something else, like a chemical spill.

I can buy two theories for the craters, one mentioned - that excessive pressure blew them out or that lightning ignited a leaking vein and caused an underground explosion. I can't think of another reasonable cause, unless there were some pretty cool fossils in situ some passing aliens decided to glom. But I think that's unlikely.
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Re: The Methane Thread

Postby stillrobertpaulsen » Tue Dec 09, 2014 4:44 pm

Iamwhomiam » Mon Dec 08, 2014 5:40 pm wrote:Guy McPherson speaks of the possibility in the future of a methane "burp" of 50 gigatons, [b]but considering how methane smells, it may be more appropriate to describe that as a 50 gigaton "fart."[/b]
Robert, Methane gas is odorless. It's also colorless. Your confusing that low-tide smell of decomposing vegetation, Hydrogen sulfide, with methane.


I believe you are correct, Iamwhomiam. Sometimes I put my attempts at humor ahead of the facts. I'm no Sacha Baron Cohen, but I try not to take myself too seriously, especially when dealing with serious subjects.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QNT_eI6SNk

Here's another source from which methane is escaping into the earth's atmosphere - abandoned oil wells!

Abandoned U.S. oil wells still spewing methane, study finds

By Richard Valdmanis

BOSTON Mon Dec 8, 2014 5:28pm EST

(Reuters) - Some of the millions of abandoned oil and natural gas wells in the United States are still spewing methane, marking a potentially large source of unrecorded greenhouse gas emissions, according to a study released on Monday.

Researchers at Princeton University measured emissions from dozens of abandoned wells in Pennsylvania in 2013 and 2014 and found they were emitting an average of 0.27 kg (0.6 lbs) of methane per day, according to the study published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

"These measurements show that methane emissions from abandoned oil and gas wells can be significant," according to the study. "The research required to quantify these emissions nationally should be undertaken so they can be accurately described and included in greenhouse gas emissions inventories."

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency is mulling whether to issue mandatory standards for reducing methane emissions from the oil and gas sector as part of President Barack Obama's broad climate action plan.

Environmental groups have told the EPA that directly targeting methane rather than secondary volatile organic compounds, which the agency currently regulates, is more effective and can help the United States make steeper greenhouse gas emission cuts.

Methane warms the climate at least 80 times more than the same amount of carbon dioxide, the most prevalent greenhouse gas, over a 20-year period.
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