TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Moderators: Elvis, DrVolin, Jeff

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby Belligerent Savant » Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:58 pm

.


Has tv stardom seduced our senses, including common sense?


Demonstrably, yes.

Do scripted performers now earn access to real roles?


Ah, therein lies the confusion. See, it's all performance. The lines have been blurred for some time*; we are now entering the nadir phase of our zeitgeist, where entertainers are politicians and politicians are entertainers. Our political landscape is scarcely more 'real' than the average American's favorite drama on TV.

The lone distinction is that political theatre has real world ramifications to those out there: citizens of other nations, the working classes, the poor.

The world of make believe has now become the greatest threat to our actual survival. The mindless audience of entertainment is mistaking the show as real.


Brings a whole new meaning to the phrase Reality TV. A scripted simulacrum of 'reality'. Just like American Politics.


*Some may argue Reagan blazed the trail as the first overt performer turned President: an inevitable 'merger', now mutated into its current form.
User avatar
Belligerent Savant
 
Posts: 5215
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:58 pm
Location: North Atlantic.
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby JackRiddler » Sat Jan 20, 2018 8:02 pm

Belligerent Savant » Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:58 pm wrote:.


Has tv stardom seduced our senses, including common sense?


Demonstrably, yes.

Do scripted performers now earn access to real roles?


Ah, therein lies the confusion. See, it's all performance. The lines have been blurred for some time*; we are now entering the nadir phase of our zeitgeist, where entertainers are politicians and politicians are entertainers. Our political landscape is scarcely more 'real' than the average American's favorite drama on TV.

The lone distinction is that political theatre has real world ramifications to those out there: citizens of other nations, the working classes, the poor.

The world of make believe has now become the greatest threat to our actual survival. The mindless audience of entertainment is mistaking the show as real.


Brings a whole new meaning to the phrase Reality TV. A scripted simulacrum of 'reality'. Just like American Politics.


*Some may argue Reagan blazed the trail as the first overt performer turned President: an inevitable 'merger', now mutated into its current form.


Some may argue.


https://www.counterpunch.org/2017/08/04 ... part-2017/

...

Perhaps more importantly, the present regime is remarkably weak, despite its open authoritarianism and ambitions to redefine reality by pronouncing its own facts, in the way of Orwell’s novel 1984. Submitted: The remarkable thing about the Trump regime is not that it is a Reality TV show (with one of the best-known and most successful Reality TV producers in the starring role). Rather, it is that most American viewers do not actually buy into this administration’s televised reality. That is unprecedented.

With that I must confess another of my no-doubt regrettable views: At the latest since the advent of the Reagan presidency, the de facto first function of the thing we call “the presidency” has been to stage a reality show for the political audience, primarily via the medium of television. Note that I did not say this is the presidency’s sole function, by any means; even given the bureaucratized permanent military state and the overwhelming consensus around neoliberal-capitalist politics, the presidency retains power as a policymaking office. Insofar as many executive policies need to be enacted in public, the personal dramaturgy of the presidency feeds the propaganda arm (a.k.a. the corporate media) with the material needed to manage the public perceptions of each otherwise inscrutable move. Ideally, policies are depicted as stages in an unfolding hero journey: Watch as the man rises to the challenges, matches himself against history. What will be his legacy? That ideal has usually failed, but there was never a shortage of fallback plots borrowed from daytime soap operas, eschatological Western shoot-outs, uplifting bootstrap stories of personal salvation, and of course the ever-more frequent professional wrestling scripts. (For extra credit, match the genre to the president most commonly associated with it.)

As of today, thanks to a long-running trend to no longer suspend disbelief that has only been accelerated by the ascendancy of the Trump, the status of the White House as the entertainment bureau of the federal government has never been as obvious to a majority of the citizenry, whether or not they can muster the energy to notice or care. Not only are the society’s major institutions understood as professionally fake, many even invite one to study and admire the craftsmanship of the fakery (as with advertising/marketing and professional wrestling). In regard to the political theater of the presidency and the two-party system, this observation remains a blind spot for many in the corporate media, although they actually co-produce the show. Producers, like Les Moonves or Jeff Zucker (two of the most important and surely witting factors in the rise of Trump) tend to understand these mechanics much better than the on-air “talent,” who doubtless are selected for their relative ability to sound serious while talking stupid shit.

Politics always involved theater. Modern democratic electoral politics merged with the news and entertainment industry long ago, and for decades they have been developing in tandem. More recently a large part of the audience has been lured into treating the results as media critics, rather than as sovereigns or citizen-participants with an actual stake in the proceedings. As interesting as anything Scaramucci said is that we all treat the identity of the White House press agent as though it is vitally important. As a result of this twisted form of transparency, however, the pretext for a new war may backfire, especially insofar as the war (or the triggering event likely to precede it!) involves numerous casualties of the precious American persuasion.


But probably Debord said it all better.
We meet at the borders of our being, we dream something of each others reality. - Harvey of R.I.

To Justice my maker from on high did incline:
I am by virtue of its might divine,
The highest Wisdom and the first Love.

TopSecret WallSt. Iraq & more
User avatar
JackRiddler
 
Posts: 15983
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:59 pm
Location: New York City
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby Elvis » Sun Jan 21, 2018 10:16 am

Belligerent Savant wrote:See, it's all performance.


Yep. "You need both a public and a private position."

Friggin' liars.
“The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.” ― Joan Robinson
User avatar
Elvis
 
Posts: 7413
Joined: Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:24 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby Karmamatterz » Sun Jan 21, 2018 3:17 pm

k, here's the magic formula: It starts with you (and me), it starts with individuals changing those attitudes that say we're hopeless and helpless, that we're doomed to making the same mistakes for eternity.
- Elvis

My attitude and way of life isn't one of hopeless or helpless individual. Far from it. Your comment implies that I seek something from the elected officials and or government. That I expect something of them.

I rely on myself for hope and intentions. Me, myself and I will bring happiness and fulfillment of goals. Nobody else can give that to me. Expecting it from others is irrational, self-defeating and pointless.

Btw, find any examples of Bernie Sanders telling a lie?


Nope, didn't go looking for any lies from Bernie. Perhaps he hasn't lied. Maybe he is one of the few, but I doubt it. My point, as Belligerent Savant also stated, is that they are all liars. BS pointed to presidents only, but its not a stretch to include the rest of the lot.

Bernie may say altruistic things, its part of the party line and a good way to garner votes, but he is a wealthy man.

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/06/06/bernie-sanders-made-over-1-million-last-year-and-has-joined-the-1-percent.html

Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders had a surprisingly good financial year in 2016. While the Democratic socialist was warning against the concentration of wealth in the hands of "the top 1 percent," he was also joining their ranks.
Though his annual income of $200,000 still makes him one of the least wealthy senators, "the former Democratic presidential candidate made some $858,750 off book royalties alone last year," Newsweek reports. "Combined with his Senate salary, he likely cleared $1 million in earnings."


I suppose if Sanders were truly altruistic he would have donated all his book sales profits to those with less abundance. I don't have a problem with anybody earning wealth. Go Bernie. But lets be real about this and remove the romantic glasses.
User avatar
Karmamatterz
 
Posts: 828
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2012 10:58 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby Elvis » Sun Jan 21, 2018 6:49 pm

Karmamatterz wrote:My attitude and way of life isn't one of hopeless or helpless individual. Far from it. Your comment implies that I seek something from the elected officials and or government. That I expect something of them.


I didn't mean to imply that your happiness should depend on the government, but I can't see any reason why we shouldn't expect—demand—that our elected leaders be upright human brings. Too many people have given up on that basic expectation, and continue to let organized big money choose the lying motherfucking candidates. Because "that's just the way the world works." If that were true—then no Enlightenment. We're due for another Enlightenment and it starts the individual. We also need collective action: "They" are trying to manage and control "Us"; shouldn't we be trying to manage and control Them?


Karmamatterz wrote: if Sanders were truly altruistic he would have donated all his book sales profits to those with less abundance.


He donated everything from a 2011 book directly to charity. Anyway. his debt closely matches the other book earnings which he keeps. And he's never tried to hide his tax returns!
“The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.” ― Joan Robinson
User avatar
Elvis
 
Posts: 7413
Joined: Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:24 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby Cordelia » Mon Jan 22, 2018 12:33 pm

Elvis » Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:49 pm wrote:
Karmamatterz wrote:My attitude and way of life isn't one of hopeless or helpless individual. Far from it. Your comment implies that I seek something from the elected officials and or government. That I expect something of them.


I didn't mean to imply that your happiness should depend on the government, but I can't see any reason why we shouldn't expect—demand—that our elected leaders be upright human brings. Too many people have given up on that basic expectation, and continue to let organized big money choose the lying motherfucking candidates. Because "that's just the way the world works." If that were true—then no Enlightenment. We're due for another Enlightenment and it starts the individual. We also need collective action: "They" are trying to manage and control "Us"; shouldn't we be trying to manage and control Them?


wadr...Sounds good, but how would that collective control-of-them work, realistically, when They have police and armies at their disposal to manage and keep control of us?
The greatest sin is to be unconscious. ~ Carl Jung

We may not choose the parameters of our destiny. But we give it its content. ~ Dag Hammarskjold 'Waymarks'
User avatar
Cordelia
 
Posts: 3697
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2009 7:07 pm
Location: USA
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby Karmamatterz » Mon Jan 22, 2018 2:24 pm

They have police and armies at their disposal to manage and keep control of us?


They don't need to use the police and military on us. All they need to do, and have done, is keep using public education to dumb down everybody. Then mix in some good "legal" propaganda (thanks Obama!) along with all the noise and bullshit in the media and just make a giant confusing mess of things. Probably more than half of whats published, broadcast etc... is all bullshit noise, much of it gets regurgitated right here on RI.

The masses are not kept under some sort of magic religious spell based on values, God, family etc....its all consumerist and or ideologically driven to become a victim of fear or some personal slight and BEG the government to intervene and save us. The U.S. is quickly becoming a nation of thin skinned crybabies who want to be saved. It used to be funny to poke fun at the religious fundies who wanted to be "saved" by their Lord and Savior. Now its everybody who has been insulted and rightly or wrongly and "feel" as if they are being oppressed by the very government they want to help save them and what is little left of this cultural mishmash of shit.

Democracy will only succeed if a the large majority shares some cultural and personal values.

Sure, hope is nice. It doesn't make a workable strategy. When people don't respect other people's beliefs or values then not a damn thing will get done in the way of progress.
User avatar
Karmamatterz
 
Posts: 828
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2012 10:58 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby Elvis » Mon Jan 22, 2018 5:27 pm

Cordelia wrote:Sounds good, but how would that collective control-of-them work, realistically, when They have police and armies at their disposal to manage and keep control of us?


As a means of control, Karmamatterz is right, conditioning & propaganda are more powerful than police and armies. But once a "critical mass" of people wake up from their conditioning, the police and armies don't stand a chance.

That said, I do think things will get worse before they get worse. Trump is likely the gateway thug.
“The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.” ― Joan Robinson
User avatar
Elvis
 
Posts: 7413
Joined: Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:24 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby Cordelia » Mon Jan 22, 2018 5:46 pm

Karmamatterz » Mon Jan 22, 2018 5:24 pm wrote:
They have police and armies at their disposal to manage and keep control of us?


They don't need to use the police and military on us. All they need to do, and have done, is keep using public education to dumb down everybody. Then mix in some good "legal" propaganda (thanks Obama!) along with all the noise and bullshit in the media and just make a giant confusing mess of things.


That and that too. Plus more; all factions in the population are studied, managed and controlled; all the bases are covered imo.

Elvis » Mon Jan 22, 2018 8:27 pm wrote:
Cordelia wrote:Sounds good, but how would that collective control-of-them work, realistically, when They have police and armies at their disposal to manage and keep control of us?


As a means of control, Karmamatterz is right, conditioning & propaganda are more powerful than police and armies. But once a "critical mass" of people wake up from their conditioning, the police and armies don't stand a chance.


I really can't imagine how government/corporate armed forces would be defeated.
The greatest sin is to be unconscious. ~ Carl Jung

We may not choose the parameters of our destiny. But we give it its content. ~ Dag Hammarskjold 'Waymarks'
User avatar
Cordelia
 
Posts: 3697
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2009 7:07 pm
Location: USA
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Jan 22, 2018 9:47 pm

Scoop: FBI director threatened to resign amid Trump, Sessions pressure

Sessions and Wray at Wray's installation as director. Photo: Chip Somodevilla/Getty Images

Attorney General Jeff Sessions — at the public urging of President Donald Trump — has been pressuring FBI Director Christopher Wray to fire Deputy Director Andrew McCabe, but Wray threatened to resign if McCabe was removed, according to three sources with direct knowledge.

Wray's resignation under those circumstances would have created a media firestorm. The White House — understandably gun-shy after the Comey debacle — didn’t want that scene, so McCabe remains.
Sessions told White House Counsel Don McGahn about how upset Wray was about the pressure on him to fire McCabe, and McGahn told Sessions this issue wasn’t worth losing the FBI Director over, according to a source familiar with the situation.
Why it matters: Trump started his presidency by pressuring one FBI Director (before canning him), and then began pressuring another (this time wanting his deputy canned). This much meddling with the FBI for this long is not normal.

McGahn has been informed about these ongoing conversations, though he has not spoken with Wray about FBI personnel, according to an administration source briefed on the situation. Trump nominated Wray, previously George W. Bush's Deputy Attorney General, last June to replace James Comey as director.

Trump has also tweeted negatively about other senior FBI officials who are allies of Comey, including the former top FBI lawyer James A. Baker who was recently “reassigned” after pressure from Sessions.

White House Principal Deputy Press Secretary Raj Shah said of Wray: “As we’ve said, the president has enormous respect for the thousands of rank and file FBI agents who make up the world’s most professional and talented law enforcement agency. He believes politically-motivated senior leaders including former Director Comey and others he empowered have tainted the agency’s reputation for unbiased pursuit of justice. The president appointed Chris Wray because he is a man of true character and integrity and the right choice to clean up the misconduct at the highest levels of the FBI and give the rank and file confidence in their leadership.”

As I reported last night, Sessions has adamantly urged Wray to make a "fresh start" with his core team.

Trump and other Republicans have been hammering McCabe — who was selected by the White House as acting director after the Comey firing — for months on Twitter.

On July 26, Trump tweeted: "Why didn't A.G. Sessions replace Acting FBI Director Andrew McCabe, a Comey friend who was in charge of Clinton investigation but got...big dollars ($700,000) for his wife's political run from Hillary Clinton and her representatives. Drain the Swamp!"
The latest: The New York Times — and others — reported in December that McCabe "is expected to retire after he becomes eligible for his pension [in] early [2018]." But senior Justice officials are still not sure what McCabe plans to do.

The FBI declined to comment for this story. Justice Department spokeswoman Sarah Isgur Flores also declined to comment.
https://www.axios.com/scoop-1516661397- ... gn=organic



Image

Image
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
User avatar
seemslikeadream
 
Posts: 32090
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:28 pm
Location: into the black
Blog: View Blog (83)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby Elvis » Tue Jan 23, 2018 11:47 am

Image
“The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.” ― Joan Robinson
User avatar
Elvis
 
Posts: 7413
Joined: Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:24 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby seemslikeadream » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:43 pm

Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
User avatar
seemslikeadream
 
Posts: 32090
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:28 pm
Location: into the black
Blog: View Blog (83)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby The Consul » Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:56 pm

The Hollywood pitch would go something like this:

Imagine "Psycho" meets "1984"
" Morals is the butter for those who have no bread."
— B. Traven
User avatar
The Consul
 
Posts: 1247
Joined: Fri Mar 26, 2010 2:41 am
Location: Ompholos, Disambiguation
Blog: View Blog (13)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby DrEvil » Wed Jan 24, 2018 5:30 pm

Karmamatterz » Mon Jan 22, 2018 8:24 pm wrote:
They have police and armies at their disposal to manage and keep control of us?


They don't need to use the police and military on us. All they need to do, and have done, is keep using public education to dumb down everybody. Then mix in some good "legal" propaganda (thanks Obama!) along with all the noise and bullshit in the media and just make a giant confusing mess of things. Probably more than half of whats published, broadcast etc... is all bullshit noise, much of it gets regurgitated right here on RI.


What's your alternative to public education? You could privatize everything (like Betsy DeVos is trying to do right now) and put education directly into the hands of the corporations, or you could go the home schooling route, which to me at least is a recipe for disaster. It would make the kids completely dependent on the teaching skills of their parents. Some will no doubt be excellent, a lot will be completely shit and the majority will be meh. Not to mention, how do you combine home schooling with having a job?

The obvious solution is to make sure you have the best possible public education with good, qualified teachers (teachers should have the same pay and social status as doctors imo). That way everyone at least gets the basics, and it's not beholden to corporate interests or the whims of stupid parents. Some reforms would no doubt be needed, for instance: stop tying school funding to property taxes and stop electing school boards (that's why you have the constant attempts to insert creationism into science classes).

The masses are not kept under some sort of magic religious spell based on values, God, family etc....its all consumerist and or ideologically driven to become a victim of fear or some personal slight and BEG the government to intervene and save us. The U.S. is quickly becoming a nation of thin skinned crybabies who want to be saved. It used to be funny to poke fun at the religious fundies who wanted to be "saved" by their Lord and Savior. Now its everybody who has been insulted and rightly or wrongly and "feel" as if they are being oppressed by the very government they want to help save them and what is little left of this cultural mishmash of shit.

Democracy will only succeed if a the large majority shares some cultural and personal values.


Wouldn't a good way to ensure this be to have a common education for everyone?

As a side note: my personal opinion is that the US should be broken up into smaller countries of 5-10 million people each (same for every other large country). It would make it much easier to create a coherent, decent society at that scale, and no one would be in a position to become a hegemony. If you're a bleeding heart liberal you move to the Republic of Los Angeles, and if you're a fundie you move to Alabamistan.

Sure, hope is nice. It doesn't make a workable strategy. When people don't respect other people's beliefs or values then not a damn thing will get done in the way of progress.


I agree that there has been some excesses in political correctness lately, but the majority of it is just people saying that being an asshole is no longer consequence free. Values change over time and older people have always complained about it. I'm only 40 (still trying to decide: Harley or sail boat) but youth today are completely alien to me in some aspects, and that is a good thing.
"I only read American. I want my fantasy pure." - Dave
User avatar
DrEvil
 
Posts: 3972
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2010 1:37 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: TRUMP is seriously dangerous

Postby Karmamatterz » Thu Jan 25, 2018 8:09 am

What's your alternative to public education? You could privatize everything (like Betsy DeVos is trying to do right now) and put education directly into the hands of the corporations, or you could go the home schooling route, which to me at least is a recipe for disaster. It would make the kids completely dependent on the teaching skills of their parents. Some will no doubt be excellent, a lot will be completely shit and the majority will be meh. Not to mention, how do you combine home schooling with having a job?

The obvious solution is to make sure you have the best possible public education with good, qualified teachers (teachers should have the same pay and social status as doctors imo). That way everyone at least gets the basics, and it's not beholden to corporate interests or the whims of stupid parents. Some reforms would no doubt be needed, for instance: stop tying school funding to property taxes and stop electing school boards (that's why you have the constant attempts to insert creationism into science classes).

The masses are not kept under some sort of magic religious spell based on values, God, family etc....its all consumerist and or ideologically driven to become a victim of fear or some personal slight and BEG the government to intervene and save us. The U.S. is quickly becoming a nation of thin skinned crybabies who want to be saved. It used to be funny to poke fun at the religious fundies who wanted to be "saved" by their Lord and Savior. Now its everybody who has been insulted and rightly or wrongly and "feel" as if they are being oppressed by the very government they want to help save them and what is little left of this cultural mishmash of shit.

Democracy will only succeed if a the large majority shares some cultural and personal values.


Wouldn't a good way to ensure this be to have a common education for everyone?

As a side note: my personal opinion is that the US should be broken up into smaller countries of 5-10 million people each (same for every other large country). It would make it much easier to create a coherent, decent society at that scale, and no one would be in a position to become a hegemony. If you're a bleeding heart liberal you move to the Republic of Los Angeles, and if you're a fundie you move to Alabamistan.

Sure, hope is nice. It doesn't make a workable strategy. When people don't respect other people's beliefs or values then not a damn thing will get done in the way of progress.


I agree that there has been some excesses in political correctness lately, but the majority of it is just people saying that being an asshole is no longer consequence free. Values change over time and older people have always complained about it. I'm only 40 (still trying to decide: Harley or sail boat) but youth today are completely alien to me in some aspects, and that is a good thing.
"I only read American. I want my fantasy pure." - Dave


Interesting that you went from one extreme to the other here. It has to be either public education or the binary choice, corporations running schools. You have heard of private schools right? Contrary to popular leftist belief, they aren't all run by corporations. I gather you don't live in the U.S., but there are many excellent private schools. If you want to send your kid to a private school you will find a way to do it....if you actually give shit about their education. Fact is, many people don't. My dad was a teacher, and I know plenty of teachers who tell me many parents don't get off their lazy asses to even bother attending parent/teacher conferences. The Creationism thing is total dog whistle. NOBODY, I mean NOBODY I talk to, or listen when they are discussing school issues ever bring that topic up. Why would they? It simply isn't an issue. Its so fringe that its funny when people on RI bring it up. Sure, there might be some school districts where it has been an issue, but its such an extremely small minority that its inconsequential to the overall picture.

Parents are more concerned about discipline in classrooms, having quality teachers who are held accountable and programs for gifted students. Teachers who can bring to the classroom a shred of skill in teaching children how to think would be miraculous. Critical rational thinking, not the latest trend in pop culture. Parents are concerned that lazy or fearful principles allow crappy behavior to run out of control in the hallways. Its a real thing. It would be grand if teachers who fall asleep in the classroom are fired. Yes, its a real thing and my son experienced it first hand. I saw the photos fo the teacher asleep. She got fired, sued the school district and because of the union contract was able to get sizable parachute. Total BS and we parents were outraged. Meanwhile, in the next classroom over the female English lit teacher was having sex with one of her students. At least she was prosecuted and sent to prison. Parents with gifted students desperately want their kids challenged and to have the highest level of teachers, programs and material available for their children to excel. If you are on RI and have children in public schools then you know (one would hope) that the history classes taught are absolutely pathetic. Have you actually seen the textbooks? What a joke. I often had discussions with my kids about what was being taught in their history and "soc" classes and was appalled.

We're all concerned with school funding. The model in Ohio sucks and an alternative to property tax funding would be a great start.
"(teachers should have the same pay and social status as doctors imo)" - Here in normal people land a lot of folks think teachers are already overpaid. I personally don't think they are overpaid, but I believe union contracts allow for some who are less motivated to get lazy with no accountability.

Getting rid of school boards? Replace that DIRECT form of democracy with what? Fact is, school boards are elected by locals. What is the alternative? A larger government body that determines all things local? I think not. Parents who care know school boards are necessary to keep a form of democracy with the local schools. The values of what the locals want in their schools is part of what this is about. Removing local control and a say is not respecting what the local citizens want for their schools.
User avatar
Karmamatterz
 
Posts: 828
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2012 10:58 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

PreviousNext

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 53 guests