Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby PufPuf93 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 12:05 pm

cv19 is imaginary and just another version of the fu edit oops flu.
Last edited by PufPuf93 on Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby operator kos » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:07 pm

Image

Image

As a nurse, I can't tell you how infuriating this asinine denialism is. Just found out yesterday that a coworker who caught it is now on a ventilator. He's 40, slim, and generally healthy.

Anyone who says this is like the seasonal flu, shut the fuck up for long enough to learn basic math. 34,000 die in the U.S. annually from the flu. 251,000 Americans have died from COVID since March.
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby PufPuf93 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:17 pm

operator kos

Hope you realize from my occasional posts that I was being sarcastic and I am 100% in agreement with your recent RI posts.

The denialism greatly upsets me, just don't have the energy or brain power to put up a strong argument as my health is poor. What is happening and has been happening is surreal, beyond my former imagination. Thank you.
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 4:18 pm

OK, but how do you explain no increase in hospitalizations and only two COViD-19 related deaths in San Francisco over the last three weeks, despite a "spiking" number of positive tests for COVID-19?

Again, has anyone been reading anything I have posted?

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/hea ... 940391002/

The U.S. Department of Health and Human Services' top testing official said Friday Nevada's ban on rapid coronavirus tests in nursing homes could "endanger lives" and urged state health officials to immediately reverse course.

Assistant Secretary for Health Brett Giroir said Nevada would face unspecified enforcement actions if state health officials did not remove an order instructing nursing homes to discontinue use of point-of-care antigen testing machines made by two companies, Quidel and Becton, Dickinson.

HHS "expects immediate action from Nevada to reverse its unwise, uninformed and unlawful unilateral prohibition," Giroir said Friday in a phone call with reporters. "Lives are at stake and our administration is not going to allow actions to risk our seniors or any other vulnerable or underserved population."

Nevada health officials did not immediately return calls or emails from USA TODAY.

On Oct. 2, Nevada officials ordered nursing homes and other long-term facilities to discontinue use of the antigen testing instruments authorized by Food and Drug Administration "until the accuracy of the tests can be better evaluated."

The Nevada Department of Health and Human Services chief medical officer and two other high-ranking health officials cited a high rate of false positive results at eight facilities that used the antigen tests, according to a bulletin for nursing homes and health-care providers.


But Giroir said Nevada's ban represents a misunderstanding of the role of testing machines in screening large numbers of people who might unknowingly pass the virus to others.

HHS has purchased and sent rapid antigen testing instruments to nearly 14,000 nursing homes nationwide as part of a strategy to protect vulnerable seniors. Deaths in nursing homes represent up to 40% of total COVID-19 deaths in the U.S., Giroir said.

These antigen tests are less expensive and provide results more quickly than lab tests. The tests can quickly detect positive cases among nursing home workers, potentially saving infections that can rapidly circulate in a home where many residents have underlying medical conditions that make them more vulnerable.

False positives are inevitable, even when using more accurate lab tests, when relatively few people are infected, he said.

"There is no such thing as a perfect test," Giroir said.

Nevada officials said eight nursing homes using the antigen instruments sought to confirm results at labs using a more accurate form of test, called molecular polymerase chain reaction or PCR. Only 40% of the antigen tests that delivered positive results were confirmed by lab tests – in other words, 60% were false positive.

Girior said Nevada's figures show "an outstanding result, not a disturbing one," because the rapid testing likely caught cases and prevented new infections from circulating in homes and potentially killing residents.

The trade-off is nursing assistants and other staff are held out of work for 48 hours, or however long it takes to confirm antigen tests with more accurate lab tests.

"This is a minuscule price to pay for identifying and isolating those who are infected, infectious and who can devastate our elderly in nursing homes," Giroir said.

In July, dozens of people who took rapid antigen tests at a Manchester, Vermont, clinic were told they had the virus, only to be informed days later by state health officials that more accurate lab tests concluded they didn't. Quidel, the company that makes the rapid antigen test used by the clinic, stood by the original results. The FDA informed Vermont it found no issues with Quidel's instruments or how they were used.

https://www.wbtv.com/2020/11/19/nc-repo ... lizations/

On Friday, Sept. 25, the North Carolina Department of Health and Human Services announced it is adding information about antigen testing to the COVID-19 NC Dashboard, including positive COVID-19 cases and deaths diagnosed with an antigen test and the number of antigen tests completed daily.

An antigen positive case of COVID-19 is a person who received a positive COVID-19 result from an antigen test and does not have a positive result from a molecular (PCR) test.

Antigen positive cases and deaths have now been incorporated onto North Carolina’s dashboards, resulting in 4,676 antigen positive cases and 27 deaths being added to the dashboards.

“The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention requires states to report molecular (PCR) and antigen positive cases separately. Regardless of the test used, a person who tests positive is considered to have COVID-19,” NCDHHS officials stated.


So this supposed record surge in NC includes the new antigen test false positives even if these were proven by superior PCR tests to be false positives, And during this whole surge, just one death in the entire state of North Carolina has been attributed to influenza!
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 4:38 pm

Am I actually the only one in the whole world even looking at the available data surrounding this recent COVID-19 spike?

Here's the "spike" in North Carolina, for example:

Image

OH MY GOD, SAVE THE CHILDREN!!! THE WHOLE STATE IS GETTING SICK AND DYING!!!

Meanwhile, here are the hospitalization stats in the state of North Carolina since this supposed spike began:

Image

Would any COVID-19 spike true believers care to explain these data?
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby PufPuf93 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 4:57 pm

stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 1:18 pm wrote:OK, but how do you explain no increase in hospitalizations and only two COViD-19 related deaths in San Francisco over the last three weeks, despite a "spiking" number of positive tests for COVID-19?

Again, has anyone been reading anything I have posted?


I read nearly everything you post and it is actually making me cranky.

I do not think you are scientifically literate, rather a cherry picker that does not seem to get that the scientific community is still early on the learning curve.

The confusion is weaponized by politics and the fact that at least 1/3 of the population is stark raving mad in an ugly manner and will not cooperate in any meaningful way.

So we head for worse case scenarios.

The economic impact does not have to be such but is political. Many European countries have folks on a reasonable monthly payment to ease the impact. Here the same dupes of the fascists have folks thinking wearing a mask is bad and payment to anyone other than themselves and people like them is socialism even if the payments actually protect capitalism and free markets.

Instead of giving money to people who need money, money was given to corporations to maintain share price for the dominatant positions of accumulated wealth.

Of course, there are so many opportunities for disaster capitalism and all the other grifts. Party time for the segments of humanity of dark heart scrambling like cockroaches to further their ends.

You are a tool of the fascists. But no way are you a fascists, I perceive you as of good heart and intent.

Have stated that I am a lifelong Democrat but that does not mean I am happy with the Democrats because neo-liberal economics is just another expression of fascism and the core of many problems.

I do not mean to be insulting. I like you. Think constructive criticism.
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:00 pm

I'm just spit balling here, but can someone please convince me that the US government is not directing nursing home patients who get false positives on highly inaccurate antigens tests to be quarantined with actually sick nursing home patients?

If so, couldn't this one change in nursing home administration (along with the CDC's bizarre directive to force states to include known antigen test false positives in their newest COVID-19 death counts and the fact that every death that is commonly attributed to influenza is now being attributed to the flu) explain the entire recent modest rise in COVID-19 related deaths in the USA?

Image

For all the boys who are crying COVID spike, where are the excess deaths from all causes that we saw earlier this year? Care to explain?

https://cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/ ... #dashboard
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:04 pm

PufPuf93 » 19 Nov 2020 20:57 wrote:
stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 1:18 pm wrote:OK, but how do you explain no increase in hospitalizations and only two COViD-19 related deaths in San Francisco over the last three weeks, despite a "spiking" number of positive tests for COVID-19?

Again, has anyone been reading anything I have posted?


I read nearly everything you post and it is actually making me cranky.

I do not think you are scientifically literate, rather a cherry picker that does not seem to get that the scientific community is still early on the learning curve.

The confusion is weaponized by politics and the fact that at least 1/3 of the population is stark raving mad in an ugly manner and will not cooperate in any meaningful way.

So we head for worse case scenarios.

The economic impact does not have to be such but is political. Many European countries have folks on a reasonable monthly payment to ease the impact. Here the same dupes of the fascists have folks thinking wearing a mask is bad and payment to anyone other than themselves and people like them is socialism even if the payments actually protect capitalism and free markets.

Instead of giving money to people who need money, money was given to corporations to maintain share price for the dominatant positions of accumulated wealth.

Of course, there are so many opportunities for disaster capitalism and all the other grifts. Party time for the segments of humanity of dark heart scrambling like cockroaches to further their ends.

You are a tool of the fascists. But no way are you a fascists, I perceive you as of good heart and intent.

Have stated that I am a lifelong Democrat but that does not mean I am happy with the Democrats because neo-liberal economics is just another expression of fascism and the core of many problems.

I do not mean to be insulting. I like you. Think constructive criticism.


For some bizarre political reason, you want to believe. You think I must be a Trump supporter just because I took a few minutes to look at readily available data that you choose to ignore for some bizarre political reason. Now you look at the data:

Image

Care to explain without calling me a fascist?
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:11 pm

Here's the thing. Believe it or not, I don't have a dog in this fight, and I am more than willing to be convinced otherwise by hard data.

But where is the contrary data? Where is the data that suggest that the recent spike n COVID-19 cases is overwhelming our hospitals and killing hundreds of thousands more people than a normal flu season would?

Show me the data or STFU. I have no time or energy for bullshit hyper-partisan nonsense.
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby PufPuf93 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:15 pm

stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:04 pm wrote:
PufPuf93 » 19 Nov 2020 20:57 wrote:
stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 1:18 pm wrote:OK, but how do you explain no increase in hospitalizations and only two COViD-19 related deaths in San Francisco over the last three weeks, despite a "spiking" number of positive tests for COVID-19?

Again, has anyone been reading anything I have posted?


I read nearly everything you post and it is actually making me cranky.

I do not think you are scientifically literate, rather a cherry picker that does not seem to get that the scientific community is still early on the learning curve.

The confusion is weaponized by politics and the fact that at least 1/3 of the population is stark raving mad in an ugly manner and will not cooperate in any meaningful way.

So we head for worse case scenarios.

The economic impact does not have to be such but is political. Many European countries have folks on a reasonable monthly payment to ease the impact. Here the same dupes of the fascists have folks thinking wearing a mask is bad and payment to anyone other than themselves and people like them is socialism even if the payments actually protect capitalism and free markets.

Instead of giving money to people who need money, money was given to corporations to maintain share price for the dominatant positions of accumulated wealth.

Of course, there are so many opportunities for disaster capitalism and all the other grifts. Party time for the segments of humanity of dark heart scrambling like cockroaches to further their ends.

You are a tool of the fascists. But no way are you a fascists, I perceive you as of good heart and intent.

Have stated that I am a lifelong Democrat but that does not mean I am happy with the Democrats because neo-liberal economics is just another expression of fascism and the core of many problems.

I do not mean to be insulting. I like you. Think constructive criticism.


For some bizarre political reason, you want to believe. You think I must be a Trump supporter just because I took a few minutes to look at readily available data that you choose to ignore for some bizarre political reason. Now you look at the data:

Image

Care to explain without calling me a fascist?


Do not think you are a Trump supporter

Specifically said no way are you fascist. But you are mistakingly carrying water.

I agree with you that the CDC has often been wildly inconsistent. Blame the inconsistency on how early scientists are on the learning curve, pressure to perform, and political interference. What is published is not only inconsistent and preliminary but spun through the media and internet in a version of the telephone game.
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:16 pm

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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:30 pm

There have been just 50 confirmed cases of influenza in the entire USA so far this entire flu season:

Image
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby PufPuf93 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:42 pm

stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:11 pm wrote:Here's the thing. Believe it or not, I don't have a dog in this fight, and I am more than willing to be convinced otherwise by hard data.

But where is the contrary data? Where is the data that suggest that the recent spike n COVID-19 cases is overwhelming our hospitals and killing hundreds of thousands more people than a normal flu season would?

Show me the data or STFU. I have no time or energy for bullshit hyper-partisan nonsense.


I am no way hyper partisan. Think Hillary Clinton is repulsive and Biden a poor choice, but perhaps the current Democratic party is incapable of coming up with a candidate that I would like or even trust. Trump is Trump and the current GOP is anti American and the Democratic party pathetic to the degree that the left hand has been providing cover for the right hand all my voting life (since 1972).

Not going to look for "data" or argue as you likely do not perceive the effort required to even type this much. Not very healthy and my brain is fading.
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:44 pm

Again, if you believe that I am cherry-picking data, then please at least try to show me how or why using data.
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Re: Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:49 pm

PufPuf93 » 19 Nov 2020 21:42 wrote:
stickdog99 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:11 pm wrote:Here's the thing. Believe it or not, I don't have a dog in this fight, and I am more than willing to be convinced otherwise by hard data.

But where is the contrary data? Where is the data that suggest that the recent spike n COVID-19 cases is overwhelming our hospitals and killing hundreds of thousands more people than a normal flu season would?

Show me the data or STFU. I have no time or energy for bullshit hyper-partisan nonsense.


I am no way hyper partisan. Think Hillary Clinton is repulsive and Biden a poor choice, but perhaps the current Democratic party is incapable of coming up with a candidate that I would like or even trust. Trump is Trump and the current GOP is anti American and the Democratic party pathetic to the degree that the left hand has been providing cover for the right hand all my voting life (since 1972).

Not going to look for "data" or argue as you likely do not perceive the effort required to even type this much. Not very healthy and my brain is fading.


I am sincerely sorry about your health problems. But how can you "know" that I am wrong if you can't or won't even try to find contrary evidence? On what hard data about deaths and/or hospitalizations are you basing your profound faith in the specificity of recent COVID-19 testing?
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