US Presidential Election 2020

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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby JackRiddler » Sun Apr 04, 2021 5:03 pm

stickdog99 » Sun Apr 04, 2021 3:30 pm wrote:Well, thank God that Trump is gone, and everything is so much better now that Biden is in charge of bombing Syria, overthrowing Maduro, caging immigrants, prosecuting Assange, not raising the minimum wage, and especially distributing the life saving gene therapy injections that Trump fast-tracked!


NOT RELEVANT TO THE DISCUSSION ABOUT JAN 6th.

THIS DOES NOT MAKE JAN 6th LESS OF A COUP D'ETAT ATTEMPT.

NOT A REASON TO TRIVIALIZE JAN 6th.

If the coup had come off, you have no idea what would have followed -- much worse than the continuation of the status quo under Biden was certainly promised.

You don't have to say it was a bigger crime than imperialism itself, which certainly I do not.

But that's not enough. You trivialize it. You take the side of Trump's defense!

Why, given how unimportant you think Jan 6 was, why are you both obsessed with continuing this trivialization and making excuses for a mob of fascists who stormed the legislature, on command from the executive, so as to overturn the election? As the final move in a coup attempt that lasted for months?

Why are you incapable of even reading the last paragraph and acknowledging it? You just go ahead and repeat the multi-screen litany of the same stuff that in no way refutes that. Why do you think the continuation of imperialism, capitalism, or the incipient bio-regime is any kind of justification for your defactualized non-argument for treating Jan 6 as some kind of harmless prank by basically nice misguided fascists that the libruls have blown out of proportion?

.
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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby kelley » Sun Apr 04, 2021 5:59 pm

farcical by the looks of it

however

a deeply tragic act

as with everything in American public life the consequences will be grasped much later

if ever
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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby Belligerent Savant » Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:27 pm

.



JR:
Why, given how unimportant you think Jan 6 was, why are you both obsessed with continuing this trivialization and making excuses for a mob of fascists who stormed the legislature, on command from the executive, so as to overturn the election? As the final move in a coup attempt that lasted for months?


My primary thoughts are as follows:

1. I object to referring to it as a 'coup attempt'. Instead, it appears to be part of an intended misdirection; i simply do not believe a 'coup' was the true objective, though of course some of the boots on the ground -- the 'useful idiots' -- were led to believe otherwise. Also, it had very little, if any, of the markings of a legit coup attempt: no demands, no govt representative was hurt or apprehended, or threatened; no extended 'sit-in' or hostage attempts; no manifesto, etc.

We'll see how current trials for the alleged perpetrators play out. Perhaps details will emerge, but initial returns aren't promising.

2. The intel op aspect of it: immediately prior to, during, and after the event. This by itself calls into question true motives/objectives.

Also, and this is more of a 'meta' talking point: referring to the event as a 'fascist coup attempt' suggests we aren't already under a creeping fascist system. The 'coup' occured many years ago (some may theorize it kicked off in earnest when JFK was taken out; others will posit that we were never a 'democracy', other than as window dressing). Whatever any of us may believe happened that day, the notion that 'democracy" was 'under siege' seems a fanciful delusion to me. This last point alone may be the largest objection I have with the establishment framing of Jan. 6th.

And what have we observed since January? More substantive maneuvers into overt totalitarian measures and mandates for the foreseeable future.

Unfortunately, as kelley indicates, 'the consequences will be grasped much later'. Moot, by then.


But i'm just an informed observer here. And some may dispute my use of the word 'informed'.
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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby JackRiddler » Sun Apr 04, 2021 8:08 pm

You're still decontextualizing. Jan 6 was not the coup, all one day. It was the last move in a coup that everyone could see had failed. Since the crowd wasn't the 10 or 20 times bigger than what was required for a full occupation, they were still dispatched to do a final fuck you, an act of destructive defiance that promised a future round, also a recruitment. By then this went on for months.

Of course it had demands. Trump, the president and the leader of the mob, the one who gave them their orders to go be strong, voiced the demands for all, had been voicing his demands for months. The demand was to flip the election, or invalidate it, or suspend the count of the vote. The demand on Jan 6 was especially on Pence. You're mystifying why they went there and did what they did, but that's impossible because it was stated in public and in the simplest, baldest terms. You're relying on some kind of confusionist amnesiac magic. (After the fact, since the flop, the right has done the same, pretending their own actions on command from a political leader were orchestrated by magical outsiders -- not a them from the state, but a them of 'antifa' infiltrators among them!)
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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby Belligerent Savant » Mon Apr 05, 2021 5:48 pm

.

There were shenanigans conducted by both establishment parties leading up to, and during election day. As such, in my view the election results were already invalid well before Jan 6th. Vote tampering and related acts of fraud are par for the course in every U.S. election, of course. But this one, in hindsight, had a number of props set up ('pandemic'-inspired mail-in voting, etc) leading up to election night to help rig the results. It seems they took extra care to ensure Orange Man was removed -- willing player or not, his ego and unpredictability were simply undesirable traits for the plans in store for the next few years. The Oval Office version of Weekend At Bernie's allows for a far more controllable environment (until he's replaced, that is). One faction out-muscled the other.

(An overly broad and stylized overview, to be sure)

As I mentioned before, my take on Jan. 6th is that Trump played his part; there were other agendas at play that day, and he wasn't the 'grand maestro' portrayed by the media.

Again: I may well be wrong, at least in part. But nothing since then has changed my position on this. Not yet, at least.

Also:
Nothing occurs in a vacuum, more so in our current era than in prior years (we can thank social media and the internet as amplifying mechanisms: the speed and efficiency [via AI algorithms/professional and mercenary influencers, etc,] in spreading messaging on the collective psyche and cultural norms, manipulating sentiment in unprecedented -- at times subtle, and other times more overt -- ways; thought management requires far less manpower than ever before); all political/societal actions leading up to and since Election Day are interlocking.
Last edited by Belligerent Savant on Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby stickdog99 » Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:36 am

JackRiddler » 04 Apr 2021 21:03 wrote:
stickdog99 » Sun Apr 04, 2021 3:30 pm wrote:Well, thank God that Trump is gone, and everything is so much better now that Biden is in charge of bombing Syria, overthrowing Maduro, caging immigrants, prosecuting Assange, not raising the minimum wage, and especially distributing the life saving gene therapy injections that Trump fast-tracked!


NOT RELEVANT TO THE DISCUSSION ABOUT JAN 6th.

THIS DOES NOT MAKE JAN 6th LESS OF A COUP D'ETAT ATTEMPT.

NOT A REASON TO TRIVIALIZE JAN 6th.

If the coup had come off, you have no idea what would have followed -- much worse than the continuation of the status quo under Biden was certainly promised.

You don't have to say it was a bigger crime than imperialism itself, which certainly I do not.

But that's not enough. You trivialize it. You take the side of Trump's defense!

Why, given how unimportant you think Jan 6 was, why are you both obsessed with continuing this trivialization and making excuses for a mob of fascists who stormed the legislature, on command from the executive, so as to overturn the election? As the final move in a coup attempt that lasted for months?

Why are you incapable of even reading the last paragraph and acknowledging it? You just go ahead and repeat the multi-screen litany of the same stuff that in no way refutes that. Why do you think the continuation of imperialism, capitalism, or the incipient bio-regime is any kind of justification for your defactualized non-argument for treating Jan 6 as some kind of harmless prank by basically nice misguided fascists that the libruls have blown out of proportion?

.


LOL. Sorry, but I'm currently just a little more interested in attacking the people who should know better. But feel free to keep preaching about how scary the masses of Q-Anon misled dolts are. Because they are.
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...

Postby JackRiddler » Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:11 pm

sd99, is that what I said? Well, no. You're still evading the point, bold and lightning bolt emojis and all. So it's eternal recurrence time. I'm just gonna lock myself out of this thread for a week or two, and then come back and reply to the latest with some damn thing I already posted above. Saves time, handy.
We meet at the borders of our being, we dream something of each others reality. - Harvey of R.I.

To Justice my maker from on high did incline:
I am by virtue of its might divine,
The highest Wisdom and the first Love.

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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby Harvey » Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:52 pm

Yawn.
And while we spoke of many things, fools and kings
This he said to me
"The greatest thing
You'll ever learn
Is just to love
And be loved
In return"


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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby Belligerent Savant » Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:53 pm

.

Remember how alot of people on the left thought they were voting out fascism last year?


Image

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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby Belligerent Savant » Mon Apr 19, 2021 8:39 pm

.

Those that fully subscribed to the narratives of Jan.6th are making it too easy for him.

The Media Lied Repeatedly About Officer Brian Sicknick's Death. And They Just Got Caught.

Just as with the Russia Bounty debacle, they will never acknowledge what they did. Their audience wants to be lied to for partisan gain and emotional pleasure.

It was crucial for liberal sectors of the media to invent and disseminate a harrowing lie about how Officer Brian Sicknick died. That is because he is the only one they could claim was killed by pro-Trump protesters at the January 6 riot at the Capitol.

So The New York Times on January 8 published an emotionally gut-wrenching but complete fiction that never had any evidence — that Officer Sicknick's skull was savagely bashed in with a fire extinguisher by a pro-Trump mob until he died — and, just like the now-discredited Russian bounty story also unveiled by that same paper, cable outlets and other media platforms repeated this lie over and over in the most emotionally manipulative way possible. Just watch a part of what they did and how:




As I detailed over and over when examining this story, there were so many reasons to doubt this storyline from the start. Nobody on the record claimed it happened. The autopsy found no blunt trauma to the head. Sicknick's own family kept urging the press to stop spreading this story because he called them the night of January 6 and told them he was fine — obviously inconsistent with the media's claim that he died by having his skull bashed in — and his own mother kept saying that she believed he died of a stroke.

But the gruesome story of Sicknick's “murder” was too valuable to allow any questioning. It was weaponized over and over to depict the pro-Trump mob not as just violent but barbaric and murderous, because if Sicknick weren't murdered by them, then nobody was (without Sicknick, the only ones killed were four pro-Trump supporters: two who died of a heart attack, one from an amphetamine overdose, and the other, Ashli Babbitt, who was shot point blank in the neck by Capitol Police despite being unarmed). So crucial was this fairy tale about Sicknick that it made its way into the official record of President Trump's impeachment trial in the Senate, and they had Joe Biden himself recite from the script, even as clear facts mounted proving it was untrue.

Because of its centrality to the media narrative and agenda, anyone who tried to point out the serious factual deficiencies in this story — in other words, people trying to be journalists — were smeared by Democratic Party loyalists who pretend to be journalists as "Sicknick Truthers,” white nationalist sympathizers, and supporters of insurrection.

For the crime of trying to determine the factual truth of what happened, my character was constantly impugned by these propagandistic worms, as was anyone else's who tried to tell the truth about Sicknick's tragic death. Because one of the first people to highlight the journalistic truth here was former Trump official Darren Beattie of Revolver News and one of the few people on television willing to host doubts about the official story was Tucker Carlson, any doubts about the false Sicknick story — no matter how well-grounded in truth, facts, reason and evidence — were cast as fascism and white supremacy, and those raising questions smeared as "truthers”: the usual dreary liberal insults for trying to coerce people into submitting to their lies:

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Because the truth usually prevails, at least ultimately, their lies, yet again, all came crashing down on their heads on Monday. The District of Columbia’s chief medical examiner earlier this morning issued his official ruling in the Sicknick case, and it was so definitive that The Washington Post — one of the media outlets that had pushed the multiple falsehoods — did not even bother to try to mask or mitigate the stark conclusion it revealed:

Image

The first line tells much of the story: “Capitol Police officer Brian D. Sicknick suffered two strokes and died of natural causes a day after he confronted rioters at the Jan. 6 insurrection, the District’s chief medical examiner has ruled.” Using understatement, the paper added: “The ruling, released Monday, likely will make it difficult for prosecutors to pursue homicide charges in the officer’s death.”

This definitive finding from the medical examiner not only rids us of the Fire Extinguisher lie but also the second theory to which these media outlets resorted once they had to face the reality that they spent weeks spreading an outright lie (needless to say, they provided no real accountability or even acknowledgement for the fact that they did spread that Fire Extinguisher tale, instead just seamlessly moving to their next evidence-free claim). They changed their story to claim that pro-Trump protesters still murdered Sicknick, not with a fire extinguisher but with bear spray, which video shows at least one protester using in his vicinity.

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The problem with that theory is that bear spray is not usually fatal, and the medical examiner's findings ruled out the possibility that this is what caused his death:

In an interview with The Washington Post, Francisco J. Diaz, the medical examiner, said the autopsy found no evidence the 42-year-old officer suffered an allergic reaction to chemical irritants, which Diaz said would have caused Sicknick’s throat to quickly seize. Diaz also said there was no evidence of internal or external injuries….

Diaz said Sicknick suffered two strokes at the base of the brain stem caused by a clot in an artery that supplies blood to that area of the body. Diaz said he could not comment on whether Sicknick had a preexisting medical condition, citing privacy laws.

So there goes that second fairy tale. The Post did note the medical examiner's observation regarding Sicknick's participation in defending the Capitol that day that “all that transpired played a role in his condition.” That of course is true: just as it is true for the two pro-Trump supporters who had heart attacks that day and the other pro-Trump supporter who died from too much amphetamine in her system, having a stressful encounter as a police officer likely played a role in why someone would have two strokes the following day. But police officers are trained for stressful encounters, and that obviously is a far cry from being able to claim that any pro-Trump supporter murdered Sicknick.

I'll have much more on this story as it unfolds. A significant amount of media accountability is warranted. But you're seeing why there is so much resentment and so many attacks on platforms like this one that permit journalists to report and analyze facts and dissect media narratives without being constrained by liberal orthodoxies and pieties and while remaining immune from liberal pressure tactics: it's one of the few ways that real dissent to their lies and propaganda can be aired.
Image

Truth matters. Noble lies are never justified no matter the cause, especially in journalism. But these employees of corporate media outlets have been taught the exact opposite model: that their primary obligation is to please and flatter the partisan agenda and political sensibilities of their audience even if it means lying or recklessly spreading unproven theories to do it. That is their profit model. And they have trained their audiences to want and expect this and that is why they never feel compelled to engage in any self-critique or accountability when they get caught doing this: their audiences want to be lied to — they are grateful for it — and would prefer that they not admit they did it so that their partisan interests will not be undermined.

What is most depressing about this entire spectacle is that, this time, they exploited the tragic death of a young man to achieve their tawdry goals. They never cared in the slightest about Officer Brian Sicknick. They had just spent months glorifying a protest movement whose core view is that police officers are inherently racist and abusive. He had just become their toy, to be played with and exploited in order to depict the January 6 protest as a murderous orgy carried out by savages so primitive and inhuman that they were willing to fatally bash in the skull of a helpless person or spray them with deadly gases until they choked to death on their own lung fluids. None if it was true, but that did not matter — and it still does not to them — because truth, as always, has nothing to do with their actual function. If anything, truth is an impediment to it.


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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby conniption » Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:01 am

Constantine Report

THE SIEGE OF THE CAPITOL: ALL ROADS LEAD TO ROBERT MERCER
By Alex Constantine
February 2, 2021



I haven't read through the entire article yet, but it's already making me wonder...about a lot of things.

anyway, HMW thought highly of Alex Constantine, iirc...

https://constantinereport.com/the-siege ... rt-mercer/
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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:57 pm

I'm starting to think that all of this is part of an agenda to divide US citizens into literally warring political camps, both elated to relegate the other to concentration camps or at least re-education centers.

Please do your best to stop advancing this agenda. Every non-elite person has more in common with every other non-elite person than any of us have in common with our would be slave masters.
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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby Belligerent Savant » Thu Apr 22, 2021 4:11 pm

.

Yes, the sooner the majority realize it's far more about CLASS, NOT race, the quicker we can minimize wide-scale subjugation. As you point out, the average American has far more in common other working/labor class Americans, regardless of race or creed, than the very few elites in the upper tiers.

It's a cliche, but accurate: Divide and Conquer is the primary M.O.
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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby dada » Thu Apr 22, 2021 5:44 pm

I have as little in common with your elites as with your non-elites, though. You know, heaven doesn't want me, and hell is afraid I'll take over.

Or maybe it's the opposite, I don't remember. One doesn't want me and the other is afraid I'll take over. Doesn't really matter which is which.

But it's perfectly alright by me, since I don't want them, either. I want the others that reject and are rejected by both elites and non-elites alike. Those are my people.
Both his words and manner of speech seemed at first totally unfamiliar to me, and yet somehow they stirred memories - as an actor might be stirred by the forgotten lines of some role he had played far away and long ago.
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Re: US Presidential Election 2020

Postby Elvis » Thu Apr 22, 2021 6:49 pm

conniption » Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:01 pm wrote:
Constantine Report

THE SIEGE OF THE CAPITOL: ALL ROADS LEAD TO ROBERT MERCER
By Alex Constantine
February 2, 2021



I haven't read through the entire article yet, but it's already making me wonder...about a lot of things.

anyway, HMW thought highly of Alex Constantine, iirc...

https://constantinereport.com/the-siege ... rt-mercer/


I'm halfway through the article—thank you. For the last couple of years I've been asking, "So what is Robert Mercer up to?"

Key Trump campaign donor steps back from supporting president’s 2020 election bid

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=41980&p=689432&hilit=mercer#p689432



And Wombaticus nailed it:

They're not out; they're working through other channels. That will come to light after the election.

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=41980&p=689432&hilit=mercer#p689433



back to reading...
“The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.” ― Joan Robinson
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