Towards Rigorous & Radical Conspiracy Theory

[Sounder]

I hope you will remember the times in my previous posts when I acknowledged agreement with your views as well as the times I saw fit to debate them.

You bet, and do feel free to challenge anything I may say, I can handle it.

The point I try to make, perhaps too obsessively is that speculative thinkers are often in a battle with confirmatory thinkers to create a space for operating.

This inhibits the development of rigorous or radical anything, let alone conspiracy theory.

And to my mind, conspiracy theory makes for a poor framing of the issues anyway, so perhaps I will do best to retire from this thread.

[jakell]

Now that someone has mentioned 'rigorous and radical' conspiracy theory, can we have another look at the thread topic ?

.........Talking of original context though, I'm interested in how that has played out. The OP seemed to desire a narrow compatibility based group centred around ideology in order to develop a 'rigorous and radical conspiracy theory'.

I suggested that an initial ideology was not a strict requirement and nor was close compatibility. I'm wondering how this is progessing (if at all).

[Sounder]

The OP seemed to desire a narrow compatibility based group centred around ideology in order to develop a 'rigorous and radical conspiracy theory'.

Well of course it does, this is an American Dream thread.

I suggested that an initial ideology was not a strict requirement and nor was close compatibility. I'm wondering how this is progessing (if at all).

I totally agree, my beef with AD lo these many years (that he has had me on the ignore setting), is that while he seems believe to the world should be (taken over and) defined through PC metrics, I maintain that a healthier society is built through the interaction of a plurality of ideas.


This sort of thing might progress better on a different thread, -right, I'm retired.

[jakell]

You're probably right. If the originator has lost heart, then who are we to deliver CPR?

It just seemed quite 'passionate' at the outset,

[Searcher08]

I think it comes down to the OP:

My perception

One set of people are driven (in this context) by
ideology, sameness, shared values, compliance, there being a correct view and way to do things re the OP

the other set by
ideas, difference, divergent values, non-compliance, there being plurality of views and approaches re the OP

One approach might be to encourage each of them to go off and 'do their thing' without interference from the other...

[American Dream]

I think it comes down to the OP:

My perception

One set of people are driven (in this context) by
ideology, sameness, shared values, compliance, there being a correct view and way to do things re the OP

the other set by
ideas, difference, divergent values, non-compliance, there being plurality of views and approaches re the OP

One approach might be to encourage each of them to go off and 'do their thing' without interference from the other...

Right- that is why I have mentioned Stormfart and the British fascist board jakell was recommending folks go to as alternatives for that small but recurrent minority who really are not with the spirit of RI.

[seemslikeadream]

You are not with my spirit of RI...I am not terrified of you're little nazi fascists like you are

[jakell]

I think it comes down to the OP:

My perception

One set of people are driven (in this context) by
ideology, sameness, shared values, compliance, there being a correct view and way to do things re the OP

the other set by
ideas, difference, divergent values, non-compliance, there being plurality of views and approaches re the OP

One approach might be to encourage each of them to go off and 'do their thing' without interference from the other...

I'm sure it's not as binary as that, but still, it's nice to have a starting point, and a binary is a starting point

I think it was you who (faintly) praised Mulebone, and I've just come across one his rants that appears fairly accurate. The trouble is he aims it at the board rather than a particular section of it, so it goes a bit wide of the mark.
I'd reproduce it here but some might get upset all over again. I'll pm it to you.

[Searcher08]

I think it comes down to the OP:

My perception

One set of people are driven (in this context) by
ideology, sameness, shared values, compliance, there being a correct view and way to do things re the OP

the other set by
ideas, difference, divergent values, non-compliance, there being plurality of views and approaches re the OP

One approach might be to encourage each of them to go off and 'do their thing' without interference from the other...

I'm sure it's not as binary as that, but still, it's nice to have a starting point, and a binary is a starting point

I think it was you who (faintly) praised Mulebone, and I've just come across one his rants that appears fairly accurate. The trouble is he aims it at the board rather than a particular section of it, so it goes a bit wide of the mark.
I'd reproduce it here but some might get upset all over again. I'll pm it to you.

I think mulebone rocks and (I hope) my posts show more than faint praise. I think the whole board deserves just about everything he says. It is like having a bucket of ice cold water thrown in your face and a great wake-up call.

The one thing the board has not done has been to have a trial separation, where some structure is created for each 'sub-community' to ignore each other and be able to post without interference but with access available for the people who want to go between the 'islands'.

This itself is difficult if one of the parties has an approach which appears to demand that the other behave the way they want...

[Sounder]

The one thing the board has not done has been to have a trial separation, where some structure is created for each 'sub-community' to ignore each other and be able to post without interference but with access available for the people who want to go between the 'islands'.

This itself is difficult if one of the parties has an approach which appears to demand that the other behave the way they want...

Ahhh,--I can’t go for that.

A past aspiration of the RI board was to respect the need for the gut and the head types to work together, so as to have a better chance for improving our collective analysis of our situation.

Having explicit sub-communities would only serve to increase passive aggressive outbursts such as Jacks current display.

Look, Jack has never liked me. (So what)

He is/was at least sharp enough to know (right from the start) that our epistemic stances toward reality are at direct odds with each other.

He believes that mind is an epiphenomenon of the activities of the brain whereas I consider that mind may be informed by a source coming from the other direction.

He has a deep disdain for my assertion that consciousness precedes being.

And I have disdain for the notion that being precedes consciousness because I think it is an enabler of neo-liberalism and imperialism.

Big wup

[BrandonD]

I think it comes down to the OP:

My perception

One set of people are driven (in this context) by
ideology, sameness, shared values, compliance, there being a correct view and way to do things re the OP

the other set by
ideas, difference, divergent values, non-compliance, there being plurality of views and approaches re the OP

One approach might be to encourage each of them to go off and 'do their thing' without interference from the other...

Right- that is why I have mentioned Stormfart and the British fascist board jakell was recommending folks go to as alternatives for that small but recurrent minority who really are not with the spirit of RI.

AD when reading your posts, such as the above comment where your unrelated reference to those negative websites implies that divergent values and different ideas are the equivalent of promoting fascism, I sometimes get the impression that you believe the spirit of this forum to be different than what I perceive it to be.

Perhaps you could clarify your statement above. What is the spirit of RI?

You seem to be under the impression that the spirit of RI is something like a political or social activist site, a crusade to eliminate fascism from the earth. I am a relative newbie so I am completely open to being corrected, but I must say that this particular spirit of RI is being projected by you alone. From the rest of the participants, the spirit of RI that I receive is closer to "a more refined and erudite discussion of non-mainstream and conspiracy related topics than you will find elsewhere on the internet".

If we do not share your zeal for fighting fascism, are we out of step with the spirit of this site? If we are not with you, then are we against you?

[seemslikeadream]

thank you


please AD let us all know what our RI spirit is supposed to be...cause I did not sign your consent form version when this board was started and I followed Jeff here from DU

I am sick and tired of your version of RI and your watch dog presence here

[jakell]

[
You seem to be under the impression that the spirit of RI is something like a political or social activist site, a crusade to eliminate fascism from the earth. I am a relative newbie so I am completely open to being corrected, but I must say that this particular spirit of RI is being projected by you alone. From the rest of the participants, the spirit of RI that I receive is closer to "a more refined and erudite discussion of non-mainstream and conspiracy related topics than you will find elsewhere on the internet".

This is a point I was questioning earlier; the assertion that ideology, and a certain set of ideologies in particular is a prerequisite for investigating conspiracies ( and hence other things too I suspect).

I wouldn't discount it outright, but I never got an answer to that question.

[American Dream]

I think it comes down to the OP:

My perception

One set of people are driven (in this context) by
ideology, sameness, shared values, compliance, there being a correct view and way to do things re the OP

the other set by
ideas, difference, divergent values, non-compliance, there being plurality of views and approaches re the OP

One approach might be to encourage each of them to go off and 'do their thing' without interference from the other...

Right- that is why I have mentioned Stormfart and the British fascist board jakell was recommending folks go to as alternatives for that small but recurrent minority who really are not with the spirit of RI.

AD when reading your posts, such as the above comment where your unrelated reference to those negative websites implies that divergent values and different ideas are the equivalent of promoting fascism, I sometimes get the impression that you believe the spirit of this forum to be different than what I perceive it to be.

Perhaps you could clarify your statement above. What is the spirit of RI?

You seem to be under the impression that the spirit of RI is something like a political or social activist site, a crusade to eliminate fascism from the earth. I am a relative newbie so I am completely open to being corrected, but I must say that this particular spirit of RI is being projected by you alone. From the rest of the participants, the spirit of RI that I receive is closer to "a more refined and erudite discussion of non-mainstream and conspiracy related topics than you will find elsewhere on the internet".

If we do not share your zeal for fighting fascism, are we out of step with the spirit of this site? If we are not with you, then are we against you?

Brandon, you're really not understanding what I meant. I was referring to people who are definitively not in alignment with the guidelines of this board, and who disrespect those guidelines. As I attempted to express it today, these are a small, small minority. They have come and gone over the years but they do seem to keep on coming.

Anyway, thanks for asking a clarifying question because that was not the impression I wanted to convey. Perhaps it was inspired by Searcher's formulation, which does not represent my view of the situation and I consider to be problematic.


.

[seemslikeadream]

that is NOT YOUR JOB...who the fuck made you commander of the watch dogs here...if someone is actively disrespecting the guidelines here....

PHONE A MOD AND STOP YOUR GESTPO TACTICS


WHO THE FUCK ARE THIS SMALL MINORITY HERE YOU SPEAK OF?

WHERE IS THE DAMAGE DONE?

This board existed just fine before you showed up and it would be just fine if you left

Six years we survived very well without you we could do very well if you were not around to fight your imaginary fascists