Terrorists take Eagles of Death Metal show in Paris hostage

[elfismiles]

Heck even ole AJ hedged his bets re "false flag" Friday night... I'm sure that's changed by now.

Probly don't wanna watch any of this but ... at the 5 min 17 second or so mark he says "this probably isn't staged"

https://youtu.be/fP0hVBeoYFo?t=5m17s

https://youtu.be/fP0hVBeoYFo?t=5m17s

but the full extent of the attacks wasn't as known Friday night as it is now Sunday night.

[elfismiles]

John Pilger on ISIS: Only When We See the War Criminals In Our Midst Will the Blood Begin to Dry
By John Pilger / johnpilger.com



In transmitting President Richard Nixon's orders for a "massive" bombing of Cambodia in 1969, Henry Kissinger said, "Anything that flies on everything that moves". As Barack Obama ignites his seventh war against the Muslim world since he was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize, the orchestrated hysteria and lies make one almost nostalgic for Kissinger's murderous honesty.

As a witness to the human consequences of aerial savagery - including the beheading of victims, their parts festooning trees and fields - I am not surprised by the disregard of memory and history, yet again. A telling example is the rise to power of Pol Pot and his Khmer Rouge, who had much in common with today's Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS). They, too, were ruthless medievalists who began as a small sect. They, too, were the product of an American-made apocalypse, this time in Asia.

According to Pol Pot, his movement had consisted of "fewer than 5,000 poorly armed guerrillas uncertain about their strategy, tactics, loyalty and leaders". Once Nixon's and Kissinger's B52 bombers had gone to work as part of "Operation Menu", the west's ultimate demon could not believe his luck.

The Americans dropped the equivalent of five Hiroshimas on rural Cambodia during 1969-73. They levelled village after village, returning to bomb the rubble and corpses. The craters left monstrous necklaces of carnage, still visible from the air. The terror was unimaginable. A former Khmer Rouge official described how the survivors "froze up and they would wander around mute for three or four days. Terrified and half-crazy, the people were ready to believe what they were told... That was what made it so easy for the Khmer Rouge to win the people over."

A Finnish Government Commission of Enquiry estimated that 600,000 Cambodians died in the ensuing civil war and described the bombing as the "first stage in a decade of genocide". What Nixon and Kissinger began, Pol Pot, their beneficiary, completed. Under their bombs, the Khmer Rouge grew to a formidable army of 200,000.

ISIS has a similar past and present. By most scholarly measure, Bush and Blair's invasion of Iraq in 2003 led to the deaths of some 700,000 people - in a country that had no history of jihadism. The Kurds had done territorial and political deals; Sunni and Shia had class and sectarian differences, but they were at peace; intermarriage was common. Three years before the invasion, I drove the length of Iraq without fear. On the way I met people proud, above all, to be Iraqis, the heirs of a civilization that seemed, for them, a presence.

Bush and Blair blew all this to bits. Iraq is now a nest of jihadism. Al-Qaeda - like Pol Pot's "jihadists" - seized the opportunity provided by the onslaught of Shock and Awe and the civil war that followed. "Rebel" Syria offered even greater rewards, with CIA and Gulf state ratlines of weapons, logistics and money running through Turkey. The arrival of foreign recruits was inevitable. A former British ambassador, Oliver Miles, wrote recently, "The [Cameron] government seems to be following the example of Tony Blair, who ignored consistent advice from the Foreign Office, MI5 and MI6 that our Middle East policy - and in particular our Middle East wars - had been a principal driver in the recruitment of Muslims in Britain for terrorism here."

ISIS is the progeny of those in Washington and London who, in destroying Iraq as both a state and a society, conspired to commit an epic crime against humanity. Like Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge, ISIS are the mutations of a western state terror dispensed by a venal imperial elite undeterred by the consequences of actions taken at great remove in distance and culture. Their culpability is unmentionable in "our" societies.

It is 23 years since this holocaust enveloped Iraq, immediately after the first Gulf War, when the US and Britain hijacked the United Nations Security Council and imposed punitive "sanctions" on the Iraqi population - ironically, reinforcing the domestic authority of Saddam Hussein. It was like a medieval siege. Almost everything that sustained a modern state was, in the jargon, "blocked" - from chlorine for making the water supply safe to school pencils, parts for X-ray machines, common painkillers and drugs to combat previously unknown cancers carried in the dust from the southern battlefields contaminated with Depleted Uranium.

Just before Christmas 1999, the Department of Trade and Industry in London restricted the export of vaccines meant to protect Iraqi children against diphtheria and yellow fever. Kim Howells, parliamentary Under-Secretary of State in the Blair government, explained why. "The children's vaccines", he said, "were capable of being used in weapons of mass destruction". The British Government could get away with such an outrage because media reporting of Iraq - much of it manipulated by the Foreign Office - blamed Saddam Hussein for everything.

Under a bogus "humanitarian" Oil for Food Programme, $100 was allotted for each Iraqi to live on for a year. This figure had to pay for the entire society's infrastructure and essential services, such as power and water. "Imagine," the UN Assistant Secretary General, Hans Von Sponeck, told me, "setting that pittance against the lack of clean water, and the fact that the majority of sick people cannot afford treatment, and the sheer trauma of getting from day to day, and you have a glimpse of the nightmare. And make no mistake, this is deliberate. I have not in the past wanted to use the word genocide, but now it is unavoidable."

Disgusted, Von Sponeck resigned as UN Humanitarian Co-ordinator in Iraq. His predecessor, Denis Halliday, an equally distinguished senior UN official, had also resigned. "I was instructed," Halliday said, "to implement a policy that satisfies the definition of genocide: a deliberate policy that has effectively killed well over a million individuals, children and adults."

A study by the United Nations Children's Fund, Unicef, found that between 1991 and 1998, the height of the blockade, there were 500,000 "excess" deaths of Iraqi infants under the age of five. An American TV reporter put this to Madeleine Albright, US Ambassador to the United Nations, asking her, "Is the price worth it?" Albright replied, "We think the price is worth it."

In 2007, the senior British official responsible for the sanctions, Carne Ross, known as "Mr. Iraq", told a parliamentary selection committee, "[The US and UK governments] effectively denied the entire population a means to live." When I interviewed Carne Ross three years later, he was consumed by regret and contrition. "I feel ashamed," he said. He is today a rare truth-teller of how governments deceive and how a compliant media plays a critical role in disseminating and maintaining the deception. "We would feed [journalists] factoids of sanitised intelligence," he said, "or we'd freeze them out."

On 25 September, a headline in the Guardian read: "Faced with the horror of Isis we must act." The "we must act" is a ghost risen, a warning of the suppression of informed memory, facts, lessons learned and regrets or shame. The author of the article was Peter Hain, the former Foreign Office minister responsible for Iraq under Blair. In 1998, when Denis Halliday revealed the extent of the suffering in Iraq for which the Blair Government shared primary responsibility, Hain abused him on the BBC's Newsnight as an "apologist for Saddam". In 2003, Hain backed Blair's invasion of stricken Iraq on the basis of transparent lies. At a subsequent Labour Party conference, he dismissed the invasion as a "fringe issue".

Now Hain is demanding "air strikes, drones, military equipment and other support" for those "facing genocide" in Iraq and Syria. This will further "the imperative of a political solution". Obama has the same in mind as he lifts what he calls the "restrictions" on US bombing and drone attacks. This means that missiles and 500-pound bombs can smash the homes of peasant people, as they are doing without restriction in Yemen, Pakistan, Afghanistan and Somalia - as they did in Cambodia, Vietnam and Laos. On 23 September, a Tomahawk cruise missile hit a village in Idlib Province in Syria, killing as many as a dozen civilians, including women and children. None waved a black flag.

The day Hain's article appeared, Denis Halliday and Hans Von Sponeck happened to be in London and came to visit me. They were not shocked by the lethal hypocrisy of a politician, but lamented the enduring, almost inexplicable absence of intelligent diplomacy in negotiating a semblance of truce. Across the world, from Northern Ireland to Nepal, those regarding each other as terrorists and heretics have faced each other across a table. Why not now in Iraq and Syria.

Like Ebola from West Africa, a bacteria called "perpetual war" has crossed the Atlantic. Lord Richards, until recently head of the British military, wants "boots on the ground" now. There is a vapid, almost sociopathic verboseness from Cameron, Obama and their "coalition of the willing" - notably Australia's aggressively weird Tony Abbott - as they prescribe more violence delivered from 30,000 feet on places where the blood of previous adventures never dried. They have never seen bombing and they apparently love it so much they want it to overthrow their one potentially valuable ally, Syria. This is nothing new, as the following leaked UK-US intelligence file illustrates:

"In order to facilitate the action of liberative [sic] forces... a special effort should be made to eliminate certain key individuals [and] to proceed with internal disturbances in Syria. CIA is prepared, and SIS (MI6) will attempt to mount minor sabotage and coup de main [sic] incidents within Syria, working through contacts with individuals... a necessary degree of fear... frontier and [staged] border clashes [will] provide a pretext for intervention... the CIA and SIS should use... capabilities in both psychological and action fields to augment tension."

That was written in 1957, though it could have been written yesterday. In the imperial world, nothing essentially changes. Last year, the former French Foreign Minister Roland Dumas revealed that "two years before the Arab spring", he was told in London that a war on Syria was planned. "I am going to tell you something," he said in an interview with the French TV channel LPC, "I was in England two years before the violence in Syria on other business. I met top British officials, who confessed to me that they were preparing something in Syria... Britain was organising an invasion of rebels into Syria. They even asked me, although I was no longer Minister for Foreign Affairs, if I would like to participate... This operation goes way back. It was prepared, preconceived and planned."

The only effective opponents of ISIS are accredited demons of the west - Syria, Iran, Hezbollah. The obstacle is Turkey, an "ally" and a member of Nato, which has conspired with the CIA, MI6 and the Gulf medievalists to channel support to the Syrian "rebels", including those now calling themselves ISIS. Supporting Turkey in its long-held ambition for regional dominance by overthrowing the Assad government beckons a major conventional war and the horrific dismemberment of the most ethnically diverse state in the Middle East.

A truce - however difficult to achieve - is the only way out of this imperial maze; otherwise, the beheadings will continue. That genuine negotiations with Syria should be seen as "morally questionable" (the Guardian) suggests that the assumptions of moral superiority among those who supported the war criminal Blair remain not only absurd, but dangerous.

Together with a truce, there should be an immediate cessation of all shipments of war materials to Israel and recognition of the State of Palestine. The issue of Palestine is the region's most festering open wound, and the oft-stated justification for the rise of Islamic extremism. Osama bin Laden made that clear. Palestine also offers hope. Give justice to the Palestinians and you begin to change the world around them.

More than 40 years ago, the Nixon-Kissinger bombing of Cambodia unleashed a torrent of suffering from which that country has never recovered. The same is true of the Blair-Bush crime in Iraq. With impeccable timing, Henry Kissinger's latest self-serving tome has just been released with its satirical title, "World Order". In one fawning review, Kissinger is described as a "key shaper of a world order that remained stable for a quarter of a century". Tell that to the people of Cambodia, Vietnam, Laos, Chile, East Timor and all the other victims of his "statecraft". Only when "we" recognise the war criminals in our midst will the blood begin to dry.



World Order Hardcover – September 9, 2014
by Henry Kissinger
http://www.amazon.com/World-Order-Henry ... 1594206147


http://www.filmsforaction.org/articles/ ... hat-moves/

[Elvis]

Iraqi Intelligence Warned France of ISIS Attack Day Before Paris Assault
Iraqi intelligence sent dispatch saying Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi had ordered an attack on coalition countries fighting against them in Iraq and Syria, as well as on Iran and Russia.
The Associated Press Nov 15, 2015 8:39 PM
read more: http://www.haaretz.com/world-news/1.686257

Well, here we go again....

I haven't watched any videos of it, I try to avoid pictures of it and hesitate even to read any accounts of it, it's too horrible. Even so -- 'all things considered' -- this is beginning to look like "France's 9/11" in more ways than one.

[8bitagent]

^^^^

Naturally, France has declared a state of emergency WAR, the most rigid and far reaching since the attempted coup against de Gaulle in 1961.

There are also some interesting esoteric aspects to the date of November 13th involving the Egyptian god Osiris and his wife/sister Isis (har har), which I've addressed before here.

As much as I see no evidence of "intel agencies" at play, it is in the cosmic order of things kind of a disturbing knee-slapper that "ISIS" brought down a Russian airliner over Egypt on Halloween.
And committed mass slaughter in Paris on Friday the 13th a couple weeks after Egypt, in the VERY BIRTHPLACE of the Knights Templar origin of the very word Friday the 13th.

If one were not convinced of an occult hand whistling through the 9/11 events, it's hard to notice (even if synchronistic coincidence) the recent syncs.

And yes, I am 100% capable of accepting a cult of Sunni Muslim extremists are perfectly capable of conquering large swaths of land and attacking major citadels of power in the West without some shadowy "intelligence" inside job angle.

[8bitagent]

The sheer omnipotence being attributed to NATO (or Israel or The NWO or neo-cons) by presuming that projects like ISIS are taking orders from the top -- is insane to me. Even at Gladio's false flag peak, they were recruiting from abundantly available raw material: the true believers. To attribute the entire decades-long polymorphous history of Islamic resistance to the whims of some white, educated puppet master is to deny the free moral agency of generations of human beings.

Quite. Well, generations of a particular minority. Which has gone through a lot of transformations.

The role of the Western "top" (which largely goes through or rather includes Saudi Arabia and Gulf states, making this more complicated, and is otherwise heterogeneous, multi-polar and factional) has been to feed the biotope with arms, training, mercenaries and cash, deploying various militias as on-the-ground proxies to various often conflicting ends; and then seeing a) the militias transmute, recombine, absorb and break up, producing results like AQ Iraq and Daesh; and b) jihadi internationals disperse all over the place, throughout the Muslim, Post-Soviet and Western worlds, largely autonomous, with multiple agendas and influences at work. This has now been going on for 35 years and it is a lot more than can be explained by simple "blowback" or "cui bono" arguments, it is certain at this point there is no in-control "top" of any of it. I don't think the Russians or the Americans (here meaning their official intel arms) or even the Saudis or Iranians or Turks have a clear idea of what is going on in Syria-Iraq anymore. About all they know is that in the morning they coordinate enough of the day's bombing runs to avoid getting into dogfights with each other, for now. All of the governments are much better at looking up the bunghole of their own more law-abiding citizens in real time than telling who the fuck they're killing -- and/or arming -- on the ground in the Middle East.

I'd agree with that. The scary thing is that none of the top dogs seem to be in control of anything, and chaos is breaking loose

[smiths]

Jumping to conclusions about false flag is ridiculous

It's just a coincidence that passport connecting Syria and Muslims was found next to a person who blew himself to pieces so quickly after the event occurred (allegedly)

What a novel idea, a coincidence theory for Paris 13/11

I said 10 pages ago, you can't 'know' because the real and the simulated are indistinguishable


I was wondering about number 12

If 10 is God, and 11 surpasses God, isn't 12 even more amazing for surpassing 11?

What about 1.618, do the masons give a fuck about that magic number?

[RocketMan]

It's just a coincidence that passport connecting Syria and Muslims was found next to a person who blew himself to pieces so quickly after the event occurred (allegedly)

This is the one detail that keeps nagging me. Why would someone going to blow themselves up be carrying a passport? Of course it's possible that they'd want to ensure notoriety that way, but to expect that a passport can survive an explosion intact...? Perhaps they were encouraged by the 9/11 passport surviving...

[conniption]

"as luck would have it"...

Paris Attacks: Multi-site Exercise planned for morning of Nov 13, 2015

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smq5iQonYeE

Serebra Sana
Published on Nov 14, 2015

Patrick Pelloux, EMT and chronicler at Charlie Hebdo, explains on France Info radio that Paris EMTs were prepared because, "as luck would have it", they'd planned an exercise to train for multi-site attacks on the morning of Nov 13,2015.

Transcript:
Le hasard a fait, pour vous dire, c'est que le matin au SAMU de Paris, avait été organisé un exercice sur des attentats multisites. Donc on était préparés. Donc ce qu'il faut voir c'est que vous aviez une mobilisation des forces de police, des pompiers, des SAMU, des associatifs qui sont venus et on a essayé de sauver le plus de monde possible.

Link to FranceInfo source:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyyQj...

[seemslikeadream]

"as luck would have it"

[psynapz]

"like a luck in a noose"

[seemslikeadream]

like a pâté in a goose

[semper occultus]

French prosecutors have said that Friday's attacks in Paris were planned in Belgium.


For Brussels is not just the very seat of the European Commission, but its heavily Muslim suburb of Molenbeek is also the epicentre of the jihadist movement within Europe. Only last year, 46 members of the Islamist group Sharia4Belgium were put on trial for recruiting hundreds of Belgian citizens to the cause of the so-called Islamic State.


NATO's headquarters are located in Haren, Brussels, Belgium, where the Supreme Allied Commander also resides.


...how cosy





sources :
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0385tzj
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/artic ... rders.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO

[seemslikeadream]

Paris Attack Will Foster an Orwellian Police State

Gilbert Mercier
By Gilbert Mercier
NEWS JUNKIE POST

Nov 15, 2015 at 7:19 am

Since November 13, 2015, France entered a state of shock. Friday the 13th will no longer be only associated with exploitation Hollywood horror flicks, but will become forever linked in the collective psyche to the mayhem in Paris that occurred on that fateful night. It took only about 10 people, plus a few more to organize the logistics of it, to bring France to a worse predicament than the one that was created by the attack on the editorial staff of Charlie Hebdo in early January 2015. The French press wrote sensationalist headlines stating that the new tragedy, which killed more than 200 people and seriously injured more than 80, was a declaration of war.



The Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) quickly claimed the seven coordinated attacks, and some social media accounts linked to ISIS mentioned France as one of its primary targets. As ISIS identified itself as the culprit, the macabre message sent by the organization and its implications for worldwide public opinion was rather simple: we can hit anywhere, at anytime, and any target will be considered fair game. The French government’s reaction was both panicked and swift, and it immediately embraced repressive authoritarian measures similar to those that had been set up by the Bush administration in the aftermath of 9/11/2001. Just like 9/11 in the United States, it seems that the way France’s bloody Friday will be exploited matters more than the tragedy itself. There is no better justification to crack down on civil liberty, freedom and other principles that define the essence of democracy than the good old permanent global war on terror.



French President François Hollande’s cabinet met at midnight and issued some decrees. A nationwide state of emergency was declared, as well as the establishment of tight control at all French borders. The mayor of Paris gave Parisians the formal instruction to stay at home, and within a few hours, civilians deserted the usually lively streets of Paris, which instead became populated by the ever growing members of France’s massive security apparatus: heavily armed police, SWAT teams and military. A decree similar to the USA Patriot Act was hastily put together to allow searches in all buildings and private residences, and the preemptive arrest, without probable cause, of any individual deemed by French authorities to be suspect or dangerous. The notion of dangerous is, of course, vague and elastic and could potentially apply to anyone, including political dissidents.



The show of support for the people of France was immediate and overwhelming, in mainstream and social media. This worldwide Francophilia outbreak in statements, and by the illumination of countless landmarks throughout the world, felt a bit contrived and obnoxious. Considering the ever shrinking global public opinion attention span, the brisk popularity of La Marseillaise, clumsy peace flag avatars featuring the Eiffel tower, and the orgy of blue, white and red will be short lived. In the typical neocolonialist bias of news coverage, the attacks in Beirut, Lebanon, which occurred Friday as well and targeted Hezbollah-controlled areas, killing at least 40 people, were merely noted in the Western press, rather than treated as an ongoing tragedy that deserved extensive follow up and expressions of sympathy. The unspoken and despicable message sent by the press was that the loss of French lives mattered quite a lot more than the loss of lives of people in the Middle East.



One can understand what such a blatant differentiation of compassion can trigger in the mind of a young French person of Arab origin who is usually at the very bottom of the French socioeconomic food chain. People with such grim social prospects are prime and easy targets to become jihadists for ISIS. Islam fundamentalism allows them to act out their deep anger toward a society from which they have been largely rejected. For decades, young French people of Arab origin have been treated like outsiders from within. Consequently, they can be indoctrinated to do the unthinkable and embark on suicide missions. While inclusion and a sense of real prospect for a better future could be a remedy for France’s deep social malaise and eventually make jihad less attractive to young French people of North-African origin, the road being taken by most of France’s political class and ruling elite is the dead end of repression and exclusion.



For the sake of the European Union’s survival, France, and Europe in general, should drastically rethink its failed policies. The Paris attacks should be regarded as the symptoms of a systemic failure. The random murder sprees committed in Paris cannot be excused or justified in any way, but they can be explained. Disenfranchised young French-Arabs know and feel the misery that their brothers and sisters in the Middle East have suffered in Iraq, Libya, Syria and Gaza from the guns and bombs of the US and its European sidekicks. The confusion from that pain gives them the warped sense that ordinary Parisians should also suffer. France has unfortunately been a diligent little helper of the Orwellian Empire, not only in the Middle East but also in Africa, since electing Nicolas Sarkozy president in 2007, and becoming a NATO member again in 2009. Actions have consequences, and yesterday’s Paris victims can be viewed as yet more civilian collateral damage — not more or less important than the innocent victims of US drone attacks in Pakistan or Yemen — in a world where the net result of absurd Western policies is always the spread of misery and death.

[divideandconquer]

The bottom line is that this is going according to plan, that is the plan of the psychopaths in power, and not some rogue evil-doers who always turn out to be from the very place the psychopaths are targeting for regime change, takeover, destruction, etc...

Terrorism is a psychological attack on the public and who benefits from psychological attacks on the public more than those in power. No matter what mainstream media would have you believe, state or privately funded false flag terror is much more common than rogue, asymmetrical terror. In fact, rogue evil-doers are very rare. Since the war on terror began, almost all of the terrorist events we've seen point to deep state organizations and government support of violent non-state actors.

First and foremost, the proliferating terrorist organizations--often interchangeable are created, armed, financed and supplied with trained jihadi nutjobs by the USA, the military arm of the globalists. This is even admitted by the mainstream media on occasion.

Second, an increasingly integrated, government-corporate surveillance hydra that it seems the more we feed it, the larger the very thing this hydra claims it's trying to prevent grows.

Third, these horrific events that no one sees coming, are always pretty much solved within hours--perpetrators almost always identified and killed--and mainstream media, in full force, is all ready to go with 24/7 coverage the minute it occurs. Wasn't Anderson Cooper right there after attacks as well as Charlie Hebdo attacks?

Fourth, we almost always have exercises/drills at the same time as the terror attack happens, in this case, a “multi-site” emergency exercise was held in Paris on the same day as the Paris attacks on November 13.

Fifth, more funding for militarization, surveillance and police state as media bombards us with prior terror events

Sixth, brown lives always pay the price without any credible investigation of the crime the bombing is based upon.

Lastly, governments that are awash with crimes against humanity not only escape without a scratch, their power and wealth increases exponentially

[MacCruiskeen]

As if the whole depraved murderous spectacle in Paris weren't already depressing enough, it's additionally depressing to see this nonsense meeting with so little resistance on this board -- and indeed with a depressing amount of apparent approval:

[...]

Now, granted, I've never read about this "Gladio" thing and I probably shouldn't comment, but I shall henceforth.

This is an incredible thing to admit. Some might feel humbled and chastened while making such an admission.

The sheer omnipotence being attributed to NATO (or Israel or The NWO or neo-cons) by presuming that projects like ISIS are taking orders from the top -- is insane to me.

Nobody attributed omnipotence to anyone or anything, so please stop suggesting that anyone did. But only a fool or a deliberate obfuscator would deny that truly enormous power is indeed wielded by NATO, and by the others you name.

Even at Gladio's false flag peak, they were recruiting from abundantly available raw material: the true believers.

The point, obviously, is not that such "true believers" exist: It is, obviously, that these "true believers" were armed, equipped, protected and controlled by extremely powerful (NB, not omnipotent) state and cross-state institutions, which encouraged and permitted these depraved "true believers" to carry out mass murders of European civilians in order to achieve their own depraved political objectives. This is all so obvious that it is annoying to have to spell it out, especially as you have allegedly just been reading all about it.

To attribute the entire decades-long polymorphous history of Islamic resistance to the whims of some white, educated puppet master is to deny the free moral agency of generations of human beings.

Aha.* And by the same token, claiming that the Aztecs were massacred by the Spaniards is equivalent to attributing the entire centuries-long polymorphous history of pre-Columbian Central American civilizations to the whims of some white, European, Imperialist, royalist puppet-master, right? Surely it's possible that the Aztecs massacred themselves? Because, after all, denying that they might have done so means denying the free moral agency of generations of Aztec human beings. Which would be racist, right? Also, NB: the Aztecs themselves weren't very nice. (They were human, therefore they did atrocities, cos they just couldn't help it, cos they were human.) Ergo, case closed, or something.

History, schmistory.

Closer to home: Doubting that Oswald shot Kennedy (or shot him alone) is equivalent to denying Oswald's free moral agency, right? Because that would be reducing the entire decades-long polymorphous history of American gun-crime to the whims of some white, educated puppet master, wouldn't it? Or something.

- Here's a thought (quaint and old-fashioned, I admit): Maybe the murders in Paris should be investigated as crimes? But no, I jest! Criminology, schriminology. Facts, schmacts. Reason, schmeason. We're beyond all that now. Exterminate all the beasts humans. This is the 21st century, you know. We have the technology, or at least somebody does. (We also have the ideology to go with it, free of charge.)

Gladio is worthy of study; so is the history of sectarian struggles in Lebanon, because I think that's the model (and nightmare) that will shape the densely urbanized, climate refugee-flux communities of the century we're only just kicking off.

Who ever suggested that studying one excluded studying the other? No one.

Nobody anywhere on Earth really has a monopoly on atrocity. It's what humans do.

Speak for yourself. In my half-century on this planet I've encountered thousands of humans from all over the world, and very, very few of them have ever committed any atrocities. In my presence, precisely almost none. Maybe they weren't human? I think we should be told.

But I do see where you're coming from. I see your ideology masquerading as anthropology. And I miss the days when this board was run by a Canadian socialist rather than a US libertarian with a foible for Mencius Moldbug and Nick Land.

I can't accept the notion that, somehow, NATO compels Asian and Middle Eastern power blocs in a way that doesn't work equally effectively in reverse. These are transactional relationships. Blackmail and terrorism are both easily utilized weapons for anyone dedicated enough to be dedicated enough.

So there's no such thing as an asymmetrical power relationship? Try telling that to the Australian aborigines, just for instance. Or if you can't travel that far, try telling it to your bank manager, your boss, your landlord, your friendly local police officer, or anyone else with whom you have one of those charming "transactional relationships".

To wrap up and be very specific, if you think that Arabs can't coordinate successful terror attacks in Europe without help -- or outright orchestration -- from white people, that's racist.

Bullshit.

My opinion. Islamic fundamentalist terrorism is a real thing. Intelligence agencies faking the work of Islamic fundamentalist terrorism is also a real thing. Neither negates the other.

Who ever suggested it did? No one. Certainly no one here.

Nobody here really has answers about the subject under discussion.

Some are trying honestly, though, rather than blowing smoke. And the crime is still only three days old, after all. Yet it's already -- who could have guessed? -- being used as a casus belli. What a shot in the arm for poor old non-omnipotent NATO! And what a field day for the poor old non-omnipotent mass media!


"TERROR-WAR!" - "I'm sorry, could you speak up a bit?"


"This time it's war". - Aha. So what the fuck's it been for the last 14 years?


* That nonsensical right-wing (and pseudoleft) "agency" thoughtstopper was dismantled expertly by the excellent US blogger Sassy Sourstein just over a year ago (yes, the thoughtstopper was already being carefully test-driven in the right-wing (and pseudo-left) media by October 2014, way back in the mists of forgotten time):

https://cienflamingos.wordpress.com/201 ... he-agency/