How Bad Is Global Warming?

[DrEvil]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Daily_Caller

http://www.wiki-rath.org/thesorosconnection.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthias_Rath

[backtoiam]

Dr. Evil with all due respect I don't care much for your sources like Snopes, etc...either but i try to be nice about it. And no I didn't know that dude dressed up as a mexican to make fun of the migrants but I can assure you I have a lot of sympathy for the migrants, and an equal amount of disdain for the people responsible for their plight.

I could regularly employ similar tactics by suggesting "oh, so you approve of the Democrats incinerating brown children of the Middle East" but I try not to engage in it, as tempting as it is.

[DrEvil]

...snip...

Scientific theories are supposed to be rigorously tested and debated to make sure they hold up. We discover on a regular basis that believed scientific theories of the past are in fact wrong. Happens all the time. If these theories are so solid why do they want to criminalize rigorous debate and testing? And if they want to prosecute the oil industry why not dozens of other industries that are contributing to the "problem?"

The theory of climate change has been rigorously tested and debated, probably more than any other, and the evidence is overwhelming. Large oil companies have done enormous damage already, and if some of them are lying about the impact so they can continue to make money then fuck them.

[backtoiam]

So we should have stopped all testing on blood letting, accepted it as settled, and should not continue to investigate? I see no need to make it illegal to test a theory, publish the results, and discuss it simply because it is someones sacred cow or profit center. As far as the "fuck them" goes I feel the same way about carbon tax profiteers because I don't trust any of them.

[DrEvil]

Dr. Evil with all due respect I don't care much for your sources like Snopes, etc...either but i try to be nice about it. And no I didn't know that dude dressed up as a mexican to make fun of the migrants but I can assure you I have a lot of sympathy for the migrants, and an equal amount of disdain for the people responsible for their plight.

I could regularly employ similar tactics by suggesting "oh, so you approve of the Democrats incinerating brown children of the Middle East" but I try not to engage in it, as tempting as it is.

I try not to post stuff that's just plain wrong or overtly racist. That's your gig, but it gets pretty tiring having to wade through all the disinfo and bullshit. That's why I keep telling you to check you sources.

And no, I don't approve of democrats incinerating brown children in the Middle East, or any other place (except aborted fetuses for fuel). I think Clinton, Bush and Obama all belong in jail for war crimes.

[Nordic]

What a waste of time and neurons. I'm putting backtoiam on ignore from here out. Sheesh.

I recommend we all do. Life's too short.

[DrEvil]

So we should have stopped all testing on blood letting, accepted it as settled, and should not continue to investigate? I see no need to make it illegal to test a theory, publish the results, and discuss it simply because it is someones sacred cow or profit center. As far as the "fuck them" goes I feel the same way about carbon tax profiteers because I don't trust any of them.

Uh, people are testing the theory of climate change and publishing the results all the time, and they keep getting more certain that climate change is real and man made. No one is calling for scientists to stop doing science so I have no idea where you got that from.

Blood letting is a pretty damn stupid comparison.

[backtoiam]

i took the same abuse for 911 and a lot of other stuff

[Luther Blissett]

We Already Know 2016 Will Be the Warmest Year on Record—and It’s Only April

It’s now abundantly clear: When it comes to global warming, 2016 is in a class by itself.

On Tuesday, scientists at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration confirmed that March 2016 was not only the warmest March in recorded climate history, it was also the most unusually warm month of any month ever measured, breaking the record set … the month prior. March was the 11th consecutive month of a new record warm global monthly temperature, the longest streak since NOAA records began in 1880—a horrendous feat that’s led to a bit of complacency in climate circles.

We should not be complacent. Gavin Schmidt, director of NASA’s Goddard Institute for Space Studies, calculated that no matter how the rest of the year progresses, there’s a greater than 99 percent chance 2016 will be the warmest year on record. That he’s able to say this in April is mind-boggling. In past record-warm years, we needed to wait until October or November to make predictions with this high of confidence.



Though the current planetary heat wave is likely peaking, it’s still rending entire ecosystems and plunging tens of millions of people into food shortages. On Wednesday, Australian scientists revealed a stark new summary of their comprehensive survey of the Great Barrier Reef: 93 percent of reefs there have experienced bleaching over the past several weeks—which happens when corals become overheated and expel their symbiotic algae, and can quickly lead to coral death. The imminent death of large parts of the Great Barrier Reef should shock the world. About 1 billion people depend on coral reefs for their livelihood. “We’ve never seen anything like this scale of bleaching before,” said Terry Hughes, who led the survey.

The current global boost of heat is linked to El Niño, but experts think El Niño is taking a back seat to human greenhouse gas emissions when it comes to the reasons for the incredible hot streak. Last month’s record warmth touched all ocean basins and all continents, and, together with February—which still ranks as the most unusually warm month in NASA records—the Earth’s temperature is going through what amounts to a step change.

The current warm streak is a perfect illustration of what climate scientists have long expected: There are natural oscillations (like the current warming boost from El Niño) overlaid on top of the long-term trend of global warming. The shift to La Niña, which is expected later this year, will temporarily bend global temperature back down a bit, and likely bring an end to the current streak of record-warm months. With climate change, not every year will be record warm, but it’s quite certain that even if 2017 doesn’t top 2016, there’ll be a year in the near future that will.

We’ve reached a unique moment in the history of humanity’s relationship with our home planet: No matter when the current streak ends, the relentlessness with which the global climate system has been breaking records is now unmatched by any moment since industrial civilization began, and likely long before that. New data show atmospheric carbon dioxide concentrations at Mauna Loa briefly exceeded 409 parts per million on a daily basis around April 10, the highest absolute level in millions of years—and the biggest year-to-year jump on record. Last month, an analysis by a team of British and American climate scientists showed that the current rate of increase of atmospheric carbon dioxide likely has no equal in Earth’s entire history, with current levels rising about 10 times faster than the previous fastest era of increase, about 56 million years ago. We’re locking in change that has no precedent, possibly since long before humans and countless other species first evolved.

And it’s the rate of change that’s the big problem here. Human activity is profoundly changing the planet in a geologic blink of an eye—which is why scientists are worried that everything from migrating birds to fracturing ice sheets to coastal cities won’t have time to adapt. If climate change were slow—playing out over millennia, as in times past—it wouldn’t be much of a problem. Instead, in our world, climate change is happening very, very fast. As the United Nations’ leading climate diplomat said on Tuesday after seeing the latest NOAA data, the most recent record is a “stark reminder that we have no time to lose.”

This urgency has immediate global political implications. As the Washington Post’s Chris Mooney and Brady Dennis point out, “the Earth itself has upped the stakes for the Paris climate accord,” agreed to just four months ago and set to be signed at a ceremony in New York this week. From the tropics to the Arctic, these past few months have pushed the bounds of “dangerous” change the accord was designed to prevent. An analysis released Tuesday by Climate Interactive and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology showed that even with the pledges made in Paris, the world is still on track for about 3.5 degrees Celsius of warming—and global leaders would need to agree to substantial further reductions before 2020 to meet the Paris target of keeping global warming “well below” 2 degrees Celsius. That’s a huge ask, but the stability of our climate system requires that it happens.

[fruhmenschen]

https://robertscribbler.com/


https://robertscribbler.com/2016/04/25/ ... g-iceberg/

Melt Expanding into East Antarctica as Nansen Ice Shelf Crack Produces 20 Kilometer Long Iceberg

Ever since 1999 a gigantic crack has been growing in the Nansen Ice Shelf in East Antarctica. By 2014, expansion of the crack accelerated. As of early 2016, the crevice had grown to 40 kilometers in length. Flooded by melt along the Ice Shelf’s warming surface and weakened by the heating of ocean waters from below, on April 7th, according to ESA reports, this East Antarctic Ice Shelf produced an immense 20 kilometer long iceberg. A towering block of ice covering an area larger than Manhattan floating on out toward the world’s shipping

[Iamwhomiam]

Ok, I'm playing catch-up, so I'll begin here and reply to this first.

I really don't want to hear anything from you on this topic

This appeared to me as Iam being unwilling to discuss AOCs alternative ideas.
It may very well have been a one off thing, hardly a "lie".

Burnt Hill, you've taken an excerpt from the conversation, which is purposefully misleading. Here's what was written and what I replied to, from which you've excerpted the quote above:

Agent Orange Cooper to Iam

So I'm not exactly sure what you want to hear... I didn't mean to imply that CO2 is the only alleged contributor, but it is obviously the largest.

<snip>

Frankly I'm not sure a constructive discussion on this topic is even possible. You hear my thoughts and immediately feel that I've been brainwashed by the Koch Brothers (rrrriight) and I hear yours and think you've been brainwashed by the UN globalists. Where exactly is the middle ground, here?

Iam to Agent Orange Cooper:

Sorry for presuming you were interested in discussing the topic, AOC. I expounded on carbon equivalencies because many do not understand the chemical mix of our atmosphere.

I really don't want to hear anything from you on this topic, because you remain ignorant of reality and appear lost in your own delusion and are unable to offer anything of value to me on this topic. I don't mean to be rude, but why talk to a rock, eh?

Seriously, BH, did you really think you could get away with such a misleading of the truth by excerpt, here at RI without being called out for taking such a cheap shot? You owe your audience better. You know better.

It's never an either/or situation. In other words, just because certain global elites want to monetize the tragedy through a carbon tax doesn't mean the tragedy itself is a fiction.

That's what's so annoying about the denialist crowd.

We are seriously fucked. A stupid fucking tax isn't gonna do shot except give Wall Street a new color of poker chip to play with.

No, Nordic, a carbon tax is not wanted by "the global elites" but is wanted by people like me. The monies raised by such a tax would go to lower costs for transitioning to renewable energy. Wall Street would rather see a carbon trading scheme though and that's something I'm opposed to even though many environmentalists support a carbon trading program. They support it because such a trading scheme was established to reduce emissions from Ohio power plants that caused Acid Rain to poison the waters and forests of New York and New England. The participating states called it RGGI, Regional Greenhouse Gas Initiative. Each round the available credits become more scarce and more expensive. Such a plan I call a scheme because it encourages fraud. Instituting a carbon tax would be advisable, imo.

stillrobertpaulson wrote
Not to speak on either of those posters' behalf, but this 149 page thread has already explored "alternative ideas" multiple times for more than six years and each time the evidence buttressing these ideas were found lacking, often times egregiously so.

I recently wrote a blog entry exploring the topic from a conspiratorial cover-up pov. Not trying to fan flames, but I hope this snip addresses some of the logical conundrums of the denialist pov. There are links to buttress my claims, click the link to access them if you want:

Robert, thank you for your comment and for writing your informed blog posting. It is difficult to understand how those who deny the validity of the findings of thousands of scientists come to their belief. In all this time it's only become progressively warmer and carbon levels have risen steadily. And still they deny the reality of anthropogenic climate change.

You blog entry was very good, but I hope you would stand in opposition to Fischer-Tropsch and other forms of gasification. They are still very expensive, wasteful, polluting, finicky devices requiring frequent costly maintenance. Gasifiers are nothing more than fancy waste incinerators. Worst of all, they continue to keep alive the mindset that burning is an ok way to create energy; a mindset we need to rid ourselves of while transitioning to sustainable, non-polluting energy-producing technologies.

Sounder, who's doing the browbeating? The evidence presented on theses pages provides ample resources substantiating the reality of climate change being caused in its largest part through anthropogenic emissions.

Well, I assume it is warming a bit, but still the basic scam is to tie good hearted folk to the idea that large institutional structures are needed to solve large problems. (This is equivalent to voting for psychopaths)

While I am glad to see you assume warming "a bit," but the "scam" is all in your mind. Large institutional structures are not needed to solve large problems - they need to be shuttered, for goodness sake, they are the problem and they are those who are most invested in deregulation. How absurd, the claim you've made! "...the basic scam is to tie good hearted folk to the idea that large institutional structures are needed to solve large problems."

What leads you to believe this nonsense? What "large institutional structures" are supposedly "needed to solve large problems"?

How about we discuss our personal carbon footprints, BH. My individual household's, mine and my cat's and my car's, against your household's, yours and your wife's, your kid's and your pig's and your farm and automobile vehicles, to see whose shitting on the future more, to see whose adding more toxic pollutants into our environment for future generations to deal with?

You really want to make it this personal?
You raised kids didn't you? How did you provide for them? No carbon footprint? What was your career?
You mock my raising pigs-homesteading-three times now.
The fact I raised them organically and butchered them myself in an attempt to achieve some self sustainability and provide protein for my extended family falls over your head?
You know nothing Iam, and your attempts to smear through innuendo is what is not worthy of this forum.

I did make our carbon footprints personal Burnt Hill, but why would you think I was mocking you? Because I called you a pig farmer? I've not once mocked your raising pigs or your homesteading.

You should have accepted my challenge; you would have won.

I do not judge you. I have no great moral standing when it comes to making money to support one's family; I made flying war machines, for goodness sake - you slaughter pigs - and I love bacon!

Call me an iron worker - I won't be offended. (sheesh! talk about carbon footprints!)

You know nothing Iam, and your attempts to smear through innuendo is what is not worthy of this forum.

I know many things, BH and I have not attempted to smear you through innuendo or directly.

But really, Judge Judy?

Iamwhomiam wrote:

Yup, more intelligent offerings from BH. Of course, you are Right. But you already know that.

Have anything on topic to comment upon, pig farmer?

That is one of the most disgusting comments I have ever seen allowed to pass through this forum with not so much as even a whisper.

Would you please point out for me and for everyone else reading this why you find my comment to Burnt Hill to be "...one of the most disgusting comments you have ever seen allowed to pass through this forum with not so much as a whisper"? Was it something particular you found disgusting? A certain word, perhaps? If so, please share with us what that particularly disgusting thing was. Perhaps you'll be kind enough to point out the few other disgusting comments you've seen allowed to pass through this forum without a whisper. Perhaps you'll recall this one?

Seems to me you're doing more than whispering, with all that typing.

"anybody smart enough, and industrious enough, to raise their own food has to be stupid"

I certainly didn't write that. They way you've placed it makes it appear you are quoting me. You should note for all readers benefit who it is you're quoting.

Are you this offensive and brave in the real world or is this just your bully internet persona?

Well, I still don't know why you think I've been offensive, I'm certainly not a bully here or anywhere else. I am brave, though.

You are laughable Iam, truly laughable. You are beneath this forum and why you are allowed to engage in these sorts of personal attacks is a mystery...

Yes. My personal attacks. Of course. Makes me wonder too, It's all about my personal attacks, and of course, not yours. I am laughing, the irony is overwhelming!

That's all for now. More catch-up tomorrow!

edited to add 's' to 'make' in last paragraph

[DrEvil]

What a waste of time and neurons. I'm putting backtoiam on ignore from here out. Sheesh.

I recommend we all do. Life's too short.

I vote we permaban him for repeatedly posting racist shit on a leftist anti-fascist board and then getting outraged when people call him on it, while at the same time explicitly refusing to check his sources before posting. It's so fucking stupid I'm really hoping it's all an act (for his sake).

On the other hand, the entertainment value is pretty high (in the same way watching a formula one pile-up can be fascinating).

[82_28]

Here's what I don't get. Is why bother with RI in the first place? It's not as though anyone is going to have any form of influence on anything. No one is going to just switch to fascist or racist or any ist because we got all persuaded and shit. We come here and have come here over the years for a reason. We're fucking unique. And like a nesting doll we're unique in our own ways. Yet by being unique we all are very similar and also at this point familiar. The similarity is what makes this joint unique. I hold all members who have stuck around in very high esteem.

I really hate to say it yet again is that basically nothing pisses me off as long as it remains in opinion-land. I bartended for close to two decades blah blah blah. I'm of the type of if you wanna tell me, lay it on me. I am willing to listen and I do not judge. It's awesome being around 95 people plus and being concerned about them all and also having to be a hardass! Anyhow, carry on and be merry.

[DrEvil]

^^Right wing commentary to illustrate an argument is one thing, posting from Pamela "Fucking" Geller, Schmormfront and the Daily Yeller with a straight face is another thing entirely.

[82_28]

This thread is slightly getting off track. But I have personally pissed on skinheads while I made them stand in a barrel. Literally pissed on them. Then I apologized of course. I was young, but had no time to entertain whatever indoctrination they had encountered. I'm a motherfucking haunted soul. But I deterred them from ever being "racist" again -- I think. . .

Alright, well it's cold right now in Seattle so now climate change does not exist.