rigorousintuition.ca

American Dream wrote:

I understand AJ, but why is everyone down on Icke?

What he says about Jew, er-zionists and reptilians, for starters...

Even if he says it without ranting llike Mr. Jones...

He's also a global warming denier.

wordspeak2 wrote:
McKenna, though, was politically naive. One wonders if he would be so naive today, in a post-9/11 world. Bill Hicks was someone who was not naive, being pro-psychedelic, hard left politically, and funny to boot in a working-class way, which made him extremely threatening to the control system, and he was in all likelihood offed (was McKenna offed, too?) With McKenna remember that he was coming out of a late sixties era that was very polarized in terms of psychedelic heads against hard-core politicos. Take Timothy Leary on one extreme and Progressive Labor Party (Marxist/Maoist) on the other. Few notable people transcended this dichotomy, with Jerry Rubin and the Yippies perhaps being an exception. So McKenna took one side, as an imperfect person. But, still, he dedicated a lot of his life to exploring mushrooms and DMT, and he took the cat out of the bag, so to speak. It's up to conscious people decades later to run with it.

Alex Jones is a right-wing Christian who needs to smoke some pot, never mind mushrooms. He does vast disservice to the rest of us genuine truthseekers- sorry, apologetics- even though he does articulate "World War 3" better than most leftists, which is just a very sorry state of affairs. But, anyway, ignore him. There's a real struggle going on, in which those DMT "elves" somehow lie at the apex.

Yeah Bill Hicks still astounds me to this day, his performances from the early 90's especially sound like they could have been recorded post Dubya.

AJ has a problem, coming from a right wing Christian background, in denouncing everything as bad. He devoted half his "order of death" mockumentary toward painting Santa Rosa area new agers as "evil occultists". History has shown a lot of "occultists" on the side of good or benign, like Rudolf Steiner.

He also goes out of his way to alienate the left wing, environmentalists, feminists, gay rights activists, etc...all sides I strongly support

I dont even want to imagine a post DMT tripped AJ!

American Dream wrote:

I would also point out that leading Nazis may have had a metaphysical view of life on Earth and framed things in terms of a great battle between the forces of good and evil but that does not make all their racist garbage right. David Icke and Alex Jones both carry a lot of racist garbage. And there are many, many critically important things which they get wrong, beyond that too.

Simply framing them as "spiritual seekers" does not change that.

Whoah, when did Icke ever espouse anything remotely racist?

Now I feel "had" in a way...a friend sent me this youtube video that I thought was amazing in showing all this genocide by the elite, how Clinton killed just as many Iraqis as Bush, etc.
But at the end of the video I felt sick that the whole thing was being narrated by *that* David Duke. Out of morbid curiosity I clicked on another video, and I guess he has changed his tune to mr peace, embrace all races...yet, in another video he coyly suggests its in black peoples nature to be more aggressive...and I was like "aha...different stripes, same suit"

crikkett wrote:

8bitagent wrote:Now I can list a hundred things I take issue with on AJ, but I think when it comes to war/terrorism/esoteric elite agenda I think he's spot on.

Are you saying that this rant was credible in your eyes? This rant that sounds like early Icke?

No, heavy on the eye rolling scattershot rambling as usual...but I think a few things he mentioned are possible and resonate with what weve seen with a number of elites(like the Nazis)

American Dream wrote:

I understand AJ, but why is everyone down on Icke?

What he says about Jew, er-zionists and reptilians, for starters...

Even if he says it without ranting llike Mr. Jones...

look - and this isn't directed at you specifically, AD - Zionists and Zionism are a force out there. We have to be able to speak about it. I do not feel that it is code for "jewish" because it is a worldview that, okay, happens to have Israel's place in the world at center stage.. but so what? We have to be able to talk about this without the bogeyman element.

At least Icke doesn't sugarcoat it.. he says Zionist when he means Zionist.

undead wrote:
Alex Jones is an idiot who is afraid of things he doesn't understand. If the elites were using DMT, they would at least realize that they are not going to survive the coming ecological catastrophe.

I agree 100%. The elites probably wouldnt be hellbent on a narrow view if they took those sort of substances.

Its not the DMT/elves part at all I agreed with in that video though.

Btw, is there a theory of why "elves" in association with DMT, or mechanical working aliens? Or why so many stories as recounted in popular pulp UFOlogy or Jeff's blog has bearded gnome aliens?

undead wrote:

American Dream wrote:

I understand AJ, but why is everyone down on Icke?

What he says about Jew, er-zionists and reptilians, for starters...

Even if he says it without ranting llike Mr. Jones...

He's also a global warming denier.

do you see how you're caught up in something there?

open your mind.

8bitagent wrote:He also goes out of his way to alienate the left wing, environmentalists, feminists, gay rights activists, etc...all sides I strongly support

word...
one day I bet I'm going to meet AJ be chance and change his view on a couple of those.

Canadian_watcher wrote:

Zionists and Zionism are a force out there. We have to be able to speak about it. I do not feel that it is code for "jewish" because it is a worldview that, okay, happens to have Israel's place in the world at center stage.. but so what? We have to be able to talk about this without the bogeyman element.

At least Icke doesn't sugarcoat it.. he says Zionist when he means Zionist.

Of course, Zionism is a real-world philosophy, and associated with lots of violence, oppression, covert operation and the like. We have a moral obligation to oppose it, in my view.

David Icke though, after the Robot's Rebellion began to venture more and more into the territory of world jewish conspiracy and various other anti-semitic tropes, down to the point of aligning himself with some really disgusting perspectives.

Have you never heard of this before? Plenty about it has been posted here on this board, and on the Internet in general...

elfismiles wrote: - The Bill Hicks / Alex Jones Nexus: Alex has channeled Bill as well as performed as a standup at Bill Hicks memorial events and alongside Joe Rogan and Doug Stanhope (two comedians in the vein of Hicks) in Austin...

Russell Crowe plans Bill Hicks project
http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/ ... 5&p=207468

Was Bill Hicks offed and did he instinctively know it?
http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/ ... 8&p=320100

"The Austin Incident" [1-6] Doug Stanhope & Alex Jones Live in Texas [2004/8/13]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2IZufncUVg


- Most of Alex's ideas about DMT probably come via Rogan and Booth; Booth being a best friend of Bill Hicks and how Alex met Bill. Rogan being a comic inspired by Hicks and into DMT...

Alex Jones and Joe Rogan Hit the Bong: Belly of the Beast
http://www.livevideo.com/video/FF2D909C ... hit-t.aspx

The Alex Jones Show - Joe Rogan DMT Interview

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pE5S9mrE8Xg

Joe Rogan talks about DMT on the Alex Jones Show - May 27, 2008

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiAiaii8N_w

Alex mentions his precog dreams, Rogan says mil had DMT in 60s, McKenna told him that he (McKenna) first got DMT from scientist working with the military.

tKl wrote:
"Psychospiritual Evolution" and Bugliosi Vs. Bush
http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/ ... =8&t=17917

Yep. Listening to yesterday's show and I am quite happy to hear the always pleasantly surprising Joe Rogan. He is apparently, among other things, a DMT wizard and he says that the human race isn't done evolving, which is the gist of "Psychospiritual Evolution."

I'm just quoting these clips you posted as I think AJ was just having a bad day. These clips are very informative in providing context. This is the AJ I hear much more often. His fear and misunderstanding in the OP is uncharacteristic. The people he hangs with and has on his show are generally 'cool'. Oh well, I still say he needs to get high and 'commune'.

Canadian_watcher wrote:

2012 Countdown wrote:I will not entertain Icke, ...

I used to avoid him too. Have you ever listened to one of his lectures, though? Entertaining and somehow inspiring.
I could not abide the reptile aliens thing and that made me completely, absolutely avoid him. Now I see it like this: his mind was blown, and he has had no other way to translate it and communicate it. His message though, and the things he brings up are fascinating. (to me)

I saw one of his lectures once. Talked about sheep a lot, had a picture of a pyramid behind him. I like Icke, he's very entertaining. I don't mind the odd lizard popping up.

American Dream wrote:

I understand AJ, but why is everyone down on Icke?

What he says about Jew, er-zionists and reptilians, for starters...

Even if he says it without ranting llike Mr. Jones...

The reptilians, I agree - I think he was a fed a line by some people around that and swallowed it.

I disagree regarding the anti Jewish claim - IMO doesnt conflate Jewishness with zionism, (which I know you dont either AD). AFAIK the main people behind that allegation are ADL types who tried to get his meetings in Canada banned. Richard Warman?

American Dream wrote:Canadian_watcher wrote:

Zionists and Zionism are a force out there. We have to be able to speak about it. I do not feel that it is code for "jewish" because it is a worldview that, okay, happens to have Israel's place in the world at center stage.. but so what? We have to be able to talk about this without the bogeyman element.

At least Icke doesn't sugarcoat it.. he says Zionist when he means Zionist.

Of course, Zionism is a real-world philosophy, and associated with lots of violence, oppression, covert operation and the like. We have a moral obligation to oppose it, in my view.

David Icke though, after the Robot's Rebellion began to venture more and more into the territory of world jewish conspiracy and various other anti-semitic tropes, down to the point of aligning himself with some really disgusting perspectives.

Have you never heard of this before? Plenty about it has been posted here on this board, and on the Internet in general...

There is plenty of stuff saying "when Icke says zionists he means Jews" which is complete and utter pants. What are these disgusting perspectives he is allied with?

I dont agree with his take on many things, but I am curious what perspectives he has that you find digusting??

American Dream wrote:Canadian_watcher wrote:

Zionists and Zionism are a force out there. We have to be able to speak about it. I do not feel that it is code for "jewish" because it is a worldview that, okay, happens to have Israel's place in the world at center stage.. but so what? We have to be able to talk about this without the bogeyman element.

At least Icke doesn't sugarcoat it.. he says Zionist when he means Zionist.

Of course, Zionism is a real-world philosophy, and associated with lots of violence, oppression, covert operation and the like. We have a moral obligation to oppose it, in my view.

David Icke though, after the Robot's Rebellion began to venture more and more into the territory of world jewish conspiracy and various other anti-semitic tropes, down to the point of aligning himself with some really disgusting perspectives.

Have you never heard of this before? Plenty about it has been posted here on this board, and on the Internet in general...

I have no idea what to take seriously on the internet. I've not run into any of that though, no. I've not heard him say any such things, either.

not to mention, my missionary analogy still stands.

Searcher08 wrote:

American Dream wrote:

I understand AJ, but why is everyone down on Icke?

What he says about Jew, er-zionists and reptilians, for starters...

Even if he says it without ranting llike Mr. Jones...

The reptilians, I agree - I think he was a fed a line by some people around that and swallowed it.

I disagree regarding the anti Jewish claim - IMO doesnt conflate Jewishness with zionism, (which I know you dont either AD). AFAIK the main people behind that allegation are ADL types who tried to get his meetings in Canada banned. Richard Warman?

yeah, that's the closest I've come to seeing that 'on the internet' or elsewhere.
BTW, I doubt Icke will come to Canada again for that very reason - he and other activists have said Canada is the worst country they've dealt with.

I would only like to point out that AJ said DMT elves ordered the Large Hadron Collider to be built.

Searcher08 wrote:

I disagree regarding the anti Jewish claim - IMO doesnt conflate Jewishness with zionism, (which I know you dont either AD). AFAIK the main people behind that allegation are ADL types who tried to get his meetings in Canada banned. Richard Warman?

We're veering into strawman territory here. While it is true that the ADL are leading proponents of the conflate-all-criticism-of-the-Israeli-state argument, it is not true that all criticism of Icke comes from such unprincipled and pro-Israel-policy sectors.

At all.

I don't have time to dig this all up now- I have to run- but it is easy enough to start your own search for "David Icke" and "anti-Semitism", cull out the ADL-type sources and other such dreck and you're on your way!