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tapitsbo » Wed Jun 17, 2015 10:51 pm wrote:Is there any chance that any contingency plans will be made for said mass meltdown?

I think there was an answer deep in the Fukushima thread, and that it was not optimistic.

I read Our World Without Us, which answered the question "what would happen if all of humanity disappeared today, without the accompanying death throes of a civilization trying to survive by any means necessary?" In a review it was noted that the book sidestepped the issue that without the presence of a human hand, all nuclear reactors are set to melt down, if I remember correctly. I'll keep trying to find that answer.

Luther Blissett » Thu Jun 18, 2015 9:23 am wrote:

tapitsbo » Wed Jun 17, 2015 10:51 pm wrote:Is there any chance that any contingency plans will be made for said mass meltdown?

I think there was an answer deep in the Fukushima thread, and that it was not optimistic.

I read Our World Without Us, which answered the question "what would happen if all of humanity disappeared today, without the accompanying death throes of a civilization trying to survive by any means necessary?" In a review it was noted that the book sidestepped the issue that without the presence of a human hand, all nuclear reactors are set to melt down, if I remember correctly. I'll keep trying to find that answer.

Here is what I think is the most relevant post in the Fukushima thread on this subject:

MacCruiskeen » Wed Apr 08, 2015 12:19 pm wrote:

Containing Fukushima Is “Beyond Current Technology”. Worldwide Radiation is the Unspoken Consequence

“The Chief Of The Fukushima Nuclear Power Station Has Admitted That The Technology Needed To Decommission Three Melted-Down Reactors Does Not Exist, And He Has No Idea How It Will Be Developed”

By Washington's Blog
Global Research, April 08, 2015

http://www.globalresearch.ca/containing ... ce/5441434

Regarding the 447 nuclear power plants being decommissioned safely without meltdown, it takes "upwards" of 60 years to do that, according to Gregory Jaczko, former Chairman of the Nuclear Regulatory Commision.


https://vimeo.com/83563406

I also wanted to write an addendum to my previous post regarding something I don't think I addressed sufficiently: the rich. Will they be able to find the technological means to evolve into a separate species? It's possible. If the bunker/cities they're building for themselves to prepare for the inevitable collapse are sufficiently stocked for decades to come, it is conceivable they could evolve separately from the radiological mutant masses.

What would happen when their stockpiles run out? Well, my imagination is a product of being a child of the 70s. I can foresee a social interaction between the techno-manipulative transhumans (haves) and the radiological mutant anarcho-primitives (have-nots) something along the lines of the movie Zardoz. They would appear and act as gods using their technological superiority to bend the people to their will.



Doesn't sound too much different from now, does it? If there's an upside to this, it would be that because these two groups of haves and have-nots are separated not by wealth (anarcho-primitives would probably burn stack of dollars for fuel to cook a meal) but by the fact that they are two different species, it will be difficult for the techno-manipulative transhumans to infiltrate the anarcho-primitives for direct intelligence. All propaganda outreach would have to be done in a crude imposing manner from the outside. This increases the possibility that the anarcho-primitives could get wise to the transhuman machinations and, presuming they outnumber the rich sufficiently, plot an effective scheme to conquer them once and for all.

Perhaps Karl Marx's long view of history may prove to be correct.

what if the anarchoprims were infiltrated from the get go

Transhumanism is the obvious choice. If you don't like it you can just simulate an anarcho-primitivist reality.

Transhumanism allows you to change the TV without a remote. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-33163593

I'll wager shopping, consumption and thought-adjustment will figure highly in the transhuman world. Good luck.

tapitsbo » Thu Jun 18, 2015 7:39 pm wrote:what if the anarchoprims were infiltrated from the get go

I like that question. Let's say, at the outset of collapse, when the rich are heading into their city/bunkers, they do send teams of infiltrators to settle among the masses facing radiological contamination. These teams would have to have proverbial balls of steel. I foresee them not only having to survive the process of radiological mutation, not only having to survive the probable violence associated with complete political and social collapse, but also the climatological events associated with a rise in temperature in the 3 to 6 degree Celsius range - famine, hypercanes, methane fireballs rocketing out of the sky, etc. And I say 'teams' because it would have to be a man/woman team willing to procreate and train their offspring to carry on their mission. They would have to raise/brainwash them to believe that they are the descendants of gods - that one day, these gods would rise from their underground slumber and lead them and that it is their job to prophecy their forecoming to the mutant masses. They might be perceived as crazy at first, but would be vindicated when the transhumans rise to be the all powerful leading the masses again.

I see this as a very slim possibility (infiltration) on top of another slim possibility (wealthy tecno-manipulation). But it's fascinating to consider.

Why would they have to send teams

the masses are already infiltrated

OK - but how long are they going to be out in the cold? Theoretically, we're talking about a process that could take a couple generations. That's why you need teams as part of a plan with any hope of success - for the rich.

I guess let's hope that the current system is so misguided that massive shifts and changes will take place and it will slip away from its current bearings

http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/02/20/ ... nihilator/
"Transhumanism: the Ultimate Annihilator"

I don't like copy-pasting clicks away from good writers. Just click it. Read it. It's worth it. This one, too:

http://www.counterpunch.org/2013/08/30/ ... shumanity/
"The Unrehearsed Flight to Transhumanity"

FourthBase » 19 Jun 2015 22:39 wrote:http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/02/20/ ... nihilator/
"Transhumanism: the Ultimate Annihilator"

I don't like copy-pasting clicks away from good writers. Just click it. Read it. It's worth it. This one, too:

http://www.counterpunch.org/2013/08/30/ ... shumanity/
"The Unrehearsed Flight to Transhumanity"

The author, Norman Ball, uses way too much Marxist/academic jargon to make his point. That's part of the problem: trying to appear smarter than everybody else by using a hyper-stylized linguistic mannerisms (there I go again). If you want to avoid trans-humanism, walk your talk and go do something that doesn't involve computers or abstractions in general. Go run, do yoga, garden, and/or volunteer in a homeless shelter.

i hear and i forget
i see and i may remember
i do and i understand

Robert wrote,
These teams would have to have proverbial balls of steel.

No, not really. All 'they' have to do is to offer shelter to his wife and offspring, with the promise to feed and care for them.

Although we have many who would sacrifice their life for their country, I tend to believe far more are willing to sacrifice their life for their families than they are for country.

Family would be cared for until they could be disposed of once their usefulness had been exhausted after their 'scout' had died. I could think of other reasons to keep them alive, but I don't want to - gets creepy way too fast.

slomo » 20 Jun 2015 11:58 wrote:

FourthBase » 19 Jun 2015 22:39 wrote:http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/02/20/ ... nihilator/
"Transhumanism: the Ultimate Annihilator"

I don't like copy-pasting clicks away from good writers. Just click it. Read it. It's worth it. This one, too:

http://www.counterpunch.org/2013/08/30/ ... shumanity/
"The Unrehearsed Flight to Transhumanity"

The author, Norman Ball, uses way too much Marxist/academic jargon to make his point. That's part of the problem: trying to appear smarter than everybody else by using a hyper-stylized linguistic mannerisms (there I go again). If you want to avoid trans-humanism, walk your talk and go do something that doesn't involve computers or abstractions in general. Go run, do yoga, garden, and/or volunteer in a homeless shelter.

All that stuff is a great way to avoid transhumanism.
How's it supposed to prevent transhumanism?

FourthBase » 20 Jun 2015 13:05 wrote:

slomo » 20 Jun 2015 11:58 wrote:

FourthBase » 19 Jun 2015 22:39 wrote:http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/02/20/ ... nihilator/
"Transhumanism: the Ultimate Annihilator"

I don't like copy-pasting clicks away from good writers. Just click it. Read it. It's worth it. This one, too:

http://www.counterpunch.org/2013/08/30/ ... shumanity/
"The Unrehearsed Flight to Transhumanity"

The author, Norman Ball, uses way too much Marxist/academic jargon to make his point. That's part of the problem: trying to appear smarter than everybody else by using a hyper-stylized linguistic mannerisms (there I go again). If you want to avoid trans-humanism, walk your talk and go do something that doesn't involve computers or abstractions in general. Go run, do yoga, garden, and/or volunteer in a homeless shelter.

All that stuff is a great way to avoid transhumanism.
How's it supposed to prevent transhumanism?

I don't know whether anything I can personally do will ever prevent transhumanism. This includes anything I could do as part of a collective action involving people immediately available in my extended social network. It certainly includes writing snarky Marxist essays. However, I can live by example (doing all those things I just mentioned) and hope that I influence enough people in my immediate social network that they also seek to do the same or similar things, thereby creating a larger and larger network of people who have no use for transhumanism. Yes, I dream, but it's the best solution I've found so far.