10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Moderators: Elvis, DrVolin, Jeff

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby Project Willow » Sun Dec 19, 2010 5:19 pm

Here are some excerpts:

Naomi Wolf wrote:...They were tied to trees and to stakes in the ground and raped by dozens of soldiers at a time. Many of them were as young as twelve or thirteen.
Their rapists are free.
...
Generals at every level instigated this country-wide sexual assault of a generation of girls.
Their names are known. They are free.
...
Women -- and girls -- are drugged, kidnapped and trafficked by the tens of thousands for the sex industry in Thailand and across Eastern Europe. They are held as virtual prisoners by pimps. If you interview the women who spend their lives trying to rescue and rehabilitate them, they attest to the fact that these women's kidnappers and rapists are well known to local and even national authorities --
but these men never face charges. These rapists are free.

In the Bosnian conflict, rape was a weapon of war. Women were imprisoned in barracks utilized for this purpose, and raped, again at gunpoint, for weeks at a time. They could not escape. Minimalist hearings after the conflict resulted in slap-on-the-wrist sentences for a handful of perpetrators. The vast majority of rapists, whose names are known, did not face charges.
The military who condoned these assaults, whose names are known, are free.

Women who testify to having been raped in Saudi Arabia, Syria and Morocco face imprisonment and beatings, and being abandoned by their families. Their rapists almost never face charges and are free. Women who testify to rape in India and Pakistan have been subjected to honor killings and acid attacks.
Their rapists almost never face charges, are almost never convicted. They are free.

...

In other words: Never in twenty-three years of reporting on and supporting victims of sexual assault around the world have I ever heard of a case of a man sought by two nations, and held in solitary confinement without bail in advance of being questioned -- for any alleged rape, even the most brutal or easily proven. In terms of a case involving the kinds of ambiguities and complexities of the alleged victims' complaints -- sex that began consensually that allegedly became non-consensual when dispute arose around a condom -- please find me, anywhere in the world, another man in prison today without bail on charges of anything comparable.

Of course 'No means No', even after consent has been given, whether you are male or female; and of course condoms should always be used if agreed upon. As my fifteen-year-old would say: Duh.

But for all the tens of thousands of women who have been kidnapped and raped, raped at gunpoint, gang-raped, raped with sharp objects, beaten and raped, raped as children, raped by acquaintances -- who are still awaiting the least whisper of justice -- the highly unusual reaction of Sweden and Britain to this situation is a slap in the face. It seems to send the message to women in the UK and Sweden that if you ever want anyone to take sex crime against you seriously, you had better be sure the man you accuse of wrongdoing has also happened to embarrass the most powerful government on earth.

Keep Assange in prison without bail until he is questioned, by all means, if we are suddenly in a real feminist worldwide epiphany about the seriousness of the issue of sex crime: but Interpol, Britain and Sweden must, if they are not to be guilty of hateful manipulation of a serious women's issue for cynical political purposes, imprison as well -- at once -- the hundreds of thousands of men in Britain, Sweden and around the world world who are accused in far less ambiguous terms of far graver forms of assault.

Anyone who works in supporting women who have been raped knows from this grossly disproportionate response that Britain and Sweden, surely under pressure from the US, are cynically using the serious issue of rape as a fig leaf to cover the shameful issue of mafioso-like global collusion in silencing dissent. That is not the State embracing feminism. That is the State pimping feminism.
User avatar
Project Willow
 
Posts: 4798
Joined: Sat May 07, 2005 9:37 pm
Location: Seattle
Blog: View Blog (1)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby Luther Blissett » Sun Dec 19, 2010 5:21 pm

8bitagent wrote:So in Sweden, is it "rape" if the guy doesnt use a condom? thats just bad form, and does a serious disservice to REAL victims of rape.

We do get into areas where someone is purposefully infecting
others with AIDS, and there has been court cases of that. Or trying to get a girlfriend pregnant to have control over her, another issue Ive heard of.


Despite the fact that what we know about the charges has now canged with what is revealedw in this thread, I did just want to say that I think that Swedish rape laws are much better than in most other countries. The law certainly encourages young Swedish men to be much more attentive and open to their partners' wants/desires/wishes etc. I think that the various punishments fit the various crimes, etc. Certainly it can be established that there is some semblance of civility associated with these laws.

But like I said, it sounds like Assange didn't just fail to wear a condom anymore.
The Rich and the Corporate remain in their hundred-year fever visions of Bolsheviks taking their stuff - JackRiddler
User avatar
Luther Blissett
 
Posts: 4994
Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2009 1:31 pm
Location: Philadelphia
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby Plutonia » Sun Dec 19, 2010 7:12 pm

Erm... how do you think a smear campaign works?

Did you not see that post about Karl Rove's possible involvement with it? That's Karl. Rove:

"A Republican operative in Alabama says Karl Rove asked her to try to prove the state's Democratic governor was unfaithful to his wife in an effort to thwart the highly successful politician's re-election," CBS's Scott Pelley reports for 60 Minutes. "Rove's attempt to smear Don Siegelman was part of a Republican campaign to ruin him that finally succeeded in imprisoning him, says the operative, Jill Simpson."
...in 2006 he was convicted on corruption charges.[1] There has been an ongoing controversy due to counteraccusations that his prosecution was intentionally wrongful, engineered by presidential advisor Karl Rove and officials of the U.S. Department of Justice to gain political advantage. National news media have published investigations into this claim and at least 50 attorneys general and officials, both Republicans and Democrats, have publicly expressed their skepticism over Siegelman's prosecution.[2][3] The treatment of Siegelman pending his sentencing was so harsh that it prompted an intervention by 44 former Attorneys General of various states... Link
Definition
...
Smear tactics differ from normal discourse or debate in that they do not bear upon the issues or arguments in question. A smear is a simple attempt to malign a group or an individual and to attempt to undermine their credibility.

Smears often consist of ad hominem attacks in the form of unverifiable rumors and are often distortions, half-truths, or even outright lies; smear campaigns are often propagated by gossip spreading. Even when the facts behind a smear are shown to lack proper foundation, the tactic is often effective because the target's reputation is tarnished before the truth is known. Link

Smears are also effective in diverting attention away from the matter in question and onto the individual or group. The target of the smear is typically forced to defend his reputation rather than focus on the previous issue.

Smear tactics are considered by many to be a low, disingenuous form of discourse; they are nevertheless very common.
COINTELPRO (an acronym for Counter Intelligence Program) was a series of covert, and often illegal, projects conducted by the United States Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) aimed at surveilling, infiltrating, discrediting, and disrupting domestic political organizations.

COINTELPRO tactics included discrediting targets through psychological warfare, planting false reports in the media, smearing through forged letters, harassment, wrongful imprisonment, extralegal violence and assassination.


Emails can be faked, people. Ditto a dating site's profile page. Witnesses can give false testimony. False accusations can be made. The emails and the profile should not considered credible. They are essentially the only "evidence" of JA's "dirtiness" and as such seem to legitimize the Swedish sexual misconduct allegations. Is that not a red flag?!

It's unceasingly disturbing to me to see how effective these rumor campaigns are. If you aren't familiar with the Anna Mae Aquash story, I encourage you to take time to look it up. She was an AIM activist who was murdered by her own people when they were convinced by weakly substantiated rumours, a known COINTELPRO tactic, that she was a Federal Agent:
I heard about Anna Mae Aquash because people said, quietly, “Yes she was with AIM. But we think she was a snitch, that’s why she was killed”. I spend 10 years researching her life, death and friends to prove them wrong. She was not a fed, but was set-up by the FBI to appear as a threat. To AIM. Link

Srsly. Please be careful of buying into any smear campaign at all.

When you fall for it, that's you working against your own interests.

:doh:
[the British] government always kept a kind of standing army of news writers who without any regard to truth, or to what should be like truth, invented & put into the papers whatever might serve the minister

T Jefferson,
User avatar
Plutonia
 
Posts: 1267
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 2:07 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby Cosmic Cowbell » Sun Dec 19, 2010 8:05 pm

Like I said, I could be wrong. It is not however, inconceivable that Mr. Assange has himself supplied the shit he's now being smeared with (which I think is my entire point here). Here's a Gawker-Valleywag link/quote from an article from back in August, again digging up a bit of JA's digital history. And it is again, demonstrative of a certain attitude/disdain towards the opposite sex which, in turn, makes the accusation seem more business as usual than some anomaly or set up..

After my state sponsored stay at ANU, I ended up at a backpackers filled
with some of the 900 Christians from the Australian University Christian
Convergence. Most were young women and I turned, somewhat disgracefully,
into a sort of Chesterton's Hardy, the village atheist, brooding and
blaspheming over the village idiot, while they, for their part, tried
to convert me with the rise and fall their bosoms.

One of the devout was the lovely daughter of a New Castle minister.
At some point in my unintended wooing of her, she looked up, fluttered
her eyelids and said 'Oh, you know so much! I hardly know anything!'.
'That is why you believe in God," I explained. This conversational
brutality took her breath away and she swooned. I was exactly what she
secretly longed for; a man willing to openly disagree with her father. All
along she had needed a man to devote herself to. All along she had failed
to find a man worthy of being called a man, failed to find a man who would
not bow to gods, so she had chosen a god unworthy of being called a god,
but who would not bow to a man.


http://web.archive.org/web/200607121845 ... index.html

http://gawker.com/5620888/the-sexual-demigod-wikileaks-founder-worshipped-by-christian-women

Of course, this could all be planted/faked info but what if it's not? And what if more emerges? I do find it interesting that much of this background is coming through Gawker Media. I suspect they are much more used to intellectualism coupled w/ douchebaggery (and calling it when they see it) than most and this guy just makes the radar go wild.

JR wrote:I think the determination among the conspiracy-aware not to be deceived, to always rise above "the sheeple," often leads to another extreme, where one can end up just as clueless in one's understanding.
"There are no whole truths: all truths are half-truths. It is trying to treat them as whole truths that plays the devil." ~ A.N. Whitehead
User avatar
Cosmic Cowbell
 
Posts: 1774
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2006 5:20 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby Plutonia » Sun Dec 19, 2010 8:47 pm

After my state sponsored stay at ANU, I ended up at a backpackers filled
with some of the 900 Christians from the Australian University Christian
Convergence. Most were young women and I turned, somewhat disgracefully,
into a sort of Chesterton's Hardy, the village atheist, brooding and
blaspheming over the village idiot, while they, for their part, tried
to convert me with the rise and fall their bosoms.

One of the devout was the lovely daughter of a New Castle minister.
At some point in my unintended wooing of her, she looked up, fluttered
her eyelids and said 'Oh, you know so much! I hardly know anything!'.
'That is why you believe in God," I explained. This conversational
brutality took her breath away and she swooned. I was exactly what she
secretly longed for; a man willing to openly disagree with her father. All
along she had needed a man to devote herself to. All along she had failed
to find a man worthy of being called a man, failed to find a man who would
not bow to gods, so she had chosen a god unworthy of being called a god,
but who would not bow to a man.


http://web.archive.org/web/200607121845 ... index.html

Are you kidding me? Is this supposed to be evidence of his irredeemably foul moral character? If that's your standard then I'm afraid every guy on this internet is toast.

Seriously, the man has (apparently) taken on the most powerful and dangerous governments/organizations/corporation/news media and BANKS in the world!!!!11

You really want to disparage the guy because of sophomoric college writings and Gawker rumors?!!

!!!?!!

Okay, you've done it now... I... can't... help... myself.... erghhhh...

Image
[the British] government always kept a kind of standing army of news writers who without any regard to truth, or to what should be like truth, invented & put into the papers whatever might serve the minister

T Jefferson,
User avatar
Plutonia
 
Posts: 1267
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 2:07 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby Plutonia » Sun Dec 19, 2010 8:53 pm

This is why I don't care if JA's a slut #1:

Crowdjournalism in action at Operation Leakspin:

England gets Russian journalist killed (06PARIS7904)

In November 2006 Alexander Litvinenko was fatally poisoned with radioactive Polonium-210 in London.
Alexander Litvinenko was a former Russian secret service agent, writer, dissident and public critic of the Russian secret service. He was best known as the author of “Blowing Up Russia: Terror From Within” and “Lubyanka Criminal Group”

After his death there has been a multitude of theories of what happened in the media. Most of them accused Russia of the murder. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_ ... n_theories

In Cable 06PARIS7904 Hofmann reports on a meeting between Russia and US on counter-terrorism. The Presidential Representative Safonov points out that “Russian authorities in London had known about and followed individuals moving radioactive substances into the city but were told by the British that they were under control before the poisoning took place.”

The result shows, that they were not under control. Why didn’t the UK stop people smuggling radioactive material into London? Or at least watch them closely enough, that something like this can’t happen?
Instead they call the Russian authorities back, who might have been able to foil the assassination. This could be interpreted as support for the murderers of Litvinenko.
Be that as it may, as it stands the UK is directly or indirectly responsible for the death of Alexander Litvinenko.

On 20 January 2007 the British police announced they identified Andrey Lugovoy as the assassin. Two months later, the British Foreign Office officially submitted a request to the Government of Russia for the extradition of Lugovoi to face criminal charges in the UK.

Russian authorities have formally refused to extradite Andrei Lugovoy.
Another cable reveals there are constitutional and other legal prohibitions against the extradition of Russian citizens.
Instead they offered to put Mr Lugovoy on trial in Russia if the evidence is forwarded to them.

That was in 2007 and there has not been a trial.
_________________________________________________________________________

Related cables:

http://www.wikileaks.ch/cable/2006/12/06PARIS7904.html

http://213.251.145.96/cable/2007/05/07MOSCOW2429.html

The GOR is highly unlikely to extradite former FSB officer Andrey Lugovoy to Britain, citing constitutional and other legal prohibitions against the extradition of Russian citizens. Official and unofficial Russian reaction to the May 22 British announcement that Lugovoy would be charged with the murder of Aleksandr Litvinenko has been nearly uniform in rejecting the UK request that he stand trial in London. The MFA held out the prospect of further cooperation in the investigation, while citing the impossibility of extradition, but other Russian commentators were more categorical, suggesting that the British charges were politically motivated. A few opposition voices called for Lugovoy to voluntarily submit to British justice. The British Embassy expects a further worsening in the UK-Russia and EU-Russia relationships.

http://wikileaks.ch/cable/2009/08/09MADRID869.html

Litvinenko tipped off Spanish security officials on the locations, roles, and activities of several “Russian” mafia figures with ties to Spain. He allegedly provided information on Izguilov, Zahkar Kalashov, and Tariel Oniani to GOS officials during a May 2006 meeting.

http://www.wikileaks.ch/cable/2007/09/07MOSCOW4599.html

Andrey Lugovoy fills number two position on Liberal Democratic Party of Russia’s ticket.
The Kremlin had pushed Lugovoy onto the LDPR list in order to somehow provide him with protection.

http://wikileaks.ch/cable/2008/07/08LONDON1837.html

Aldred said the cost of the fall-out to HMG from the Litvinenko issue was an end to close cooperation with Russian intelligence (FSB) on counterterrorism and other global issues.

Brown and Medvedev made little progress on the issue of diplomatic visas, which are still being restricted by both countries as part of the fall-out from the Litvinenko case.

http://wikileaks.ch/cable/2008/10/08LONDON2643.html

The UK has had more experience lately than most western European countries with Moscow’s ire, going back to the Litvinenko poisoning case

http://213.251.145.96/cable/2006/12/06HAMBURG85.html

Summary: Hamburg State Police (LKA) confirmed December 14 that Dmitry Kovtun had left positive traces of polonium 210 in Hamburg prior to his departure from Hamburg for London on November 1. A senior official in the Federal Interior Ministry in Berlin also confirmed the reports and noted the ongoing investigation. Hamburg police continue to examine where Kovtun was and what he did while in Germany, but are not yet able to confirm if Kovtun was transporting polonium or if he had been contaminated through contact with the substance prior to his arrival in Hamburg on October 28.

http://213.251.145.96/cable/2006/12/06PARIS7755.html

speculation

Quote for lulz:
Independent (UK newspaper): Did you murder Aleksandr Litvinenko?
Andrey Lugovoy: Prior to answering such a deep and thought-out question, …

Other topics in the cable (06PARIS7904):

US and Russia agree on engaging the private sector in counter-terrorism.

Russia (Safonov) cites a scientist regarding terrorism as an indicator for larger problems.

US suggests they direct the Sandia National Laboratories in Mexico to undertake terrorist scenario modeling. They already worked with Russia on nuclear safety and biological weapons threats.

The CIA failed to provide Russia with all the requested information on the kidnapped and killed Russian diplomats in Iraq within six months. Although that is portrayed as something positive in the cable:
“CIA had already met all but one of the Russian information requests that had been made since June of 2006.”

The US side said “there was a pressing need for the G-8 to establish uniform criteria for designating terrorists and terrorist groups.” Considering the wars and occupation of countries because of terrorism it is baffling there apparently isn’t a generally accepted definition on what we are actually fighting.

[the British] government always kept a kind of standing army of news writers who without any regard to truth, or to what should be like truth, invented & put into the papers whatever might serve the minister

T Jefferson,
User avatar
Plutonia
 
Posts: 1267
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 2:07 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby Ben D » Sun Dec 19, 2010 9:49 pm

Stephen Morgan wrote:
vanlose kid wrote:from the bbc interview last night (:

JA: “I’m informed that there will be, within the next 24 hours or so, another leak of information, deliberately, from either the Swedish prosecution service or some organizations that have managed to obtain selected material. Nothing that we have.”

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12015140?u ... um=twitter
*

Hoist by his own petard. He who lives by the leak dies by the leak. And cetera.

Thanks for that astute observation Stephen, though the wheels of karma may turn slowly, they do turn surely,...whatsoever men sow, that they shall reap. Etc.
There is That which was not born, nor created, nor evolved. If it were not so, there would never be any refuge from being born, or created, or evolving. That is the end of suffering. That is God**.

** or Nirvana, Allah, Brahman, Tao, etc...
User avatar
Ben D
 
Posts: 2005
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 8:10 pm
Location: Australia
Blog: View Blog (3)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby vanlose kid » Sun Dec 19, 2010 10:46 pm

Ben D wrote:
Stephen Morgan wrote:
vanlose kid wrote:from the bbc interview last night (:

JA: “I’m informed that there will be, within the next 24 hours or so, another leak of information, deliberately, from either the Swedish prosecution service or some organizations that have managed to obtain selected material. Nothing that we have.”

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12015140?u ... um=twitter
*

Hoist by his own petard. He who lives by the leak dies by the leak. And cetera.

Thanks for that astute observation Stephen, though the wheels of karma may turn slowly, they do turn surely,...whatsoever men sow, that they shall reap. Etc.


either that or JA and WL have inside sources in Sweden, giving them notice beforehand.

anyway, if JA and WL is a scam as you seem so certain of then so are the charges, and the karma thing makes no sense, right? or do you mean that fake karma and real karma are identical? what do you mean, really? do your thoughts on this cohere?

whatever.

*
"Teach them to think. Work against the government." – Wittgenstein.
User avatar
vanlose kid
 
Posts: 3182
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 7:44 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby Ben D » Sun Dec 19, 2010 11:19 pm

vanlose kid wrote:
Ben D wrote:
Stephen Morgan wrote:
vanlose kid wrote:from the bbc interview last night (:

JA: “I’m informed that there will be, within the next 24 hours or so, another leak of information, deliberately, from either the Swedish prosecution service or some organizations that have managed to obtain selected material. Nothing that we have.”

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12015140?u ... um=twitter
*

Hoist by his own petard. He who lives by the leak dies by the leak. And cetera.

Thanks for that astute observation Stephen, though the wheels of karma may turn slowly, they do turn surely,...whatsoever men sow, that they shall reap. Etc.


either that or JA and WL have inside sources in Sweden, giving them notice beforehand.

anyway, if JA and WL is a scam as you seem so certain of then so are the charges, and the karma thing makes no sense, right? or do you mean that fake karma and real karma are identical? what do you mean, really? do your thoughts on this cohere?

whatever.

*


Hi vanlose kid, karma is a universal principle as I understand it, analogous to the physical law of 'for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction'. I don't understand the concept of fake karma, nor have I ever heard of it before, could you please explain it to me?
There is That which was not born, nor created, nor evolved. If it were not so, there would never be any refuge from being born, or created, or evolving. That is the end of suffering. That is God**.

** or Nirvana, Allah, Brahman, Tao, etc...
User avatar
Ben D
 
Posts: 2005
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 8:10 pm
Location: Australia
Blog: View Blog (3)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby vanlose kid » Sun Dec 19, 2010 11:23 pm

Ben D wrote:
vanlose kid wrote:
Ben D wrote:
Stephen Morgan wrote:
vanlose kid wrote:from the bbc interview last night (:

JA: “I’m informed that there will be, within the next 24 hours or so, another leak of information, deliberately, from either the Swedish prosecution service or some organizations that have managed to obtain selected material. Nothing that we have.”

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12015140?u ... um=twitter
*

Hoist by his own petard. He who lives by the leak dies by the leak. And cetera.

Thanks for that astute observation Stephen, though the wheels of karma may turn slowly, they do turn surely,...whatsoever men sow, that they shall reap. Etc.


either that or JA and WL have inside sources in Sweden, giving them notice beforehand.

anyway, if JA and WL is a scam as you seem so certain of then so are the charges, and the karma thing makes no sense, right? or do you mean that fake karma and real karma are identical? what do you mean, really? do your thoughts on this cohere?

whatever.

*


Hi vanlose kid, karma is a universal principle as I understand it, analogous to the physical law of 'for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction'. I don't understand the concept of fake karma, nor have I ever heard of it before, could you please explain it to me?


hi, the concept of fake karma is based on the fact that you believe that the entire WL business and Assange are fake, stage managed, whatever. now if that is the case then the rape accusations, jailing, bail hearings, extradition requests are fake. and if that is the case there is no question of Assange being hit by karma, unless you posit fake karma. – just following your line of thought through, basically.

*

*
"Teach them to think. Work against the government." – Wittgenstein.
User avatar
vanlose kid
 
Posts: 3182
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 7:44 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby norton ash » Sun Dec 19, 2010 11:25 pm

Go read up on karma, Ben D. , before you start posting SHIT like:

"though the wheels of karma may turn slowly, they do turn surely,...whatsoever men sow, that they shall reap. Etc."

that you will quite rightly get called on. Especially as you're celebrating a frame-up.
Zen horse
User avatar
norton ash
 
Posts: 4067
Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2006 5:46 pm
Location: Canada
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby JackRiddler » Sun Dec 19, 2010 11:27 pm

.

Karma? Please!

Image
We meet at the borders of our being, we dream something of each others reality. - Harvey of R.I.

To Justice my maker from on high did incline:
I am by virtue of its might divine,
The highest Wisdom and the first Love.

TopSecret WallSt. Iraq & more
User avatar
JackRiddler
 
Posts: 16007
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:59 pm
Location: New York City
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby Ben D » Sun Dec 19, 2010 11:38 pm

vanlose kid wrote:hi, the concept of fake karma is based on the fact that you believe that the entire WL business and Assange are fake, stage managed, whatever. now if that is the case then the rape accusations, jailing, bail hearings, extradition requests are fake. and if that is the case there is no question of Assange being hit by karma, unless you posit fake karma. – just following your line of thought through, basically.
*

*


I still don't understand what you mean by false karma, I'm only seeing the karmic connection between Assange dealing in leaked information, and the fact that information about him is now being leaked deliberately.

JA: “I’m informed that there will be, within the next 24 hours or so, another leak of information, deliberately, from either the Swedish prosecution service or some organizations that have managed to obtain selected material. Nothing that we have.”
There is That which was not born, nor created, nor evolved. If it were not so, there would never be any refuge from being born, or created, or evolving. That is the end of suffering. That is God**.

** or Nirvana, Allah, Brahman, Tao, etc...
User avatar
Ben D
 
Posts: 2005
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 8:10 pm
Location: Australia
Blog: View Blog (3)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby norton ash » Sun Dec 19, 2010 11:41 pm

I still don't understand what you mean by false karma, I'm only seeing the karmic connection between Assange dealing in leaked information, and the fact that information about him is now being leaked deliberately.


"This one goes to eleven."
Zen horse
User avatar
norton ash
 
Posts: 4067
Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2006 5:46 pm
Location: Canada
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: 10 days in Sweden: the full allegations against Assange

Postby Ben D » Sun Dec 19, 2010 11:51 pm

norton ash wrote:
I still don't understand what you mean by false karma, I'm only seeing the karmic connection between Assange dealing in leaked information, and the fact that information about him is now being leaked deliberately.


"This one goes to eleven."


Ok, so I'm obtuse, please be kind enough to explain why this isn't an example of karma?
There is That which was not born, nor created, nor evolved. If it were not so, there would never be any refuge from being born, or created, or evolving. That is the end of suffering. That is God**.

** or Nirvana, Allah, Brahman, Tao, etc...
User avatar
Ben D
 
Posts: 2005
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 8:10 pm
Location: Australia
Blog: View Blog (3)

PreviousNext

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 18 guests