Moloch

[theeKultleeder]

What does all that have to do with the origins of Moloch?

Brighid seems to think it has something to do with LaVey's satanism.

I did apologize at the top of the post. Sorry...

[Stephen Morgan]

In Genesis 41:45, we read, "And Pharaoh called Joseph's name Zaphnathpaaneah; and he gave him to WIFE ASENATH the DAUGHTER OF POTIPHERAH PRIEST OF ON. And Joseph went out over all the land of Egypt."

Yer Bull, On.

[Brighid_Moon]

What does all that have to do with the origins of Moloch?

Brighid seems to think it has something to do with LaVey's satanism.

I did apologize at the top of the post. Sorry...

Not necessarily, except to the extent that all those gods are connected and similar, hence why it's so difficult to trace many of them down. I've had that same difficulty in tracing the origins of the New Age movement... too much fog and cross-over. Still looking though!

[John E. Nemo]

Looking for the origins of the New Age movement?
Look no further than the Masonic Lodge who published "New Age" magazine (later known as the Scottish Rite magazine).



As I mentioned in another thread, Masons are Baal/Molech worshippers and invoke his name in their "rituals".
They incorporate Gnosticism, Arianism and Mystery Religion mind-control cult BS to slowly convert Theists into either atheists or Baal woshippers, depending on which Lodge you join and how high you progress in the pyramid scheme.



It all dates back to the "Mystery Religions", i.e. ancient mind-control cults, which are based on legends (and pretty lies).
Some of these legends, when pieced together, form an interesting picture.

Set/Typhon/Rahab-Satan is kicked out of Heaven, for "trying to be like the Most High".
Most have speculated that he was trying to "storm the gates of Heaven" and overtake the throne, but he may have, instead, been trying to procreate.

The Egyptian and Greek legends, and the mentions of the story of Rahab-Satan in the Tanach, indicate that Rahab-Satan was a dragon or serpent who was castrated and that his consort was either killed or made barren.

Prior to this, many "dragons" were spawned, and some walked on two legs like humans, as evidenced by the fossils of Tyranosaurus Rex.

Deprived of the ability to procreate, Rahab-Satan first entices Eve to fall from grace, and then entices angels to mate with mankind, creating the Nephilim.

A great flood destroys the Nephilim, so Rahab-Satan resorts to setting up Mystery Religions that involve child sacrifice, in order to strike back at The Most High and his children.

The drunken fertility rites of these religions, in addition to directing worship of the Most High away, are attempts to create a "MoonChild" or human/serpent baby.

The Masons "inherit the wisdom" of the Mystery Religions, indoctrinate the elite and propagate the New Age/Wiccan movements, which are just the same ole Mystery Religions minus the child sacrifice, barring, of course, Bohemian Grove (and New Orleans).

[Eldritch]

Maybe the worship of Moloch is everything some modern western religionists say that it was. Maybe. Still I can't help but wonder if the sacrifices—human atrocities, really—attributed to the worship of Moloch weren't hyped a bit as sort of a polemic, used in order to justify pitting one culture over another.

The stories of the babies being sacrificed down the fiery brass arms of Moloch caused me to think of the babies that were, allegedly, being thrown out of their incubators in Kuwait by the Iraqis—a falsehood, concocted and used as cultural rallying cry before the first Gulf War.

[John E. Nemo]

Funny how occultists always want to whitewash pagan human sacrifice and demonize Christians who mention it as liars.

This is the original "Burning Man".
Pagans set fire to the Wicker Man and burned humans alive, as a sacrifice to their gods.


Deal with the truth and stop believing pretty lies.

[Crow]

Maybe the worship of Moloch is everything some modern western religionists say that it was. Maybe. Still I can't help but wonder if the sacrifices—human atrocities, really—attributed to the worship of Moloch weren't hyped a bit as sort of a polemic, used in order to justify pitting one culture over another.

The stories of the babies being sacrificed down the fiery brass arms of Moloch caused me to think of the babies that were, allegedly, being thrown out of their incubators in Kuwait by the Iraqis—a falsehood, concocted and used as cultural rallying cry before the first Gulf War.

Your point about this being propagandistic strikes me as accurate, though as Nemo points out in his reply, human sacrifice was much more common in ancient religions and cultures than it is in modern times. Life was cheaper then, sadly. In the days before birth control, abortion and warehouses full of food, it is much easier to imagine people being willing to give up children for "sacrifice."

Christianity revolutionized human sacrifice by bringing in martyrdom, and people have been sacrificing themselves more often than each other, on and off, ever since. Now they're doing it in the Middle East.

Et, I'm not sure how much further back one can go than the Biblical description of the Moloch cult. But maybe I don't understand what you're after.

[Eldritch]

I have little doubt that some pagan groups practiced human sacrifice. I also have no doubt that the Church murdered pagans by the thousands—and probably millions—but they did it "for the Lord."

Religious barbarism and insanity, no matter who does the killing.

[John E. Nemo]

Your point about this being propagandistic strikes me as accurate, though as Nemo points out in his reply, human sacrifice was much more common in ancient religions and cultures than it is in modern times. Life was cheaper then, sadly. In the days before birth control, abortion and warehouses full of food, it is much easier to imagine people being willing to give up children for "sacrifice."

If you're saying that the "elite" always required humans, other than their own family, to be sacrificed to appease "angry spirits", then I am in complete agreement.
But your also white-washing things like Mayan priests slitting the throats of children, as chronicled by cave drawings and first hand accounts.

Christianity revolutionized human sacrifice by bringing in martyrdom, and people have been sacrificing themselves more often than each other, on and off, ever since. Now they're doing it in the Middle East.

It appears you've bought into some "pretty lies".
[b]Christians were murdered by pagans in Rome and modern Luciferian pagan elites use wars as the modern version of human sacrifice.

[Et in Arcadia ego]

Take it somewhere else, m'kay?

[John E. Nemo]

I have little doubt that some pagan groups practiced human sacrifice.

ALL PAGANS PRACTICED HUMAN SACRIFICE.

I also have no doubt that the Church murdered pagans by the thousands—and probably millions—but they did it "for the Lord."

The same Roman pagan Luciferians who pretended to be Christians went on slaughtering after their "conversion", because they were not Christians, but blood-thirsty pagans.

You have been indoctrinated with a lot of pretty lies by groups like the Masons.

[John E. Nemo]

Take it somewhere else, m'kay?

Take the truth somewhere else?
Is that your response when someone calls you occultists on your BS and Historical Revisionism?

[Eldritch]

Take it somewhere else, m'kay?

Take the truth somewhere else?
Is that your response when someone calls you occultists on your BS and Historical Revisionism?

Exactly who are you calling an "occultist," John?

I practice no religion whatsoever, nor do I have any particular allegiance to a religious and/or occult group.

Many people here, perhaps most, feel similarly I would imagine.

[Brighid_Moon]

Looking for the origins of the New Age movement?
Look no further than the Masonic Lodge who published "New Age" magazine (later known as the Scottish Rite magazine).

Thank you for that information, it was something I hadn't found yet, and look forward to investigating!

Still I can't help but wonder if the sacrifices—human atrocities, really—attributed to the worship of Moloch weren't hyped a bit as sort of a polemic, used in order to justify pitting one culture over another.

Of course it was. You'll never find one major take-over of a society where the old religion isn't condemned in one fashion or another (or integrated into the new form of religion) and where propaganda isn't used. However there are also physical proofs behind these sacrifices of the various religions.

et in Arcadia ego:

I found more information and a couple of sites which proved some form of information on Moloch.

Encyclopedia Mythica

This was the first one I used above, where I began.

"King". The sun god of the Canaanites (Ammonites?) in old Palestine and sometimes associated with the Sumerian Baal, although Moloch (or Molekh) was entirely malevolent.

The Nibiruan Council Of Twelve and their names translated into 12 language groups

This had some interesting name corrospondances.

CANAANITE: BA'AL, MOLOCH
NIBIRUAN: ISH.KUR
SEMITIC: YAHWEH

Hyperstition

This had more information on the Persian religions. I, personally, found the connection to Zoastorism interesting.

Malek Tavoos is obviously a Persian deity originated from Sumerian / Phoenician / Assyrian pandemonium of god-devils (the system of Evil-against-Evil): Melkarth --> Molekh --> Moloch and later in Persian Malek (I guess you have already read about Moloch in Five Billion Years of Hell-engineering) ...

Yazidism as a direct line from the Z-crowd [sic] [Zoarostrians] running through monotheism has been renamed many times, the current name Yazidi belongs to later islamo-christian era and Malek Tavoos obv. comes from the strategic germ-line of their religion / cult to absorb (and be absorbed) by different monotheistic branches and righteous religions. Unfortunately, there are no direct connections between Zahak and Malek Tavoos (at least I cannot detect them now since as I mentioned Yazidism has been reformed, changed and disintegrated many times) ... however, their bond to the cult of Druj and the Z-crowd is still very tangible even among the reformed sects of Yazidism, a devil or Drujih entity which asks you to be righteous and clean as a ‘sacrifice’ (however, people should appease the Malek to keep him away from this world).

Similarities Between Sumer and the Bible

A side note about the connections between the religions. This and the following link shows that human sacrifice was turned to animal sacrifice through turning of religions/politics.

It should not be forgotten that the sacrifice of children was not all that unusual, particularly in Phoenicia and Canaan, where one offered one's first born to the god Moloch ; moreover the Bible mentions the sacrifice of children a thousand years later in Israel. (This was later transformed into the sacrifice of animals). Jesus as first-born was repurchased to satisfy this tradition at the temple with two doves, (the symbolic offering of the poor).

BABYLON, PERSIA AND JUDAISM BREAKUP OF ASSYRIA'S EMPIRE AND ASCENT OF THE MOSES LEGEND

I hate those all capital letters but I'm too lazy to cut them down right now. Recall that Baal and Moloch are virtually interchangable.

The Yahweh priesthood claimed to have found in a secret archive within Solomon's temple a scroll signed by Moses -- a document to become known as the Book of the Covenant. (2 Chronicles 34:1) How a work of such importance as Moses' scroll had been lost or misplaced and forgotten for the two hundred years since the building of Solomon's temple, remains a mystery. King Josiah treated the scroll as genuine. He supported the Yahwist priests, and he complained that previous generations had not listened to Yahweh. Now began an official intolerance that had not been the policy of kings David, Solomon, Jeroboam, Ahab, Jehu and Manasseh. According to the Old Testament, king Josiah, accompanied by a great crowd, went to Solomon's temple and there made a covenant with Yahweh. Josiah ordered all objects of worship that were not Yahwist taken from Solomon's temple, and these were burned in a field outside Jerusalem.

The high priest of Yahwism ordered lesser priests to Jerusalem, and he issued a new code that forbade all subjects of Josiah to practice religious rituals of "foreign" origin. According to the Old Testament, the code's proscriptions included religious ordeals of passing through fire. It included practicing witchcraft, sorcery, using omens, worshiping images of gods in wood or stone, and it included a prohibition against orgiastic fertility festivals -- festivals held in the spring and autumn that were accompanied by mass drunkenness and religious frenzy. The new code forbade all religious worship outside of Solomon's temple. Temples outside of Jerusalem were rendered unusable. The new code forbade human sacrifices. According to the Second Book of Kings (23:10), Josiah defiled a place called the "Topheth," a word meaning drums, which had been beaten loudly to drown out the screams of children being burned to death in sacrificial offerings. note http://www.sullivan-county.com/news/mine/pbj.htm#nt And the new code forbade the sacred prostitution that had been attached to temples, including the homosexual prostitution that was a part of Ba'al fertility worship.

Those who had been indulging in the now forbidden religious practices were great in number, and their religious practices had become habits not easily surrendered. And rather than try to force people to completely eradicate all of their old habits, the priests gave Josiah's subjects a new meaning to various rituals that could fit with Yahweh worship. In the place of human sacrifices, animal sacrifices were to be performed. Instead of fertility festivals, they would engage in festivals that demonstrated their gratitude and devotion to Yahweh. The most important of these festivals, the spring festival, became the Passover -- a commemoration of the exodus from Egypt led by Moses.

Phoenician influence on Greek Religion 900-600 BC:

Human Sacrifice: As the first millennium progressed, this practice would appear to have gone into decline in the Phoenician homeland, but was still carried out by the Carthaginians in the time of the Punic wars. The most demanding of the gods was the bull-headed Moloch, into whose fiery arms children were given. Moloch with his bull associations was a god who may have been known to the Cretans,95 and thus also the early Greeks. If this is true, he may be linked with the minotaur96 of Greek myth, defeated by the hero Theseus. Bronze Age Greeks may have practised human sacrifice, as it is alluded to in Homer, as seen in Agamemnon"s sacrifice of Iphigeneia to Artemis and the substitution of a deer at the last minute. It would appear that the Greeks therefore normally used an animal substitute rather than a human sacrifice. There is a parallel as in Jewish Scripture, Abraham was commanded by god to sacrifice his son Isaac and at the last minute a ram was substituted. Human sacrifice is evidenced in the cult of Hera Akraia with reference to Medea and was identified as being influenced by the Phoenicians.97

Did the Phoenicians Introduce the Idea of Interest to Greece and Italy; and if so When?

Seems as if the worship of Moloch and its sacrifices, which were eventually transformed into animal sacrifices (at least it was more convenient to food supply as well!) continued to use Moloch's form in the use of bulls and calves. I believe, if I recall correctly, that the Golden Calf of Israel/Moses was an offshoot of this.

On relatively rare occasions the rate of interest may rise to as high as 50 percent per year, as attested in Bronze Age Mesopotamia and even in the modern world (e.g. on Argentina's and Brazil's 1989 public debt). But archaic interest rates typically reflected the smallest unit-fraction measure of their local societies: 1/60th per month in Sumer (a shekel per mina, working out to 12/60ths, or 20% a year), a tenth (dekate) in Greece and a twelfth (an uncia per as) in Rome. The Greek and Latin use of terms meaning "young animal," "calf" or "birth" (tokos in Greek, faenus in Latin) as terms for interest (the birth of numerical increments due periodically) thus directly translate the Mesopotamian usage of mash (kid or calf, birth).

Phoenician Inscriptions Around the World

More interesting proof of the common sense/convenience of using cattle/animals rather than humans.

Inscription of Marseilles
"The temple of Baal . . . Account of the payments fixed by those set over the payments, in the time of our lords, Halats-Baal, the Suffes, the son of Abd-Tanith, the son of Abd-Esmun, and of Halats-Baal, the Suffes, the son of Abd-Esmun, the son of Halts-Baal, and of their colleagues:--For an ox, whether as burnt sacrifice, or expiatory offering, or thank offering, to the priests [shall be given] ten [shekels] of silver on account of each; and, if it be a burnt sacrifice, they shall have besides this payment three hundred weight of the flesh; and if the sacrifice be expiatory, [they shall have] the fat and the additions, and the offerer of the sacrifice shall have the skin, and the entrails, and the feet, and the rest of the flesh. For a calf without horns and entire, or for a ram, whether as burnt sacrifice, or expiatory offering, or thank offering, to the priests [shall be given] five [shekels] of silver on account of each; and if it be a burnt sacrifice, they shall have, besides this payment, a hundred weight and a half of the flesh; and if the sacrifice be expiatory, they shall have the fat and the additions, and the skin, and entrails, and feet, and the rest of the flesh shall be given to the offerer of the sacrifice.
[...]

Phoenician Canaanite Religion

I found this website to be an abundance of information about the Phoenecians and their legacy.

Baal, El, Ruler of the Universe, Son of Dagan, Rider of the Clouds, Almighty, Lord of the Earth

Baal-Hammon, God of Fertility and Renewer of all Energies in the Phoenician colonies of the Western Mediterranean

Baal, El, Ruler of the Universe

Baal (ba'al), plural Baalim (ba'allm) [Semitic,= possessor], name used throughout the Old Testament for the deity or deities of Canaan. The term was originally applied to various local gods, but by the time of the Ugarit tablets (14th cent. B.C.), Baal had become the ruler of the universe. Baal (Hadad) is regularly denominated "the son of Dagan," although Dagan (biblical Dagon) does not appear as an actor in the mythological texts. Baal also bears the titles "Rider of the Clouds," "Almighty," and "Lord of the Earth." He is the god of the thunderstorm, the most vigorous and aggressive of the gods, the one on whom mortals most immediately depend. Baal resides on Mount Zaphon, north of Ugarit, and is usually depicted holding a thunderbolt. Baal, also known as El. In 1978, Israeli archaeologists excavating at an eighth-century B.C. site in the eastern Sinai desert found several Hebrew inscriptions mentioning Ba'al and El in the form of "Elohim," a name used to refer to God in the Hebrew Bible. Further, whenever the Jews refer to God or our God they use "Eloh, Elohaino or Elohim."

The Ugarit tablets make him chief of the Canaanite pantheon. He is the source of life and fertility, the mightiest hero, and the lord of war. There were many temples of Baal in Canaan, and the name Baal was often added to that of a locality, e.g., Baal-peor, Baal-hazor, Baal-hermon. The Baal cult penetrated Israel and at times led to a syncretism. The practices of holy prostitution and child sacrifice were especially abhorrent to the Hebrew prophets, who denounced the cult and its "high places" (temples). This abhorrence probably explains the substitution of Ish-bosheth for Esh-baal, of Jerubbesheth for Jerubbaal (a name of Gideon), and of Mephibosheth for Merib-baal. The substituted term probably means "shame." The final detestation of the term is seen in the use of the name Beelzebub (see SATAN), probably the same as Baal-zebub. 1 Kings 11.4-8; 2 Kings 1. The Baal of 1 Chron. 4.33 is probably the same as RAMAH 3. As cognates of Baal in other Semitic languages there are Bel (in Babylonian religion) and the last elements in the Tyrian names Jezebel, Hasdrubal, and Hannibal.

Canaanite Pantheon
ATIK: The Calf of El. Enemy of Baal slain by Anath.

Phoenicians take Egyptian cults to Greece

"It is certain that Melampus introduced the phallus, and that the Greeks learnt from him the ceremonies which they now practise. I therefore maintain that Melampus, who was a wise man, and had acquired the art of divination, having become acquainted with the worship of Bacchus through knowledge derived from Egypt, introduced it into Greece, with a few slight changes, at the same time that he brought in various other practices. For I can by no means allow that it is by mere coincidence that the Bacchic ceremonies in Greece are so nearly the same as the Egyptian- they would then have been more Greek in their character, and less recent in their origin. Much less can I admit that the Egyptians borrowed these customs, or any other, from the Greeks. My belief is that Melampus got his knowledge of them from Cadmus the Tyrian, and the followers whom he brought from Phoenicia into the country which is now called Boeotia.

"Almost all the names of the gods came into Greece from Egypt."

Culture migrates....

"The following tale is commonly told in Egypt concerning the oracle of Dodona in Greece, and that of Ammon in Libya. My informants on the point were the priests of Jupiter at Thebes. They said "that two of the sacred women were once carried off from Thebes by the Phoenicians, and that the story went that one of them was sold into Libya, and the other into Greece, and these women were the first founders of the oracles in the two countries." On my inquiring how they came to know so exactly what became of the women, they answered, "that diligent search had been made after them at the time, but that it had not been found possible to discover where they were; afterwards, however, they received the information which they had given me."

Unfortunately I found no references about the actual riturals involved in the worship of Moloch, thus far. I beleive I ran into that difficulty a while back as well, when researching a few years ago. I'm sorry!

[John E. Nemo]

Exactly who are you calling an "occultist," John?

I'm calling someone who has the username "Eldritch", an occult term, which, when used as an adjective, refers to "the operation of supernatural influences", an occultist or occultist sympathizer.

I practice no religion whatsoever, nor do I have any particular allegiance to a religious and/or occult group.

Many people here, perhaps most, feel similarly I would imagine.

BS.
You, like a few other posters here, are anti-Christian and pro-pagan.
That constitutes a belief system.

One, in fact, built on pretty lies, which none of its adherents can defend.