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Nordic wrote:Well, anyone who has been paying the least bit of attention has known that this whole thing was quite literally a big Ponzi scheme. Environmentally speaking. And that we would either figure out ways to stretch it along, so long that it wouldn't matter to our lives, and those of our children, or else it would come to a very ugly end sometimes sooner rather than later.
The question is not if, but when. It always has been.
And the question is who's gonna suffer the brunt of it, and who is going to skate?
Obviously I hope that I and my loved ones will somehow avoid the worst of it.
When I first saw this coming, 30 years ago, I thought one of the best ways to avoid the pain was to become quite wealthy so that you could weather the storm a little more painlessly. I failed to do this, having to follow my heart (or was it my ego?) in order to live the kind of life I wanted to live, do the kind of work that was "creatively rewarding" and all of that rot.
Bad decision. I should have been one of the many things I could have been that would have made me some good fat chunks of steady money over the years so I'd now be in a position to buffer myself and my family.
Oh well.
wintler2 wrote:Who benefits from the apathy that Lovelock preaches, from the continuation of business as usual? The same psychopaths who led us into this abyss.
Why is Lovelock singing their song? Maybe because he is a 'made' man, he is inside the establishment and wealthy enough to look after his own, and doesn't want the plebs rocking any lifeboats.
Apathy is a sickness, alienation and internalised powerlessness writ large. This confirms for me that Lovelock has nothing further to offer.
wintler2 wrote:Who benefits from the apathy that Lovelock preaches, from the continuation of business as usual? The same psychopaths who led us into this abyss.
Why is Lovelock singing their song? Maybe because he is a 'made' man, he is inside the establishment and wealthy enough to look after his own, and doesn't want the plebs rocking any lifeboats.
Apathy is a sickness, alienation and internalised powerlessness writ large. This confirms for me that Lovelock has nothing further to offer.
Seamus OBlimey wrote:We've been told we're fucked since biblical times but, hey, let's just change the name of the planet and maybe no one will notice.
Naive comrades, there are evil men on Earth.
If one wants to be an ecologist, one must stop being a half-wit. Ecology totally overlooks social issues, that is, the relationships of power and wealth at the heart of societies. But symmetrically, the left overlooks, ecology...
Consequently, we find simpleminded ecologist - ecology with no social conscience - alongside a left stuck in the old days - social conscience with no ecology; and above them all the happy capitalists: "Speak, good people, and above all, remain divided."
We must get out of this space and understand that the ecological crisis and the social crisis are two faces of the same disaster. And this disaster is implemented by a system of power that has no other objective than to maintain the privileges of the ruling classes.
Jeff wrote:..
IMO, Lovelock's practical pessimism is preferable to Gore's no-lightbulb-left-behindism, which largely lays responsibility at our composter and leaves the Satanic Mills unafflicted by systemic critique.
Herve Kempf wrote:..If one wants to be an ecologist, one must stop being a half-wit. Ecology totally overlooks social issues, that is, the relationships of power and wealth at the heart of societies. But symmetrically, the left overlooks, ecology.
Consequently, we find simpleminded ecologist - ecology with no social conscience - alongside a left stuck in the old days - social conscience with no ecology; and above them all the happy capitalists: "Speak, good people, and above all, remain divided."
Herve Kempf wrote:We must get out of this space and understand that the ecological crisis and the social crisis are two faces of the same disaster.
Nordic wrote:Do you really think that people are gonna do anything?
Nordic wrote: Do you seriously think that in a country where George Bush walks free, and Karl Rove is running around doing book-signings, and the rest of the cabal skates completely free and gets high-paying jobs at universities and think tanks, and nobody cares, in a country where people will shell out 5,000 bucks for a television set, that citizens are suddenly going to get up off their fat asses and do something to "save the planet?"
nordic wrote:Please.
Nobody is going to do anything until it's far too late, until they are hungry, cut off, their power shut down, their TV's shut off, the gas stations empty of gas.
No.
Everybody has been warned, the information is out there, we've all known it for decades now, and yet the monster grows, the waste grows, the destruction grows, the population grows.
Lemmings.
People are NOT equipped to deal with this, he's absolutely right.
Jeff wrote:Naive comrades, there are evil men on Earth.
If one wants to be an ecologist, one must stop being a half-wit. Ecology totally overlooks social issues, that is, the relationships of power and wealth at the heart of societies. But symmetrically, the left overlooks, ecology...
Consequently, we find simpleminded ecologist - ecology with no social conscience - alongside a left stuck in the old days - social conscience with no ecology; and above them all the happy capitalists: "Speak, good people, and above all, remain divided."
We must get out of this space and understand that the ecological crisis and the social crisis are two faces of the same disaster. And this disaster is implemented by a system of power that has no other objective than to maintain the privileges of the ruling classes.
We have created phenomena we cannot control. Since our origins, water, air and forms of life are intimately linked. But recently, we have broken those links.
Let's face the facts. We must believe what we know. All that we have just seen is a reflection of human behavior. We have shaped the Earth in our image. We have very little time to change. How can this century carry the burden of nine billion human beings... if we refuse to be called to account... for everything we alone have done?
The cost of our actions is high. Others pay the price without having been actively involved. I have seen refugee camps as big as cities, sprawling in the desert. How many men, women and children... will be left by the wayside tomorrow? Must we always build walls... to break the chain of human solidarity, separate peoples and protect the happiness of some from the misery of others?
It's too late to be a pessimist.
I know that a single human can knock down every wall. It's too late to be a pessimist. Worldwide, four children out of five attend school. Never has learning been given to so many human beings. Everyone, from richest to poorest, can make a contribution. Lesotho, one of the world's poorest countries, is proportionally the one that invests most in its people's education.
Qatar, one of the world's richest states, has opened its doors to the best universities. Culture, education, research and innovation are inexhaustible resources. In the face of misery and suffering, millions of N.G.O.'s prove that solidarity between peoples... is stronger than the selfishness of nations.
In Bangladesh, a man thought the unthinkable... and founded a bank that lends only to the poor. In barely thirty years, it has changed the lives... of one hundred fifty million people around the world.
Antarctica is a continent with immense natural resources... that no country can claim for itself, a natural reserve devoted to peace and science. A treaty signed by forty-nine states has made it a treasure shared by all humanity.
It's too late to be a pessimist.
Governments have acted to protect nearly two percent of the world's territorial waters. It's not much, but it's two times more than ten years ago. The first natural parks were created just over a century ago. They cover over thirteen percent of the continents. They create spaces where human activity is in step... with the preservation of species, soils and landscapes. This harmony between humans and nature can become the rule, no longer the exception.
In the United States, New York has realized that nature does for us. These forests and lakes supply all the drinking water the city needs.
In South Korea, the forests have been devastated by war. Thanks to a national reforestation program, they once more cover sixty-five percent of the country. More than seventy-five percent of paper is recycled.
Costa Rica has made a choice between military spending and the conservation of its lands. The country no longer has an army. It prefers to devote its resources to education, ecotourism... and the protection of its primary forest.
Gabon is one of the world's leading producers of wood. It enforces selective logging not more than one tree every hectare. Its forests are one of the country's most important economic resources, but they have the time to regenerate. Programs exist that guarantee sustainable forest management. They must become mandatory.
For consumers and producers, justice is an opportunity to be seized. When trade is fair, when both buyer and seller benefit, everybody can prosper and earn a decent living. How can there be justice and equity... between people whose only tools are their hands... and those who harvest their crops with a machine and state subsidies? Let's be responsible consumers. Think about what we buy.
It's too late to be a pessimist. I have seen agriculture on a human scale. It can feed the whole planet if meat production doesn't take the food out of people's mouths. I have seen fishermen who take care what they catch... and care for the riches of the ocean.
I have seen houses producing their own energy. Five thousand people live in the world's first ever eco-friendly district, in Freiburg, Germany. Other cities partner the project. Mumbai is the thousandth to join them.
The governments of New Zealand, Iceland, Austria, Sweden... and other nations have made the development... of renewable energy sources a top priority. I know that eighty percent of the energy we consume... comes from fossil energy sources.
Every week, two new coal-fired generating plants are built in China alone. But I have also seen, in Denmark, a prototype of a coal-fired plant... that releases its carbon into the soil rather than the air. A solution for the future? Nobody knows yet.
I have seen, in Iceland, an electricity plant powered by the Earth's heat - geothermal power. I have seen a sea snake lying on the swell... to absorb the energy of the waves and produce electricity. I have seen wind farms off the coast of Denmark... that produce twenty percent of the country's electricity.
The U.S.A., China, India, Germany and Spain... are the biggest investors in renewable energy. They have already created over two and a half million jobs.
Where on Earth doesn't the wind blow? I have seen desert expanses baking in the sun. Everything on Earth is linked, and the Earth is linked to the sun, its original energy source. Can humans not imitate plants and capture its energy? In one hour, the sun gives the Earth... the same amount of energy as that consumed by all humanity in one year. As long as the Earth exists, the sun's energy will be inexhaustible. All we have to do is stop drilling the Earth and start looking to the sky. All we have to do is learn to cultivate the sun.
All these experiments are only examples, but they testify to a new awareness. They lay down markers for a new human adventure... based on moderation, intelligence and sharing. It's time to come together. What's important is not what's gone, but what remains. We still have half the world's forests, thousands of rivers, lakes and glaciers... and thousands of thriving species. We know that the solutions are there today. We all have the power to change. So what are we waiting for?
Wintler2 wrote:Ever hear of EF Schumacher? Holmgren & Mollison? Vandana Shiva, the Zapatista's, landles peasant movements like the MST, the Peace Brigades, how long have you got?
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