Giffords shooting

[Simulist]

Any ideas as to the meaning of the rotten oranges? I'm not familiar with any tradition that uses them, unless they were simply meant as an offering.

Cain, the biblical character who murdered his brother, is said to have offered his god vegetables and fruit as a sacrifice.

I wonder if Loughner might have been emulating Cain — and maybe in more than just one way.

The fact that the fruit had been around for a good, long while could be due to the fact that gods just don't seem to eat as much as they used to.

[Canadian_watcher]

the truth of the matter is that we don't know the truth of the matter, and never will.

the whole media machine is doing exactly what it's in place for.. STILL.. after all these years we fall for it. This thread attests to it. We are drawn in to the bizarre immediately, or we are drawn into labeling immediately, or we are drawn into human dramas immediately.

I really can't imagine the conclusions that would be drawn about me based on my belongings - I'm thinking of this peeling, weird, blue Asian statue I've got in my garden, my books & my day of the dead art pieces. My diaries.. oh lord what they could get from those! My internet presence I'm sure would make me look odd - angry possibly - hypocritical maybe - smug definitely.

all I know is that it is heartbreaking.. the whole thing. I think mostly its the rush to get angry at each other about it, when it's no one's fault but the shooter's (and his programmers, if there are any)

[sfnate]

Kinda makes me wonder about the metaphysical contention that we all create this reality via a decoding of information through our consciousnesses...

I don't think it would be too controversial to suggest that we are embedded actors in an imagined landscape: this collective narrative is a participatory project, an occult language with a grammatical and syntactical structure that recapitulates the ontological themes which are the motivating mythologies of every tragedy and comedy.

We acquire a fluency in this language through our shared suffering with other actors, whose dialog interrupts our solipsistic reverie with insistent demands for the next lines in the drama. If the whole thing seems eerily and unsettlingly reminiscent of some vaguely remembered something just beyond conscious recollection, it's not a coincidence we're feeling the curious vertigo of deja vu. Synchronicity is the clever plot device used to signal the organization of the narrative around several recurring, archetypal motifs. The decoding of these themes is the principal occupation of those who have become conscious of their roles as actors in an imagined landscape. Other players have resorted to a rigorous form of method acting called amnesia. They require subtle techniques of assistance, as waking them up too suddenly often produces violent reactions of disorientation and fear.

We're seeing a lot of disorientation and fear these days.

[Simulist]

I think that's a very insightful analysis, Nate.

[nathan28]

wasn't/isn't the judge who was hit a Republican?

No doubt; he was recommended by McCain and nominated by H W Bush.

http://judgepedia.org/index.php/John_Roll

That's why this shit looks more like Travis Bickle/John Hinkley than LHO/Sirhan Sirhan to me. I just can't figure out what sort of politics would lead someone to assassinate Giffords and strike--though it was probably unwittingly--a Poppy-Magog Bush nominee. Here's here "top 20" (i.e., top 20 donation sizes, with a lot at the bottom tied at $10,000) donors to Giffords:

"University of Arizona"
"EMILY's List"
"League of Conservation Voters"
"Raytheon Co"
"Lewis & Roca"
"ActBlue"
"Democratic Congressional Campaign Cmte"
"Grant & Eisenhofer"
"Boeing Co"
"Calendar Club"
"United Space Alliance"
"Lockheed Martin"
"PricewaterhouseCoopers"
"AmeriPAC: The Fund for a Greater America"
"Apollo Group"
"Landry's Restaurants"
"American Fedn of St/Cnty/Munic Employees"
"American Crystal Sugar"
"New Democrat Coalition"
"Orbital Sciences Corp"
"Women's Political Cmte"
"American Assn for Justice"
"National Air Traffic Controllers Assn"
"International Assn of Fire Fighters"
"Intl Brotherhood of Electrical Workers"
"Ironworkers Union"
"PAC to the Future"
"BRIDGE PAC"
"National Education Assn"
"American Society of Anesthesiologists"
"Blue Dog PAC"
"United Food & Commercial Workers Union"
"USAA"
"Service Employees International Union"
"American Federation of Teachers"
"Carpenters & Joiners Union"
"Competitive Edge PAC"
"New York Life Insurance"

OpenSecrets list of contributors

Mostly these look like Democrat PACs that exist for little purpose but to fund Democrats (and freeloading "consultants", which include property mgmt. firms), a bunch of aerospace/defense and the usual assortment of unions. Notably, EMILY's List is a pro-choice lobby group and the number two funder to Giffords, a blue dog. Giffords also appears closely connected to Lewis and Roca LLP, which funds her directly and through at least one of those PACs. The notable absence is the "dirty industries" like coal, uranium etc., and banks (NY Life Ins. is there, though).

In what is probably a far cry, Lewis and Roca represents the UFC, which was back in the '90s on John McCain's shitlist b/c it was (not really) taking away viewership from boxing matches sponsored by Anheuser Busch, you know, the firm that filled his wife's trust funds.

But still, this is the usual mix of corporate nonsense and "New Democrat" Blue Dogism. Sarah Palin's website may have literally targeted Giffords, but beyond that and the abortion angle, Giffords wasn't exactly Bernie Sanders.

[DoYouEverWonder]

It is being reported that he had built a shrine in his back yard. Pics & info here:

ny daily news - shrine in backyard

LOL. That one's a joke compared to the ones you can find in half the houses in Little Havana.

[Pele'sDaughter]

fwiw, there are Hollywood connections to Giffords and the little girl. Via Perez Hilton.

The congresswoman, who had been holding a meeting with constituents when the attack began, is actually a cousin of Gwyneth Paltrow's, though the two have never met. In light of her kin still being in critical condition this morning, Gwyneth released this statement:

"Although I have never had the pleasure of meeting congresswoman Giffords, my thoughts and prayers are with her and her family as well as the other victims of this horrible act of senseless violence."

Another actress who lost a family member in the shooting is One Tree Hill star Sophia Bush. Her nine-year-old cousin, Christina Taylor, was shot and killed during the rampage. Sophia took to her Twitter to express her grief, sharing:

"Devastating. There are no words to explain what my cousin's family is going through in Arizona…How can this be? Violence is never the answer…If you know anyone who is struggling, please reach out to them. No one should feel so alone that they resort to senseless violence…"

[brainpanhandler]

I just can't figure out what sort of politics would lead someone to assassinate Giffords and strike

It's probably emblematic of the times that's it's not clear at all, but people, for purposes that say more about them than loughner, not least of which is a desire for simplicity, will try to cram him into some sort of pigeohole.

[happenstance]

Kinda makes me wonder about the metaphysical contention that we all create this reality via a decoding of information through our consciousnesses...

I don't think it would be too controversial to suggest that we are embedded actors in an imagined landscape: this collective narrative is a participatory project, an occult language with a grammatical and syntactical structure that recapitulates the ontological themes which are the motivating mythologies of every tragedy and comedy.

We acquire a fluency in this language through our shared suffering with other actors, whose dialog interrupts our solipsistic reverie with insistent demands for the next lines in the drama. If the whole thing seems eerily and unsettlingly reminiscent of some vaguely remembered something just beyond conscious recollection, it's not a coincidence we're feeling the curious vertigo of deja vu. Synchronicity is the clever plot device used to signal the organization of the narrative around several recurring, archetypal motifs. The decoding of these themes is the principal occupation of those who have become conscious of their roles as actors in an imagined landscape. Other players have resorted to a rigorous form of method acting called amnesia. They require subtle techniques of assistance, as waking them up too suddenly often produces violent reactions of disorientation and fear.

We're seeing a lot of disorientation and fear these days.

Nicely said!

"Synchronicities are the jokers in nature's pack of cards for they refuse to play by the rules and offer a hint that, in our quest for certainty about the universe, we have ignored some vital clues." F.David Peat, physicist

[dbcooper41]

http://www.wral.com/business/story/8911916/

By JACQUES BILLEAUD, Associated Press
PHOENIX — A 22-year-old man described as a social outcast with wild beliefs
steeped in mistrust faces a federal court hearing Monday on charges he tried to
assassinate Rep. Gabrielle Giffords in a Tucson shooting rampage that left six
people dead.
A military official in Washington said the Army rejected Jared Loughner in 2008
because he failed a drug test. The official spoke on condition of anonymity
because privacy laws prevent the military from disclosing such information about
an individual's application.
The official did not know what type of drug was detected.
Public defenders are asking that the attorney who defended Oklahoma City bombing
conspirator Timothy McVeigh and "Unabomber" Ted Kaczynski defend Loughner, who
makes his first court appearance Monday at 2 p.m. MST (4 p.m. EST).Loughner is charged with one count of attempted assassination of a member of
Congress, two counts of killing an employee of the federal government and two
counts of attempting to kill a federal employee. More charges are expected.
Police say he has not been cooperating with investigators.
The hearing in Phoenix comes just a few hours after President Barack Obama,
standing with first lady Michelle Obama on the White House South Lawn, presided
over a national moment of silence for Giffords and the other victims. Obama said
the nation is still shocked and grieving. The White House said Obama called
Giffords' husband Mark Kelly — an astronaut — and the family of Christina Taylor
Green, a 9-year-old girl killed.
Flight controllers in Houston fell silent as Kelly's twin brother Scott,
commander of the International Space Station, spoke via radio from space,
leading NASA in a moment of silence.
"As I look out the window, I see a very beautiful planet that seems very
inviting and peaceful," he said. "Unfortunately, it is not."
"We're better than this. We must do better."
Giffords, a conservative Democrat re-elected in November, faced threats and
heckling over her support for immigration reform and her office was vandalized
the day the House, including Giffords, approved the landmark health care
measure.
It was not clear whether those issues motivated the shooter.
The day before Giffords was shot, the congresswoman sent an e-mail to a friend
in Kentucky discussing how to "tone our rhetoric and partisanship down."
In the message, obtained by The Associated Press, the Democratic congresswoman
on Friday congratulated Republican Secretary of State Trey Grayson on his new
position at Harvard University.
She wrote: "After you get settled, I would love to talk about what we can do to
promote centrism and moderation. I am one of only 12 Dems left in a GOP district
(the only woman) and think that we need to figure out how to tone our rhetoric
and partisanship down."
In Tucson, about a half dozen people gathered outside Giffords' hospital during
the moment of silence. Giffords, 40, remained in intensive care.
On Sunday and Monday, Giffords was able to respond to a verbal command by
raising two fingers with her left hand.
"When she did that, we were having a party in there," Dr. Peter Rhee said. And
even while sedated, she has reached for her breathing tube. That's a purposeful
movement. That's a great thing."
Giffords met Loughner at least, at an event three years ago when he asked a
question.
Authorities weren't saying where Loughner was being held, and officials were
working to appoint an attorney for him.
The federal public defender in Arizona has called on San Diego attorney Judy
Clarke, a former federal public defender who served on teams that defended
McVeigh, a coconspirator in the 1995 Oklahoma bombing and other high profile
cases.
"Given the gravity of the charges, the possibility of the death penalty and our
discussions with the U.S. attorney's office, we believe that death-qualified
counsel must be appointed," said Federal Public Defender Jon Sands. All the
attorneys in the Phoenix federal defenders office either declined to take the
case or had a conflict, he said.Prosecutors allege Loughner scrawled on an envelope the words "my assassination"
and "Giffords" sometime before he took a cab to a shopping center where the
congresswoman was meeting with constituents Saturday morning. Police said he
purchased the Glock pistol used in the attack at Sportsman's Warehouse in Tucson
in November.
Comments from friends and former classmates bolstered by Loughner's own Internet
postings have painted a picture of a social outcast with almost indecipherable
beliefs steeped in mistrust and paranoia.
"If you call me a terrorist then the argument to call me a terrorist is Ad
hominem," he wrote Dec. 15 in a wide-ranging posting.
The six killed included U.S. District Judge John Roll, 63; the third grader,
Christina Taylor Green, 9; Giffords aide Gabe Zimmerman, 30; Dorothy Morris, 76;
Dorwin Stoddard, 76; and Phyllis Schneck, 79. Of those injured, eight are still
hospitalized. One is in critical condition, five are in serious condition, and
two are in good condition.
The girl killed was featured in a book called "Faces of Hope" that chronicled
one baby from each state born on Sept. 11, 2001. Recently elected to student
council, she went to the event because of her interest in government.
Amanda Stinnett, a parent who got teary upon seeing a memorial outside the
girl's Tucson school, said her two kids sometimes played together.
"My youngest said, 'She was so nice Mommy. She always let me play with her,'"
Stinnett said.
At the same time, she said Christina seemed mature for her age and with a sharp
vocabulary.
"It seemed like she was a grown adult."
___
Associated Press writers Pauline Arrillaga, Justin Pritchard, Terry Tang in
Tucson, and Marco Sibaja in Brasilia, Brazil, Anne Flaherty in Washington
contributed to this report.

[fruhmenschen]

see link

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.c ... _event.php

[8bitagent]

Looks like Loguhner is giving the smug, silent Mcveigh treatment in court and with authorities:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40997616/ns ... nd_courts/

[Simulist]

see link

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.c ... _event.php

From that link:

So why does Roll's reason for attending the event -- which ultimately ended in his death -- matter? Because under federal law, the murder or attempted murder of a U.S. official is only considered a federal crime if committed while the official is engaged in or on account of the performance of official duties.

If one focuses only upon the single statute linked to in that quote, then perhaps yes. But aren't there numerous other ways that murder can be construed as a "federal crime" under other statutes?

I'm pretty sure there are.

[The Consul]

Wait a minute are you saying that the city of Tuscon derives from the shookson/Cuk Ṣon story cycle of the Pima people that involves a hero murdered by public consent?

I HAVE to see a link to that.

http://www.everyculture.com/North-America/Pima-Papago-Religion-and-Expressive-Culture.html

[Canadian_watcher]

see link

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.c ... _event.php

From that link:

So why does Roll's reason for attending the event -- which ultimately ended in his death -- matter? Because under federal law, the murder or attempted murder of a U.S. official is only considered a federal crime if committed while the official is engaged in or on account of the performance of official duties.

If one focuses only upon the single statute linked to in that quote, then perhaps yes. But aren't there numerous other ways that murder can be construed as a "federal crime" under other statutes?

I'm pretty sure there are.

and here I thought that the writer of that article was going to get at it being the difference between 1st & 2nd degree, since if he Judge Roll was scheduled to be there then the case could be made for premeditation, whereas if Judge Roll stopped by for buns on a whim, there could be no such forethought ie assassination.