The silence is deafening.

by **israelirealities** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 4:39 am

:-) I am not in total panic over the kabbalist's prediction yesterday, but I do believe that if many people entertain a scenario in their minds, they might actually bring it about... <blockquote>Quote:<hr>wherever you go, there are people already there<hr></blockquote> :-)) I think this document I brought up here is important to see how things were in fact decided back then, and who were the proponents of the zIonist movement, and how similar this letter looks to things that can be written today, if you only replace England with USA. You can also see how ZIonism itself could have indirectly given an ideological impetus to what happened to the jews in the next world war. Anyway, the UK was only trying to keep its hold on the region, and the rest is history. I also think this analysis by montagu turned out to be very realistic, as indeed this has become a large ghetto. As I said earlier I am less concerned with the kind of masonic/reptilian/illuminati/Jewish/Satanist/ZIonist legend than you, perhaps I am underestimating something which is in fact huge. I am more concernd, naturally with the quality of rulings we get lately from our high court of justice, and now I might attribute it to the architechture and the "evil eye" embodied therein. Never thought of it this way :-). Also, from this entire article by Makow (btw it is a very common Jewish name here), is the part about the 1950 x-ray scandal, which gradually appear to be an American military experiment, from what the association of the victims of this atrocity have been able to dig up, they even found the records in the US corporation that manufactures the x-ray machines that were used. But their case is always being pushed aside here, the Knesset, our parliament enacted a special universal compensation act for it only 40 years after the fact, but still refuses to conduct a hearing on the real story behind this large scale x-ray event. Maybe you have some information on this experiments. It started in Morrocco, post WW2, and then for lack of cooperation there, the US military found the new immigrants from Morrocco to Israel as suitable replacement. -------- As for masonic conspiracies, rest assure there are similar stories here, and in fact a few years ago an important local newspaper ran an article about the masons lodge in Tel Aviv implying that all the "who is who" in israeli economy are members doing all kinds of rituals, and not letting women in the order, and closing all their financial little dirty deals during their twisted funny rituals. I see their building, in Tel Aviv sometimes, I can't say I am very happy with it, there is bad aura coming out of it...when rich males gather for rituals..nothing good can come out of it. ----------------- I don't have huge ideas about israel, I think everything has already been said about it. i was just bitching about the priorites. Namely, if you take the Makow article as a good case study, he writes all this crap, but in the end of it he points to a very important story that is being covered up by Israeli government. This further serves to obscure the only worth while issue in his messed up pile of crap. I think this reflects my frustration in general. Now the ISraeli government will say - see, those Morroccan survivors "trouble makers" in ISrael are giving ammunition to Makow. Another reason not to tell the truth about this major league scam and burry the victims further down to their graves without justice. Who benefits ? ------------------------ One can delve deep into myth and legends, and it is tempting these days. All I'm saying is let's just stick to reality and present day issues, and address the suffering. I am very happy there are people like you who although not Jewish, you realise that the greatest falacy is in depicting a large group as depersonalized, dehumanized, "similar" people. This misconception is espoused both by antisemites AND our nationalists. getting a little into heavy theology, I think some roots of this problem lies in the religious problems between Christianity and Judaism. Can't brush away the fact that the division is rooted in a very problematic story. Philosophically, the challenge of individualism (by Jesus) to the collective nature of Judaic practice, continues to be relevant, except it takes a "secularized, national" form. (Martin Buber had a lot to say about it). There has not been an honest attempt to discuss the deep issues around Jesus and that whole messy conflict. Nothing of that sort is present in the Jewish Moslem dialogue, which is why I think the problems here between Jews/Moslems can be resolved, whereas the west-christian world...dunno...as long as most of the people there go to church and read the new testament...how can they think anything else about Jews ? one has to be honest about it. its an "issue" even if one is totally secular. - as to political platforms...I'll have to stay with it a bit longer to come up with something useful without repeating what's already known and chewed to death.

by **israelirealities** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 4:42 am

last <blockquote>Quote:<hr>The fact that the Jews are so often met with opposition and repression in so many countries suggests that I might have taken up the zionist cause myself...<hr></blockquote> I think this is a bad idea to solve problems this way. And reality shows that creating a place for all those "problem people" does not solve it, its one global villlage anyway, and it really doesn't matter where people are located. has Israel solved the problem of not liking jews ? no. perhaps it made it a little worse. the old saying, you can run but you can't hide, or is it the other way around ?

by **Dreams End** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 4:50 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>This further serves to obscure the only worth while issue in his messed up pile of crap.<hr></blockquote> Ding ding ding. THAT is exactly the problem...and I think it is intentional much of the time. If you let your secrets out on disreputable forums, then when those secrets get discovered by more reputable folks, it's too late. And this is why I keep harping on this. Well, that and hating fascists. We must use discernment in choosing what information to accept and act on. If someone is so knowledgeable that they can pick out b.s. from truth on a given site, then why do they need that site in the first place?

by **anotherdrew** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 4:51 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>dreams end: "I'm hoping from you for some basic ideas of what a reform movement in Israel might look like. Who are the "good guys" in your estimation."<hr></blockquote> <a href="http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en">the Good Guys</a> - In my opinion. <blockquote>Quote:<hr> Sharon carries out more assassinations and pours more oil on the flames. Mofaz declares that peace talks with the Palestinians should be held only "in the next generation". He has time. We have not. Because in the meantime hatred and despair accumulate, the killing and destruction continue. The Labor Party lends its total support to the government, which could not survive without it. Peres and the other Labor ministers share full responsibility for the approaching disaster. The Labor Party must take the fateful decision: to leave the government immediately! -Gush Shalom ad published in Ha'aretz, November 4, 2005<hr></blockquote> <a href="http://www.jewishvoiceforpeace.org/">and another place</a> Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=anotherdrew>anotherdrew</A> at: 11/8/05 2:00 am

by **israelirealities** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 5:04 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>If you let your secrets out on disreputable forums, then when those secrets get discovered by more reputable folks, it's too late. And this is why I keep harping on this.<hr></blockquote> ah, I agree with that. but then, no reputable forum will deal with most of the darker issues in my country. Let's not get into it, because it will feed right into the already existing notion of "world domination" :-)) Isn't it always like that ? what is your suggestion, then. This is YOUR home field. what is a reputable, yet uncensored (out of fear, of course) forum ? not only in the web, but generally? I will follow any suggestion you have and bow.

by **Dreams End** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 5:32 am

Good question. I had a long post somewhere about how I go about determining that. Basically the first thing I look for is whether the info is sourced or not. If it's anonymous sources, etc, I give it no credibility unless the poster has a track record. my favorite source is the person I'm looking into. I'd far rather quote Heinberg on Heinberg or Dugin on Dugin. Still run the danger of quoting out of context. Govt docs when available are good. Sometimes paper trails lead further than you'd think. Often I'm left with a string of hints but not definitive proof. There are other things...too lazy to look for that post. However, I'm simply amazed at how many folks will repeat things that they saw posted somewhere with no sourcing whatsoever. For the longest time, I simply assumed the Illuminati were COMPLETELY fictional, for example, simply because no site I read up till that point ever botherd to SOURCE any allegation about them. Why do people not get bothered by that. I also look for language and themes that ring bells as disinfo. I knew that was Makow before I checked on it, for example. Ah...late. bed. Why don't you post links to Israeli news you find reputable.

by **israelirealities** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 6:10 am

POint taken. Still i want to be extra clear. Suppose there is a group in Israel dealing with the x ray experiments, and since they don't get fair hearing in ISrael, certainly not msm, they are going to the websites abroad, place it there. Comes Makow and says "aha, here is good trash for me" and cites it. Come DE, tells this group of walking dead survivors in ISrael, don't place this in makow;s website, he is disreputable. ..etc. etc. What would be a good place for them to bring up the issue ? here? ----- as for links to reputable sources in Israel. Since israeli msm is as controlled as yours, i hardly recommend it, although for general news and to know what's going on mainstreamwise, its a good source, especially www.haaretz.com (english edition). The are no "alternative" news sources as you have in the USA, regrefully. there are some ok alternative websites, with some news and investigative features. they are all in Hebrew, and they will never have the money to run a bilingual service. its very very expensive. Sometimes I post here bits of news from semi alternative news-sites, and you will have to trust my translations, or not. One site I use, www.news-israel.net, a horrible person running it, but he is very very reliable (and you have to bear with his numerous spelling mistakes, bad hebrew, and arrogance). There are "theme" websites, and I gave a list early when I joined this board, to all known left wing English websites. (women, children, minorities, peace, refuseniks human rights, west bank etc.). Backtalks are major news source in Israel, that's the only place people can anonymously publish cover ups and hushed info, but then - 1/ its in hebrew.2/source anonymous. 3/youd really have to be an Israeli to understand the subtleties and the hints, it is almost "coded" FYO to ISraelis. but you can try the backtalks in Haaretz.com (english) there is a sizable group of ISraelis abroad who respond. So if you read an article on an issue you are interested in (say, Booms over gaza) and the website opened the article for backtalks, you can get some glimpse into the alternative news source for ISraelis. However, perhaps www.haaretz.com is a paid service for IP's outside israel, I don't know. Its' free here, but not sure as to abroad users. You also have www.ynet.co.il (*look for ENglish icon), this is THE mainstream news service for ISrael, BUT again, if you have the time read the backtalks. among the garbage and foul language, you can get worthy information which will never appear formally. In my Hebrew blog, I sometimes do this work for my readers, I copy paste a news article and copy paste a very important backtalk with information. Sometimes when there is a financial scandal, employees from the investigated corporation would backtalk and "tell stuff" they would not otherwise tell anyone. etc. Generally, we don't have boards and websites like this one. Only ones remotely similar in terms of "subversion" come from the far right (www.rotter.net), and they sometimes have "scoops" but only those that support their party line. It is in Hebrew. good dreams, Dreams End Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=israelirealities@rigorousintuition>israelirealities</A> at: 11/8/05 3:17 am

by **israelirealities** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 11:38 am

You seem to have a valid claim against the situation in Israel/Palestine, but you kind of lose me with the Ben Gurion mystical interpretation. He was just a despotic practical politician, I don't think he was prophecizing or had any "secret knowledge' of the future. I am quite sure he also hated Rothchild, as these people alway fight over power, and he didn't look favorably on any Jew who was not already here digging new roads and speaking fluent Hebrew, Rothchild included. I think you fail to realize the Jews, and Israelis too, are just a regular fucked up nation (a bit more so, but not the way you mean). Attributing supernatural powers to Ben Gurion is something he really didn't earn. Perhaps Rothchild is also a sorcerer, frankly I don't have a clue which Rothchild you are referring to (its a large family ?) and who they are, besides their big money business. As for Jews benefitting from "NWO' more than others, now if I get you correct, you are saying that , right ? who are those "Jews" who will benefit..not me, for sure, I am at the bottom of the food chain here, and the majority are like me, or at least a majority, and so we join hands with the rest of the world in exposing any rich people's plan to turn us all to slaves or organs for their cosmetic operations. You have to get it straight there, Rothchild does not invite me over to dinner, and he will gladly send me to arbeit macht frei for him, as he will do to you. Case closed with this "Jewish thing". there are Jews among "them", maybe more than their numeric proportions, but that's that. It actually makes it more likely that they will abuse their fellows first, at least there is more accessibility...and be sure they do. That's the last time I am dispelling obvious projections on me, as part of those "Jews". Ben gurion, btw has gradually turned here from a reverred founding father to the epitome of tyranny. Eventually, even us, the ISraelis, wake up, usually rather late.

by **Dreams End** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 11:47 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr> Still i want to be extra clear. Suppose there is a group in Israel dealing with the x ray experiments, and since they don't get fair hearing in ISrael, certainly not msm, they are going to the websites abroad, place it there. Comes Makow and says "aha, here is good trash for me" and cites it. Come DE, tells this group of walking dead survivors in ISrael, don't place this in makow;s website, he is disreputable. ..etc. etc. What would be a good place for them to bring up the issue ? here?<hr></blockquote> No time to read all. But come on, IR, this isn't hard. If the x-ray stuff is true but the rest of Makow is false, how do you KNOW the x-ray story is true. Simple, you must have some other source or you wouldn't be able to make that claim. So don't cite Makow, cite the source that told you that this piece of the Makow article was true. If you DON'T have other outside info that something like that is true, then wait till you get it, because Makow is not to be trusted.

by **israelirealities** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 11:52 am

Oh, the X ray story is old news in ISrael, and practically not contested. I was just wondering : 1/ how it got to the makow website.2/ if this is in fact a smart move on behalf of the Israel activists who know this is annoy the government and Jewish organizations in the USA. I am just saying, try to look at the Makow maneover from an Israeli standpoint (I know you can;t) he is not all bad...one needs a place to dump stuff that government is covering up and make some NOISE. Its not "nice" but then who cares.

by **eric144** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 11:52 am

My simple message was that Ben Gurion had exactly the same picture of the NWO I do. I don't care where he got his information from (I'm sure it wasn't remotely mystical). The Rothschild dynasty continues with its current faces. I have no idea how the world is actually run but I strongly suspect it is, that's what conspiracy theory is about. I read something simlilar a while ago concerning Jerusalem being the NWO capital, it makes a lot of sense what with Islam, Christianity and Judaism focussed there. It is also a symbol of division and conflict (and the healing therof by the NWO). "As for Jews benefitting from "NWO' more than others, now if I get you correct, you are saying that , right ? who are those "Jews" who will benefit..not me, for sure" No, I just suspect that there is major Jewish (financial) influence in the world and like other people, they're tribal. But it's also the old Abraham story and the division (Jew/Arab) then the division into Christianity that makes this compelling . Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=eric144>eric144</A> at: 11/8/05 8:57 am

The silence is deafening.

Re: I think I'll step into this

Re: I think I'll step into this

Re: I think I'll step into this

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Re: bottom line, and important too

Re: bottom line, and important too

Re: bottom line, and important too

Re: eric

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Re: x Ray

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