Aurora CO Theater Massacre

[Hunter]

So after a string of shootings in Democrat-held districts, including the murder of a Democrat activist, we have a giant skinhead named Floyd Lee who's obsessed with Nietzsche and weightlifting and attended the Grace Brethren Christian School for his primary and secondary education, stroll into the DC office of the Colorado-based Dominionist cult the FRC (founded by the man who wants fathers to shower with their sons) with a Chick-Fil-A bag in hand and shoot a black security guard in the arm. The leader of the FRC promptly accuses the SPLC of inspiring the crime (which I find ironic and hilarious, given that the SPLC accuses any two people to the right of Barney Frank of being a "hate group") and the right wing media goes into a state of apoplexy.

Yeah, none of this is fishy at all.

UPDATE: Remember that College Station shooter, who miraculously happened to shoot a passing Democratic activist in a hotly contested district? Well, guess where Ashley Todd -she of the faked Obama kinfe attack is from? College Station, TX. http://austinist.com/2008/10/24/college_station_mccain_worker_fakes.php

Good call, Mr Knowles. I really wish I could put my finger on what exactly is going on and what the purpose of these shootings are. Other than what we discussed the other day, an attempt to increase gun sales and flood the country with guns getting more and more of them in to the hands of the unhinged righties, I really cant make sense of it, but that theory seems to be the best one yet and it does make a lot of sense when you couple that with all the rhetoric coming from right wing radio about race wars, gays poisoning society and whites getting the shaft from immigrants and other minorities, it really seems there are plans in place to start some sort of civil/cultural war and those with the most guns will be left standing, in this case the religious right and NRA types.


Let me ask you this (or anyone for that matter) I noticed you (CLK) mentioned you didnt really believe in Manchurian Candidates and I am not entirely sure I do either, at least in the popular, hollywood sense of it. So, if these people are not mind controlled Manchurians as such, how would whoever is behind this get them to commit these crimes? I guess if they were to find a mentally ill person it wouldnt take too much to set them up as a patsy or even a shooter, someone like Holmes for example, but I am just having a hard time understanding how this would work especially for the ones who dont kill themselves as it cannot be easy to get someone to do this knowing they will then spend the rest of their lives in prison and also they would seem to pose a risk to their handlers if they were to talk later.


So, I ask, how do you see this type of thing playing out, how do they recruit and convince people to do these are in fact manufactured events and how do they later prevent those people from talking an fingering their handlers/programmers?


I am very familiar with MKUltra and all of that and I have a solid understanding of what mind control is and what they are capable of doing with it, but never having experienced anything like that myself or seen or known anyone under the influence of it, it is very hard for me to wrap my mind around it so hearing others explain how they thing this works, how these people are turned in to mass shooters and assassins, is always helpful and interesting and I would appreciate any comments wrt that from any of you here on RI.


One final question for you, CLK, I know you have said on your blog that you try and not draw conclusions until you have all the facts at your disposal, but given what you do have at the moment do you think Holmes was the shooter or was he just a patsy covering for another shooter or shooters who escaped in the midst of all the chaos afterwards? Personally I think Holmes was involved in some neuroscience experiments at that school (we know the family who supports that program financially has shady ties for example) and he was somehow turned in to a patsy due to this. Its like the Unabomber, we know he was used in mind control experiments while in college at Harvard and many researches now believe this played a big role in what he became.

[justdrew]

I am getting REALLY sick of watching these wingnuts lie from malice or ignorance about the so-called "Fast and Furious scandal" - can they not read OR think? Jones panders while building his media empire, JUST LIKE A PREACHER, his own 700clubfoot. Have you seen the "nightly news" he produces? Mostly an hour long infomercial for products (maybe perfectly fine products, but whatever).

and yes, I totally suspect the FRC shooter of being a plant. very possible, they had their talking points all ready to go

[justdrew]

I really wish I could put my finger on what exactly is going on and what the purpose of these shootings are.

standard reich-wing mode of operation...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strategy_of_tension

[Hunter]

I am getting REALLY sick of watching these wingnuts lie from malice or ignorance about the so-called "Fast and Furious scandal" - can they not read OR think? Jones panders while building his media empire, JUST LIKE A PREACHER, his own 700clubfoot. Have you seen the "nightly news" he produces? Mostly an hour long infomercial for products (maybe perfectly fine products, but whatever).

and yes, I totally suspect the FRC shooter of being a plant. very possible, they had their talking points all ready to go

I have some very close connections to Fast and Furious and know just about everything about the case, would you mind telling me what lies they are telling, I have no doubt you are correct but I am just curious what you are hearing since that case is an area of interest for me.


Also what is FRC, excuse my ignorance.

[Hunter]

I am also very confused about the FRC shooting, was the shooter a right winger and is the FRC leftist, and what is the significance of the Chick-fila bag and how does the SPLC fit in to this whole thing, they are leftist so how could they possibly inspire a sright wingnut to shoot this place up?

Can anyone connect the dots here for me, thanks in advance!

[justdrew]

I am getting REALLY sick of watching these wingnuts lie from malice or ignorance about the so-called "Fast and Furious scandal" - can they not read OR think? Jones panders while building his media empire, JUST LIKE A PREACHER, his own 700clubfoot. Have you seen the "nightly news" he produces? Mostly an hour long infomercial for products (maybe perfectly fine products, but whatever).

and yes, I totally suspect the FRC shooter of being a plant. very possible, they had their talking points all ready to go

I have some very close connections to Fast and Furious and know just about everything about the case, would you mind telling me what lies they are telling, I have no doubt you are correct but I am just curious what you are hearing since that case is an area of interest for me.


Also what is FRC, excuse my ignorance.

FRC = family research council

ok, quick synopsis

the Feds somehow notice that a lot of guns are being bought in arizona and shipped to Mexico for the gangs

they setup a group of people to go after them

the higher-up 'lead prosecutors' who we're 'taking the lead' looked at the law in arizona and decided they never had cause to bring charges, no law seemed to be being broken. Sure people without the financial means we're buying guns and immediately reselling to gangsters who'd spotted them the money in the first place, but somehow the Lead Federal Prosecutors never felt there was a chargeable offense

some of the people on the task force were themselves 'loose cannons' primarily the "whistle blower" who came forward. He came up with a scheme on his own to buys some guns and track them back into mexico. In actuality, he did NOTHING and let the guns he was supposed to be tracking "get lost" - this was his own 'plan' and had not been approved by his boss. When it came to light, he was going to get in trouble, then decided to run and be a fake whistle-blower. When in fact he's the most criminal member of the task force and probably should go to jail yesterday. but now the republican clowns are protecting him more or less.

Now one area I'm a bit confused about, I guess there was an earlier event years before this lead by the ATF(?) that wanted to put radio trackers in guns and follow them to the gangs in mexico, except the trackers had limited range and short battery life and it was a bad idiotic joke. I think that was Fast and Furious 1 and we're now on Fast and Furious 2. but event 1 had gone down everyones memory hole.

[CLK]

Let me ask you this (or anyone for that matter) I noticed you (CLK) mentioned you didnt really believe in Manchurian Candidates and I am not entirely sure I do either, at least in the popular, hollywood sense of it. So, if these people are not mind controlled Manchurians as such, how would whoever is behind this get them to commit these crimes? I guess if they were to find a mentally ill person it wouldnt take too much to set them up as a patsy or even a shooter, someone like Holmes for example, but I am just having a hard time understanding how this would work especially for the ones who dont kill themselves as it cannot be easy to get someone to do this knowing they will then spend the rest of their lives in prison and also they would seem to pose a risk to their handlers if they were to talk later.

Great questions, Al- let me address them as best I can.

First of all, let's remember where the whole Manchurian Candidate explanation comes from and who trots it out after every mass shooting- it comes from the radical right, specifically the militant wing of the gun lobby. It started with calls for gun control following the assassination of RFK in 1968. So, people need to be more discerning about where this propaganda comes from and whose agenda they are furthering by endorsing it. If you're a radical rightist, fine- just be upfront about it.

Secondly, where does it come from, the motivation to commit these crimes? How about a massive infrastructure of incendiary political propaganda spouting apocalyptic scare stories to marginal personalities already indoctrinated their entire lives in Fundamentalist churches? How about a four-decade strong program of conditioning to identify partisan political ends with "God's Will", bolstered by tens of thousands of radio stations and TV channels and "churches" and millions of websites?

This isn't new technology- this are the same techniques perfected by the Assassins back in the Middle Ages. Dying for the "glory of God" is a lot better than living as some loser in a trailer park. The idea of a patsy is connected to political hits- establishing plausible deniability a la Oswald. In these cases looking for patsies seems like a copout to me.

Laughner won't get the chair and will probably thrive in prison. Holmes may well plead insanity, end up in a "hospital" where he'll be quietly transferred to some facility where he can continue with his work once he's been pumped full of drugs.

So, I ask, how do you see this type of thing playing out, how do they recruit and convince people to do these are in fact manufactured events and how do they later prevent those people from talking an fingering their handlers/programmers?

I have no idea, really. I just see patterns that are hard to deny and that the so-called alternative media is either too chickenshit or too compromised to point out. It's possible that the closer we get to the election I think we'll see some of this taken on a more explicitly racial angle.

One final question for you, CLK, I know you have said on your blog that you try and not draw conclusions until you have all the facts at your disposal, but given what you do have at the moment do you think Holmes was the shooter or was he just a patsy covering for another shooter or shooters who escaped in the midst of all the chaos afterwards? Personally I think Holmes was involved in some neuroscience experiments at that school (we know the family who supports that program financially has shady ties for example) and he was somehow turned in to a patsy due to this. Its like the Unabomber, we know he was used in mind control experiments while in college at Harvard and many researches now believe this played a big role in what he became.

Well, again- this is all conjecture on my part. Cast your deepest suspicion on anyone who claims to speak authoritatively on these cases.

Holmes might have been the fall guy (a la Sirhan), but I don't know if I buy the patsy angle. Two different functions here. A fall guy is a participant who is set up to take all the heat while the co-conspirators skate. But as I said, people don't realize that Neuroscience is bad news. It tends to attract marginal personalities and seems hellbent on scrambling everyone's circuits. So that might have been why he was targeted for recruitment for an op. The cryptofascists run and hide when you point out the Anschutz connection and No Braine Mustaine is still dribbling out the already debunked lie about the UN gun bill.

But at the same time I often wonder if conspiracy is a more comforting alternative to the idea of a total nutcase with a lot of money and a genius IQ who gets the idea he needs to start killing a lot of people (gee, sounds like Christopher Nolan's Batman, no?). If there's a conspiracy, we can find those responsible and take them out. If Holmes is another Amy Bishop- which for me is still on the table- then we're really screwed. The other unemployed Jokers with millionaire's arsenals tend to militate against that possibility but it can't be discounted.

I grew up in the 70s when various intelligence agencies were using terrorist groups and "lone nuts" in Europe to achieve political aims. So I wouldn't be surprised if what we're seeing this summer is a repeat of that, with this Bubba Lee Nietzsche and his Chik-Fil-A bag as a bad red herring.

[Hunter]

I am getting REALLY sick of watching these wingnuts lie from malice or ignorance about the so-called "Fast and Furious scandal" - can they not read OR think? Jones panders while building his media empire, JUST LIKE A PREACHER, his own 700clubfoot. Have you seen the "nightly news" he produces? Mostly an hour long infomercial for products (maybe perfectly fine products, but whatever).

and yes, I totally suspect the FRC shooter of being a plant. very possible, they had their talking points all ready to go

I have some very close connections to Fast and Furious and know just about everything about the case, would you mind telling me what lies they are telling, I have no doubt you are correct but I am just curious what you are hearing since that case is an area of interest for me.


Also what is FRC, excuse my ignorance.

FRC = family research council

ok, quick synopsis

the Feds somehow notice that a lot of guns are being bought in arizona and shipped to Mexico for the gangs

they setup a group of people to go after them

the higher-up 'lead prosecutors' who we're 'taking the lead' looked at the law in arizona and decided they never had cause to bring charges, no law seemed to be being broken. Sure people without the financial means we're buying guns and immediately reselling to gangsters who'd spotted them the money in the first place, but somehow the Lead Federal Prosecutors never felt there was a chargeable offense

some of the people on the task force were themselves 'loose cannons' primarily the "whistle blower" who came forward. He came up with a scheme on his own to buys some guns and track them back into mexico. In actuality, he did NOTHING and let the guns he was supposed to be tracking "get lost" - this was his own 'plan' and had not been approved by his boss. When it came to light, he was going to get in trouble, then decided to run and be a fake whistle-blower. When in fact he's the most criminal member of the task force and probably should go to jail yesterday. but now the republican clowns are protecting him more or less.

Now one area I'm a bit confused about, I guess there was an earlier event years before this lead by the ATF(?) that wanted to put radio trackers in guns and follow them to the gangs in mexico, except the trackers had limited range and short battery life and it was a bad idiotic joke. I think that was Fast and Furious 1 and we're now on Fast and Furious 2. but event 1 had gone down everyones memory hole.

Yea that sums it up well, they had originally planned to arrest the buyers immediately before he guns got across the border but as you say they supposedly couldnt find a law that would allow that so someone decided instead to let the guns go through to Mexico and they would then follow the buyers hoping they would lead LE to the cartel leadership, but that never happened for some reason we still dont know why or who dropped the ball there, it should have been easy to track those guns right to the hands of the cartel leaders because we had informants all over the place on both sides of the border watching this all go down.

THEN when the guns started showing up at crime scenes used for murder of thousands of people, the shit started to hit the fan and then became a political nightmare when it was proven that one of the guns was used in a border region desert shootout between an AZ LEO and some drug smugglers and the AZ LEO was killed, the gun that killed him was traced directly to Fast and Furious buyers.

The big question of course is who made the decision to let the guns go through to Mexico in an attempt to get to the cartel leadership, no one wants to take responsibility for that and some say it was Holder, he says it wasnt him and he had no idea this was all taking place. As with everything like this, we will never know the truth but this was a much bigger scandal than the media made it out to be even though they did make it out to be a pretty big deal it goes even deeper than they let on, thousands and thousands of people were murdered with those guns and it allowed one particular cartel to pretty much take over large areas of Mexico that it didnt control prior.

I think there is evidence that we knowingly armed and have been arming Los Zetas cartel for a long time, most of them are ex Mexican military and LEO and were in fact trained here in the US on our military bases before they left the military and LE and joined the cartel. So I think this was all part of our own government's attempt to take over and control a large swath of the Mexican drug business using Los Zetas to do it by training and arming them so that they would be technologically superior and have better paramilitary training and fire power than the other cartels. My research has shown over the years that there is a direct connection between Us government and Los Zetas and Fast and Furious was a big part of this that has no been covered up because they almost got exposed.

[Freitag]

My research has shown over the years that there is a direct connection between Us government and Los Zetas

US Court Documents Claim Sinaloa “Cartel” Is Protected by US Government

[Hunter]

My research has shown over the years that there is a direct connection between Us government and Los Zetas

US Court Documents Claim Sinaloa “Cartel” Is Protected by US Government

Yeap that doesnt surprise, I kind of thought it was Los Zetas since we trained most of them when they were Mexican military and LE but it would make sense that since they left the military and LE and joined the cartels and are using our training and weapons against us that we would now arm their biggest and most feared rival Sinaola in an attempt to clean up the Los Zetas mess we created, as I said in the other thread it is becoming more and more clear from the way this is all being handled that a huge coverup is taking place wrt F and F and it was indeed a deliberate arming of at least one cartel maybe more.


None of this should be a surprise to anyone as this is exactly how we handle foreign affairs the world over, we will arm and provide financial aid to any leader or group that is willing to do what we tell them, it doesnt matter if they are a facist or communist tyrant of a dictator, if they will do what we tell them to do we will give them whatever they want and the minute they stop doing what we ask we will then arm and give money to their opposition to take them down. Happened with Noriega, Saddam, Chavez, Castro and countless others over the decades, all over south and central america, the middle east, Africa and Asia, we have been propping up dictators and arming them and then propping up their opposition and arming them when the other guy isnt cooperating anymore to our satisfaction. So it may be that we have been arming and supporting Los Zetas, which I have found evidence for over the years, and they have perhaps fallen out of favor for some reason and now F and F was started to arm and support their bitter rival Sinaola. That is how we do business.

[8bitagent]

Sooooooooooooooooooooooo....

Why isn't the GOP demanding inquiries into Obama's mass murders in Pakistan???

Normally I am all for shit being flung at the US government, but I am also against false accusations and charges. I don't know enough about FAF to make a statement.
Other that, if these were Islamic terrorists blowing up and killing masses amounts of people in Mexico...we wouldn't hear the end of it.

[82_28]

Well we wouldn't hear the end of it because it's our free-for-all cheap, easy to get to, tropical vacation grounds -- that being Mexico. But I too suspect, it's all the same globalized "shadowy" forces doing it all everywhere. Planet Earth is a veritable Disneyland for false assed flagged shit. Whether true flagged or falsely, it gets flagged and gets used to exercise authority.

[compared2what?]

And here's another fact about the Holmes shooting. Not only are the judge and DA both Republican apparatchiks, but the US Rep of that district is a major enemy of the gun lobby.

UPDATE: Put away the Ouija boards and the secret decoder rings for the time being- just like Tucson, Aurora is represented by a Democrat on the gun lobby's hit list:

Perlmutter, a moderate Democrat who represents Colorado's 7th District, was elected to Congress in 2006. During the hard-fought Democratic primary, he ran ads against rival Peggy Lamm, a former state representative, that accused her of ties to the Republican gun lobby.

Although Aurora was recently named one of the safest cities in America, the issue of gun control resonates there. Aurora is less than 20 miles from the site of the Columbine High School shootings, which left 13 people dead in 1999.

Before the 2006 primary, Perlmutter campaigned with the father of a victim of the Columbine massacre. Tom Mauser, whose son Daniel was among a dozen students killed, said he supported the former state senator because Perlmutter promised to work to revive the assault weapons ban that expired in 2004. The Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence also endorsed Perlmutter.

Let's also remember the close links between the NeoNazi underground, the conspiracy media and the Religious Right hierarchy, which is HQ'd in Colorado and runs the school Holmes attended via the Anschutz family. Remember also that the Religious Right agenda started immediately after MK Ultra ended its experimental phase.

Here's a list of questions I raised on the post that Red Ice Creations refused to link to. Let me just say that I don't pretend to present any of this anything but pointed speculation. But I don't see why the only conspiracy theories that are allowed to be circulated are those that bolster the power of the Extreme Right.

So; who benefits most of all from mass shootings? The gun lobby.

FWIW, though, I kind of wonder (a) how much of a make-or-break swing-vote issue a politician's stance on guns really is in the 7th Congressional District of Colorado; and (b) whether any electorate anywhere would really be fickle enough on that particular issue to make the gun lobby's murdering people in order to win an election worth the investment, politically speaking.

Because, I mean, they'd have to be pretty damn sure that plan would work, I'd imagine. There might be some risks attached to it.

______________

Also FWIW -- and the ad itself is priceless, btw -- the GOP challenger in that race is Joe Coors.



So. He's not a beer. That's definite.

But....I don't know. I'm not really familiar enough with the political landscape out there for this to be able to say whether or not he looks like a candidate to whom a district traumatized in the wake of a mass shooting would flock, I guess. He doesn't look like one to me, though. Also, it looks like jobs/economy are topping the list of voter concerns.

^^Pretty safe bet, I suppose. However, again, I actually totally don't know.

__________________

WELCOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



I'm TOTALLY with you in spirit, btw.

You see, there are real conspiracies. And by acting like a irrational, kneejerk hysteric, people like Republican Party agent provocateur Alex Jones are discrediting the serious investigation of these crimes.

Couldn't agree more. "Or worse," you could even say.

They are useful idiots for the real conspirators.

Ditto.

Cheers.

[compared2what?]

Sooooooooooooooooooooooo....

Why isn't the GOP demanding inquiries into Obama's mass murders in Pakistan???

Because it's actually the party that benefits the most directly from equating American patriotism with endless, savage, bloodthirsty military aggression in the service of U.S. imperial interests?

Because it's therefore also actually the party that made doing stuff like that into a contemporary political necessity?

Because it doesn't want to risk creating a popular non-partisan demand for such inquiries?

Because, while calling them "Obama's mass murders" for propaganda purposes, it doesn't really think of them that way, in light of his having inherited both the policy and practice of using drones in Pakistan from Bush?

Because drawing attention to the subject would make it even more obvious than it already is that the chief reason drone strikes in Pakistan have increased under Obama's administration is that he got stuck with several raging wars on which GOP policy had not only already wasted too much of the country's blood and treasure but also too much of the country's international stature for there to be any good options remaining?

I don't know. I guess I give up.

Normally I am all for shit being flung at the US government, but I am also against false accusations and charges.

Me too. I don't follow, though. Who's falsely accusing whom of what bogus charges?

[2012 Countdown]

This has been made...


Published on Aug 15, 2012 by LordDefiler
For those who do not believe the story we are being told by the government and media. The James Holmes Conspiracy. Several witness testimonies, news reports, theories and ideas behind the motives of the crime. Topics discussed include the second suspect, weapons, police audio analysis, James Holmes education and bio, LIBOR scandal, MK Ultra, Project Gunrunner, and several other important elements. Several new pieces of evidence and testimonies all in one video.

Documentary made by Mark Howitt http://www.youtube.com/lorddefiler
Video published on August 14th 2012

The James Holmes Conspiracy (2012 Full Documentary)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qk6OOvgj ... r_embedded