"Big Bamboozle" 9/11 Truth Author And Family Found Dead

[FourthBase]

There's plenty of perfectly rational reasons to think perhaps Gary Webb actually committed suicide. And multiple head wounds in suicides, though rare, do happen. I realize that's a sliver of sacrilege around here, and I may not even fully want to believe it myself, but I don't disqualify Hopsicker for that perspective.

1) I do not disqualify Hopsicker. His research is not disqualified by what I did.

2) Which was simply return to him the same contempt he supposedly has for anyone who might look at the evidence and context of Webb's death and claim (how does Hopsicker even define "claim"?) it was more than mere suicide. I called him a cocksucker for that, for glibly waving away the possibility of Marshall's death being more than mere suicide with horseshit reasoning (including the ludicrous presumption that he knows how well the rest of the 9/11 author world sleeps and why, and the always-despicable re-framing of normal human distress into some foreboding harbinger of extreme violence), for a generally dismissive approach to both men's deaths that might as well be that of a sellout debunker. You claimed he had said "almost the identical thing" as I did about the possibility of Webb being methodically gaslighted to death, actively driven to suicide. No. Hopsicker's version of the "buzzsaw" only provides for a journalist losing his job and credibility, and then the rest is just a proverbial downward spiral. Nowhere does Hopsicker dwell on or even imply the possibility of anything more direct or extensive than that. Never mind the other possibilities. Webb could have been presented an unthinkable ultimatum in the weeks leading up. The letters could have been written and mailed at gunpoint. The gun could've been fired by someone else. But no, according to Hopsicker, you are contemptible if you don't think Webb simply offed himself. It's Hopsicker who isn't setting the bar correctly there, not me.

[divideandconquer]

I don't know if Danny Casalaro and/or Gary Webb would be considered Bush biographers but someone wrote:

Four Bush biographers, Mark Lombardi, J.H. Hatfield, Danny Casalaro, and now Gary Webb—all “suicide” victims. What are the odds all of these people actually committing suicide?

… Examining the male U.S. suicide rate for recent years, we can extrapolate a conservative estimate of 17 male suicides per 100,000 people, or 0.017%. The odds of 4 specific, male biographers committing suicide would be the 4th power of 17/100000, or 8.3521 4.913 x 10^-17… roughly 1 chance 10,000,000,000,000,000. About as good a definition of impossible as you can get. A person would stand a better chance of playing the Canadian lottery 6/49 exactly twice in one’s lifetime and winning ther grand jackpot BOTH TIMES! (That is, picking 6 numbers out of 49 possible numbers and matching all 6 numbers out of 6 random draws, on 2 separate occasions, and having only purchased two Canadian lottery tickets ever.) This calculation should be regarded as a conservative estimate: the actual odds against such a “coincidence” would be much greater. For example, if any of the biographers were female, the odds would be even greater.

Now that Bush has his “mandate,” we will probably see other critics fall victim to accidents and suicides. Crime families usually deal harshly with their enemies—and so does the CIA.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/political- ... y-webb/304

[FourthBase]

I don't know if Danny Casalaro and/or Gary Webb would be considered Bush biographers but someone wrote:

Four Bush biographers, Mark Lombardi, J.H. Hatfield, Danny Casalaro, and now Gary Webb—all “suicide” victims. What are the odds all of these people actually committing suicide?

… Examining the male U.S. suicide rate for recent years, we can extrapolate a conservative estimate of 17 male suicides per 100,000 people, or 0.017%. The odds of 4 specific, male biographers committing suicide would be the 4th power of 17/100000, or 8.3521 4.913 x 10^-17… roughly 1 chance 10,000,000,000,000,000. About as good a definition of impossible as you can get. A person would stand a better chance of playing the Canadian lottery 6/49 exactly twice in one’s lifetime and winning ther grand jackpot BOTH TIMES! (That is, picking 6 numbers out of 49 possible numbers and matching all 6 numbers out of 6 random draws, on 2 separate occasions, and having only purchased two Canadian lottery tickets ever.) This calculation should be regarded as a conservative estimate: the actual odds against such a “coincidence” would be much greater. For example, if any of the biographers were female, the odds would be even greater.

Now that Bush has his “mandate,” we will probably see other critics fall victim to accidents and suicides. Crime families usually deal harshly with their enemies—and so does the CIA.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/political- ... y-webb/304

Yep. How's that for ugly math.

[barracuda]

I'll take Daniel Hopsicker over Kurt Nimmo and Wayne Madsen any day of the week. And Phillip Marshall to boot.

[bks]

Hatfield almost certainly committed suicide. Mark Schone's piece is fairly definitive, IMO.

You certainly can't imagine Mark Schone's "Unfortunate Con" not finding a home in a magazine culture that cared anything about good nonfiction writing. It's a long, fascinating and sad piece about James H. Hatfield, the Arkansas writer who claimed to have uncovered witnesses who told him a sympathetic Texas judge had quashed George W. Bush's arrest for cocaine possession. When Hatfield's criminal past came to light, and when nothing in his story checked out, his Bush bio, "Fortunate Son," was pulled by St. Martin's Press. Hatfield ended up killing himself shortly after the book was reissued by Soft Skull Press.

Rolling Stone, which commissioned the piece, was apparently disappointed that Schone disproved the conspiracy theories that suggested Hatfield was murdered by dark GOP forces. Editors told Schone the piece was too long and too "depressing." Schone sums up the situation faced by writers like him, as well as the decline of a once-great magazine: "In an era when 'hot' lists are feature articles, and Hollywood publicists pick cover shots, there just aren't that many major magazines around that will assign a story like this one, much less publish it."

http://www.salon.com/books/review/2004/07/26/killed

[JackRiddler]

I'll take Daniel Hopsicker over Kurt Nimmo and Wayne Madsen any day of the week. And Phillip Marshall to boot.

I'd not take any of those three (never read Marshall yet), period. Nimmo, have barely read. The main difference between Madsen and Hopsicker at this point is that Madsen's a touch older, and thus further degenerated. Hopsicker did some great early post-9/11 work in getting on the trail of Atta and digging up Dekkers, Hilliard, etc. Then he fucked it to hell with artificial constructs of his own, like the "Assassination of George Bush," as baseless as anything he's ever attacked as a "conspiracy theory." Basically, it's reporting if he says it and a "conspiracy theory" if someone else does. He engaged in character assassinations entirely worthy of a Madsen or a Barrett. If he decides something, he will not shrink from sophistry and rhetorical war. Even if he's occasionally right about something, fuck him.

[FourthBase]

Hatfield almost certainly committed suicide. Mark Schone's piece is fairly definitive, IMO.

You certainly can't imagine Mark Schone's "Unfortunate Con" not finding a home in a magazine culture that cared anything about good nonfiction writing. It's a long, fascinating and sad piece about James H. Hatfield, the Arkansas writer who claimed to have uncovered witnesses who told him a sympathetic Texas judge had quashed George W. Bush's arrest for cocaine possession. When Hatfield's criminal past came to light, and when nothing in his story checked out, his Bush bio, "Fortunate Son," was pulled by St. Martin's Press. Hatfield ended up killing himself shortly after the book was reissued by Soft Skull Press.

Rolling Stone, which commissioned the piece, was apparently disappointed that Schone disproved the conspiracy theories that suggested Hatfield was murdered by dark GOP forces. Editors told Schone the piece was too long and too "depressing." Schone sums up the situation faced by writers like him, as well as the decline of a once-great magazine: "In an era when 'hot' lists are feature articles, and Hollywood publicists pick cover shots, there just aren't that many major magazines around that will assign a story like this one, much less publish it."

http://www.salon.com/books/review/2004/07/26/killed

Again though, there are ways of actively driving people to kill themselves, or forcing people to kill themselves. If all anyone is looking for is another set of fingerprints on a gun, or a suspicious toxicology report, etc., then that gives the Sick-fuck-ocracy free reign to do just that. Obviously, gaslighting and ultimatums and such are not only hard to prove but could be almost impossible to detect from a distance, even if that distance is a matter of feet, within the same house. Obviously, they're the kind of things that could be speculated about, without recourse to falsification, forever, even in instances where people really do just throw in the towel for good by themselves, unprovoked. (My dual reaction to those instances: a - Poor thing, such a sad shame, b - Idiot, stupid selfish idiot!) But there might be ways to detect such a circumstance, circumstantially. By listening closely to close friends, by trying to add up and subtract the various excuses given as motivation, by estimating the likelihood that someone had touched a third rail of dangerous truth, by generally sizing up the person's character and research, comparing what can be known about someone to what's being claimed they've done. In that way, to me, the official Marshall narrative stinks, and fails.

[Jerky]

Unfortunately, for those of us with long memories, the idea of Wayne Madsden making it all up out of whole cloth is entirely too probable. Far more probably than I'd wish it to be.

Not passing judgement on the Marshall case, here. Just on Madsden's track record.

Jerky

[Jerky]

It behooves us to ponder upon the reality of these horrific facts every once in a while.

Thank you, StarmanSkye. It was about time to refresh our collective memories.

Jerky

Wot Da FuGG?

Hopsicker is basicly saying the Criminal Syndicate Gummint doesn't HAVE to -and so doesn't- murder troublesome prying-where-they-shouldn't-stick-their-noses Journalists because they are FAR too-easily discreditted & their careers demolished in an instant should they be too stubborn & refuse to back-down, tone-down or 'spin' their stories?

-And that's WHY he doesn't believe Marshall, or by extension Webb, Hunter -Gonzo- Thompson, or JFK-assassination reporter Dorothy Kilgallen, among undoubted other rigorous newspeople couldn't POSSIBLY have killed-themselves or died by unnatural causes/murder.

But when he suggests he scorns anyone who disagrees with him, he's taking his own belief far too strongly. I simply don't know why he'd even bother to weigh-in unless its damage-control - or to insure his own survival. There are SCORES of loosely affiliated, semi-independant agancies & corporations w/ military/Intel associations & little if any direct 'gov' oversight that are likely motivated & capable of eliminating 'inconvenient' truth-tellers. Whose Hopsicker kidding?

If 'they' kill witnesses & people who know too much, from JFK and thru the Clinton & Bush Inc Body Counts, why WOULDN'T they kill journalists & writers?

In 2005, there were many thousands of suspicious deaths of occupation-protestors attributed to US-trained Iraqi Wolf Brigade, modeled after hard-right Death Squads in El Salvador - including Journalists & news/media-people who were critical of the occupation, shot 'accidently' by US Troops. Some 70,000 people in El Salvador were murdered by US-trained paramilitary forces simply for having 'leftist' sympathsies & not being enthusiastic supporters of the brutal military regime.

[FourthBase]

If 'they' kill witnesses & people who know too much, from JFK and thru the Clinton & Bush Inc Body Counts, why WOULDN'T they kill journalists & writers?

Not in any way to bolster Hopsicker's shallow, shitty take on Marshall and Webb, but...
Check out my posts from several pages back.

Kill too many, kill the wrong ones, too obviously, and you risk erecting a "Look Here!" sign, which would defeat the whole nefarious point. Of course, the risk drops when you can bank on even "maverick" conspiracy theorists like Hopsicker to shrug and say, "What sign?" And there's hardly any risk at all when you kill practically-invisible brown people halfway across the earth, no matter how many, or when you take out a journalist in a laughably-convenient arena of plausible deniability like a fucking war zone.

[divideandconquer]

There must be a correlation between high suicide rates and telling the truth, whether you are a journalist, a scientist, a computer genius, etc, because the suicide rate amongst these occupations, when linked to certain events, is far beyond the realm of any statistical probability. Actually, the correlation is between premature death and telling the truth because not all conveniently commit suicide...some, linked to certain events, just die prematurely.

[FourthBase]

There must be a correlation between high suicide rates and telling the truth, whether you are a journalist, a scientist, a computer genius, etc, because the suicide rate amongst these occupations, when linked to certain events, is far beyond the realm of any statistical probability. Actually, the correlation is between premature death and telling the truth because not all conveniently commit suicide...some, linked to certain events, just die prematurely.

That'd make quite a morbid Onion article.

Scientists discover link between truth and suicide, insist nothing to see.

CAMBRIDGE - In a breakthrough that may lead to a re-examination of hundreds of deaths officially categorized as suicides, researchers at Harvard's Institute for Unusual Statistics have discovered a shocking connection between committing suicide and investigating political taboos related to the military-industrial complex. Startling connections were also found between such investigations and airplane crashes, car crashes, long falls off tall buildings, hunting accidents, premature cardiac arrests, fatal food poisoning, drug overdoses, and drownings. When phoned for comment at his Somerville home, lead researcher William Stevens excitedly replied, "What?! Who is this?! Look, I told you already we set fire to our hard drives!! What more do you monsters...oh, who? Nevermind. I never talked to you." Among fellow statisticians, news of the groundbreaking discovery led to speculation about a possible Nobel Prize for...Hello? Yes. What? Who...okay...okay. Understood. There is nothing to see here. Move along. I never wrote this.

[divideandconquer]

That'd make quite a morbid Onion article.

Scientists discover link between truth and suicide, insist nothing to see.

CAMBRIDGE - In a breakthrough that may lead to a re-examination of hundreds of deaths officially categorized as suicides, researchers at Harvard's Institute for Unusual Statistics have discovered a shocking connection between committing suicide and investigating political taboos related to the military-industrial complex. Startling connections were also found between such investigations and airplane crashes, car crashes, long falls off tall buildings, hunting accidents, premature cardiac arrests, fatal food poisoning, drug overdoses, and drownings. When phoned for comment at his Somerville home, lead researcher William Stevens excitedly replied, "What?! Who is this?! Look, I told you already we set fire to our hard drives!! What more do you monsters...oh, who? Nevermind. I never talked to you." Among fellow statisticians, news of the groundbreaking discovery led to speculation about a possible Nobel Prize for...Hello? Yes. What? Who...okay...okay. Understood. There is nothing to see here. Move along. I never wrote this.

[Nordic]

Hopsicker just doesn't want to end up one of the dead ones.

Let's not forget all the dead microbiologists of the last 14 years or so.

And as far as the "they can discredit and ruin careers", well sure, they did that to Gary Webb years before he finally had to STFU due to the 2 gunshots to his head. It's hard to shut a good man up, but that's how you do it.

This Marshall guy, well now he's discredited AND dead. Family killer, you know, nobody reads below that label.

[FourthBase]

Hopsicker just doesn't want to end up one of the dead ones.

Let's not forget all the dead microbiologists of the last 14 years or so.

And as far as the "they can discredit and ruin careers", well sure, they did that to Gary Webb years before he finally had to STFU due to the 2 gunshots to his head. It's hard to shut a good man up, but that's how you do it.

This Marshall guy, well now he's discredited AND dead. Family killer, you know, nobody reads below that label.

Which might suggest that not only did he have to be quieted, not only did he have to be physically eliminated, but he had to be terminally discredited. Which might suggest that not only was he barking up a very right tree, not only did he spot something super-sensitive in the branches, but he had already caught whatever it was and already presented it in his mouth for all the world to see. In other words, they couldn't just scare him, they couldn't just kill him, they couldn't even merely discredit him, they had to discredit his books that were already or about to be published. Now that they will be perceived forever by anyone from the general public who happens upon Marshall's name, as books written by a deranged family killer...mission accomplished. Or. Not. Because to those wise to this possibility, it only amps up the wattage on that "Look Here! This Guy Found Something Big!" sign.