Challenger Disaster

[BrandonD]

(found no info after a search)

Were there any sinister elements behind the Challenger disaster?

I really have no idea one way or the other, really the only element of the disaster that raises an eyebrow is the "spectacle" of it, it was a huge hollywood-type explosion in midair. It seems that if this incident was sabotage intended to condition society in one direction or another, a huge visual spectacle would be required to create the emotional trauma and suggestibility.

So I wonder, was any credible evidence ever found to suggest sabotage? Or was it ultimately just a genuine mechanical/electronic malfunction?

[8bitagent]

Challenger/Columbia. Going up/going down. 1986/2003. I remember being kind of scarred watching the Challenger blow up live on tv in class.

Its funny, was just thinking about the Challenger cuz of this new animated short about Mcnair

[82_28]

I'll tell you one thing. It is the singular date apparently we're all meant to face and remember "where we were" for our generation. School forces certainly spared no time in rolling out the AV equipment and gathering the children in order to watch the explosion over and over again all together. I don't think we actually knew what the fuck we were seeing come to think of it. It was fantastical and was surreal. I remember the real buzz about it was that Christa McAuliffe was on it. The first TEACHER IN SPACE!!! I also think that it fell within a time of seeing a shit ton of space explosions FOR FUN in the "pictures" -- movies. The most realistic shit that we'd, ANYBODY, had ever seen happen in space was at long last actually believable through the combination of Industry, Light and Magic. Oh, ILM.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teacher_in_Space_Project

I'm not going all "Hugh" here. But I remember it as being a something I was told to take seriously (indeed I did) but I think that I totally chalked it up as a ten year old as another Star Wars battle type shit upon first pass.

Interesting question and something I've not considered before.

Off to think. . .

[82_28]

Here's something.

This was well before the Internet and was also well before the advent of any kind of regular "cellphone" communication -- possibly even "speed dial". The only computers we knew were Apple IIes in our "computer labs" and our Atari 2600's at home. How did the news get out so quick that we were all virtually, everyone I've ever met of my age, got some TV rolled in at the moment? They ushered us into hallways and maybe the gym so we could all see the meager offerings of elementary school AV equipment in all of it's glory. I had to go to the principal's office quite a bit and I don't ever remember seeing a TV. Yet suddenly, the world knew. My ridiculous side says this was a far reaching psyop. My not so ridiculous side says -- could be!!!

[8bitagent]

I'll tell you one thing. It is the singular date apparently we're all meant to face and remember "where we were" for our generation. School forces certainly spared no time in rolling out the AV equipment and gathering the children in order to watch the explosion over and over again all together. I don't think we actually knew what the fuck we were seeing come to think of it. It was fantastical and was surreal. I remember the real buzz about it was that Christa McAuliffe was on it. The first TEACHER IN SPACE!!! I also think that it fell within a time of seeing a shit ton of space explosions FOR FUN in the "pictures" -- movies. The most realistic shit that we'd, ANYBODY, had ever seen happen in space was at long last actually believable through the combination of Industry, Light and Magic. Oh, ILM.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teacher_in_Space_Project

I'm not going all "Hugh" here. But I remember it as being a something I was told to take seriously (indeed I did) but I think that I totally chalked it up as a ten year old as another Star Wars battle type shit upon first pass.

Interesting question and something I've not considered before.

Off to think. . .

I certainly don't think I can recall a bigger deal about a tv being carted into class for a live broadcast before that. I just in retrospect can't think about Challenger without pairing it with the Columbia.
But yeah 1986, I was in 4th grade. HUGE deal made about the teacher in space thing

[8bitagent]

Here's something.

This was well before the Internet and was also well before the advent of any kind of regular "cellphone" communication -- possibly even "speed dial". The only computers we knew were Apple IIes in our "computer labs" and our Atari 2600's at home. How did the news get out so quick that we were all virtually, everyone I've ever met of my age, got some TV rolled in at the moment? They ushered us into hallways and maybe the gym so we could all see the meager offerings of elementary school AV equipment in all of it's glory. I had to go to the principal's office quite a bit and I don't ever remember seeing a TV. Yet suddenly, the world knew. My ridiculous side says this was a far reaching psyop. My not so ridiculous side says -- could be!!!

You know, I didn't think anything was wrong. At first. I had seen the thrusters disembark before and thought maybe that was it. That's why some of us weren't in shock.

If you were an 80's kid, Challenger was our 9/11

[Nordic]

People listened to the radio a lot more back then. I was driving through Denver, following my roommate back to our house for some reason, when he pulled up next to me at a red light and frantically motioned for me to roll down the window. He shouted it over to me and told me to turn on the radio.

I think I decided to not become any kind of photojournalist when the media was oh-so-happy to show the faces of McAuliffe's parents as they watched their daughter get blown to smithereens. Fuck that. That should have been a private moment, nobody should have watched that unthinkable grief unfold on someone's face.

What got me about the one in two thousand three was that it seemed a particularly grim omen for Bush and his plans. It even streaked across Texas as it disintegrated. Turned out it most certainly WAS one hell of an omen.

[Ben D]

(found no info after a search)

Were there any sinister elements behind the Challenger disaster?

I really have no idea one way or the other, really the only element of the disaster that raises an eyebrow is the "spectacle" of it, it was a huge hollywood-type explosion in midair. It seems that if this incident was sabotage intended to condition society in one direction or another, a huge visual spectacle would be required to create the emotional trauma and suggestibility.

So I wonder, was any credible evidence ever found to suggest sabotage? Or was it ultimately just a genuine mechanical/electronic malfunction?

Not sabotage that I am aware of...just greed...I've met Steve Agee personally here in Australia in 1992 where the FBI had arranged his stay wrt his ongoing protection as he had received credible death threats in US...

http://www.nytimes.com/1988/09/14/us/2-more-engineers-sue-shuttle-rocket-maker.html

I met Steven Agee in my capacity at the time as a committee member of the NSS Qld Chapter, where he was interested to contribute if he could. One of our sponsors, a law firm, organized the meet and there were security personal present whom I presumed were there for Steve. He didn't go into details except to say that the death threat was a result of his involvement in the Challenger disaster investigation. I never saw him again.

[82_28]

Nice of you to drop by my school and say hi, Nordic. You could have PMed or something and we could have set a meet up time. We could have gone sledding or played with my Castle Greyskull.

Yeah, the radio. I just don't know where someone in my school would have been listening to the radio at the time it happened. Obviously someone was, but the suddenness of breaking out the few TVs modern schools had in those days is kind of strange looking back on it. We were still watching reel to reel documentaries back then, projected upon the roll down white screen (what are those called?).

[kelley]

the space program is fraught with assumptions and expectations across generational lines. the morning of the challenger explosion i was in a university classroom, and remember my teacher walking in visibly upset with the news. he was devastated. my reaction was like, great-- this 'disaster' will make the reagan-bush militarization of space a little more difficult to implement.

many of the engineers at NASA knew something like the disaster was inevitable. i think steve agee was one of them? but there were others, including bill mcinnis, who resigned his post in 1984, and those at the contractor who'd built the rocket boosters and decided to sue in the wake of the explosion. richard feynman demonstrated the technical failures that led to the explosion in his comments before the presidential commission convened to investigate challenger's demise, done with a breathtaking simplicity and elegance that exposed the political stupidity at the core of the shuttle program. unqualified representatives in congress had been making decisions best left to qualified professionals. there wasn't really anything sinister or nefarious about challenger blowing up, other than the typical greed and avarice endemic to large bureaucracies with competing agendas. what a shock.

[InfraGard]

Were there any sinister elements behind the Challenger disaster?

In a word .. RonnieRaygun

Not so much sinister as political expedience. There was intense political pressure on NASA to launch in spite of less than ideal conditions for launch. Namely the frigid temps wreaked havoc with the infamous O-rings. With that in mind NASA decided to launch anyway because there was pressure from the White House since Reagan had Christa McAuliffe as a major talking point in his SOTU speech that night.

[zangtang]

my understanding is that the only sinister aspects relate entirely to (huge) commercial (and Pentagon) pressures re the shuttle (and nasa's) viability and credibility as a satellite delivery system - up to and including much nailbiting over pre-booked launch windows, schedules for contract delivery etc.

the Columbia thing, i fear/suspect....mebe whole differnt story

[8bitagent]

I would say syncs, even if discovered years later, are a large part of game changing events regardless if there was any actual conspiracy.

I still think space is interesting. Loved seeing Gravity in 3D IMAX. People applauded Obama for shutting down the space program(which I assume is now going to be even more black budget military projects now)
but Im thinking, long as Uncle Sam is wasting billions on space and not blowing up people, what's the harm? I'm sure a whole generation of kids were inspired by seeing a man land on the moon
(still not convinced of any of the moon landing theories)

[8bitagent]

What got me about the one in two thousand three was that it seemed a particularly grim omen for Bush and his plans.

definitely. especially the scattering over Texas(and people then selling debris on ebay)

[kelley]

Long as Uncle Sam is wasting billions on space and not blowing up people, what's the harm? I'm sure a whole generation of kids were inspired by seeing a man land on the moon.

the shuttle program was DoD's trojan horse for the militarization of space. in the early '70s, contractors at GE and elsewhere were building prototypical flight simulators and writing algorithms for artificial vision and robotics architecture that would ostensibly become key parts of the shuttle mission, yet that research was also integral in the development of smart guidance systems and the unmanned drone tech of today. only a cretin wouldn't marvel at a man on the moon, but everything comes with a price.