Who Parked The Moon?

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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby BrandonD » Sun Oct 05, 2014 9:57 am

Ben D » Sat Oct 04, 2014 10:38 pm wrote:I have explained before, my own daughter was taken in by the moon hoax meme and so I have learnt first hand, how, once people have seen it on TV, video, etc., the true reality is blurred and the hoax reality emerges as the new truth.....and has a life of its own....good luck with that!


Seeing that you call the official story the "true reality", it seems clear that you've already formed a conclusion. I'm fine with that.

I haven't formed a conclusion, the subject for me is a grey area with strong indications of deception in some manner. In exactly what manner, I don't know. But as I said, if I could magically see the truth and the official story was totally true, I wouldn't bat an eyelash. There are any number of possible scenarios.

I'm simply leaving the possibility on the table, something that conventional society as well as "serious conspiracy people" find highly objectionable. Does this mean that I've been swallowed up by the "hoax reality"?
"One measures a circle, beginning anywhere." -Charles Fort
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby thrulookingglass » Mon Oct 06, 2014 12:51 pm

A super-moon, blood moon, lunar eclipse is due to occur in the northern hemisphere on the morning of Wednesday, Oct. 8th. This is an extremely rare celestial event, almost a statistical impossibility from what I read. Moreover, this has NEVER occurred at the start of Hebrew Sukkot, Christian feast of the Tabbernacle.
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby NeonLX » Mon Oct 06, 2014 4:12 pm

thrulookingglass » Mon Oct 06, 2014 11:51 am wrote:A super-moon, blood moon, lunar eclipse is due to occur in the northern hemisphere on the morning of Wednesday, Oct. 8th. This is an extremely rare celestial event, almost a statistical impossibility from what I read. Moreover, this has NEVER occurred at the start of Hebrew Sukkot, Christian feast of the Tabbernacle.


I can say, with absolute certainty, that the sky will be overcast where I live during the morning of October 8.

*Absolute* certainty.
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby BrandonD » Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:16 pm

NeonLX » Mon Oct 06, 2014 3:12 pm wrote:
I can say, with absolute certainty, that the sky will be overcast where I live during the morning of October 8.

*Absolute* certainty.


Do you live in Seattle? Or London maybe?
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby Belligerent Savant » Tue Oct 07, 2014 12:32 am




So, in sum, the above link essentially breaks down NASA's claim that the following technological 'breakthroughs' and/or innovations that were CRUCIAL to the success of the reported moon landings over 40 years ago, namely:

- Implementation of an operational Heat Shield for the Command Module

- Successful Re-entry into the Earth’s Atmosphere and subsequent safe landing (within close proximity of targeted landing zone)

- Minimizing/neutralizing radiation levels beyond Low-Earth Orbit

- Successful Landing and Take-off from the Lunar Surface

- Resolving structural vibrations inherent with the Heavy-Launch Rocket

[to paraphrase a response found on the 2nd page of the above link]
A) no longer exists B) can't be relied upon C) can't be reproduced D) can't be reverse-engineered E) can't be retro-fitted so as to be enabled to better handle new problems, and F) can't even be utilized as a prelim template to create new, improved versions.

Right.

Perhaps they simply never existed (or were never successfully resolved).... or is that too bold of a leap to take?


Add to this the laughable narrative some time ago --- also discussed in these forums -- about how NASA somehow LOST all the data/intel related to Moon Landing research/technology. Silly Gov't -- it can be so inept at times! I mean, they were caught with their 'pants down' on 911...how difficult can it be to fathom that some govt clerk adhering to standard policy related to routine data retention/destruction of legacy content inadvertently destroyed ALL RECORDS (AND ANY BACKUPS) related to the moon landing??
Last edited by Belligerent Savant on Tue Oct 07, 2014 12:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby Sounder » Tue Oct 07, 2014 5:05 am

I once asked some questions of a skeptical nature to a NASA engineer, the husband of our daycare provider.

This was a rather straitlaced fellow, and he replied that he was on the assembly team for the lunar module and that he did not understand the functions or operation of the parts he was putting together. (And he should have.)

On another moon hoax thread it was suggested that on launch day a paper was circulated around the NASA command center saying that the moon shot was a hoax.

If true, that paper must have been approved by higher ups.

So I tend to speculate that we went to the moon but did it using tech that has not been approved for public consumption.

A good way to hide exotic tech would be to push the meme that we do not have the ability to get to the moon at all.

All data points then fit and NASA has its cake and gets to eat it too.
All these things will continue as long as coercion remains a central element of our mentality.
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby Ben D » Tue Oct 07, 2014 6:22 am

BrandonD » Sun Oct 05, 2014 11:57 pm wrote:I'm simply leaving the possibility on the table, something that conventional society as well as "serious conspiracy people" find highly objectionable. Does this mean that I've been swallowed up by the "hoax reality"?

Imo.....yes...but hey, who really cares about the Apollo program anymore, the world's moved on since then and there are now numerous new manned moon landing programs in the pipeline, so you of the generation who were born after Apollo will not miss out on your turn. For we space enthusiasts, the maturing space age is an exciting time....and all things considered, it has unfolded as fast as could reasonably be expected given the economic/political systems in place at the beginning.

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There is That which was not born, nor created, nor evolved. If it were not so, there would never be any refuge from being born, or created, or evolving. That is the end of suffering. That is God**.

** or Nirvana, Allah, Brahman, Tao, etc...
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby Sounder » Tue Oct 07, 2014 8:14 am

either/or rules (the blood red moon)
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby elfismiles » Tue Oct 07, 2014 10:19 am

The radiation claim of the moon-landing-hoax believers seemed convincing to me ... here is NASA's response to that...

The Deadly Van Allen Belts?
http://spacemath.gsfc.nasa.gov/Algebra1/3Page7.pdf

4. Some people believe that the Apollo moon landings were a hoax because astronauts would have been instantly killed in the radiation belts.
According to the US Occupation Safety and Health Agency (OSHA) a lethal radiation dosage is 300 Rads in one hour. What is your answer to the 'moon landing hoax' believers?

Note: According to radiation dosimeters carried by Apollo astronauts, their total dosage for the entire trip to the moon and return was not more than 2 Rads over 6 days

The total dosage for the trip is only 11.4 Rads in 52.8 minutes. Because 52.8 minutes is equal to 0.88 hours, his is equal to a dosage of 11.4 Rads / 0.88 hours = 13 Rads in one hour, which is well below the 300 Rads in one hour that is considered to be lethal.

Also, this radiation exposure would be for an astronaut outside the spacecraft during the transit through the belts. The radiation shielding inside the spacecraft cuts down the 13 Rads/hour exposure so that it is completely harmless.


... but what I tend to believe is that the Military Industrial PsyOps Complex would NOT have risked the potential first-timer mis-steps that could have occurred without already having done it a few times before.

But this is just a feeling and by no ways an absolute in my mind. :coolshades
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby Belligerent Savant » Tue Oct 07, 2014 12:13 pm

.

Interesting link. To be clear, I personally don't have a strong opinion on what may have actually occurred out there during the late 60s/early 70s. It can be any variation of A) Human moon landings occurred more or less exactly as publicly displayed, B) Human landings on the moon never actually occurred at all, or C) Human moon landings did occur, but not nearly as depicted to the populace, likely due to certain advanced technologies that couldn't be disclosed for undisclosed reasons, or prior 'moon landing programs' already in place which may include lunar bases and/or interactions with Alien races to discuss the latest intergalactic gossip, etc --- one's imagination can run wild with the possible speculations here.

I lean towards option B, though given limited intel on what's actually going on beyond our atmosphere, an iteration of Option C can't be ruled out either.

Re: acceptable levels of radiation, below is an excerpt from Chump's link that appears to directly contradict the blurb taken from the 'spacemath.gsfc.nasa' link:

Radiation beyond Low-Earth Orbit

Regarding the radiation limits for travelling beyond LEO, ‘NASA relies on external guidance from the National Academy of Sciences and the National Council on Radiation Protection and Measurements (NCRP) for establishing dose limits. Due to the lack of data and knowledge, the NAS and NCRP recommended that radiation limits for exploration missions could not be determined until new science data and knowledge [were] obtained.’ (Arch. Study, 2005 p.109)

The next year, in swift response to NASA's request, the NCRP produced a report with a title to puzzle an unprepared reader: Information Needed to Make Radiation Protection Recommendations for Space Missions Beyond Low-Earth Orbit (NCRP, 2006). By this, the NAS admits that there is no substantial information available on cosmic radiation beyond LEO, including data on lunar surface radiation, despite the alleged achievements of Apollo.

The Augustine Committee quotes another report, this time from the National Research Council (NRC, 2008), which largely confirms the problem: 'Lack of knowledge about the biological effects of and responses to space radiation is the single most important factor limiting the prediction of radiation risk associated with human space exploration.' (Augustine, 2009, p.100)

The National Academy of Sciences needed some raw information just to be able to start working on those recommendations. Of course, some data should have been readily available to the American scientific community over the 40 years since the Apollo program.

Common sense tells us that information regarding radiation effects on the Moon, if such information exists at all, should be available within NASA, but from the Committee’s report, it is clear that NASA does not have it either. This is an incredible omission because if the Apollo crews were indeed on the lunar surface, the agency definitely should have the relevant extra-vehicular radiation data. Where is this data? Especially significant would surely be those of the Apollo 15, 16 and 17 missions.

According to the mission reports, the six astronauts on these three missions spent from 18 to 20 hours each on the lunar surface during three exits (extravehicular activities, EVAs), under the direct radiation from the Sun and other sources, in their space suits – without any additional shielding. Moreover, some EVAs occurred at the time of elevated solar activity, potentially bringing excessive solar flares or particle events and resulting radiation to the crew. It is notable that more than 40 years later, there is no overt indication that the Apollo astronauts ever experienced any residual effects from radiation exposure.

In their late 70s and early 80s, the astronauts seemingly continue to lead normal lives. Neil Armstrong recently passed away at the respectable age of 82, due to causes apparently unrelated to radiation effects. This is a fantastic outcome of the Apollo program – provided it really was accomplished in 1969-72. Yet, strangely enough, there is little indication that NASA has ever paid any attention to this remarkable bio-medical fact which is a direct scientific outcome of the Apollo program. This is important self-evident information, and NASA should have started talking about this exciting finding: that no special medical and protective precautions against walking and working on the Moon are required.

On the contrary, NASA is silent on the matter and as shown above, has asked for help on a subject where the agency should be in full possession of the prime information and be the proud leader in this research. It is also noteworthy that in its mass media releases, NASA regularly reminds its audiences about Apollo 11, where astronauts were on the surface for only two hours, while it does not usually talk about circumstances of the Apollo 12 and 14 EVAs to such a degree, and is remarkably silent on Apollo missions 15 to 17 which would be crucial evidence in favour of harmless trips to the Moon.

Regarding radiation effects on humans, the Augustine Committee concludes: 'These radiation effects are insufficiently understood and remain a major physiological and engineering uncertainty in any human exploration program beyond low-Earth orbit.' (Augustine, 2009 p.100)

The Committee doesn't speak specifically about potential radiation problems on the lunar surface itself. Nor is the radiation danger during landing of crews on the Moon in the Apollo missions considered to any extent. Could it be that the decision not to mention Apollo was based not on the fact that the committee limited itself to studies carried out in LEO but precisely because there is no medical data on effects on human health beyond LEO? In fact, there is no connection or reference at all to the legendary Moon missions regarding the radiation problem in the quoted NASA reports (i.e. Arch. Study, 2005, and Augustine, 2009).
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby Iamwhomiam » Tue Oct 07, 2014 4:35 pm

Interesting. I've always accepted the official line, that we repeatedly landed men on the Moon. As a boy I was fascinated with the rocketry of Robert Goddard and read whatever I could get my hands on about his research.

I was also intrigued with the Bell X-1 and X-2 rocket planes and watched all I could about the rocket sled and its riders, who always looked afterward as though they had their faces beaten severely, but the rapid deceleration was what caused their blood vessels to rupture. I knew who Chuck Yeager was long before we had a space program and was disappointed he was never chosen to be one of our first Mercury Seven astronauts. Or any other kind.

He didn't have a degree.

But I digress - radiation from the Van Allen Belts was then of great concern, though I now believe they, what was to become NASA, were more concerned that radiation would damage the capsule's electronics preventing their return then they worried about the astronaut's health. All part of collecting new science. The capsule's return was paramount, the pilot's life not so much.

I really don't know why the radiation from the belts has now become so life threatening, unless it's to discourage others from attempting manned flight.

How could a two year mission in space to a rock with little atmosphere to shield the Sun's deadly radiation be less harmful than going to the Moon and back? This simply defies logic, imho.

And where is the data from the Van Allen Probes? They've been up in the belts constantly measuring their radiation effects for the past two years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_Allen_Probes

I firmly believe, with no sound basis, I admit, that we've been warned off the Moon.

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http://tinyurl.com/p6324qo
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby 82_28 » Tue Oct 07, 2014 5:02 pm

This is apropos of nothing. But about a year and a half ago I had an inexplicable dream that there was a sphere or boundary in which no human soul could pass. One simply couldn't pass it. It would destroy anything that had a soul on it -- electronics were fine. In the dream, I watched spacecraft, one after another get destroyed as they were headed (I guess) past the orbit of the moon -- only because it had living creatures aboard. I hadn't watched any sci-fi, hadn't read this thread. Just the dream. I took it as living entities on Earth cannot pass a certain point and I wondered if this could be true.

I wonder the same thing when I see some insect. Something is uploading some sort of programming for the little fucker. He just hatches out of an egg and then knows what to do and goes about doing it. Humans need more temporal space in order to develop. But it seems to me that there is a direct rational (read ratio) correlation to our lifespans and that of insects. Insects seem to be little microchips who know exactly what to do as soon as they hatch. Birds are a bit different in that they do hatch, but a mother or father looks over them for a time. But humans. . .

Hard to say. Perhaps send some insects out beyond the Moon and see what happens?

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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby Iamwhomiam » Tue Oct 07, 2014 5:24 pm

Image
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby DrEvil » Tue Oct 07, 2014 5:33 pm

82_28 » Tue Oct 07, 2014 11:02 pm wrote:I wonder the same thing when I see some insect. Something is uploading some sort of programming for the little fucker. He just hatches out of an egg and then knows what to do and goes about doing it. Humans need more temporal space in order to develop. But it seems to me that there is a direct rational (read ratio) correlation to our lifespans and that of insects. Insects seem to be little microchips who know exactly what to do as soon as they hatch. Birds are a bit different in that they do hatch, but a mother or father looks over them for a time. But humans. . .

Hard to say. Perhaps send some insects out beyond the Moon and see what happens?

:starz:


Maybe we're stuck in Vinge's 'slow zone'. :)

Getting off topic here, but I have to disagree with
"Something is uploading some sort of programming for the little fucker."


The programming is already there, or rather, the underlying rules that give rise to what looks like programming to us, aka 'behavior' (Just my personal opinion, of course).

That said, there's some incredibly fascinating insects out there, like 'Portia' spiders: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portia_%28genus%29, I just don't see the need to bring in "mind" from "somewhere else" when you don't have to.
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Re: Who Parked The Moon?

Postby Iamwhomiam » Tue Oct 07, 2014 6:09 pm

Try telling that to the scientists who've discovered rats love being tickled. He's tried his best to not suggest mindfulness, but his work demonstrates otherwise. I also heard recorded sounds of spiders dancing. Both were heard on different radiolab reports, I believe.

Dancing spiders This appears at least similar in subject, if it's not the same I referred to.

On edit:
Whoops! I located the first;
http://www.radiolab.org/story/91589-is-laughter-just-a-human-thing/

This is probably the second I referred to:
http://www.radiolab.org/story/299399-why-spiderman-such-good-dancer/
:backtotopic:
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